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Conversation with John
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nacala demon, Ashburn
a man Yes, sir only come to life john Fontaine, just before we begin the podcast please make sure you click subscribe and also seeking notifications. Make sure you check out the earlier podcasts up to around 40 podcasts or far there's lots of podcasts there for you to benefit from. Make sure you check that out. Also, if you can go to the john Fontaine YouTube channel as well. Click subscribe, so you notifications, and also enjoy the other videos is a flick of love series, a series on Christianity and other videos regarding dour also if you'd like to support the podcast by supporting us financially, with the equipment and the travel costs and the running costs, not just for the
podcast, but also the other tower activities I'm involved in, please support on the Patreon account Jazakallah fair Somali council law. Okay. Bismillah R Rahman r Rahim Salam aleikum wa Taala Welcome to the young smarts podcast. I'm here with the biggest smoke from London.
The great deception.
Okay, great deception. And what was even the sign of the hour?
We have to explain what that means. Okay, very quickly, we had an event in Karachi. And it was called the Great deception. Okay, it was about this, the day of judgment and what they had was my picture on the poster. And next to it the topic, the great deception. Yeah, it literally looked like this. I was
The designer in Pakistan, Mashallah, you know, it had the great deception and machine? I see the worst one, by the way. Yes. Again, from Karachi.
Again, from Karachi. Yeah.
That was that the job? Okay, no, no, no, no, no, they were it was I'm not going to name the organization by institution. They were doing a course on the job, right? They had the picture of the chef, who was going to teach the course. And next to him the job?
Of course, I understand what they mean. Yeah, it's a topic, the job is the topic and the shake is going to deliver it. But it looks like that as if he's the law, you know. So advanced panel. I've known you for a long time now. And, you know, I've got a lot of respect for you, you know, for martial law, I believe that you were a big part of bringing me into dour
and nurturing the younger generation.
You know, this is something that you actually got a lot of, I think a lot of people would disagree with you on that when you first started doing that thinking, you know, why are you taking a bunch of newly practice in our converts or whatever you had me the likes of me, Ali, Tao Moosa, you know, others, you know, you took us to like Africa, you took us to Pakistan, you seen that there was something in us when we were young, you know, it's like 10 years ago, we're talking eight, maybe eight, nine, you know, and I remember, I contacted you, because obviously, I found Islam in Africa. And one thing I was shocked about, because obviously, you're from Pakistan, but you have a love for
Africa. And that's something has so much respect for because that's not something
necessarily Pakistan's are very known. Not necessarily known for working in Africa. Yeah. Right. You know, cuz Why would anyone work in Africa? Yeah. But you had an actual love for Africa. And I know you actually went through trials as well. And because you was, you know, you wanted to work in Africa. Yeah. And you actually set up at the time you set up your organization competencia hitting Institute, you know, and so, yeah, I just wanted to get you on the podcast. First.
