Pre-Marital Conversations – Episode 2

Assalamu alaykum warahmatullahi wabarakatuh. Muhammad has reached the age of marriage and he decides to propose for Fatima. Fatima is very excited because her family knows Muhammad's family. Mohammed is equally pleased, because he knows of Fatima. And he knows the kind of family that she was brought up in all his seeming perfect for a beautiful and blissful marriage. They then move on to have the most beautiful, romantic fairytale wedding ever.

They are now married for three months, when Mohammed says we are relocating, he needs to move to another town, because his career takes him there. And Fatima and only child asks, did you know about this before we got married? And he said yes. I just didn't think it was important to discuss with you. And this is Fatima's response. I have ailing parents, I have a responsibility towards my parents.

I married you because you were from the same town and married you because I knew I wouldn't be moving. I need to check on my dad daily. My dad does not drive anymore. My mom has never driven a need to be closed by to be of assistance to them. And what is Mohamed say? That is not my concern. Nigeria's This is just a scenario that are related. But you can change it to another scenario scenario x y Zed, but I think the principle is the same.

Families of Mohammed have said that Fatima is overreacting. There is a career opportunity for Mohammed and why isn't she going and nobody in Muhammad's family is seeming to understand her situation. She's being selfish. She's being immature. She's an only child. So she's used to having her way. And the community is now divided. Because you must remember, this is a small little town that they've come from other friends, neighbors are having to take sides, or you're on Fatima and her family side on Muhammad and his family side. You know, shamima? That's precisely the point. If this young couple have gone through a premarital conversation at the discussion, if they've been to

someone who knows about these things, one of the fundamental questions that is asked, Where are we going to stay? And how long are we going to stay? It's an important question is a fundamental question. Now the thing about pre metal conversation, it does not mean that you and the person must agree on everything. But this particular point is sensitive to Fatima. It's important to her because she has a stake in it because of her relationship with a mom and dad being the only child. And then she could have said you know what, Muhammad, if you are going to move three months time, and that town is so far away from home here. I'm sorry. As much as I love to marry you. I don't think we

should continue with this.

These less aggravation, less tension, so on and so forth. And this is a fundamental thing. Okay, I just sort of move on to a slightly different scenario, where, you know, it's same Fatima and Muhammad

haven't gotten married. However, this situation arises, not three months later, but three years later, and it wasn't planned. What should Fatima's reaction be? Yes, she's still going to be disappointed because she's going to be moving far away from from her parents. However, I need you to understand this is not something that was planned, mushy just up and leave the marriage now, three years later, or how does she now deal with this kind of scenario, the situation is different. Because something was hidden from her in the first scenario, okay. And she would have inshallah enjoyed a wonderful relationship in this three years with the husband, realizing his integrity, and

his honesty, and so on so forth. So now that she is in a quandary, but she would, inshallah Allah will guide but she'll make an informed decision. Maybe Allah makes it such that the husband out of his compassion will say, you know what, I do not mind your mum and dad accompany as to the town, for example, you know, then you could see them or else for example, if it's not so far away, that is it possible that

every third day or so you could visit them, you know, in other words, you come to some kind of compromise, there are some things out of your control. And you got to understand that it is only when people hide things, when they lie, they some omission, then it becomes a real problem, since the idea of keeping the trust open, shall absolutely this CD we talking about what happens when the problems arise, that means the conversations didn't take place, there's been mistrust on either side, maybe both sides, we've not been empathetic towards each other, we're not to be able to forgive each other, that kind of thing, which would then result in the unhappy event of divorce.

What are some of the reasons that a couple would get divorced?

There are many, many reasons for that.

