He Grew up Jewish and went to a Z!onist training camp Then This HAPPENED!
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I grew up Jewish. I grew up in a Jewish household, born and raised when you're young you just think, oh Zionism most most Jews who are around you are Zionist, especially in America. That's just the fact and our counselors were Israeli soldiers from the IDF Yeah, there is an was I remember when I was there, an anti Palestinian sentiment and anti Muslim sentiment, yeah.
There is no permission from the Torah to have any mercy. Before the ships came to former American vessels carrying nearly 4000 Jewish refugees arrive at the port of Haifa, Palestine, and the Muslims and Jews were there living in peace and then from Italy to Palestine. It was not Israel yet. It was Palestine in France. When the Nazis were coming to take the Jews Muslims were forging documents he was just in significant No, no, we don't I believe he's a prophet. What do you think he was? So we're here with Jacob Yaqoob who comes from a Ashkenazi Jewish background you grew up in a Jewish household you went to Hebrew schools studying with orthodox rabbis even went to a youth camp, but it
was you distinguish it was actually a Zionist use camp. That's right. And we'll talk a little bit about your background some history we'll try to dispel some of the myths people right now with everything that's going on in Philistine Gaza. They're trying to make this Muslim Jewish things like Muslims want to eradicate all Jews, you being someone who comes from his background, you can help us to have a good nice context understanding of this inshallah God woman. And so this is the dijo.
was ready to talk about
how much respect I have for the faith of Islam Show. Welcome to the deen show. The Deen show?
How are you hungry? So let's start. Okay, tell me, you're in a nutshell, just for the people that didn't see the program that we've done your story. Tell us a little bit about your background. So, you know, I grew up Jewish, I grew up in a Jewish household, born and raised here in Florida, and not too far from the Dean center, maybe an hour away. And I grew up, you know, mostly secular, you know, but I didn't have no connection to my religion, I was constantly involved with learning Hebrew, learning about Judaism, you know, learning the Torah, and, and learning all the traditions and customs. And I went, you know, from first grade onward, I went to, you know, an Orthodox and
ultra orthodox, they called the Habad. Here,
Hebrew school, and I learned Hebrew from them. And I, you know, I went to a lot of events there. And, you know, later on I started going to a reformed synagogues, they're going from, I guess, the top of the religious totem pole to under the bottom, where it was mostly secular,
still going, you know, Friday night services and learning all the prayers, and I had my Bar Mitzvah. And, you know, I, but as I was growing older, I didn't have a stronger connection, because I felt that there were just some things in Judaism, but they weren't explaining to me about how how life was and how was supposed to work. It always felt like it just kept going against what they were teaching.
But as growing up, I did also go to this, this Jewish Jewish summer camp, and it was in North Carolina, and they, you know, it wasn't really a surprise that they were a Zionist organization. You know, when you're young, you just think i was i And so most most Jews who are around you are Zionist, especially in America, that's just the fact. Most of them are very pro Israel, and they think it's their homeland, and so on and so forth. And we grew up like that's just second nature. So, you know, going into this camp, it was, you know, Jew ish, you know, they still kept they kept the Sabbath they made sure you know, no electronics No, you know, nothing nothing's happening during
Sabbath is a day of rest, you're not learning at work and you're just enjoying every morning you go and you pray and you have the same prayer service and then on Friday night and Saturday morning, that's the Sabbath you go to the you go to pray and it's it's very it's very, you know, involved. But during the day, what you're learning aside from just you know, having the same activities as any other summer camp, you know, swimming sports, rock climbing going in the lake, you know,
you're constantly being fed.
Israeli. You know everything about Israel. It's you learn Hebrew, you same thing. You're learning more conversationally right here.
words here and there to us.
But they they teach you about Israel, they teach you about the geography of Israel, the history of Israel, they even during color, like they have color Wars is a very popular thing during those summer camps where, you know, there are like four teams or so on. And they all fight against each other with sports and activities, but they always have a
one event or theme that they go around. And I remember one of the years the theme where Israeli heroes, and they're all War soldiers who fought in, you know, most of these battles against Muslims. And they treat them like they killed terrorists there the entire time. And they teach about so you know, they kept they kept in our counselors, were Israeli soldiers, from the IDF. Yeah, actively in it. Of course, everyone in Israel has to go to the IDF what man or woman you think it's men, three years, women for two years, something about that? I don't know if it's changed. I haven't looked into that much. But I know for two years, for men, it's a two now two years for women on your
foremen. So all I know is they have to be at least a certain amount of time to serve Exactly. Just to get training. And they're all they're all, you know, active duty soldiers. If they're called in,
then they have to fight. But a lot of the ones who came in were counselors, or they were in it. For the long term. They actually came. They were boot camp training commanders, they were snipers. And at this camp that you are, yes, part of my, in my cabin. I had. I remember one of the years. One of my counselors in the cabin was a sniper. And you know, for bedtime stories. He talked about how he went on and went on missions to assassinate the terrorists. I mean,
I'm not making this up. Whether he was or not as another question, I really hope he I hope he was, but I guess maybe he was just trying to get us all thrilled. But the same thing goes they were they were kind of spoon feeding us what we should think about Israel. And you know, I went to Israel in 2012. I went to visit Israel, I've been right before my Bar Mitzvah. And so I saw with my own eyes, you know, so you were bar mitzvahed? Also, that's right. What does that mean? For someone who just doesn't know what does that mean to be Bar Mitzvah, like you're coming of age, you're becoming an adult. So you know, in Judaism, that's, you're of age to be able to, you know, read the Torah,
you're actually able to study it now. And so a Bar Mitzvah is basically, you're leading that Saturday morning service on the Sabbath. And you you're the one reading the Torah portion, yourself, you're reading the Haftorah, you're giving the hoods by the sermon about the Torah portion. And that that signifies it's the same with women, actually, they do the same thing more so and
I would say the least the less or conservative, or the you know, reform and conservative and some Orthodox Jews will do it to the same extent the click button mitzvah.
And so they'll do the same thing. They'll get up on the menu bar, or, you know, do the same thing.
