Reacting to ‘Honest Tea Talk’ on Marriage, Divorce and Gender Roles

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Welcome Welcome to library council How you guys doing? It's me Muhammad hijab Mohammed the learned one hijab Muhammad the nerd Buster hijab

Joining me is the man saliva

saliva please please

dowel machine the marriage document

so I didn't hide them on this kind of collaboration for some time yeah I've tried to you know distance myself from you know because the person is seldom said you know bad friends are like you know blacksmith

Joker yeah man it's been a long time we've been chilling out I think it's been more relaxed while I sometimes get fed up of just filming filming so we just chilled out but you know sometimes when important topics come and when it pertains to

the family unit which is already under attack. I think it's important for us to you know, jump

head first you know, what the important topic and this is something that in the next couple of months we're going to be going straight into as well because you know, for the whole LGBT we've got gender roles that we're going to be talking about is one inshallah. So I think it's a serious topic and I think we've had enough break chilling out and I think it's time to get back to business and well not returning after all a bit

yeah, so this is what we wanted to comment on today in Sharla is this YouTube channel which I've been made aware of called honesty talks and actually we welcome a lot of brothers we you know, we've spoken to

in different parts of the world are very much against this kind of thing where women come out and they they bring their own perspective and they speak on behalf of other women that maybe they've been in communication with you know, they come out and they attack the delivery trigger just like the idea of women coming in and speaking on a public platform Yeah. From from our kind of interactions with people in the West etc all the different countries have been to a different universities don't you think it's in the muscle how the common interest of the Muslim community to have women actually speak independently in the way that these women are doing? It's important and

you know these very people who come and this whole notion of you know they shouldn't be there they shouldn't talk etc You know, and it's the same people were there when their daughter was on the show Mahatma don't listen to us maybe they will listen to a sister if they go through other dynamics in life what they go through maybe they will listen to a call system because they can relate to you get it and most of the times if you see I've incorporated when I'm doing a reaction with you or certain topics that is pertaining to sisters I assist on board because I don't know what they go through. So it's important for us incorporate this but people who are living in a box don't realize that when

their kids go through this and you limit them to a certain point some of them end up leaving the dean because of this attitude you know so we appreciate and value sisters like their self you know honestly talk it's good but also we need to also keep each other in check you know the same goes with me to you you to me We miss you.

We have to because if we don't keep each other in check, you know then we're gonna go straight like you know the people in the past have gone history is important and this is what this Dean upholds in joining Buddha forbidding evil is a fundamental album only above that exactly and in the believing woman Yes. allies to one another exactly before we get to some points of correction that we want to kind of address in this video and constructive criticism quite frankly on some of the content that we've we've witnessed. We want to say that actually one of the most controversial videos that they've made in terms of public controversy has been one that basically they were coming on so

talking about women's sexual rights like intimate rights as I forgot a lot of us a lot of people were very upset at the fact that women were saying like, you know, there's an issue in the community where men are not sexually pleasing women basically like they have a laissez faire attitude or you know, a non existent drive when it comes to women sexually and stuff like that. I personally find that much controversy in that message that's all juicy is full on I mean if we have a problem with that then we shall call with the Ansari woman who came to the person to sell them you know and and actually Anna said you know May Allah merchant unsteady woman you know when it comes to these

matters the upfront you know, and obviously there's an absolute an adverb about how you address it and I don't believe they crossed those limits. For my remember, maybe there may have been one occasion, something was said I can't remember. But other than that, other than that brought me to talk about modesty brother.

You know, and also for those that have issue like brothers acquire you for watching that? Yeah, I mean, I didn't even go into x rays often go into, I mean, there's more to be said, by way by way of discussion and things that men should give him sexually and women vice versa. You can actually you can go more into detail.

We won't be doing that today maybe that's another video for another day. What we will be doing today inshallah though is we're looking at some of the things that have been happening in this or some things that have been said and maybe straightforward and say there are some things which are missing in the content I'll tell you what I think the number one thing which is missing in this kind of content is is reference to the religion direct reference. Like Okay, so for example, you know, I've watched a few of the episodes not right, divorce is one of them. Divorce is a very complicated topic very complicated and very dangerous to Livewire and I personally believe that if you want if we

wanted to speak about divorce we'd have to do extensive shorter with people like scholars and stuff like that and vet it and stuff like that because if you give wrong advice when it comes to divorce, it can literally ruin lives it's dangerous well I'll be honest with you I don't think that there will be a point where we could ever talk about divorce look when I go to shut him up people have knowledge that that bro when we call him and ask about you know there's this process going through this the first thing he says to me is bring the Baba to me exactly bring his wife to me he's not gonna come see me go to the bar for the divorce yeah well why wasn't let's see with them let's start

