Thrown in a Well – Episode 22

Bismillahirrahmanirrahim

aalameen or salat wa salam alata man, Camilla and a faithful killer marine. The Buna Mohammed involved early he was a big marine of any standard base una de la yo Medina sama, Marburg cinematic La La he a worker to, there are certain sisters.

This is the 22nd 22nd lesson from the series on the fear of sort of use of Allah ceram. This one's going to be going to include, if you like a, a short

tangent at the end, which we'll be discussing the topic of depression, and Islam. This is a topic which is,

I think,

something a lot of people want to know about. The key question is, can a mint suffer from depression? Or is it the case that a person who has week a man suffers from depression? This question will be tackled towards the end. And the reason why we're doing it here is because in the verse that we'll cover today in sha Allah, verse number 7081, to 85 or other 86. These verses are about jacobellis salam expressing his long standing grief, sadness and sorrow over use of Alison I'm, so I kind of fits in with this already. inshallah, we'll be taking that towards the end. But the scene so far, is that the scene we left off at is well, the brothers are there in Egypt. Now for

the second time, they are holding their heads in, in anguish, that, look what was happened. Binyamin, the youngest of us, and the one who's second most beloved to our father, has now being taken as a slave to Aziz. And we got to go back until that about what happened. However, the eldest of them, pilot Kabira, whom

he's not having it, he said, we can't go back like this. In fact, myself, I'm post self exile. I'm going to stay here in this foreign land.

Until dad comes and gives me permission or sends permission for me had the Avi Oh, come along, Leo. Allah decides, that's all I can go back. I can't face that. I'm the eldest of you all hold the most responsibility. And I can't face dad for the second time now. Yeah, after doing this to us for so long the first time. So now, he tells them what you need to say when you go back to that. Okay, acting like a proper older brother here. telling them what you need to say this is where we are now and Charlotte's recite from this portion.

Are them mila hamina Shane banyuwangi Bismillah Ar Rahman

Jr, who ILA being

in

a coma and he didn't even

know he

was

anti

fee.

Te

fi

de

Paula.

Lancome,

Phu Kham and more.

Jamie

t n e b him Jamie

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LA Li Mo hanky.

If

you

want sign

shows neither one can

on boonton law

says guru so far had Cancun

Cancun Amina

Allah

nama scuba see me

so

eldest brother says, look, you guys, you go back, I'm going to stay here. When you go back, this is how you break the news to that. It'll do a big pool go back and tell that the following now the way that I is constructed, it's as if you add the scene where the brothers are having their second huddle, you know, coming together this time round. Unlike the first time to try and rescue the brother. The first time round it was to try and get rid of the brother second time round. Look this what we need to do, we call it a scream like this, well Plan B is go back. But then when you say you say this to dad, it is as if they have actually reached back to Palestine and they are now seeing it

to dad face to face. Okay, that's how you read this verse. So he says for Paul who say, and now they actually going to say this to that? Yeah, burner, our Father in rubberneck, asakawa Masha hidden, Ellerbee ma Lima, one acuna Lin ye have you Lynn

say, oh, our Father, your son, he stole

your son. He stole one Masha hidden Illa Bhima alumna and we cannot be a witness except to that, which we know.

Now, that's interpreted in two ways. But let's move on to the second part first. And then they say one man cannot even why we have a lien and we are not when it comes to the unseen protectors. Yeah, protectors. So what does this mean that we can only bear witnesses that which we know and we can't protect against the light? One interpretation is that they're saying that we took that covenant with you. Yeah, we bow witnesses our covenant for a lot.

But we only did that based on what we know, as in, we only knew that we're going to go there, get the stuff and come right back. So we did that based on our knowledge. We never knew what's going to happen in the future from the rape. Yeah, so the second part, one I couldn't I didn't lie behalf you lean is as Josie said, you know, that we took that oath based on you know, what we knew at the time, but we never knew what's gonna happen in the future. Now, you can't expect us to protect against the hype. How can you do that and like protecting against things that which you don't know. Yeah, it came out of the unseen. That's what they're trying to say. That's one interpretation. The second

interpretation is he was this thing. This whole story is so complicated at this point, because number of factors. Number one, the brothers no Binyamin is not a thief.