One of them is when one of the individuals, either husband or wife is a poor parent, is incredible how this can create a conflict. So your parenting styles must be similar. If one person undermines the other, it creates a conflict, that's one. The other one is when these repeated or when there is infidelity. That is the real issue in marriage. The other is when one person becomes a recall a control freak,

you know, undermining the other controlling the person, and so on and so forth. The other reason is when there is any kind of addiction, you know, whether it's drugs, whether it's pornographic addiction, whatever, that is an important thing. And also, when you are marrying for the wrong reasons, when you're, you know, when your intention is wrong, when you marry someone purely because they are wealthy, or whatever, whatever whatever. So your intention is not Noble. And when you marry for the wrong reasons that you are not going to find happiness in that home, neither with your partner. Then the other issue is that sometimes in the young couple become parents, that the mother

or the father gets so lost in their parenting, but they forget about each other in the process that can also be problematic. The other thing is often some people tell me that I've outgrown my husband, in the sense that she has developed spiritually, she has become an avid reader, you know, she is now emotional maturity, but the husband is the same person that she knew at that time when he hasn't grown. The other thing is this also, when there is no shared vision, in the marriage, for example, the couples themselves are not moving in the same direction, and be moving in different directions that result that can create problem. The other issues and there are many shots to share a few more

with you, they are issues of intimacy, when that is being neglected, that can be very, very problematic. The other one is the whole issue. When you have had what you call unmet expectations, they are not being met. And the issue that you spoke about early on about finances, right. And also, when there are different priorities. And the one that we spoke about a bit is when you do not know how to resolve your conflicts. So this is something is problematic. Of course, it one of the things that no people want to hear is also when the we have overzealous in laws, you know, in laws, that can also be a situation, what can we do? Before a couple of get to a stage of, of, of divorce? You

know, divorce doesn't just happen overnight. It's a series of events that led up to it. It could be let's just take your example of unmet expectations.

A young girl can't get up one morning and say, Well, I can't be in this marriage anymore. Because you had promised me to do that, that and that and goodbye. I'm now going to my parents house. How can this young girl have the conversation to say, you know what part of our life plan was, after three years of marriage, we're going to inshallah start our family. And you have said to me, no, we can't start our family now because your career is more important or you're very involved in sport and the such like, another example could be that you know, in terms of finances, you said to me, that at the time we five years into our marriage, we have moved out to your for your parents house,

you went to buy me a beautiful house, three storey house in the suburbs. I'm going to have my own SUV and you know, you're going to have an escort

car, we still borrowing your dad's car we still living in the little granny flat at the back of their home. I can't do this anymore.

What can we do? I know you're gonna say yes, be patient, and you know talk about that. But help me help our listeners to start that conversation at the beginning of the problem. You see, I think I'll go beyond the beginning of the problem, I would say. And when we discuss pre medical conversation and preparation, you look at almost each of those items that could have been discussed, right? For example, one of the things that I spoke about not knowing how to deal with conflict is something that's part of pre metal conversation, where you ask each other if we go through a situation of disagreement, how should we resolve it? Should we speak to someone else? You know what I'm saying?

There's one, the other issue about expectations, for example,

person x want to marry person y. So person x as person y, what are your expectations of marriage? What are your expectations of me? What do you see as my role you understand, that is being discussed? Of course, it cannot be exhaustive, but you discuss it, the whole issue of addiction, addiction, for example, you know, there are a small percentage with the addiction starts up after marriage. But you could ask the question, are you addicted to anything? Have you maybe substance abuse? Right? Now I know of instances, for example, where father knows his son is either a recovering addict, or is addicted. And he thinks that if he marries someone, it will all change.

Now, there's also cases where the boy's family does not tell the girl's family. And she goes three months into marriage, and she realizes, and the parents feel that let's get him married. And all the problems are going to be solved. And that's now one of the largest statistics of problems in marriages, in our community. Yeah, absolutely. So what I'm saying, if you look at each of the items that I raised, each of the items could have been addressed prior to the marriage, for example, what is the role of your mom and dad in our marriage? I mean, when you make a decision, right, to what extent would you consult with your parents? You know, yes, I have no problem consulting with them,

but about what issues are you going to consult, for example, you get some woman who complained that the son will not go anywhere, anyway, anyway, even around the corner without telling his mother about it. And I, you know, to me, is a petty thing. But the reality is this, that if a mother gets upset that the son did not say that I'm going to the corner cafe or whatever, I find that a particular issue. So what I'm saying to you, we got to understand, because what you got to bear in mind is shamima, that it is two individuals from diverse backgrounds, who are sharing a space. And in that space, in that transition, how they relate to each other depends largely on the