with never happens I want to react to the first part of this we can elaborate let's see they're both good people they have fallen out of love or something has happened it's just created a massive wedge they've tried all of the can to improve the marriage it's just not happening

and yet they have a level of care and love now maybe not in love but a level of care and love for each other is divorced the right option in that case

it's a personal choice bass sounds like yes, like it can't you know it that's a rare model. I think a lot of times when you see a marriage coming to the point where people are thinking about divorce it's a hostile environment and it's it's not it's not usually amicable and everybody's not sure they process

many of the cases

I see people will maybe you're looking at it from the loveless marriage perspective like they've grown to this point. But when I see divorce coming up it's usually in a hostile setting it's it's in a chaotic hostile setting like things have erupted and now divorce looks like Let's just end this I see I see both I see both I'm encountering both here I'm encountering sisters who are just empty their husbands are good men

but they're just empty and they crave connection

and they just say that really just running on empty I don't know how long they can continue like this for so it's for them I think sometimes that's a deeper predicament because he's not abusing me. You know, he's actually good to me.

But it's I'm potentially choosing by saying I'm potentially choosing a completely loveless and sometimes even sexless marriage as well.

So can you see here when when he asked the Somali sister sorry, I don't know.

When he asked a Somali sister she said it's a personal choice but yes, yeah. Now for me that's too nonchalant. Yeah, and it's quite frankly, it's damaging it's dangerous ambiguous. What do you mean by like, like divorce in what what because you need to understand something Yeah, these issues are deep issues and it's and these issues get a lot of views because a lot of people are going through it Yeah, it's not Islam q&a saying for example somebody mentions I'm going through this with my daughter Okay in this situation that are that are optimistic he says maybe my best did was I doubt they would ever say that. And then you have a wonder general mass I'm writing I'm having a problem

Shall I divorce and that comes up and they like

it and then they apply it to their self That's dangerous. Yeah, that's fat. What is specific to a specific individual like after after menopause somebody came to him and said, If I kill someone, would I be forgiven? And he said you never be forgiven? And then another person came same question is How will I be forgiven? Is that you'll be forgiven? And so what you're saying is that for for each individual yes so the reason is they asked him I said why did you say to one he won't be forgiven and to the other you would he said the first one I saw he's about to kill and the second one had already killed is looking for mercy. So do you see how the differentiated between given the

ruling to two separate individuals whether the famous examples where the Prophet worry about kissing the

older man is the younger man he allowed? The point of the matter is its divorce should not be spoken. Is it okay to divorce is not okay. First of all, we have to appreciate something. There's different models of divorce. Yes, like a woman. What can she do is different to what a man can do? Yes, I know that is such a straightforward thing to say, but that's not fleshed out in this video. Well

A woman can do his holiday she can do fast, okay? She can ask the man for her law. So the man gives it He grants it to her and what her life is different to the law according to some some especially the same one of these are very important details in it. How does one differentiate from Attila if it is in fact the opinion you follow? A what what has to happen etc. The point is if if you if you give women or people the ammunition to just go actually women in this case Yeah, to their husbands and say I want to divorce because I'm not, not in love of you normal, you could actually be pushing them to do a major sin because that might not be that might not be a valid reasoning. Now there's a

difference between repugnance or core because when when the woman came to the Prophet Mohammed Salah Salem and a hadith in Bukhari, when she says Lola refer to Layla was autophagy that if it's if it wasn't for the fear of Allah would have spat in his face. And if a farmer cabana homie and then he divorced between them, this is repugnance This is not it's not the same as not having the love that they're talking about whatever that may mean, by the way, and that's that's a sliding scale. So if someone is is poor, like disgusted by their husband, okay, that's that's a different kettle of fish to someone who is falling out of love have the same passion. What about if the man is not having

intimacy with now that's that's a good point, because as she mentioned that at the end, because I believe she conflict, yeah, yeah, no, no, the first question was different to the second because the second part of what she said was, it could be a sexless, sexless marriage, that sexless marriage could be coming from the woman cuz she don't wanna have sex with a man. Or I'm assuming that's what she means. But if she means that the man is not giving her unnecessarily that's a separate issue of inquiry Even then, but do you not think the complaint confusing two things? Yeah. Which is dangerous because first she said, What?

The Look, this is really important, bro. Yeah, he's a good guy. Yeah, as an abused much as a kids, kid. I don't know. One second one second. That sounds like a good guy to me. Yeah. But and this is keep talking about a woman being empty, empty on what? What you? Because what do you mean by that? I'm asking the system, because then you added no sex. Let's take the no sex out the picture because there might be a young sister watching this video and be like, no, he does have intimacy with me. He's actually a good guy. He's everything you just said. But I feel empty. Yeah, you've just given them advice of divorce. Yeah. You basically said you're empty. You shouldn't be feeling empty. How

do you define this? They need to be careful with this. He said anything?