13 years old for men and 12 year old, 12 years old for women.
And yeah, I mean, usually, for most kids, it's actually just a time to celebrate, and have fun. It's, it's just like a wedding, you'll invite all your friends and have fancy food and party, really, it's a party. That's what it is like for. I mean, I've seen kids spend more money on their bar mitzvah than on their wedding, or with parents.
So it's like that signifies something and I remember in Israel, I was studying my Torah portion of memorizing it, it was Deuteronomy
22 or 23.
And, you know, while I was there at one interesting thing, I remember being in the Golan Heights, which is the contested area where bordering Syria, and we went on a like a Jeep tour through it and I remember there we saw barbed wire fencing and
and we see a sign that says danger landmines so behind there there were plenty of mines it was a minefield and he says we see in our tour guide etc in English and in Hebrew it says minefield but in in our Arabic it says picnic area. Wow. So and it's not the only time that we kept hearing like you know, don't trust the Palestinian taxis. They're gonna rip you off you know, there is an was I remember when I was there an anti Palestinian sentiment and anti Muslim sentiment yeah
and, you know, they were doing an ingest but they didn't they weren't really laughing You know, they do it to so the just so there's there was a minefield, and it was displayed minefield on the Israeli side, but then on the day in Arabic said he was joking. He was he was joking about an Arabic It doesn't actually say picnic area. Okay, but because of you speaking to Americans, yes, you can follow them. But the thing is, they really do think that way. Oh,
I see what you're saying. Right? They they really think that they're, they're just, they're just they're they're just extra. They're just they're like, they don't mind playing around with the idea of oh, he just threw that out there. Yeah. Okay, I see what you say. It was it was it was a joke, but at what he did, but did they hold the sentiment? Yeah. So how was your time at that camp? And then just in general, what was the education you are getting with what was going on with your the neighboring state to neighboring Christians, Palestinians, Muslim Palestinians there? How were you made to view them?
It really was, you know, Israelis are the your are your friends, Israelis are the ones who will take care of you. The Palestinians are not going to take care of you and take advantage of you.
You know, we learned about the war. And I remember while we were at camp, they had a ticket get like a daily counter of Gilad Shalit, the IDF soldier who was taken hostage,
they were they had a countdown or, you know, every for every single day, they move the counter of how many days he was captured for so very anti Gaza, anti Muslim, anti Palestinian rhetoric. That was that was given there. Of course, they would never go into Islam as a religion, never. They just kind of lumped them together.
You know, they,
most of the time, they will just use the term Hamas. At that time, we especially it was because that's when it all kind of started were you know, I was in Canada, which doesn't, he doesn't.
Nine 2009 2010. So that's when you know, it was it was at its peak of you know, this is new. And this is a lot worse than what we imagined, at least in their eyes. So we were getting a lot of that rhetoric just put in front of us. And
it actually inspired me in 2012 or 2013. That year, eighth grade, I decided to do, we have a National History Day where usually Social Studies students who are in like, honors class or something, they will do a project that takes up a good portion of the grade. And they take the day off and present it to people to judge. And it's just you show a historical project. And you know, that it hasn't determined some part of history. And I chose mine to be the Israeli Palestinian conflict. You know,
my award was the most thought provoking because why they can't really choose a side. But what did I end up discovering? While I was looking into I knew when I was 13 years old, that it's not Israel is the good guy and Palestine is the bad guy. That 13 I was already like, Okay, we have something going on here that is way deeper. It's it's it's rooted in something way more chaotic. And, you know, just like,
you know, Dan Cohen, you had him on? Not too long ago, the Jewish also independent journalists. Exactly. He was the
filmmaker of killing Gaza. That's right. Yes. And talking about the history of Zionism, you know, and gee, we're already at that age thinking like, there's more to this. Yeah. And I, of course, I put it on the backburner. Ironically, I left early from National History Day to go to a Jewish youth youth event
on the other side of Florida, but same thing, same thing applies, it was just at that point, it was, I had in the back of my mind that it's not just left and right. It's not it's not white, black and white. And there's a lot more to it, you know, a lot more history that that makes it
not what you think, call me this. So when you hear this statement that's put out there that Muslims want to wipe out Jews or this is a Jewish Muslim thing. What goes through your mind being someone who comes from a Jewish background? Well, I can tell you I had a lot of discussion with my family regarding this, of course, my mom, still Jewish, you know, and she grew up she was part of Hadassah, the women's Zionist organization and
you know, my family's all pro Israel and they continue to be so that's just how they grew up. That's what they learned and, but I've had discussions with my mom and I've brought to light a lot of this history that makes it more clear that it's, you know, when something goes against morality, it should be shown from no matter who is at fault. You need to see that it goes against morality, which of course, it goes against Islam, whatever goes against morality goes against Islam. So I'm bringing forward this is what our religion teaches, do not kill women do not kill children. Do not kill innocent people. And you know
There's no but it's so you know, that's, of course, I have to condemn any, any form of that no matter what side that comes from. And no matter what, there is never a case where collective punishment is allowed. It's not like it's not something that they are asking for. The Gazans never agreed that, you know, whatever Hamas says, we'll accept that. No, they know that they're in this situation where they're just trying to live their life, they're barely living in poverty, it's lower than poverty. They can't survive without the help of the UN. I mean, it's, it's such a terrible situation. And, you know, they gotta give them a way out. So, it's just, it's not something that
you know, if you look at history and the way that Jews were treated in, in, you know, in the historical past with with Islam, it was never like this, it was never Oh, you know,
we're gonna, you do you do a little thing to us. So we're gonna, we're going to completely wipe you out. That's not how it was. It's, you know, it's supposed to be very balanced. And I'd love to talk more about that. Yeah, let me get you, you your reaction. So this is really important. So differentiating, I mean, what you it's very clear in Islam.
How would you categorize in your experience now, let's say, rabbis like this, who are coming out, and they're quoting
the Old Testament, and
they're talking about pretty much no mercy. And this is including children, innocent women, non combatants, there is no permission from the Torah to have any mercy whatsoever.