understanding of the other, what we require, is what they call a perspective transformation, you know, is they sharing a space together, and then there's the added dimension of the families being brought into the space? and more. So I'm talking about both sets of parents. And you mentioned earlier that in the midis, premarital conversation, the couple is going to say, when should we approach your parents for for help with a particular problem? That is so dynamic and so important, because sometimes there's over involvement from the parents. So there could be a case that, look when we buying a car? Yes, we'll, we'll approach your dad, because he knows all about cars, and he's

got all the context. But you just tell my parents about it. So doesn't mean we don't tell my parents. We're talking to your dad. And we say to my dad, you know what, we decided on buying X, Y, or Z car? What do you think of our choices? So we involved in both sets of families, and the stigma of the mother in law? You know, girls need to get that out of their their minds. Give that mother in law a chance. And I often say to two young girls, doesn't your mother sometimes say something to annoy you a little comment? And you say, oh, Mommy, man, you know, you're being silly about it. So why is it when the mother in law sees it? It's taken in a completely different context because

she's, it's the same as your mom saying to you that something sometimes accepted as positive criticism, accepted as her wanting to assist you. And don't take it as her thinking that only she can do the best for her son. But then we have other scenario with the mom feels that nobody can cook for my son like I

Nobody can make his lunch like I do. And how can this young girl who knows nothing? Please, my son? No, absolutely, I think you make a very valid point. And therefore, you know, in the next round, we're going to speak about the whole issue of self esteem. But when you have a very low self esteem, then you feel very, very insecure. You got to accept yourself. And something else that which I did not intend to speak about, but I'll mention it here now is that, you know, sadly, we must realize that men and women are different. And we could understand that difference. And once you understand it, you find that will be a reciprocal understanding of the other, that'd be far greater empathy.

You know, to understand that woman, for example, in the conversations, they like detail, they've got very, very powerful memories. If you tell your wife, you know, darling, I'm so sorry. I, you know, she'll say to you, in remember ninth of April 1945, you did this to me in 1946. You know, and jokingly say this, when I'm often officiating in a marriage reception. And if the couple is sitting on the stage, I will say to the young girl, I want you to put your palm above the palm of your husband, and the husband must tell her, this is a first and last time you're going to have the upper hand, you know, and I say, they've also I say to him, as your wife, you know, she's, why are you

marrying me? She might say, Oh, I think you're gorgeous, you're intelligent. And you're like this, write it all down, because 20 years later, she bound to tell you, I don't know why I married you. He said, No, no, darling. And you forget, I wrote it down. But it's so important, you know, to tell each other what you think is important. And the reason you chose to marry that person, because in the moments of slight unhappiness, in the moments of differences occurring, you remember the difference as that that occasion, but it's not what now taints your entire image of the person is a married person, because of his or her good looks, I married the person because of his o'clock I

married them, because they have such a lovely kind and caring nature, or married my husband because he is so loving towards his sisters, and his mom. And then one year down the line, I am now crossing irritated because he, you know, defers to them for everything. And he wants to go and get advice from his mother, forgetting that that's the reason I married the man in the first place. You know, you're talking about that. I mean, there were instances there was a study that was done, where people are made for 1520 odd years. So the ask these females Tell me, what was the main reason you married, your husband, they all cited the reason and they all said, Now that we are married, we

realize that the reason for marrying him had nothing to do with marriage,

in a sin, okay, nothing to the marriage because the reality of marriage is different from what you fantasize, and your own pure romantic notions of it is much more prosaic and much more practical, you know, right now, you spoke earlier about self esteem and how important it is. And we even spoke about in our first CD, how to develop self esteem in our children. So they growing up, they confident within themselves, and leading up to them becoming adults, and deciding inshallah, to go into a marriage, they comfortable with themselves. Now, low esteem would definitely cause some sort of problem in the marriage. Right? My question to you is the following. What impact would a low self