Can you just tell us a bit about yourself? I mean, you
you know, you come from a family of Muslim family I've seen you know, yeah, I come hungry. La La Mancha, Rahim. Al hamdu Lillahi Rabbil alameen salatu salam ala rasulillah. I come from a scholarly family. My great grandfather was a scholar, his father and then his father, almost five to six and six, five to six generations. They were all scholars, they had memorized the Quran. They were political activists. They were involved in the political movement called the independence movement in India at the time, they struggled against the sacral and the Punjab region, they also struggled against the British colonial rule in India,
at times are faced many difficulties. At the same time, they continued with this, the pursuit of knowledge and wisdom. They studied many
From the Islamic civilization,
commentaries of the Quran, and they took ijazat certificates and Hadees from major authorities alive at the time. So Hamdulillah, I have something to look up to looking behind me when it comes to my ancestors, but that doesn't mean I have a certificate to gender. Or that doesn't mean they're definitely going to gender we pray for them will accept the sacrifices of May, Allah subhanaw taala
bless us with his with their virtues, and May Allah forgive their mistakes and errors. So I have to do my own thing, I have to really work hard
to possibly do justice to the legacy and to leave a legacy of my own behind for my progeny for my children, for my descendants, so that they can look back and say, Okay, hold on. This was
this was a process that never really got broken. You know, it continued. Generation after generation, maybe there was a break of two or three generations, but then it continued. So I really have this advice for my descendants, if they ever see this interview. In the coming generations, maybe it's maybe 50 years, 100 years from now, my advice is to stick to Islam. Stick to the Koran, stick to the Sunnah, be sincere, live simple lives, and live a purposeful life. And the best thing you can do in your life is Tao feasability lukol people to Allah, because Allah is the Creator, he is the most important entity, nothing else matters in this life. And once you do that, you will be
successful, not only here, you will be successful in the hereafter as well. This is my basic advice to my descendants, to my progeny upon, you know, my early, early memories of use upon Allah, if I knew you, I used to see you in Hyde Park before like this recent kind of you know, he went kind of a lot more famous than it was, you know, US debating Christians and different people. And I was very inspired by you know, a lot of your research and things like that. And, you know, I started I was doing dour, like privately and things like that, but you kind of invited me at the time. You invited me. First of all, we went to Malawi, if I'm not mistaken. No, we went to Tanzania. First. Went to
Zanzibar. Write me you mellow. And then we joined the brothers in Malawi. You remember that? Yes, I can. Yes, it was it was about seven years ago, about seven years ago. That was like the first international trip. We went on national I you invited me there. And I think you just kind of took a bunch of young brothers. Yeah, who obviously was keen in the dean, but we needed kind of Yeah, directed, nurturing. And you know, you would give us like lessons you would, you know, teachers had these, you know, little bits of reminders here and there. Yeah. pulling us out when we were wrong. Many times when we were wrong, sometimes with gentleness sometimes with.
It was a, it was a learning experience for all of us. We all made mistakes. And we all learned so much. And it is because of those experiences we had. We are doing whatever we are doing today, except for Mommy, you know, it's because of those experiences. And we have learned so much that that time that period was gold, it was golden. It was a golden age for all of us. Because we were growing and we were experiencing new things. We went out there. We talked to people, it brings confidence to the youngsters who are watching online and offline. It was a good experience for people like yourself and other reverts who came with us. And I have a balanced view on dour. Some people think
that, you know people who are new to Islam, they shouldn't do Tao at all. And some people have this view that they should be teaching everything. Now, I have a balanced view. My view is that people will come to Islam in order to keep the Islam healthy. In order to keep the mind high. They have to get involved in some sort of dour activity, they really have to share the beauty of Islam with others. Some sort of projects like exactly for Islam. Yeah, exactly. But at the same time, they must stop when it comes to complicated questions of theology, for example, advanced stuff.
Having said that, it doesn't mean that they cannot talk about Islam. Absolutely. brothers who are new to Islam, there must talk of a law it must talk about the Prophet why he's a prophet, why Allah exists. Why do we have to worship Allah? Why do we have to believe in a prophet called Muhammad in who was born in seventh century Arabia and why we must follow him all these things are very important. But as we grow with our knowledge, we share Okay, so I have seen many brothers who get involved in our and they are new and they're very energetic. Okay. I've seen
I mean, I was like that myself. I mean, when I started dour nearly 20 years ago, okay, I was very
How can I put it?
