Agnostic Challenges Muslim on Slavery in Islam

Oh yeah, Islam being slavery being permitted in Islam. So I spoke about this

a couple of months ago with Mansur and

one of the claims that came up Oh, and shamcey, as well. And one of the claims that came up was that

they're more like servants. It's not as though kind of they were forced to be saved. What was your contention is that Islam forces human beings to be slaves? Yeah. Okay. In that case, I'll give you one piece of evidence. That's in chapter number 24, verse number 33,

which talks about a process called

the slaves and they work for slaves at the time when

he came to forbid they said, You can't call them slaves, and you can't call masters this whole thing. It cannot exist anymore. Those individuals who

say indentured servants, those individuals, who are, let's say, trapped against their will prisoners, if they weren't prisoners were captured as a result of wars, or they were already in the pre existing slave trade before

they could do something cool.

Now what is what

is the ideal

indentured servant goes to the master and says to the boss, I demand to be freed. Now, according to the Scirocco, to be one of the main seminars of SEO, which is the extra Jesus, He says that if

an indentured servant, someone who is referred to commonly as a slave comes forward, and says that I want to be freed and run some myself, in other words, all the pain.

And I'll run some myself. There's two opinions among the classical jurists. One of them, which is attributed to the classic companion companions

is that if, if an indentured servant he was a prisoner who comes forward and says, Look, I want to be free, here's a contract, and I'll run some myself for 200.

In other words, I'm going to, like you do in America, you know, ransoming and all these kind of prisons,

that was necessary, is that he has to do that. In other words, he has to be free. Who says that I was supposed to be such that

this would mean to say, and the only condition is in Ireland,

if they know in them good. So in other words, if they are people that are not, let's say murderers, or rapists, or someone who wants to create some kind of corruption in the land, that have good in them,

if that, if that condition is fulfilled, there's no reason to imprison someone in their house, if they are telling them the person that they want to be free. So you could say from this perspective, Islam is the only religion in the whole world that has come to do away completely with the pre existing framework and slavery framework that we have. Yeah, so I've got a couple of like counter evidences here. Mohammed, why

is that how you pronounce her name?

Was she not initially a captive? Who asked Mohammed? Can I be free at first? And Mohammed said, No. And then after that happened, her father came and tried to pay ransom to get her back. And Mohammed still said,

Marita, this is wrong. There you go. Thank you very much. Wow. She hates Oh, hold on, hold on, did not give her freedom when she first asked though. This is you have to understand things properly. Let's get a better example of a profound example.

I'll take I'll take that as well.

Maria, Maria. Yeah, she was given as a as a gift.

And she was a slave. In the Egyptian lafountain Empire, she was given as a slave by the Christians.

What he did is that he made a wallet, which is that he had a child with

his infancy, which gave him pretty much all of the rights

and

the rights of the lives. Now, the point is, you have to understand that because you came in a place where there was slavery and you have to deal with the issue like

he was a slave, the black man

he bought him, you have to buy him in order to sell them. Same thing applies now with middle Katia, I have to accept her as a gift in order to give her otherwise

which means I have to give her you have to accept her as a gift. First, you have to accept parts of the slave trade in order to fix it. So this is a realistic, practical, pragmatic way of dealing with the problem of slavery.

You're in the 21st century. Maybe your great, great, great, great granddad was a slave owner, I tell you something, if you look

to be let's be fair, and you were in the kind of heart that they used to wear in the colonial, I just I just tell someone, I'd be wearing a straw hat so that they can identify me. No problem. I'll just have a joke with you. Yeah. Well, I'm saying is that the West in order for it to come to a place where Islam came to have to have to develop for 1000s? So basically, Islam was 1400 years before the western

abolition of slavery in many Arab Muslim countries didn't occur until 1968. That was Iraq. 1960s. It's the Gulf states. Okay, thank you for,

like, 2000. So Well, I mean, look, if Islam was gonna be judged on what Muslims do,

okay, but like, he did kind of decide to say, like, you know, the West was a fountain, the behind Islam on slavery. So

I'm saying, Okay,

well, we do need to go there. Who said that? Because now what you've done is you create another straw man, and a straw man, for a man wearing a straw hat is something which isn't easy, but basically was a straw man argument. a straw man argument is when you cannot deal with someone's main argument, they create another argument.

Why is it? Why is that a straw man argument? It's a straw man argument is because you're conflating what Islam is, which is primarily on Asana. With what Muslims do, and I'll tell you something, if you do that, but I'll tell you,

because I know Muslims are sinful people, bad things, in the course of 1400 years, if I was gonna stand here and defend Muslims, I would use every argument.

Maybe not every argument

I made to defend Islam. So when I say, Western discourse, I was talking about the western legal framework. Let me tell you something you didn't know. Did you know that in the abolition of the abolition of slavery, even,

even up until the 1940s, into the Second World War period, you see that when they said the abolition of slavery, they didn't actually mean it in a full set. And it was a powerful was a cause of the law, that we must the slave owner,

he would continue having to sleep in that house for six years. And this was like an apprenticeship

was an apprenticeship. This was in 1940. And now we're talking about 1980 was the country so that he was talking about something in the West that occurred, which is almost tantamount to slavery, which actually, if you think about it deeply?

This is more

like, like, if that's true, and not a slight misrepresentation of the British legal system, then, okay, great. Like, but I i'm not i'm a little bit skeptical about that. I'd have to go and

double check up the in terms of jawara, though, Yes, she did. She does offer like

a free class. I believe that this is true, according to the Islamic sources. And then the common trying to like,

the way it works, generally.

If you've admitted this yourself getting married.

In the end, yes. Generally, that was what was that was?

Initially she tried to know, within a walk like that.

I have to okay.

It's initially from Wikipedia, but I don't know. But I think we'll find an Islamic source in the end, though.

Islam itself COVID.

Yeah, and this hadith

himself, which says that if the woman doesn't consent to the marriage, then the marriage is invalid. So here, we have to understand something right. Generally speaking,

make the case here, it will be very difficult for you to make the case that Joe was being forced to be married. No, I'm trying to make the case that is an example where a slave in the possession of Mohammed

or like a war that he possessed, can I leave?

She was given full rights, as you would have to be given when she was married to them. Before this was one of the strategies that was employed by

the company and giving the youngest play by the rules because you have conventions of the time. You have slave slavery going on. How are you going to deal with bias

and bias a

bias laid married asleep, all of those things eventually lead to

the freeing of the slaves which is the objective, so

difficult for us to make the argument

that Islam actually is a system which attempts to bring in

an impossible

especially in the Quran, it says

what would make you know what the good way is?

The best source I can find at the moment is from a book written by Robinson.

Like I suspect that came the source will eventually be finished

is

what it was before the elections, right? No.

Books of Sierra, why is the pirate ship

they don't have any

strong authentically, okay. Okay. So

it's not within their remit to just put in strong Honey. Yeah, he didn't, they didn't do the full kind of process. They didn't want to because what they assumed was that it matters to do with history. That it's not, it's not needed to do that now. Okay. Why? Because it's not gonna happen.

On our freedom, life trajectory.

So in other words, the books or

the books or like biography, filled with wickedness or sometimes even fabricated ideas. Okay, don't accept okay.

Yeah.