esteem have in a relationship have in this marriage? low esteem has a profound impact on a marriage? Remember this when you

do not accept yourself? If you do not have a healthy self concept? What are some of the attributes that you would have? You would be suspicious, you can become a control freak, you would have a victim mentality. You'll blame your circumstances for everything that goes around. And even if your spouse for example, tells you how much she loves you or he loves you, and you begin to say, but why is he saying this to me? Why, or what's his reason you know,

it is something is being done. So in that way, what happens? The other critical aspect is this. When you got low self esteem, then you cannot embrace change, you cannot adapt to situations, because in the end, you want things to be done your own way, the way it has been done in the past. And what it does really, it really negates

Your spouse, you do not want them to flourish, you want them to do it only one way, you look at things that you need dimensional way. So low self esteem is a real issue is a gift, you know, self esteem, a positive self esteem is a gift we can give to our children is the gift that can liberate them open the minds, that can help them cope with the changing landscape, a changing environment, inshallah, they would be productive in many ways than one as a husband as a wife, and they would contribute to the happiness rather than being a victim, that they themselves have perpetuated, you know, now, sadly, many parents erode the self esteem of their children, by, amongst other things,

diminishing them, you know, you you're not good enough, you know, look at the artwork you've done, or look at your sister, how well she's doing in school, all of that is reducing the self esteem. Now, what can parents do to enhance the self esteem of their children? Here, again, I'm talking about practical examples, you know, like practical examples, yeah, we theorize, but I want practical examples as well, to to lend more discussion to the theory, you see, all children require, what I say is a six A's, they require acceptance, they require appreciation, they require acknowledgement, they require a formation, they require affection, and they require attention. If they got that, that

is the best way, number one, the other one is to hug them and tell them how much you love them. The other is spending time with them. The other day is, you know, having a conversation with them in a conversation is also for example, you know, listening to what they've got to say, listening to them with empathy, also allowing them to make mistakes, because we are human. And I also said early on, to give them self belief and to give them positive attributes. So these are some of the ways that you can really enhance the self esteem of the children. You know, this was one was skills you spoke about earlier in our CD, in answer in CD one, that we need to develop self esteem in our children.

How is that going to help in the marriage, it would help in many ways, you see what happens that when you go to help the self esteem, then when you look at the other person, it is not colored by a negative lens, it's not colored by your own inadequacies is not colored by your own, for example, sensitivities for you look at the person, the other person, when the person smiles at you, you accept is coming from the heart, when the person does something good, you do not say hey, maybe these an insidious reason there's something else behind it. And more than all of this, then when you got a healthy self esteem, then you can give love, we've got low self esteem, then you only want to

be given love, you only want to be a recipient of that love. I'm finding an example here that I want to just talk about, you know, relation to the self esteem. And if you know, newly married and you know, quite happy and your husband spending time with you, or the wife spending time with you. And then you see your husband just sitting quietly on his phone, or your wife's, you know, the other way around. If the wife is sitting quietly on the phone, the person with the low self esteem is gonna say, oh, my goodness, he's not happy with me. She's not happy with me, perhaps the chatting to somebody else. And you start reading into problems you see in the marriage, and you go and you sit

next to your wife or husband, and they put the phone aside. So your mind is saying, Yes, it was something private. And then you go and sit right next to your partner and say, Oh, you know, let's do something tonight. And he says, I'm feeling tired. Or she says no, I'm feeling tired today. And then your misguided thoughts are now affirm that yes, there seems to be a problem. And that very evening, he or she is sitting with other members of the family and chatting and not sitting with you and you're not taking it personally. So come the next morning, when the husband says to you, you know, I really didn't like the breakfast this morning. And he's saying it very nicely, because you

and him had discussed earlier that it is something we really don't like we talked about it so we know that

we keeping our relationship open, how can we prevent this kind of thing, and it started from just me

being negative, me having this low self esteem bog myself. Whereas if we had that conversation at that moment, and I verbalized how I was feeling, all of this could have stopped. You see, that's the point. The point is this, that in any marriage situation,