Is something I've ordered respect. If that's what they're saying publicly, I'm worried to know what they would be saying privately. If people were coming to that, because you have no right. Let me just make this very clear. You have no right to advise any woman of divorce, unless you've heard two sides of the story, and you are qualified to be able to make such a judgment. I don't have a right and you don't have a right. If the case is simple and straightforward. Yeah. Where the man is, you know, he's putting her through this and that her life is on the line. Okay. That's different. We're not talking about this. Yes. We're talking about very ambiguous cases right now. You have no right

to advise any woman at any point. Yeah. When you have not heard two sides of us. That's why in a bar, it might have to do with judgment. Yeah, they'll bring both If yes, they know what they're doing. Yes. They'll bring both parties in and they'll hear both sides. Yes. They have to do you have that and they have to know what you see the kids what the situation with kids is because you could be breaking homes. You think you're making things better but you're not you're making things worse, you're making things worse? And then that will be on your skills on the Day of Judgment. Exactly. You know, we need to be very careful, motivate careful aspects of shared hate them and showcase them

says look, sometimes sisters come and they're crying. We're human beings. When we see individual crying, we sympathize. That's right. But until we will sometimes I want I'm not just saying this only happens with sister said sometimes it's because once we come and speak to the husband, it's a whole

different green color. And it's like totally the total opposite and then I will come on I want to move on to the next video because there's there's more things going sorry. That's there's more there's more issues here with some of the content, but what the content is missing, and I say is for an Asana, like you Oh, you can go through the whole video. Yeah. And once again, we're constructively criticizing and no word respect no chivalry effects is gonna stop us from doing it because you deserve the peer review that we all get. And this is peer review. You got to think of it like that. And if these peer review systems were not in place, the Muslim Ummah would be would have

a bad service we get to the end of the day of course we do so by everyone, public and private. Yeah, exactly. So this is just consider this a constructive critique we're not saying And just to be clear again that therefore let's cancel them therefore they don't know what they're talking about. Therefore the ignorant we're saying that you're doing a good job Mashallah, but just on these points, please bear in mind that you need to change some of the pilots. Here's what I would say the first the summarize each thing as we go along here. Firstly, when it comes to divorce, when it comes to issue with khobar, or judgment, keep out of it, keep out of it unless and only unless you have

someone who is extremely well qualified. She's a woman let's say for if you want to keep all women, that's fine, but she's extremely she's she's a well known

A pilot with an island or Shea house or something, you bring her, and she speaks with the authority that she has. But if you just lay people speaking about divorce, and issues that can break families, this will do more harm than good. Second thing here is this. I was watching thing, gender roles in the community. Yeah. Now, I watched this particular video for another purpose. Obviously, our remit is at our remit, we have a completely different remit to them. There, there is more pastoral. So they're dealing with women's issues, and these kinds of things. But there's a significant intersection, right? So there are things which we do and they do, which intersect. Yeah, and this is

one of them. So she This is one of the things that she's gender roles in the community. So we're talking about gender roles between man or woman.

I can't let obviously you can't watch the whole thing, I can't watch the whole thing. But let me tell you one thing that was not mentioned and the entire video, the entire video, however, was not mentioned, pa was not mentioned, which is the male responsibility or the ability for him to have a degree together. He's a maintainer of the protector. The hierarchical hierarchical

superiority that a man has overall, a husband have a wife, that's not mentioned, that is the elephant in the room. That's what makes a traditionalist complementarian system of marriage different from an egalitarian system. So if you're going to do a video of gender roles, you have to define what the gender roles are in the first place. Yeah, we haven't even defined what gender roles are. And worse yet, worse yet, quite frankly.

You start to mix liberal ideas with Islamic ideas. Let's Let's listen to what we're talking about. Yep. And if you think about it, suppiler when you look at different couples, Allah pairs someone would say, with who they need. So you have a strong, powerful woman who's active, who's maybe running a business who has a career, the man is more mellow. When you have a man that is out there, yeah, he's in the tower. He's you know, he's working. He's busy, busy, busy, you've got a woman who is holding down for his whole

life.