But they saw the cup come out of his bag, and they saw that he doesn't protest. Binyamin is really you

don't say nothing? Coffee taken away? not aware the protest was going on? We don't even know that he's a thief. Yeah. Second complication.

Okay, but how did when you mean get taken away as a slave? Well, the thing is, we kind of said that whoever stole should be taken away a slave. What? So you're telling me that

you think that he did still?

That's one thing, but how did he get taken as a slave? what the thing is about that? Your guess what happened? That diseases Ain't No, seriously. You gotta listen to this. As he was saying, okay, you tell me what's the punishment for the one who steals it? So we said, as you told us that, that according to Sharia, if you still don't have us, you becoming a slave to the one you stole from,

we only share hidden. We only gave that Shahada to Aziz in saying what the punishment should be based on what we knew, meaning what you to us, they see. And we never knew what was going to happen after. We don't know where this is gonna go. Yeah. So the other factor, which is making it even more complicated is that

they came back to that, and they're being very honest now. They actually being honest now.

But dad also knows not only that they were once upon a time lying about the same thing, but the thing they are saying now, it can't be true because Binyamin is not a thief. I know that he's not a thief. So how can I accept that he's, you're telling me that he stole you see his car very good. And this foreigner this part of the story very, very emotional. Yeah. And you can feel the pain of jacobellis and I'm already but you kind of can feel the pain for the brothers All right.

Like the boy that Cried Wolf, but this time it's actually happening like they never did anything that they actually being honest and it tried so hard to explain that to them.

You know,

The predicament that they find themselves in. Okay, so that's the second interpretation, Masha hidden, meaning, that witnessing we gave to Aziz, when we said that the thief should be enslaved to the one that he stole from was based on what we knew at the time. We can't, you know, we never knew the hype after that.

Now, it's interesting that they specify that they can't be healthy lean when it comes to the hype. Yeah. Why do you think they use that word in particular that we can't be a half youth? When it comes to the vape?

What do they kind of say already? that give us when you mean?

So okay, he can come with us. When it comes to when you mean we are

protectors, they will have his own. Yeah, we're in the hula, half way gonna look after him.

Yeah, we're gonna look after him. So you said you had a few. And now what happened? Yeah, but we can't we have and when it comes to like, a common. The other thing is that if you look at in light of the covenant that said, Do you swear by Allah, you're gonna bring it back to me. Yesterday we are. And then dad said, Eli, you help Polycom except if you know, something happens beyond your control. Isn't it that stipulate that as a kind of exception to the rule? You swear you're gonna bring back Yes. exceptive circumstances beyond your control? You know, like we counsel.

You say that counsel because of circumstances beyond our control? Yeah, that means we couldn't do anything. So the same thing, the brothers are coming back and saying that, look, we did whatever we could try our best he stole, and it was something out of our control. We can't protect against things, just like you said that, you know, the covenant will try our best, but if things happen beyond our control, can't blame us. All right. There is many ways of reading this verse.

But the point is actually being honest. Okay. Now, we're going to look at how they broke the news the first time around to dad when they were lying. How does it differ to the way the breaking the news this time? Okay, we'll take that in Sharla in just a minute. The second thing they say was a little power utility fee.

That are no you don't believe us? I can we can. We already know that. But was an ask. Okay. And Korea, the town? This is referring to Egypt? Yeah. The thing that you don't believe us was a little Korea allottee kunafa. Ask, you know, the people of Egypt, either you go there and find it yourself. Or you send someone there to find out because those guys over the know are telling the truth. Don't believe I said ask people in Egypt. Oh, second thing that will lead you to a common fear or the caravan that also went with us from Palestine to Egypt. You know, we didn't go alone. We went with the other people Palestine. So they were going to get on there. And those guys, they know what

happened as well. So you can ask them if you don't believe us? Yeah. What am Allah saw the code and indeed we are truthful, very, very honest, right now that you got to believe us.