God, not on children, not on women, not on anybody. How would you classify this Rabbi with the rabbis that you learn from? We don't want to play that game like, Oh, gotcha here. Look, you know, and if there's something that's out of context, what they do with, with the Quran, they'll take one verse, they'll throw it out there. And look, Islam is violent, but you just have to read the verse before and after it. Look at things in context is very clear non combatants, not to be touched rules of engagement. Everything just laid out because we truly believe like a law says, probably Muhammad was set as a mercy to mankind. And we'll get into some of those examples of mercy, where he was
actually fighting anti semitism. And this wasn't even something at that time, because there's Semites also Right, exactly. He's crazy. But they were they were fighting this, this hate towards any kind of people. Right? So now, how would you classify this Rabbi who's pretty much saying no mercy to anybody? Are we? Are we just not understanding him correctly? Or how would you classify this type? Because this, this could be very scary. And we see what's happening now in Gaza. I mean, there's like, no mercy towards any of the kids that are just being annihilated. Right.
I mean, I know what he was gonna say, after that, if you understand the point of this war, he's gonna say, well, it's to fight idolatry, it's gonna, it's about fighting. polytheism. And, you know, we as Muslims, we also are, our whole point is to, you know, is to strive to make monotheism, the main message that everyone can learn about and can can believe in, and should believe in, but what he the way that he's saying it, no mercy towards women and children, that's not even in adulthood. That's not in the Torah. They both explain the same way as the end there to be secure there to be safe. And you know, there. There are a lot of people who will reinterpret the Torah. That's the what
I learned. That's what got me out of Judaism in the first place, is constant reinterpretation of the Torah. I mean, you'll find rabbis all over the spectrum of what they believe about Israel, about Zionism, about Judaism, about how to interpret texts, how, what, what should be followed as far as
how do you
on Passover? Are you allowed to eat rice and beans? Or has it can only be such something so separate? Like, you know, little things here and there, but some of those things are not literal at all. But you have these verses in Deuteronomy, you have him words talking about when you go into a town, just pretty much women, children annihilate everything. Have you seen some of these? Right. A lot of them are misinterpreted, misinterpreted? I think so. Yeah. So um, but now he's, he's pretty much going and saying given a green light? Yeah. Well, that's the I think the way I would classify it is there are three types. Yeah, that what you were saying before, there was three types of the
ones that follow, you know, the ones that are open to Dawa, the ones that are open to listening. That's, you know, you have people like I believe in Salem, who talked about the last time you know, the one of the first major rabbis who accepted Islam, you know, you have sadly been wildly you have others the Chief Rabbi You just mentioned that during the time of Prophet Muhammad
Amid peace be upon him. He saw that this was he fit all the descriptions of Prophet coming. And he accepted him. Yeah, exactly. And he understood, he understood the real message of the Torah. And he didn't listen because he understood the real, okay. He memorized the Torah. Yeah, yeah, he was among the people who actually he knew most of it, if not all of it by heart. And there's a story I'll mention in a bit, perhaps, but
because it goes in line with with how the Prophet Muhammad peace upon him, treated the Torah and treated the Jewish people. But you know, so people like him who they heard the message, and they saw, they saw the stuff that
the Jews at their time, were saying, This is what we believe this is how we interpret the text. He says, no, these interpretations don't make sense. They don't fit in line with, with what how I understood from from what was very clear in the Torah and other parts of the oral tradition, parts of the Tom woods because Tom woods in two parts, you know, the real Oral Law, and then the interpretation of that, and then the rabbi's who are interpreting that are from the same time there's a study a sudden Jesus peace be upon him. We don't really know to what extent I mean, I've written that poem with myself. And I have to say some of their interpretations are wacky, at the
least wacky regarding
a number of things, the you know, what's allowed when it's allowed to lie. In court, for instance, again, versus like a Jew versus a non Jew in court, the Jew can circumvent a can circumvent, or the jury, the judge can circumvent the non Jew in favor of the Jewish person, just because he's Jewish, you can try to slightly squeeze around the law to make it so the non Jew gets convicted rather than the Jewish personnel. I mean, that just shows you there I mean, so this is in there, people will check this out that's, that's in the Talmud. That reminds me the story of
one of the clips from the time of Prophet Muhammad peace of Muslims who came after Ali Ali, or the law when and you know, the story when he was the kala F. And now there was an issue with him and the Jew. And they went to the court, you know about the story, remind me. So they went to the court, and then, like, he's the head of state now. So as the head of state, you would think now hold on the judge. The quality who's there, he's gonna rule in favor of the head of state. He's there like, but then he actually ruled in favor of the Jew. Right? You know about the story. Yeah, I've heard it. Yeah. Yeah. And then
the, if I recollect correctly, the judge he asked him seems like you're upset about something too. Ali. Had a stain. He says, Yeah. Because you you because he addressed him by by his, his Konya or his nickname, or something, almost seeing like that, like, favorite him a little bit. He didn't want that he wanted justice, real justice all across. We have so many examples of this. Exactly. That reminded me when you were talking about there's no slant towards, you know, because you're Muslim, or is justice all across the board? Exactly. That's it, there's, there's justice, it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter.
And, you know, you can see that all across the prophets life. I mean, the other two groups, the ones who this middle one is quite interesting, the ones who stick with the Torah, but still don't believe in the message of Islam right there. But they're, they don't lie, and they don't, they're not deceitful, and they don't try to circumvent or anything. They're a rare group to find, but you'll find one like, in the time of the Prophet peace be upon him. There was one by the name of Mohiuddin. And he was one of the leaders of the other been with
one of the tribes on the Jewish tribes there and in Medina. And so, you know, one thing that we know is that the Prophet peace upon him when he moved to Medina, when he migrated to Medina to escape the persecution of the Mexicans. He established, you know, they made him the leader, but he established the Constitution of Medina, which was a defensive pact between every single tribe who was there, we defend you, if you're attacked, you defend us if we're attacked, and we do not attack each other ever. As long as we're in this pact, and you don't go against the fact that this is this is, you know, created the creation of a state. Really, you know, it's it's the creating a society. And so,
you know, they're
in this when the battle of God was taking place.