I mean, that was a second name. But

let's get to the book and see they use my

strong, powerful woman. Once again, you have to look at the language and a strong, powerful woman that's running her own business. All these kinds of things that she's doing, in a strong way strong and powerful correlated with capitalistic success. Exactly. And this whole video yeah. seldomly Do they? Do they mention exactly what the traditional roles are? There is no clear definition of it. And in fact, I don't think they've ever mentioned and someone can correct me if I'm wrong.

concepts of ta concepts of karma. They've clearly mentioned a clearly delineated it, what is it? It's the equivalent of men not telling men, other men what their responsibilities are in Islam? Yeah. If you want to help women in the community, you need to tell them what their responsibilities are actually telling them only what their rights are. Yeah, well armed them to make their homes, more hostile places, because they're now stocked up with all these things about Okay, what we need to get what what was for me was to be have to be a career woman. I have to do this after that. Where are these coming from? That no one said Muslim woman can work but the terminologies you're using are

very similar to what the liberals talk about they are, what we're saying is that these are dangerous, because we know the study been over 20 years, over 100,000 women, a woman more happier. Now, they're not

talking about blood flow. And Oswald Yes, the 100,000 people don't just study for 20 years, 20 years, 100,000 women, we're not talking 100,000 100,000 women and women are less and less happier. Yeah, I will put the link to that.

After the after second world, sorry, after the second wave of feminism after all the implementations of that. The point is, is that we need to be clear that there is in fact, there are gender roles in Islam. And those gender roles do mean that the men ideally will be I'm not saying always, what is robbery that breadwinners over what is wrong with the house? Because the final, let's say, the studies show it Jordan Peterson has one of the reasons is blown up is because he states this fact he talks about, for example, when women who are working in the you know, it'll be

whatever sectors it might be that they when it comes to their 30s 40s. They're leaving their jobs. They're leaving their jobs, because they're realizing that they're putting in 6070 hours work. And they're looking at their life, and there's nothing to account for you are preparing yourself to a lonely death. You've reached the age of 30 to 40. You're a career woman who's got no money in the bank, and you've got no man that wants to marry you. And you and let's talk about biologically. Can you have children? No. So the thing is, why are we propagating a failed system where studies show that women are less happier. That's true. It's true. It's dangerous. I'm not saying that there's

got to be clear about what the ideal Islamic ideal is. Yeah, because if you're gonna do a whole video about gender roles and not mentioned what Quranic

One Hadith or one call of any Ireland, and that at the end of it refer to women that start their own business and do well in the workplace or public figures wherever it may be as strong. The an implication that can be taken from that is or the inference that can be taken from the at least in the subtext of that speech. Is that strong women are those women that the liberals are defining not what the liberal feminists are defining? Exactly. You know, why is he put it this way? Put it this way. If you watch that whole gender video that they made, it's not incompatible with feminism. It's not Yeah, it's not incompatible feminism. I don't think like a second way feminists will look at it

and probably not disagree with most of what has been said, yeah, if they're liberal enough to different cultures, they won't disagree with them. Also, in order for us to really know once again, if you want Islamic solutions for Muslim problems, we have to bring the Quran as simple as that really, if you're if you want to give Islamic solutions for Muslim problems, bring the Quran and the Sunnah tell them of the ayat and the Hadith and the column otherwise it's to be honest with you it's it will be just opinion forget forget this a super powerful career or forget that Okay, yeah. Why don't we Why don't our sisters are doing this honesty talk to you. And it's honestly to me, they've

been honest about here. They should be schooling brothers and seen your sisters, you go to your husbands, you're the maintainer, and the protector of the house, go out and work empower them by doing that. They should not have obviously haven't seen a video of them incorporating that role. They should incorporate that and talk to sisters and tell them you tell your husband you're the maintainer protector I accept that and this is what I was fine with allegedly did go out and welcome you might you might find segments of them saying that they remember I hope Yeah, let's let's see this bit here. This is you're talking about dying alone and living as it will understand like Kevin,

bloody Samuel is true. But this is one thing that I was I was watching how to find the husband. Yeah. So listen to this, but I found that quite unusual. To be honest, this is quite unusual, really

build upon their confidence and to know exactly what they will and won't accept and to journey through the

the looking stage with Allah knowing that Allah will give them what they need and what they deserve. When you know divorce women are not second class citizens just because they were divorced. I mean, if you look at the time of the prophet SAW asylum, how many of us have yet to divorcees, widows and and the Sahaba washed to marry them somehow? So any sort of system and the prophets I saw them in itself? Yes. It's so so important that I think forefoot for divorce sisters, that they that they come to a brother who's already married who's looking for a second one. Why is it the assumption that because you're divorced that you that you that necessarily your preference is polygamy? I mean,

it may be for some women, it may not be but it's almost as though I see. And, you know, I don't know if you see this, too, that for divorced sisters, there's a narrative that's kind of shoved down their throats that, okay, because you're divorced, you need to lower your standards. You need to accept

anyone that's going to take you because you have kids, because who's going to marry a sister, we're fortunate and you should be grateful that anyone wants to marry you, right? And, and I am totally against this. I am totally against this. I think it's really really important.