I was too enthusiastic to a fault. Yeah, you know, at times, I would make major blunders, major errors. For example, I would go to a mosque and I would see a little thing and I will start making noise that how can you go against Islam? You know,
what I didn't realize at the time that these guys some of these people have been in Islam for the for the last 2030 years. And I've just been born into Islam, and I'm coming and telling everyone change everything because it doesn't really fit into my Islam. Yeah, okay. And my Islam was like five months old, six months old, a year old or two years old. This is where the problems kick in, they start to happen, when you start to think that you know what Islam is what I think it is no, we really have to humble ourselves. We have to learn for a very long period, go through classical texts understand the core, the essence of Islam, and then we will start to get more tolerance, we will
become more tolerant, even towards people who don't agree with, but we will see that, you know, these people, they have their own experience. Yeah, they have their own study of Islam, they have their own, what we call tadoba. Basically, yeah, in Islam, so we can disagree, but it has to be done with due Islamic principles, right? So I have this balanced view that
not every Dyer, who calls to Allah has to be a scholar of Islam. It doesn't have to be a Mufti alarma shekel Islam or anything like that, or even sugar daddies, you don't even have to memorize all of the Quran, or memorize all the reports from the prophet or even,
you know, few, I'm saying,
you don't have to be that at the same time. Someone who is a diet and he puts himself in a place where he can now give lectures on a pseudo Hadees Okay, or sort of Tafseer for example, or complicated issues of theology like fick. Now, this balance has to be struck you have Yeah, 100% even this, this goes for myself before anyone else. Yeah, I don't like to step into areas where, you know, I start to face criticism because I haven't really studied and this is something I advise all the brothers and hamdulillah brothers are very you know, Mashallah. Most brothers are sincere. They listen, they know the place. You mentioned some names like people like Adi Da. He was at times
talking about things that we advise them martial law is brand new to Islam, or when I when I first came, Alito was brand new to Islam. Yeah, I was. I've been a Muslim a couple years, but I've not really didn't know much about Islam. Yeah, you know, is when I met you, you kind of realized and established that look, you need to study more, you need to read more, learn more, because I was fresh as a new Muslim, but not really had any like, kind of truth kind of teaching. You know, I didn't really have a property with you, you have done quite well, Mashallah, you know, I've seen your development through all these years. And you've written booklets you have worked hard towards
building upon your and you've, you
discussions always happen. No, you agree, disagree at the same time, but
we all must, this is a must for all of us, myself, myself, primarily before anyone else myself, I need to stay in my lane. I need to know my limits. I need to know what I can do and what I can't do. Okay, now just try and focus on the basics. 100%. And that's the best way to go. For people like us, we must stick to the basics. Unless we are confident enough in a field that we can speak on it. I mean, of course you you've studied extensively. I mean, you historian, they say this is your topic. You know, this is this is a topic. I'm still a student. Yes. And I don't feel confident about all the history of humanity. No, I don't absolutely not. Can I speak on Greek history? No, I can't. Can
I speak on Roman history? No, I can't. I mean, I know. You know, I know the main dynasties and the Emperor's and their deeds. But do I know the details? No. Okay. So likewise, even within the history of Islam, which I have studied somewhat, I don't know everything. No, that's that's that's the wrong assumption to have. Just because someone is a historian. He has the word historian
next to his name means that he has to have all the answers No, that's, that's a very
incorrect way of looking at things. Rather, even historians have the avenues for example, I like to study and talk on the history of Islam in India, the Indian subcontinent, especially some some of the Middle East, early Islam as well. For example, the first century of Islam. I've studied it somewhat. I'd like to
Talk about that. Okay, maybe the early church, the history of Christianity when it comes to the first three centuries? I can, you know, I feel confident enough to talk about that. So other than that, you know, everyone has to choose an area and focus on that. Yeah. So Paula, you know, you actually heard you actually said something in Hyde Park video, a long, old one fuzzy one before HD. And you said that every Muslim should have a library? Yeah. And from this moment, you know, I started collecting books. Because of you. I'm so happy to hear that. And I just thought, you know, what he's right. Like, you know, and I just, you know, I've got books everywhere, you know, I don't
not read them all. But it's like, you know, you think you need to get around to reading of course, I've read a lot more. But the point is that, and I've been to your house, I've been to, you know, your house in the UK. I've been to from your family, your library in Pakistan. And I've never seen so many books. And I'm not just talking about books. I'm talking about antique books, like, I was shocked, you know, you you're literally being a part of that, like preservation of the Islamic history. You know, you have coins, you have books. Tell us a bit about how this started. Brother john, as you I mean, rightly pointed out that I talked about this
issue, this problem we have
the book lessness I call it the Muslim dilemma of book lessness we were the most bookly people in the world. The Muslims once upon a time, our civilization depended on books. Yeah, we are from a book. Yeah. We are Muslims because of a book the Quran, Quran is a text, it is a book, which was revealed upon the Prophet and the first command from Allah subhanaw taala for the Muslim Ummah in the Quran is read.