The most of the it was happening on the day of the Sabbath on Saturday for the Jews, right. And so there's a statement in Judaism where you're not supposed to voluntarily go to war unless it's fully in defense of your own group. Most of the Jews have thoroughly said no, we're not fighting, because it's the Sabbath.
They're going against the pact, in favor of a preference, a preference that we prefer not to fight. But
mucolytic, one of the leaders said, You don't understand the deeper meaning of this, we have to fight. And it's been, it's been said,
Allahu Allah, we don't know if he really died as a Muslim. Some people say that he does, but it's more, it's more evident that he probably died still believing in Judaism, but he still believed, perhaps the Prophet was even messianic and character. So they, he believed in his prophethood, too, in a way, and is and then but in a different way than other Jews did, but still had a deep meaning that he believed in due to what I read, actually some very clear interpretations, at least you could see from the text, that from the texts of of
the like the later prophets. Anyway, he ended up dying in the Battle of our hood. He was the first Jewish martyr of Islam. And he left an entire field of date ponds and entire garden of date palms, what she actually put in the name of Muhammad sallallaahu Salam. So that ended up being the very first walk for the first Islamic trust in all of Islam, and Islamic history. So, you know, and the Prophet Muhammad said of him, he was the best of Jews. He honored him. Even if he didn't die upon Islam. Again, we don't really know. But from the way it was said, you have the best of Jews, not the best of Muslims who became you know, it's pretty, it would seem that he just died as a, you know, in
his religion, but still honored him for that.
So, because he honored the treaty, and he was he was there for them. And none of the other Jews ever fought for the Prophet, sunnah, except for maybe a couple, a lot of them ended up taking their shahada later. So that's that middle line, right? The rare the rare version of middle just like a double bottom, you know, the the uncle of the rabbi, somebody never accepted Islam, but he defended the Prophet, right. So those two groups are super tiny, the vast majority are what you see in this era of the Prophet is Islam and what you see in throughout, you know, throughout history, and it talks about them in the Quran like this. It's the group who distort their own interest, and they
interpret their own texts differently. They might add something to it or remove something from it, to suit their own desires. Not that the text necessarily had to be changed for them to just omit it when verbally, the they would try to teach the it'll translate parts of the Torah in Arabic to teach some of the Muslims what they know. And then they'd come to the Prophet system and say, what is the verdict done? And they say, he says, Don't affirm it, nor deny it. Just say we believe in the books as they were revealed, or something along those lines, you know, so
did that increase you at your email on your faith? The more you study this, the more you looked into this. And now that when you talk to your mother or you talk to other people in your family, Jewish family that now are they clear at this? I mean, do they know like the history before? Before the ships came to former American vessels carrying nearly 4000 Jewish refugees arrive at the port of Haifa, Palestine, jammed like cattle on the rustic craft, the fugitives and their bleak voyage, which began at a Black Sea port, and went from Italy to Palestine. It was not visited yet it was Palestine. What How did you get the one by boat by boat was to visit him and it was not Israel yet.
Tullman people were coming to Palestine. And the Muslims and Jews were there living in peace and Muslims welcomed anytime they were persecuted. Jews were persecuted. They were welcomed by the Muslims, Muslims were actually saving, helping to protect the Jews from anti semitism from the hate that they were the persecution that were going on there. Right. Even during World War Two, Albania, who, amongst other Muslim countries, they they took a lot of European Jews and hid them and kept them safe. They think suffered as far as in Europe, at least see that has been just thinking if you know that that's like part of that's clear. I mean, you have
David Ornstein. Islam saved the jury jcsa It's their Jewish Chronicles. I mean, you have so many historians just you cannot deny this. No. In France, when the Nazis were coming to take the Jews, Muslims are forging documents for the Jews to say that they were muslims too. So how can how can it's like, is this taught at all? Is this something that when you
Growing up, did you learn about this? No, you didn't know. And, you know, only later realizing, you know, the king of Morocco. When When Hitler said, bring, you know, send your juice to us. He says we don't have your juice here on the Moroccans. You know, it's it's kind of a, it's a statement, right? That look, our people are our people. If they're under us, there are their hours. And that's what the Prophet of Islam he always did that he never fought against Jewish people ever, except that they broke a they broke a treaty or they beat the committed high treason is the only time and even then he was always very, very,
you know, he gave he gave them some leeway. In every case, he always give them leeway. So for instance,
you know, one of the most, you know, talked about story that
non Muslims love to bring up with us is the attack. So they say, you know, it's the attack on Babu, Pura Vida. Yes, that has always been the most
distorted story, I think in the history of the CRO of the province.
You know, this is a defensive pact that they broke. And they weren't the only ones that broke it, all of them. The major groups broke it. And bonaldo They were just exiled for it.
They were exiled but
but Colorado, the first during the first instance of rebellion, they were given a pass, they said, It's okay, you guys can stay there.
But then they broke it again. And they started fighting again, after how, you know, that's not it's not it's not a one time offense, it's to continue to. So from then from that point, the Muslims had to defend themselves. Because the person said, I fear, I fear bunker, whatever he says, he says, take arms, I fear of them. We need to defend ourselves. And eventually they laid siege to the city. Because first of all, they were, you know, they wanted to make sure that their muscles are small. And they needed to make sure that they were safe. And whatever was fighting alongside all the other pagan Arabs, and they needed to defend themselves. And so it was it was very clear.
Once they had surrendered, they said, we we defer our case to Saudi wild, one of the Jewish converts who they trust. And what does that do? He says, I'll judge you based on your text.
And he takes Deuteronomy 20 verses 12 through 14. Saying if basically if you lay in the city,
Lacey, Lacey John you you lay siege on them and continue to fight until they're, they're done until it's surrendered. And when you do kill the combatants, the male combatants, and take the women and children as, as as booty as spoils of war, and enjoy the spoils of war in the name of the Lord your God. She's in the Bible. This is Deuteronomy 20 verses 12 through 14.