So

polygyny is an institution in Islam, they know they've done a video on it. Yeah. Which was a bias video, which, which itself requires discussion, but we're not gonna have time for it today. Yeah. But basically, that video didn't and it was just prioritizing the trauma of the first wife, not putting the second wife in the equation at all. Almost her trauma, or the or the the kids. Maybe the kids or their what even the Annie. It was it was a bias video. And in fact, they should they should title that video. The dysfunctionality is of polygyny and implementation, not polygamy as they have. Yeah. But put that to the side. This video here that they've done.

Which, sorry, this this mcda Hills little bit that this little video bit here where she was saying that someone who's divorced should not should not accept the fact that you know, and it's true, and we don't say that she should lower her standards or think that she's less angry, and no problem. But listen to what she says thereafter. Yeah. So she says that I agree with what she said so far. So do I. But this is what I found quite ironic.

of the prophet SAW Salem, how many of us have yet with divorcees, widows and, and the Sahaba rush to marry them? somehow. So.

Yeah, but you see, what do you think I'm gonna say? So she said, she said in the first instance, that you shouldn't, if there's a woman who's a divorcee, she shouldn't just accept polygyny, right? And then she mentioned that the examples habia

And the prophets wives. What do you think the disparity here is in these two examples?

And you tell me you said it before. Okay? The disparity in these two examples is those women who are divorcees married in polygynous marriages.

Okay. Oh, once beneath themselves tomorrow.

Okay, let me so they will divorce women who got into polygamy. So I'm saying, if you mentioned in the Prophet Mohammed Elijah lamea, as an example, he had made wives at one time. So these women were divorces? Yes. But they were also getting a polygynous marriages, okay, but there are companions who did marry divorce woman without being in polygamy

is very, very unlikely, because they might have had rock creation, they might have had the mill kameen and stuff like that. That was that was the exception. Let's let's talk about the Sabbath mentality. Are you telling me not at the Sahaba would have want to marry a doula, for example, that's Wk Oxley? Oh, no, no, the one who the person who sent him said Why did you not marry a virgin? He said, I married a divorce us kids because we don't know that's the only wife he's gonna know. And we don't know if we also can.

But what I'm trying to say is, possession of the right hand is talking about let's let's be real, this I have to have the mentality of I will not marry divorce, because she's divorcing all that we know we agree with. Okay, but that's what they turned out. No, I understand that. But what I'm saying is, it's not, it's not lowering your standard necessarily. If a divorcee, now she's got four kids, or the example they gave, or five or six, or whatever it may be, for her to realize that that is, okay, that is going to be an inconvenience for a lot of men. That is going to be an interview. So what do you see what i'm saying is, that's the reality. So when I say that's how it should be

fun. Once again, this is another thing we should, we should make everything clear, which is that he has no responsibility over them. The father, and she does have responsibility, but he has no choice. But he doesn't need to give the money like anything. So the point of the matter is he cannot go through but if the advice has been given, yeah, is not going to help. Yes, let's just be honest about it. polygyny is there for a reason. It is there to make sure that women who are married or unmarried who maybe divorces and cannot find husbands and have been looking for five years, 10 years, whatever it may be. Yeah, can be absorbed back into the marriage market. If they take this

kind of advice. Sorry to say this. The reality is they may die alone. It's not productive. I think what the issue here is this year Look, when I was looking to get married, yeah, there was a sister I was getting to know for marriage who had kids? Yeah. And I wasn't thinking about polygamy. Yeah, yeah, I was like, Mike

I was thinking about polygamy in my head I was like, is this the right person to meet I accept myself okay maximum i would i would i can marry divorce with two kids that was maximum three I personally wouldn't personally the point I'm trying to make here Why are the equating and then a woman why was your preferences oh she cuz I don't want to marry a man with kids. Thank you. Thank you. The point is this why is it seen as degrading that a divorced sister gets into a polygamy I don't understand this

I'm totally against that.

And this is talking about that they are seen as second class citizens I doubt they are because if a man is willing to marry you he's not making you a side chick yeah exactly often

marry you and you're a divorce you okay? No problem he's not saying oh I'm going to marry you maybe for the sake of Allah maybe for marry someone younger but he's like look I want to marry a sister with kids maybe because the society that we live in sadly see them as low value woman like these retold whether they talk as and because of that I want to marry them What is wrong with that? Why do you feel degraded? Why is this notion of look you go to the moments it's just so you got admire about them

we call each other

as my co system

sister Muslim sister that's what come today and say that's my core sister

go to sub Saharan Africa you're not you're not you know we're talking in the western context but you know you know where there are some places in the world where a cultural polygamy is much is much more acceptable and women are much more agreeable to it for example, people correct me if I'm wrong yeah but Sub Saharan Africa Nigeria because Nigeria go to Indonesia Mali apparently Indonesia Malaysia we've been told that his people are much more open to Yeah, you know, I'm talking about

but here's here's a segment Okay, so we've talked about that. So just to summarize, just to summarize this point, the idea really is about you know, polygyny is there for a reason yeah quite helps with the marriage market I don't want an every get don't get advice as unproductive Okay, one second. Yeah, one life polygamy is a solution. Yes, I don't care what like I'll take off but unless they said to me, we will hug you as he pleases. You want to go hang myself? Absolutely. So So.