Arabic Allah The colic read in the name of your Lord. Okay, so how can we the Muslims be the most uneducated, illiterate people on the
on the planet? This doesn't make sense, not that I'm not that we are. But we can't even imagine that we are the last people on the planet to be in that state where our children are, you know,
performing underperforming for example. They're not the best educators, they're not the best lecturers. Maybe there are exceptions. Of course, I know there are exceptions in all Muslim countries and beyond, right. It's not like, we don't really need the field of education anymore, like we did for over 1000 years. Look, the best libraries in the world, the largest libraries in the world, or in the Muslim world. Cordoba, Damascus, Timbuktu Timbuktu was relatively humble in comparison to Baghdad. Okay, but the Mongols what they burnt and destroyed in the river. Only Allah knows what we lost there. You cannot imagine brother john what we lost in that particular library.
Can you imagine all the manuscripts of the Quran from the first second, third fourth century? We lost there? Can you imagine all the manuscripts of Bukhari Muslim books on philosophy, science, astronomy, had these commentaries on the Koran and the poetry of Islamic medicine? You name every single field? Muslims are booked crazy book maniacs, okay, they were biblio mains. Okay. And unfortunately, after this destruction, we kind of drifted away from this tradition of keeping books, book production, bookbinding, book collecting book writing, book, authoring, all these things. We had pioneered all these things. And what's the evidence? The evidence is the record of our
libraries, you know, how come the second one of the Umayyad caliphs in in Spain, he had a library of 400,000 volumes. So this is when there is no printing press, by the way, every all handwritten, all collected from around the world. He had agents working in places like Baghdad and Damascus and Aleppo, where scribes would be writing books and these agents would specifically buy books for him and send them to Cordoba to Spain.
And 44 volumes alone, catalogued the names of the books, just just the names, just the catalog was 44 volumes.
400,000 volumes, and not even 10% of that survives today. Because wars, political turmoil,
you know, when Spain was lost, all of this was lost with the with the loss of land, unfortunately. And finally, the library of Grenada so you can see how passionate I feel about this. I really feel strongly about this, that we the Muslims have
The mentally neglected
the knowledge of our civilization, and the reasons why that civilization was so great to you think this is the key to actually regaining our Islam 100% 100% we need to become bookly as we were for over 1000 years in the past, right? We still have manuscripts. I mean, you've seen my manuscript some of them, right. I can't explain to anyone at home you have to realize that is your house is literally full of books. Yes. There's nowhere else yeah. To is crazy to the detriment.
Literally, you have them up your stairs. Yeah, I'm so used to describing how
that's the way it is. Yes. No, you're not supposed to. But I'm just saying there's literally books and books and books everywhere. You know. Yeah. Yeah. You know, like Cipolla is because you know, you and I've been to a few I've traveled you remember going to a shower with a shower, you wanted to buy some antiques, you know, he bought and we had to hide you under under a baton hat.