It says it right there. It's Bible and you can't if you're a Christian, if you're Jewish, you can't say this is this is this is in the Bible. You know, you can say, Oh, I think they're fables like you know, some people will say, the judgment that they agree to that was in their own text, they agreed to the whatever. So even Wilde said, and that's it. And that's the thing he ruled based on what they would have done if the tables would have turned if the table sort of turned and they they thought based on their texts, they would have done the same to the Muslims, because it's in their text is the Torah. They believe in it. They really do. So that's why they knew what was coming. They did.
And so it's not the only time that during the time of the Prophet slam that, you know, judgment was, I would say justice was placed back in the hands of the Torah. There was another moment, including after leaving Sudan, where he
some some people committed
premarital relations, or outside of marriage relations, and in the Jewish tribe, and they asked the Prophet is Islam to judge judge between them? And socially came to him. Yes, seeking judgment. Isn't that interesting? They came to the came to the Prophet slap. Now maybe they thought that he was gonna be more lenient. Maybe he said, Judge how you please. Maybe he thought they wanted to test him, as you know, see if he was a prophet, because they kept testing him in different ways.
But he said, what, you know, what do you do? What do you rule and they say, well, we we cover their faces with coal and we we lash out, we lash them, right? And he says, Well, what about
versus have an edge of stoning. Because he knew about it. He knew he knew. You've heard about it.
And they say there's nothing in the Torah that says that they said that there's nothing in the Torah that says that. I believe in Salam was there and he says, You are liars bring forth the Torah. And there's a very interesting Hadith that isn't in the main ones. But it's, it's a testament, it's still good. And it's an addition to it. When they brought out the Torah. They actually went to the fort, the Jewish fortress, the rabbi slum, and Abdul Salam, they went to the, the Jewish fortress, where they, they brought up the Torah.
And the Prophet Islam was sitting on a cushion. And when they brought up the Torah, they were about to put it down on the ground. It seemed, he took out the cushion under his, under underneath him, he sat on the ground, and then placed the Torah on the cushion, honoring, because he knew that the revelation from Allah within this, this was a revelation that what we had left of it, right. Yeah, exactly. He honored he knew that the revelation was in there. And he never wanted to, he always treated it with utter respect. And then one of the Jewish priests from from that area came sort of reading but placed his hand over the, the part that talks about stoning. And he read from what was
before it and after it. But um, don't even sit down. He had already memorized the Torah. So when you heard that he says, this is not correct. He lifted the hand from the guy who was reading it. And he asked the other Jewish people to read what he was covering up and it was that was a scholar of Judaism accepted Islam. And even said, yes, yes, yes. So he called them out on that. He called them out on that. And so that so then the Prophet ism says, that's your ruling, I rule based upon your book. And so you know, that's, that's the end of the story. It's, they kept it's because they kept twisting and altering their religion, the powers that he never, he never cursed them for anything
except for things that they did, which went against what Allah has decreed for them. So now you can see with all these games, how the text how it was changed in the past, right? So what they had was altered because they're manipulating the text, Allah calls them out well, to those who write the book with their hands and hold to them for what they gained by that. Right Allah is saying, See, that's why the Quran was sent. Exactly the last and final testament authentic preserved. And we haven't It's original, and those who saw the fulfillment of the prophecy that's in their mention of the communist problem. Muhammad is there. Right? Right. It's true. And Prophet Mohammed ISIS them
whenever he heard, if he revealed some, if Allah revealed something in the Quran, and then the prophet has some, he would, he would not deny if a Jewish person wanted to come in and seek His counsel, they would come in and they'll say, you know, they'll say, I've heard Do you wish to know about this? This is what we've heard about the Day of Judgment. This is what we've heard about this. And they'll share the stories of what they know. And they line right up with the court and they affirm the court. And when every one of the prophets or someone hear that, what would you do, he would start smiling and laughing? Because he loves hearing the affirmation that this, like, he gets
a revelations, you know, PC upon him. And, and he gets affirmation from what is what is previously revealed that clearly was, was previously revealed. He, he doesn't dislike being in, in this vicinity. And so it's only in the cases when they were fighting against him already, so to slam that's when he had to draw lines, but he never
oppressed them, even even when, during like the Battle of High Blood, for instance.
And that's where, when we're not did, you know, they,
the because they broke their treaty the same way.
They, you know, they went and they fought, but then even after the fighting, they let them stay on the land. And they just shared in the crops. They always because they asked, Can we stay here? They said, Sure. They asked, they got leniency. They didn't say
please let us be and they say no, you're you all need to die. That's not That's not the first time that happened that consistent leniency whenever any type of intercession whether from them or from someone else, they say please have mercy on them. There was always mercy. So this is something this is totally false. It's a lie. It's something that's perpetuated by people who have just no historical context, no historical references to this that and it's clear that clears day for anyone who looks into this that and and then
As Muslims, because Muslims historically do not have a history of persecuting Jews, they don't, actually, actually. And this is not to step on any toes from our Christian friends and neighbors, but it's actually the Christians who are persecuting the Jews, that if you want to go down, listen, don't have and this is just historically, this is the
facts, right. And we're not trying to hurt anybody's feelings. But it's a strange relationship now that a certain group of people who were protected, and they ran to from persecution from the Christians. Now, I don't know maybe some of the Christian Zionists have this guilt now. And now they're actually supporting this injustice in justices that are happening happening against innocent human beings. So the whole love, love, love is out the window. And I don't know if you know much about the prophecy that they're pushing to try to be fulfilled from both. So you have a Jewish prophecy to trying to fulfilled? And can you the only thing about this and then the Christian
community? Can you elaborate on this, I think the majority of it come from the Seventh Day Adventists where they believe that, you know, once a lot of the a lot of these groups, you know,
they're not the only ones there are other religious groups as well, that believe that it all comes down to the coming of the Messiah. And whatever happens, then it's like, once the Messiah comes, once it is said, I'm like Jesus peace be upon him, we believe he will come down and fight the Antichrist at the jail right?