The point is this yet polygamy is a solution because we need to understand is polygamy is not exclusive to Muslim men. Men practice polygamy.

In the wrong ways, Allah stipulated to be done in the right way. So con wives view a divorce, you know, divorce with kids or no kids, you have your rights protected. Okay, so it's been legislated. So things can be done in the right way. I know ministers would message me when I, when I first came to stamina summer YouTube channel, I was doing a reality show. But trust me, I used to get message from sisters who were on the verge of wanting to zero, because they are looked down upon their single mothers who have kids, nobody want to marry them, they go to this address, all these men want to see to me are going to this app, once they found out I'm a divorcee with kids, they start

flirting with me, they start talking to me, in a certain way, when a man comes and he wants to marry us. Why are you degrading that man? Why are you making unacceptable, please? The point is this here, once again, I want to emphasize your video is a good one, why it's needed. All we're just trying to say is there's certain things that you're seeing that have great consequences. Because don't think it's words that you are taught, there are people that are watching and thinking, actually right? Or does that actually mean divorce actually means they're making life changing decisions? You know, so what would you try to say sisters? is when you say something, look, because you said he was a lot

older videos, and they don't have

five or six. Okay, well, then to me, it might be that you're talking from experience. Yeah. And I'm not talking about the specific issue of divorce. I'm not talking about that. So you need

to make it clear. Okay. Well, what I've seen is that if you bring your experiences to the table, it's not necessarily wrong. But what you may have gone through what you have suffered, or what you were still suffering that you may not have not been over, can cause harm, because what you're doing is you don't points to any of the sisters. What I'm saying is it might be something we all have gone through stuff in our life. If I come and give it the site, they if somebody comes to ask me for advice, and I say Oh, do this, because I'm in a mental state of something that I've suffered. My advice might not be productive. As you know what this is called. It's called self referential

altruism. Interest isn't the only you'll find these kinds of words.

Self referendum is

self referential altruism is what it is the word self referential altruism, basically altruism is when you care about other people, right? Yeah. Self referential altruism is you care about other people, or you give advice that would, let's say, for example, impact other people, because you refer to your own experiences. Now, this is actually a very poor way to moralize, because it's first, it's very, it's a very small sample size, you've got yourself just and that person, like you said, experience, yeah, that person might go go for a completely different Yeah, but this analogy is self things. And what you're doing is you're projecting your kind of own emotional, yes, energy onto

them. It's a form of Freudian projection. But let's put that sort of side. Yeah. Let's see this next bit. Because advice gets worse, to be honest, is because to feel to be accepted to be wanted. If you like, if I show that I'm a mother, then that means I'm not good. I'm going to be less desirable. You know, it's so important. This is who I am. This is how I am and this is what I've got. And are you down? And if if this lady's if, okay, the man, US you've listened for the red flags, red flags you can they live with their father?

He's not accepted your kids? Are they going to be living in a house full time? He's not accepted your kids. listen out for these.

Living with the Father is actually the Hong Kong chalet. It's actually the ruling. If a woman is divorced, and she remarries the majority of Islam from my understand, based on a hadith and Timothy by the way with them whether it were the Prophet Mohammed Salah, a Mormon came to him and says, should I get How could I not get custody of the children when she was they were on my you know, lap and they were suckling from my breast and whatever. And he said, you get custody of the children, but if you get married, then he gets the children. That's the ruling. So if you get custody of the children, obviously doesn't mean that the man doesn't see them. Yeah. It just means that you get

your the primary custody like custodian or the old guardian of the child now, but if you get married, then he the father now gets custody of the children. So if, if a man comes, how could that be a red flag if he just wants to do a column of the hadith of Allah? Okay. The cam of Allah, He wants to he wants to uphold, I think, I think she's talking about something else. No, I don't think so. It's not

No, No, she's not. She's she said, Listen to red flags. Yeah. She said, if he says, can they go live with their father, that he hasn't accepted your children? Now, if he says that he can go live with your father, that might just well be because that that's where they need to go. Okay. Can it be also that for example, the father doesn't want them and the guy that she's getting to know is basically saying, I don't want them in my life, kind of like I don't want them to. I think that's where she's coming from. Even if I don't think she's coming. He says it's the right

fit.