And literally, we walk in through the shower market is not the safest place. But you know, your interview some coins? Yeah, some manuscripts. We went to some antiques in London, I've been I've been over with you and to see suppiler law, that love for the preservation of his heritage. This is our heritage, I believe we must get involved in preserving our heritage, we have to protect our heritage, because with this heritage is attached our sense of identity, you lose your history, you lose your identity. And once you lose your identity, you have nothing to look up to. No, you don't have any,
any legacy to claim. You don't have anything to be proud of. You know, the reason we today the Muslims can speak about are poets or philosophers or thinkers or ghazali is unable to pay me as an worthies and you know, all the maybe olives and half is a Shirazi version, or do in Arabic poets and all of that and beyond. And all our people is because we possess the legacy in the form of manuscripts. And they've been destroyed systematically. By the way, this because we have neglected that. So I'm doing my part, to my, to the best of my ability to protect as much as I can. Okay, at times, I've been with my Indiana Jones hat on you know, you you've been to some of those journeys
with me, the purpose is bringing it back to the main issue, the purpose is to leave this heritage behind, for our progeny for our oma the youngsters for them to take the next generation. Yeah, for them to take inspiration. And I really love this idea in Australia, I came across it. It's called the Islamic Britain of the Islamic Museum of Australia. It's in Melbourne,
we the Muslims, you know, we have built 1000s of massages, which is final 100. Allah massages are blessing places where we pray, but do we need need anymore? What we need is we need more museums
of Islamic heritage, we need more institutions where we can actually teach our children specifically about the civilization of Islam, because this is where we are getting really badly hit because we are completely unaware what happened before.
I want to ask you what what is the most obviously, aside from you know, the Quran and Hadith, what is the most important book in your collection? What would you say that this is one book, which, you know, if you had to protect one book out of your whole collection, this is the one to be honest with you, there is only one manuscript in the world.
Let me explain that
a bit further. When you have a manuscript in your hand, handwritten copy of any particular text, right, that is the only copy in the world. It is unique. You know why? Because that particular copy was written by a particular person at a particular time, in a particular place. And it has its own unique history, you may open a text, which may not be highly attractive for you, for example, for me, but the fact that it was written by a person, let's say five centuries ago, in a village in India, and he puts down the date and the place and the reigning ruler, the name of the ruler that I wrote this book in such and such place at the time when Emperor saw and saw was was ruling, you
know, that manuscript is the only one in the world. Although you may have other copies of the same text, but that particular manuscript is the only manuscript into like that, for that reason, I believe.
Each and every single book, and manuscript is unique, but if if you were to ask me my favorites in my personal library, I would say there are a few I have a manuscript of autobody
Which is a very special manuscript. It's very close to my heart. We discovered it recently in our ancestral library. It is incomplete from both ends, right? The The beginning is incomplete and the end is also incomplete.
And it is amazingly capable Jihad Kitab al Jihad al Bukhari and the commentary of eminent hydrolysed, Kalani, and it is almost 600 years old, very close to the actual period, the actual time of eminent Hydra scholar with this come from India, when it was found in our ancestral my my ancestral library, my ancestors acquired it, where it came from, I have no idea. Obviously, the my ancestors had been collecting for the last best part of last two centuries. And this is such an important book, because this is an explanation of the most important book. Absolutely. And I am so close to the time of Yes. And that's one of the special manuscripts I have in my collection. There
are others, for example, manuscripts with the, in the handwriting of people who were very famous, and they were known at the time, you know, scholars,
they actually autograph the actual copies written in their own hands. We have many examples of that. I mean, I've seen some some some that your father collected when we were there, I remember him showing me like what ends with gold and beautiful writing and different all different types of your tafsir here in this beautiful works of art, because like you said, we're talking, we're not talking about printed books here. We're talking about the majority of your library is actual manuscript. Yeah, you know, the amount of time and patience. You know, I was, I was actually I sometimes contemplate, you know, you currently. I think you've just finished your studying, right? Yes, yeah.