Now, whoever is a partisan with the Messiah, they're the ones who are going to wipe out the, you know, the evildoers. So, the, for the Christians, they believe it's the second Sunday Adventist, you know, once he comes and all the Jews will be killed, because they're, and all the all the Muslims will be like, you know, because they're because they realized they were wrong, and that they're not even going to see that it's useless, and so on and so forth. You know, I might be a bit wrong about this. But it's, it's still a general principle. And the Jews have the same understanding of the Messiah, it's not necessarily the death to the same extent, well, I accept that the prophet is
in before will hurt before it's coming. The reason why they were in Arabia in the first place, was because they knew that the last messenger was coming. That's an important point. Yes. Why were the Jews around this area because they were expecting a messenger to come the final messenger and they would keep telling the house in the hut and hydrogen, the people of yofoto or Medina, for it was Medina, they would tell them, once our prophet comes, we will we will fight against you and kill all of you. They will say that multiple times consistently so then why didn't they when they saw all the signs, they knew that he was like Allah, so they know him like they know their own father's? I'd
like to bring forth the story of Sofia bintray them Mother of the Believers, may Allah be pleased with her. You know, the wife of the Prophet peace upon him. It was Sofia. Well, the her father, her yay, was one of the chiefs of Manuel Pinaka, one of the other
tribes in in that, you know, in that area at that time.
And while she was very young, she always her, you know, her uncle and her father, they were very playful towards it. They give her a lot of love. But there was one day when they heard about the Prophet isis that when he was when he was, they heard about he was the chief Jewish leader of that tribe. Yes. Okay. So she overheard them. After one day, they realized that she wasn't getting any attention. So she decided to listen in on them.
And they they were speaking to the uncle asks the Father, is that him? And he'll say yes, after they want to go see him to investigate even further, right.
Is that him? They said, Yes, verily, it's there's no doubt that it's even they confront and this is coming from her testimony. Right? Yes, yes. And then he asked, What are we going to follow him? And she's and the father said, No, barely. He'll be our enemy until the end of time. Now, the question is, why? Is it because he wasn't one of their own? That's part of it. Because they believed that partially because they believe any, any of the people of Ishmael have a you know, he's married and SLM. If they came from his descendants, they believe them to be cursed in a way or at least they believe the because you came permission now. Yeah, because they don't believe they didn't believe
your profit. That's that racism now that we're better than you. So is that the that's the main reason. It's not better, per se. It's that they they already had a
they already had some, you know, somebody in there in the past of the rabbi's basically interpreted things this way. To say that you know, only
Profit profitable only came stemming from is it Sudan? And wouldn't it wouldn't come from another direction. They have already ruled they're confirming this is him, if confirmed everything case, but it's based on not just that, but also, if he comes, what happens to their wealth? What happens there to their society? What happens to the power that they had? They had the same issues with the professor Islam as the pagan Meccans. Same issue, right? What's going to happen to their wealth? What's going to happen to that? They had all this power in their society. I mean, they were constantly going between the house and the house on edge, but they had there were a lot of Jewish
tribes there, they had a lot of power. Yes. And so they use that, and the distortions of their texts to affirm their position. Right, but it doesn't take a lot of research to know, you know, I don't even sorry, I didn't take. He didn't hesitate one bit. In fact, when he was asking,
you know, asking the questions, right, the the famous hadith of what, how he became a Muslim,
you know, what's one of the first sign of the first portion of the hour? What are
what's the first meal in agenda? What is? How do you determine the
the gender of a child or the likeness of the child, you know, but right after he said, that, professor said, Well, God and Ali Salaam has informed me of these answers, and what was the response? God is the enemy of the Jews? Why did you say that? Because God, Lani Salam always came with the bad news, in their times, right? Always came with
the, you know, the commandments of war always came with bad, you know, so they considered him to be a bad omen, because they believe in bad omens. And so, but the thing is, is that didn't deter and I believe in Sudan, because what was the response as well, the prime minister said, and then reciting the Quran, saying those who take God literally Sudan as an enemy, and continued and from there, then he told the three answers that were
extremely accurate, that only a really properly learned rabbi would possibly be able to know.
So on the spot,
after he misled and took his shahada, and said, Verily, the Jews are liars. And if you were to ask me, if you were to ask them about me, surely they would invent a lie about me. And, you know, that goes back to that story that I remember talking about last time.
At first, he was the best of the best. And the second, he took his shahada in front of them, he is the worst of the worst, and started creating lies about him. Yes. When he when he asked them to ask, ask them about me who I am, right. So and then they confirm he's the best of the best. And then after he exposed that, no, I accepted Islam, actually, oh, he's the worst of the worst. So this goes to that whole third category, right? of, you know, the worst of the worst.
You know, there's the unfortunate aspect that a lot of you know, a lot of Muslims, they may not know anything about Judaism, but because of what's happening, and because of, you know, misunderstandings of a hadith like the,
the killing of the Jews in the time of DeGette. Like, they don't know, it's about a digit, they just think, oh, you know, we're gonna be killing Jews. Like, that's not how that works. And that's not who you see now. And that's, and it's a very, very vague statement. And you shouldn't just accept whatever you read as, as like, oh, you can interpret it yourself? No, you have to know the whole history of why like, why why, why would they be fighting? Well, it's easy. If the Jews don't believe in it study. So then, then who's the first Mr. Messianic character who's going to come, it's going to be at the jail, it's going to be the Antichrist. And it will come with everything that will
confirm what they have, but distorted because they've already had a distorted so of course, the Jewish people are going to follow with the gel first, it's not even a question in my mind, that actually was one of the reasons why I was I was certain that it's an was the truth because it explained how, right and I knew that that's their understandings of the Messiah and how they interpreted it would make sense that you follow it, at least from their time and who knows how a digital will, you know, convinced them? May Allah protect us? But that's, that's just it, you know, it's, it's not, it's not that you should consider everyone to be your enemy. In fact, and this is
what we're talking about, you know, anti Jewish sentiment even at the time, the prophets Islam when, when Sophia
was, was married to the prophets, Islam, right, once she became very first, you know, she was kind of a, she was seeking refuge with in high bar, but then after the Battle of High but she was just there and the thing is that she knew she believed in the price then so while she was taken, you know, really as
As a refugee, you could say or captive. But the second that she sees the Prophet son, she takes her Shahada.