For the human the best like the sake of RGB for the sake of argument, but this either way is no red flag. If the man doesn't want if a man says Look, I really want to get involved with with children got my own children to raise. I don't see anything wrong with that. Likewise, if not, I don't see anything wrong.

If a woman wants to get if if a woman wants to get married to a man who's got children? Yeah. She says, Look, I don't want to, I don't want to raise your children. No, no.

I don't see anything wrong with that. How did you do with the kids? What do you mean? What does? What does she do with the kids? Can you imagine speaking to a man and the man said, How long were the holiday? Let's say the eight and nine, depends on a situation, no one doesn't want to raise them. But he doesn't. Because this is his catch 22 for a lot of men, yeah, you want to raise a child. But then when you get into their life, you're number two, because you are not the final decision maker, you will not be given the same privileges as you would be if you were the Father. And this goes on, listen to what they continue saying, Listen to what the Somali sister says, Yeah,

you will see more, you get a flavor of what they're talking about.

Right? Because that is a sign of whether he is ready to assume them into his fold or not. And or absolute indifference. You can state that they're there upfront, but sometimes you get the case where they're acting like they don't exist, there's no interest whatsoever about their names, their ages, their it's like they're not in there, the way they project the future. They're not taking them into account, like you said, and also in the position of his mom, your your current home, you know, your home environment has a particular balance right now. It's stable, it's set, it has a culture, and you're going to bring an outsider into that culture. And you have to take into account whether

they're going to be a good fit for the culture, or not somebody who's going to come in and be uptight, and throw off your balance, and shift your kids and change your home dynamic. And that can be applied to you too. So think of it this way earlier. So the guy he was he this is this is the conundrum that you're putting the man in Yeah, he either comes in, he comes in and assumes the children. He says, You know, I have no problem raising the kids. He raises the kids, but part of raising children is disciplining them, you start pushing the kid that what she said about the Constitution is nonsense. Other than that, dynamic that other than that, this is the problem people

are facing. I don't know what that's not about what she's saying about a person coming in, it's easy to understand their children. But a man who doesn't even actually doesn't know the name, doesn't care about them. That is concerning to anyone, even if I'm a father of a child. And a woman said the same thing. But did not have to be real, because Come on, but if you're not even acknowledging my kids, and you want them out, is red flags to me, bro, I have to be real. If this is compensated, how many kids will have to kiss from another marriage? How many days you keep them free days are our brothers and red blood banks. Because you're disregarding market, you can come and say look, for

example, we can work a central

telling your if a new wife comes in, you got kids from level, you start saying that now you got a raise, you've got to raise my children as if it's a no, no, no.

No, no, no many women do this. No, no man is having a kiss from another marriage. Yes, they've got another father or they got another mother, let's say Yeah. Why are they not taking why they're not assuming the responsibility of the parent? Why are you now putting that responsibility on someone else? It's very simply, I don't think anyone could force anyone to come and see, look after my kids, the person that you marry, if you do have goodwill, they do it. But when they come in and come and tell them, you have to if they come in, and they want to assume that responsibility and whatever. Yeah. And they start, you know, disciplining the child.

That is that that's nonsense. With all due respect to the sister to say, you can't what is what is this? What the hell is this? I've married you have accepted your kids and undisciplined, totally talking about? I'll be honest, this is pathetic. Yeah. What was this? Is this nice leaving the house? Yeah, exactly. You've made him basically an equivalent, and you've made him an equal one.

Child, yeah, you might have another child. So you've got your own dynamics. So this goes back to Columbo, which they don't mention ever. Yeah. In the videos, I've seen that. You basically want the dilemma. Because if he's in the house, and he he comes to kids, what's what's happened to him, he's become an equal one of the kids. So if you choose to kids, while you're going to discipline, the way you're gonna do, are you going to undermine him in front of the kids? And let's see how long of such a marriage last. Your marriage is gonna last? My friend can Yeah, honestly. Because if you want to undermine the disrespect to a man in front of your children, even though he wants to come in and

contribute to their upbringing, and upkeep or, or their discipline, then what you're doing is you're basically self sabotaging your things. That's what's gonna say, because at the end of the day, you're just prone in yourself to being divorced readily. Yes, I'm sorry if that sounds harsh, because if you have a man who's coming to willing to look after your kids loving, etc, and you're coming in Boston, you can't say to my kids, don't you ever raise it? Look, you can't be protective. But you've married this person if you trust this person, you point your house your life, if he wants to discipline the kids, I'm not talking about you come home, and he's flippin talking.