if both parties got low self esteem is a big issue, big issue. Now, if for example, let's say one of the persons is the wife or the husband as a healthy self esteem, and you realize that your husband or wife has got low self esteem, then you able to deal with the game to manage it. But you as an adult, you can also help the person to enhance the self esteem. And how you do that, you got to understand what is it that contributed to low self is often you know, schooling friends and the home especially. And what happens is this, when there's negativity at home, that you are used to fit for nothing, then the child grows up feeling very insecure, the child has a low self esteem and becomes

suspicious. And it's important to help your partner to deal with that. Now, what happens is this, that, you know, in life, the mistakes we make, we are essentially responding to symptoms, rather than the underlying reasons for why a person behaves in a particular fashion. And most importantly, very few people will tell you, I've got low self esteem, nobody, nobody will tell you. And remember, remember that I often said that a person sweeping the street can have a higher self esteem than even the king is not about what you possess isn't about how beautiful you think you are, or what car you own. It's about self acceptance, recognizing that you are a unique creation of Allah.

Going back to my scenario, where all of these could have been alleviated. In the instance, where the young girl says to her husband, you know what, I'm just feeling a little bit insecure. I just felt that you are talking to somebody else on the phone, give me his positive reaction and a negative reaction, what is the wrong and the right, give me the wrong first. Okay. Now, the

the wrong would be

I knew you are like this. Jealous, you know, that's a negative reaction, right. But the other way to say is to discuss it, you know,

to be open about it, and to chat, you know, tell me that, you know, is a Are you okay? Are you uncomfortable about something, you know what I'm saying to you in that way. So you show a lot more sensitivity. Now, you got to avoid the you must use the I, II must say you always behave like this. It's about the eye. And once you learn to engage, it's about really having conversations, without, for example, pointing fingers, because to to the male, that incident may seem very insignificant. And if he lends insignificance to it, it becomes a major issue. However, if he says to her, you know what, I'm sorry that I made you feel that way, and then start the conversation. So in other words,

it must be the must show empathy first, and then go on, and understanding in other words, like, for example, there's one person who went to a marriage counselor, and the marriage counselor knew him. So he said, was quite surprised. He says, Bob, I'm so surprised to see you, it's a man, I have a lot of issues about my wife. And the man said, I'm so disappointed in you. I thought you had issues about yourself. Then suddenly, I began to look at myself to the eyeballs of my wife. And I saw in me three obnoxious qualities. When I rectified it in three months, I was in a happy marriage.

In other words, the bottom line, remember this, those that want to marry, you mustn't think you're a reformer, that you're going to sort your husband out, he's going to change unison I'll be vigilant, I'm going to be assertive, it doesn't happen the only person you can change yourself and inshallah when you are wonderful human being an angel ik inshallah, who knows your husband be inspired to also change, inshallah, on what you're saying is so true. You know, the young couples, you oftentimes hear one side saying, you know, I really, really don't like that aspect about her that, you know, she's always very materialistically inclined. I want to change that about her. I don't like the fact

that, you know, he always shows off about, you know, this car and that car and how many cars his dead has and how he always

He spends time with his mother, I'm going to fix that up. And I'm going to tell you just give me three months. That really is your recipe for disaster. Absolutely, absolutely. Because in the end, I think you're being unrealistic, you have no idea about how relationship dynamics work. And when something is a habit. And it's not easy overnight to make the transformation. Now listening to you through a hole of the first CD and quite a bit of the city address, I realized that in marriage, both sides, the boy and the girl need to have their emotions intact, you know, they must be emotionally stable. Yes, they must be, you know, academically at a at a uniform level, in a sense

that they will be able to talk about worldly things together, and be able to have general world discussions together with both sides, knowing what it what, what we talking about. But even that is not as important because if a girl is in a certain profession, she can educate her husband. And likewise, he can educate his wife in terms of his profession, or his life experiences that he has that she's perhaps unaware of. But here I'm talking about the emotions, I want to know from you. What is the role of emotional quotient in marriage?