Yeah, I'm still continuing. Can you imagine doing that without a computer? You know,
it's crazy. Yeah. When you think just even just writing a letter. Imagine writing a letter to somebody, yeah, email, you know, the way we type and write these days, we delete, we delete a word, we change a word we copy and paste we like, you know, we how many people can actually write a letter these days without mistakes, with with a pen, most people cannot write in their hand. Because we have stopped doing that. And you know, to use Isaac, books and books like that. And, you know, supanova, what people don't realize are the dynamics of book production. Throughout the Muslim civilization, people think that you pick up a manuscript and you can flick through it. And it's just
a matter of, you know, being impressed by Okay, amazing. But think of the man who wrote that entire manuscript page by page. It took them a long time to do it. You know, we had scholars who were professionally scribes, they would make money from scribing books. And when they had time left, they would study Malala Chari, for example, Mullah Ali Khan, he
was a great scholar in the 10th century history in Makkah, he was a scribe by profession, he would write one Quran,
it would take him a year to copy or to transcribe this entire manuscript. And at the end of the year, he would, he would give it away for some hadia, maybe 10 dinars, oh, I don't know the actual price at that time. And then he would live on that money for the rest of the year, writing another Quran, while he's studying Quran and Hadees and commentaries, and he was a great scholar of Islam, if you read his works, they are amazing. So there are so many examples like that. So good book production was a phenomenon, you know, and this, these are the things we need to really study and we need to teach our children. You know, I want to move on to just briefly because I want to know what
why Why do you have such a love for Africa specifically, and our, I believe Africa is one of the most productive regions, when it comes to results. It is one of the most receptive continents in the world. When it comes to Tao. people accept Islam literally by you talking to them, when you talk to them, they will not reject your message, they will actually accept it immediately. They will not say anything.
They will not argue with you, they will not
reject the message of Islam, they will always appreciate
the goodness of the message. And I have experienced this firsthand. And so have you I'm pretty sure you just have to be there. And people will accept Islam. So I think it's it's one of the most receptive continents. Islam makes sense to them. Yeah, it it, as they say clicks with the fidra. You understand other faiths, which were imposed upon them, and were brought to them by whoever, for example, colonial powers, they have not accepted those faiths. Okay? rationally, those things do not make sense to you if you speak to them about those fates. Firstly, they don't understand they don't understand it. Okay. And if they understand
They don't accept it. You ask them
basic questions about, for example, that faith. And they will say Christianity, for example, because a lot a lot of these people became Christian after colonial occupation of Africa. And missionaries went in with colonial administration, and they preach to these people, and by schooling and medical help a lot of people converted. But if you ask them today,
any random African walking on the street, in Sub Saharan Africa, I'm saying any, if you ask them, Do you believe Jesus is God? They will say no.
They will say no, and I've done this many times. Why? Because it doesn't make sense to them. How can be a man God? How can be a man you know, be God doesn't make sense. This is why Islam makes a lot of sense to them, and they accept it. So it's receptive, I believe Africa is the place to go. And we we should we must put a lot of effort into Africa and inshallah things will change. Shall we finish if you got any final bits of advice to? I think we've spoken about so many interesting things. And it's always nice meeting you, brother, john, thank you so much for this invitation. For john smirks, podcasts, I invite everyone to watch both of John's content is amazing. Alhamdulillah we love him
for the sake of Allah, you know me and Adnan we,
I have a lot of respect for you. You know, I likewise, I have the respect for you like an older brother, but I treat you like we like we twins, we fight we fight you handle all these good. But the point is, we never show respect. Yes. We never let this get to our waist. When we meet, you come to my house, you stay with me. You sleep you sleep at my place.
Absolutely. And he's and he's for the sake of Allah, you know, there's no ill kind of fee never, never. I always tried to show respect. And you know, and I really appreciate, you know, that definite, positive kind of nurturing, I would say, of the US and giving us the time for that. And people shouldn't forget that. You know, you should you should always be grateful to the people that helped you find Islam and helps you find the truth. Yes. You know, it doesn't matter who they are, what sex they are even even if you have a you have to have respect hundreds of people that teach you teach them. Yes. My lawyers are not lawyers, court of law, who the one who does not thank people
cannot find a law. So we have to thank people for whatever little favors they have done to us. And in thanking them, we are thinking alone. And that includes our parents, our families here, and then, you know, you, you know, have stayed in your house, I've met your father and your family. And, you know, you've always, you know, treated me in good manners, you know, you know, especially as a Gora you know, you know, my father actually still asked me to do coming back.
John's been to my house in Pakistan, he loved it. He went, he went everywhere, you know, having all the street food, you know, all the crazy stuff. And I was watching it. You know, I was thinking how is this guy eating all this? And he says provided me he does doll. You remember that? Yeah. You know, when we had the dollar on the GT road on the way to Lahore to Yeah, that was?