Bro. Yeah, sure. So these are just some of the things that we've come across is a vast topic is of course it's an ocean. There's a lot of things about the points that we that's less let's summarize and give constructive criticism. Yeah, summarize. Look. Number one, don't get involved in issues that have any implication of what

is referred to as potluck, which means Islamic rulings. Because these kinds of things they require

an arbitrator, they require someone to come in and to see person, one person to side person one side and to make a decision holistically, especially when it comes to divorce. divorce. And I'm really sorry to say this for people that want you're considering it man or woman do not approach lay people like us like them. Yes. Don't approach us for four. I'm thinking of divorce. Yeah, I'm thinking of office.

Number two, yeah. Number two, the second thing I say is you have to say if you if you want Islamic solutions for Muslim people, and you've got a demographic which is uniquely let's say, female, right, then you have to start introducing a quote on Asana more regularly. Yeah, yeah. You and you have to emphasize and don't shy away from emphasizing the key components of the religion especially with intergender dynamics and stuff. So for example, Kawashima PA, the kind of emphasis that is put by the prophet Mohammed Salim on these concepts, with with with to us indicate that that should be that kind of emphasis should be put by a man or woman who wants to speak about these issues to

Muslim people. Yeah, and especially on pastoral levels. Number three, what we said number one, number two

Quran and Sunnah. And number three, I would say this Bro, I would actually say it would benefit you guys, if you had one person of knowledge. Yes, a female Yeah, doesn't have to be a man at all you get a female, I share her or stat that valuable time to to look over your stuff. And not only that, but to sit with you guys. So you can actually consult her so you can get it because either past or Alicia's. In many ways, they're actually even more complicated than now issues, they're more complicated. So you need a flip specialist on hand because some of the blunders that are coming out would suggest that you don't have that kind of thing. And if that's someone there with you they can

do is to do well they can use the shadow meaning they will be bringing up Quran as Hades and that's what the that's what this thing is missing. Apart from that you guys are doing good work of course and hopefully didn't take offense to this we need to check each other and hold each other look at some of the advice that was given it has to be productive. And it also has to be realistic and we hope we because we have the same objective we're on the same team. We are on the same team and the objective is to get people in stable families you know people can't get people away from sin so my question to you though is when is your marriage fraudulent documentary coming out?

I mean,

let me tell you something Yes, it is coming out and when it does come out when it does come out, it would be groundbreaking in a box office machine and it's gonna cause earthquakes in Ghana to maybe hear 10.7 millimeter scale Yeah, it's going to cause and the reason why because this is the

nano This is gone above that proper yeah this is caused tsunamis and and regions Yes, people drowned you know people drown people need life jackets.

The point the point is, is I'll be honest it is a big topic man and it's and that is what I aim to do when I release it is to delve. Delve. There's no you just have to delve into the topic because it is such a big ocean Yeah, and there's so many problems actually and the reason why I was a bit passionate and aggressive in the video I want to give a disclaimer it's not towards the sisters is because it's sad to see

you know it's really sad to see bro is because I hear left center hello yeah bro I'm gonna divorce I'm gonna divorce unless it's a pandemic So the thing is this when we have the issue and the oma bro it's dangerous we want to Greek we don't want people to get divorced because divorce marriages mean broken families broken keep the future oma is ruined. So that's why we need to make sure we're very careful with our words. And when we are towards that divorce so easily. It's not that easy, you know? So yes, as we're careful you know, we're doing takfeer etc, etc. 31 s parties are buddies. We need to be careful the word divorces especially relating to women because it's exactly what women

doing I'm going to ask a man for divorce is not the same as men going to ask a woman exactly what a woman a man can do tell octoman without a consultation with a woman doing a festival in Holland is a completely different kettle of fish altogether and had these has come that a woman asked for divorce for no reason Yeah, then she is to be given such and such a punishment she will not be you know, the fragrance of jasmine she will not smell and so on. It's not the same. It's also the tala cola for example, Courtney mentioned that the reason talaq was deflated the three is because the pagan Arab used to abuse it they used to divorce their wives and the West wanted to move on and they would take

them back and they will do this over and over again. Allah legislated to free so let's not get the terracotta locking of I'm in power I'm yes there is an element by also that if you abuse it, Allah subhanaw taala is Allah legislate that your wife would have to go and have intimacy get married with another man. That's the consequence. So won't be a wife. But we won't be wife anymore. But the point is this bro. If it's your wife, he knew you don't we didn't want to give that divorce and he gave it

Because you have his stupidity that comes across so let's not make it seem that the topic that we have is something that we carry on this year I'll use however like no we can find

backfires anyway this is the topic inshallah in the coming times in February when the documentaries are going to begin to happen to delve into this I mean till next time happy New Yorkers