And the Prophet ISIS son was was he was shocked. He says why? And that's when you get the story. And they weren't married immediately. And while they were married, they were walking around their camel, right? And the camel falls down.
And the Popeyes slam is sheltering, Sofia, but the women around say, May Allah may Allah do away or or
do something with this Jewess.
At the time, and this isn't a hadith, this is
the woman who had anti Jewish sentiment, even to the wife is freshly married, fresh off the block freshly married to the Prophet, peace be upon him, and that's how they treat her. There were there was even animosity between the wives that at some, you know, some times and and the thing is, Sofia had to had to maintain her honor. And so that's unfortunately, and it has nothing to do with Islam. It just has to do with preconceived notions when they're when, you know, if there's this large group, but it's not the only people like you just have a large group who that makes up what you know, the Quran is always talking about the majority of other people, not all of them because it
says, and the believing Jews and believing Christians, right? And it talks about the, like the Mercy of Allah being upon those who truly understand and they're separate, right? It's not, it's not about it's talking about people who corrupt and they do wrong. And that's what we're seeing now as well, you know, so it has nothing to do with
Muslims versus Jews. I think we could put that to rest on any person. I mean, if they're their heart and minds open, they can see it there. If they're looking at history, if they're looking at
the text, stories that you're sharing with us, I mean, it just pretty much very clear that this is not something that is a Jewish Muslim thing. And Muslims do not have a history of persecuting Jews. And Muslims don't hate Jews, Muslims hate injustice, right? Muslims want to live together in peace, Christians, Muslims, and whoever else is there out there? As long as they're not oppressing you or stealing your home stealing your land? Obviously, that's the issue here. Right? And yeah, it doesn't mean that there's never injustice from any group. When you have a group of unrighteous people, whether they be Jewish, Christian, Muslim, if there if you're not going by morality, that which God
has sent us, right? That which Allah has sent and revealed to us, if we're not going by that, then I reject that. And everyone, everyone as a Muslim should reject that. And so those people who look into history they say, Oh, look, the Muslims look the oppressed, this Jewish, these Jewish this Jewish group, oh, they did this. And I say, look at the leader. Do we do we align ourselves with that leader? You say they're Muslim, but look more into it. And you can go deeper you can you have the most honored woman in Islam as a Jewish woman, do s woman, Mary, medium, chapter named after her in the Quran, Jesus is Blessed Mother. Why would Prophet Muhammad go in honor this Jewish Jewish
woman, Muslim woman will accept because most of us want to submit to the will of God. Jewish is just in the nationality, right? How would you define someone can be a Jew? That's their nationality? or ethnicity? Ethnicity? Yeah, right? Exactly. She was of that ethnicity. But she was one who submitted her will to God to a lot. She was a Muslim, and she's honored in Islam, Jesus also please be upon them. And you mentioned him a few times want to get your reaction to this.
From from a Jewish point of view, or we don't believe in the divinity of Christ. There you can make an argument that the the Gospels which were written he was just off it and significant No, no, we don't I believe he's a prophet. What do you think he was? What do you what do I think he was historically, I think he was a Jew who tried to lead a revolt against the Romans and got killed for his trouble, just like a lot of other Jews at that time, who were crucified for trying to lead revolt against the Roman and get killed for their trouble. Jesus will conclude with this. We'll talk about this for a few minutes. This is a person who's on the front line. He's out there. I don't know
if you know about this individual, Ben Shapiro, Shapiro. And he's stirring up a lot of hate. Right he started he's he's not trying to de escalate things. He's been known to call a certain group of people, Muslims, the Palestinians, pretty much animals and he's, you know, kind of stuff that he's saying. So now when you come in here towards Jesus, peace be upon him. What do you think in contrast with now, you becoming Muslim accepting Islam, what we believe about Jesus? I know one of your previous guests had spoken about how there are
lot of different opinions on Islay Sam.
And, you know, it's there there are different
interpretations of how he should be whether he's just, you know, just a rabbi who taught, but maybe didn't go in line with, you know, the because he's he's, what's his belief if you ask him as a Christian, someone who follows Him and you love Jesus, you ask us, so we love him, right? You can't be a Muslim unless you believe in Jesus. You go to the Hellfire disrespecting him, but he's pretty much in a nice way. Is it not a consensus there that pretty much he's not coming out with it, but they believe that he's like, in the lower depths of hell Jesus.
Most Jews don't even really believe in hellfire validate, most don't. So what are they? What What's the belief that Ben Shapiro would have about Jesus?
To be honest, Ben Shapiro, he follows the same line of rhetoric as every other Ultra nationalist Zionist. He's not following. To me. He doesn't follow pure Judaism, because he doesn't follow the rabbinical. He was on Aleksa. He was up there he was, yeah, he was one of those people who first went up there. And before you know, what even happened a few weeks ago, I know there was a very popular who's there? Yeah. And stirring up trouble. That so you know, just because someone calls himself Jewish, doesn't mean that they are the resounding voice like, what what? Which, which rabbinical school? Did he go to which yeshiva did he? Did he study in to get his? No, he's just, of
course, I have no scholar, either. I'm just repeating, you know, Hadith and things like that I am in no way learned. And I shouldn't even begin to say that I'm probably made a lot of mistakes today. But he never admits to his mistakes. That's the problem. Yeah. And people take him as a as a Jewish like almost scholar authority, but he has no authority. And he doesn't understand his own religion. He's just, he's doing the same thing that the right wing Ultra Nationalist government is doing, which is reinterpreting the Torah. They're going against the ultra orthodox community. They're, they're oppressing the ultra orthodox community in Israel. I think he's using this for his own
benefit. Now. I think he believes what he's saying. Because he's, he's in line with, you know, that group. Yeah.