I regard emotional quotient as one of the most fundamental things that couples need to have. It is the most effective antidote to marital discord is the most effective antidote to disagreements. Because what it does, as we said, in one of the other recordings, that you are smart about your emotions, you're able to deal with your emotions in such a way that you'd not allow your emotions to overcome you in such a way that it impacts on the other. It's about self regulation, it's about self awareness is about understanding a context is understanding a social situation, that a person that has a high EQ is expressive about his emotions, without hurting the other, the point that I made

early on, when I say to you, I'm angry, as opposed to I'm angry. That's the difference. I am angry. So what happened, they stood dignity around you. And what, what this does, essentially, when you have a high EQ, it helps you to put your situation in a particular context.

For example, you recognize that you know what, my wife and I are happy, you know, this is a situation, it's an aberration, this deal with it. So, when you have a discussion about it, you have a discussion in terms of calmness, and you also know when to have the discussion. And when, for example, let us say, I raised the issue with my wife, there is an issue. And if I could see, I see her

emotions, I see these anger coming up. So I realized, you know, what, it's an inappropriate time to discuss it. Right? Maybe I should discuss some other time. Or perhaps I need to be what he does really shamima It makes you self aware, you will begin to listen to your words. You do not say afterwards, I shouldn't have said it. You are listening all the time. Oh, yes. Yes, you know, so therefore, you find that people that have a high EQ also acknowledge and express the positive thoughts at an appropriate time. And they are able to discuss areas of concern at appropriate times. And what it does, essentially, then, without getting too emotional, the couples are able to discuss

an issue. And they say a problem well defined, is 50% solved. So it's about understanding it, because what we are going to say now to repeat this, you find that when couples have a high EQ, they never get hysterical. They don't go out of control. There is no hysteria in order to curb them, you know what I'm saying to you? Because they're able to express the issues without displaying all of the other things. It's suddenly what happens now for example, if I raise an issue, if

person x raise an issue with a wide AI, you know, you are an eight year old man, I always known this about you, you know, my mum and dad. Suddenly she says to me, I must not marry you. And in fact, I spoke to one of your exes. She also told me the same thing. What an idiot. I mean, suddenly you're

a mom and you want to marry him. Then you say to her, yeah, if your mom and dad

did not want to marry me, then why did you pack up and go, you know what I'm saying to you. So this is so fundamental studies have shown therefore, in homes parents is so important that they become smarter about the emotions that not overreact. They harness the energies without being saying hurtful things, understanding a social context, recognizing, you know, the positive energies when they are there. in that picture growing up, they will also be expressive, but the love, also be expressive when they are angry. But without exaggerating it. Okay, I understand you know how to develop the emotional quotient in children, you know what the parents need to do. However, here's a

case where there's an aberration, this young couple in the marriage, and one of the spouses realizes that the other one's emotions are not, not very strong in the sense the emotional quotient is a little bit low with is often you know, overreaction and everything. What can that spouse do to assist the partner? Therefore, you find you see part of the premarital conversation, you discuss the issues you discuss, what is it that makes you unhappy? How do you express your unhappiness? You understand? Now when we come to that is so fundamental. So I think you need to also show empathy and try to understand the person and therefore, you know, for example, when our parents used to ask us

when we showed an interest in a girl, tell me about the family. However, the first question is, tell me about the family. You know, then you say but Daddy, I'm not making the family says No, son, you are marrying the family. I recall. You know, I met one of our ex pupils she was flying to Johannesburg. She a lot of kids around her you know, she says, you know, Mr. camisa I'll never forget what you told us. You told us when you marry you may thought family said but the whole family, my nieces nephews dog coming with me, you know, and that is the reality because you must understand that happiness is not a selfish emotion. It affects a lot of people. So I think it's

important to understand the person the person is a victim of the past. You need to deal with it, help them and if they require professional help, do that if you're not in a position to help that person inshallah.

In this CD entitled divorce, self esteem and EQ we discussed what are the reasons for divorce, the role of self esteem in marriage, and how to develop self esteem in our children.

And we discussed the role of EQ in marriage and its importance