That was the real one. Yeah, I guess like,
and also, I was really surprised you being from, I'm telling you, I'm telling the people at home. Right. And I don't know why Pakistan is a living here. Go back home. What are you doing here? I don't know. They don't
treat. You treated like second class citizens here. And most Pakistanis here, they have a house back home. Yeah, they have a family home. To be fair, do you think to be fair, it is self inflicted? Somewhat, this country has given a lot to the Muslims, okay, we have to be thankful we have to give credit where it's due. Of course, there are problems. We know there are problems. There are problems in every society, but living in Britain as Muslims, we have very little to complain about. Okay, apart from the the foreign policy, I don't want to get into that. But, you know, generally, we are treated well. Alhamdulillah we have freedom and we can educate ourselves. No one is stopping us from
going to the university. No one is stopping us from establishing a museum or from establishing mosques. Okay. So far, so good. Right. So there are issues so that being said, Yeah, Pakistan is an amazing place. Absolutely. Now, and Subhanallah there's so much to do this. You know, you can live in Islam of the whole Karachi. Beautiful place. Yeah. Beautiful piece. A lot of culture. A lot of you know excitement. People. Every city is like a different country. Different cultures different if you move from Russia to Karachi, like it's a different country. Yes, it's a completely different human.
Number one, we we we stopped at a service station on the way from fashola. Yes. I went to I heard and I went to pray. And I obviously am combining my salon.
I don't know I wasn't clued up on 150. So I started praying behind them for Maghreb. Yeah. Right. And then I said the for the uncles I you traveling because we're in a service station? He said, Yes. I said, you know, this, and he said, No, no, you so I started praying to record for Asia without telling them right. These uncles God left Yeah, another coach load of uncle's common supreme Missouri behind me. Yes. So I only pray to Rucker right. Next thing. Yeah. And then like,
he doesn't know because at the time there's been a white man who's an undercover right? Yeah. And for showers. Yeah, there was there was some controversy going on because so they thought this guy's anyway I run to you guys is that sauceman
Moosa was with us. And I said, Come on, we have to go we got the cow. Well, and then some brothers contacted me for custody. When they contacted me on Facebook, they said, Look, we recognize you. Yeah. And we managed to calm all the brothers down and we told him zacky and I say it's okay to pray.
So, Savannah, you have to know your effect. Yeah. When you travel and culture. You will tell us look, I remember after that you said, Look, you know, because you in Pakistan, you know, just pray your your your you know, if you combine in just pray alone, yeah. Because we don't want to cause friction. Yes. This is a part of wisdom, right? 100%. This is to be tolerant towards other other
different Yeah. So don't get into people's faces when you go to someone's region, or even someone else's place of worship. Okay. Don't face your story. Don't force your way into their faces. No, okay. Just Just be tolerant. I mean, people are doing their own thing, you do your own thing. Don't you know, sometimes what happens is a lot of our youngsters because they're so enthusiastic, they're new in Islam, they want to force everyone to accept their version of Islam, which doesn't happen in the real world. So we have to really learn in reality pushes people away. Yes, yeah. Yes, yes. And we have many examples, unfortunately, nowadays, where people, you know, they are born into Islam,
they hardly start walking, and they start giving verdicts, you know, on this very delicate, intricate Islamic matters. They shouldn't be doing that. You know, I'm sure you had discussions on this recently with brothers. And I agree with that. 100%. People should know their limits. I think when you lack knowledge, you just think that there's one opinion for everything. Yes. So when you travel when you meet different shapes, when you see that the there's many different opinions that are valid opinion. Yes. You know, it might not necessarily be the most Yeah, we're not talking about popular
opinion is acceptable. We're talking about there's a certain scope Yeah. Which you know, you can do that is allowed. And, and like you say, you have to be flexible. You can't just you know, absolutely, yeah, and I think, I think, you know,
thank you so much.
Demon ash bertola