But it doesn't mean that he are they equivalent to like the kk k of Christianity and the ISIS Daesh that people? How would you? How would you equate them what they follow a similar ideology, ideological pattern, but that doesn't mean that they're fully extremists. There are fully extremist Jews out there. The ones who are the settlers that are gunning down innocent Palestinians in the West Bank, in their illegal settlements, you know, that's different than, you know, the ones who they just agree, but they don't necessarily, you know, so they're, they're getting close to extremism, but they haven't crossed the the main border, as far as individuals go, you know, a
collective as you know, the Israeli government and the IDF and what they're doing against the Gazans like that those are war crimes. It's not even a question. Yeah, if there are more crimes, and it's, you know, it's unquestionable how bad it is, and, and how, you know, God, God doesn't put mercy on their efforts. And they're only going to they're only going to suffer for what they're doing in the future. You know, so do you think if
knew what we believe about Jesus, because they're waiting for a messiah to come? Right, so this is the Messiah, he came, you missed it. He's, he came already. But now, like, when I was speaking to my last guest, Stanford, Stanford, pass, he he believes that if you know, the sincere, those who are really looking for the truth, because now they have a twisted understanding about Jesus, because certain people have elevated him to a God, little son of God, and it's all in all these other made them divine, and that goes against the first commandment. Right? Right. But if they really look into Islam, and they see like, hold on, this fits the description of the Messiah, that like you,
obviously, you accepted him though. Right? I think part of it is
I read the Bible before I read the Quran. And I didn't find anything in the New Testament that rose Jesus specie upon on to that level. And, you know, I don't agree with Paul. I don't consider him an apostle. He I don't believe he saw Jesus the real Jesus in Damascus. I think he saw the shaytaan in Damascus because he only saw a bright white light but if you really see a prophet we know in our you know, because of the Hadith and how it the professionalism says if you see me in a dream, surely you have seen me, but that means he has to take the exact same form. Yeah, every single aspect of his of how he looks must be seen. If he's a bright white light. He's not who he says he is. He had to open
the shade on it.
So devil, yes. So I cut out everything after the four canonical gospels. Really? I mean, as far as the power of the Pauline Epistles go, if you just read, and of course, there's no, you can say chain of narration of who said what in the they say it's divinely revealed? I say, how can that be when they're just people who heard this, this and that. And it wasn't even in Aramaic. It was in Greek. Regardless of all that, you know, all due respect to the religion of Christianity, but I saw flaws as I was reading the Bible, and I was open minded, I was asking Christians about how to understand this metaphysically. But Jesus peace be upon him, had said, the first commandment. The first is, if
we're going to if we're going to the most important thing to follow from the book, fro from the Torah, or the most important thing ever to note. He said, the two things are
the Shema, which is here, O Israel, the Lord is your God, the Lord is one. And then the second thing is Love your neighbor as yourself.
And if that's it, and the first thing was pure monotheism, why would and there's there's no proof of any Trinity, there's no proof of, there's no establishing a pure divinity, there's what you call the divine passive, which is voice where you don't know if he was just speaking, the revelation, the actual energy that he was given, when we don't know whether whether it was a hadith or had narration from him, or whether it was revelation of actually from Allah from God. So there's all this right. And if you look into that, and you really dive into that, whether you're Jewish or Christian, you'll find not only was he a prophet of God, he was one of the most truthful, one of the most peaceful,
one of the most
worshiping people, and he had this essence of pure monotheism. Last question, we'll conclude with this, what would you say to, to an Israeli Jewish coming from that background? The same way, we would also condemn? I mean, we talked about this earlier, we don't human life is precious life doesn't matter. From what background race, creed color, this is straightforward. So we don't have a problem condemning, you know, any human life. You know, this is clearly something that is as evil. But now somebody, you know, you've seen some of these videos, mocking. Have you seen any of these mocking some of the people who don't have water basic
essentials for life and mocking some of these stuff? What would what would you say to to someone who maybe has taken a certain people who are your neighbors, right? They're, they're your neighbors, and now you're taking them as animals is?
dehumanizing, you know? How would you get for them to look at the human element to look at the human side to, you know, touch their hearts, you know, coming from a background now, and you really know what Islam is, you know what being a Muslim is all about? How, how would you approach if you have a one on one conversation with someone who's of that mindset, the Zionist mindset, Jewish mindset. And you know what, it's just the camps they went through, like you. It's something coming up, right? Right. You have a lot of people who are also coming up, but they like you. They looked and saw, there's more to this, and they went investigated, and they're talking a different tone, we can maybe
play a video real quick, that people can see it's people from all different Jewish Israeli backgrounds who are speaking up on behalf of the injustice has happened, and they're siding with the Palestinians here. What would you say?
Well, I would say if, you know, why don't you side with or why don't you identify the side of your Israeli brothers? Who who see the injustice? Why Why aren't you siding with them and seeing that killing innocent civilians, women and children, when children make up a third or more of the deaths that we see the killings in Gaza? How is that justified? And you can't say, oh, they're going to become terrorists one day? No, they're not the vast majority of people in Gaza by every news source or every media who is actually in their whose recording. They're not there. They're not training to that's not what they want. And all they want is to end the oppression that's happening and the
suffering that's happening, that doesn't justify an attack on Israeli civilians. It doesn't, because if they were truly innocent civilians, women and children who are dying, that's against our religion, and we don't side with that. But that doesn't mean that collective punishment is allowed. And under what under what case? Would you say collective punishment? Is? Do they ask for it? No, they didn't ask for it. Why would they ask for it? They're only trying to fight for their lives. They're barely hanging on as it is. I mean, all you have to do is stop listening to the same one tone media. Stop listening to the people who you grew up with saying the same message over and over
and over again.
It's the same as following the religion. You're just following Zionism as a religion, instead of following Judaism as a religion. Thank you very much. Thank you very much Zack. Hello, hi, Armenia. I cannot leave without giving you a gift if you're not yet Muslim and you tune in and see what these Muslims are talking about, and you'd like a free copy of the Quran, go and visit the deen show.com will take care of the postage and everything and get it delivered to you. And if you still have some questions about Islam, call us at 1-800-662-4752 We'll see you next time until then Peace be with you as salam aleikum. I'm sure all of you know Eddie from the D show. And I'm sure that you've all
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