So how does that compare to the first time round when they threw us? Well, Islam in the world, they came back and they made up the story. Or that time they said, Call we have a banner in the hub, an anesthetic or whatever I can use to find the material enough Akela, who did? They said, Oh, Father, indeed, we went and we had a race, and we left us with our belongings, and then a wolf at one time, we want meaning Lana, you're not going to believe us that you're not going to believe us. Even though we are telling the truth, and then they brought the bloodied shirt. Okay, now how does this work? But when you get into pesos, you know, and tell me how does this differ? From the second time

around? second time around to being honest, we know that, but how did they words differ? Because if we can see differences in the words, we can kind of learn lesson as to recognizing when someone might be lying. And when someone is actually telling the truth, even though it seems like they're lying together. So you need to analyze a lot told us exactly what they said when they were being honest and breaking the news about lost son and allows a did exactly what they said when they were actually lying and breaking the news about the lost son, son leave it here. This is what they said verse number 1718, about useful listener.

And I'm gonna give you two minutes, okay, Your time starts. Now. Get into pairs and discuss it, what kind of things are different from previous compared to now?

I'm going to ask you in sha Allah What do you think is the difference?

Let's let's see what you have to offer. Brothers over here on the side. What do you think?

Second time when it comes to beniamino about use of Islam

about the use of Islam Okay, so this is more detail

Okay, so we they said dad we win and then we you know had raised and stuff messing around and then we left use of with our staff and Wolfie

as opposed to the second time when they just say your son stole

Okay, so that's very good point that the first time round that they're lying and they sentence when the way they explain is a lot more detailed and convoluted, isn't it?

Anyone else know is that?

Yeah. What do you think? Why Why do you think that is?

Okay. And the third person perspective interesting.

Okay.

Yeah.

Okay, all right. They this interesting that is,

you know, recently I saw on a on the news

is a documentary about trade unions, right? They're talking about David Cameron. And he made like a manifesto before the last general election. And he said to the

the fire brigade services, they said, Are you going to cut

anyways, as your minister gonna cut jobs in the fire service? And he said, This is his answer. He said, If the minister came to me with a plan to cut the jobs in the fire service, or tell him to go back to the office.

Now, what's interesting is when they did come to power, they cut jobs in the fire services.

So why don't you say no, we're not gonna do that. What do you say if he came to me with a plan? We'd say go back to the office is not yes or no. Is it?

They? Okay. So more detail. That's very good.

What do you think brothers? Yes. What differences what are the difference? Can you see?

The translation is the same.

Okay, so they was different, though. So while canalside the pain, even if we weren't in the truth, birds in the second time around, they just say we alternate The truth is what you're getting at. Okay.

Any any any want to and you want to elaborate on that point?

Or you got different things? Yeah.

Okay, yeah, go ahead. What do you think

there's an actual, like psychological treat, which is what?

It's basically you judge others based on what you know, for yourself? Sure.

Yeah.

The person is going to click on as well.

And that's why I'd say one other thing, even if we weren't in truth, so you know, tentative

reverse psychology. I'm not sure. Okay. Maybe anything different now.

These will come to you as well.

In regards to Binyamin they say they don't say you're not gonna believe us. Firstly, they don't say that. But they just say at the end, we're telling the truth.

can

go and have a caravan

Okay, so you

Saying I think I've got to get to what you're saying. So you're saying that when it came to use for this system, they just said, You're not going to believe us, even though we're telling the truth. Full stop. But when it came to Binyamin, they said, this is what happened. Don't believe us? Us them.

Yeah. But the thing is, didn't they bring a proof when it came to usefulness of the bloodied shirt? But what's the difference in there then?

Okay, so

yeah.

Ah

yes. See this parlor clear. They said, this is what happened. And you We invite you to investigate.

We invite you to investigate, as opposed to the other time which is, this is what happened. And here's the proof. All right.

Yeah. Now which one sounds more truthful? Yeah. Which one sounds more honest. If I'm telling the truth, I've got nothing to hide. Ask any asks the Egyptians, people asked the caravan is that we went with, you know, what else could they do? You know. So

the difference is, there's one other difference as well, which is that when it came to usefulness, they contradicted themselves.

Yeah. How do they contradict themselves? They said that would let us take use of because we're going to take him yellow, tap away your lab. He is going to enjoy himself eating loads, and he's going to be enjoying himself playing games. When they come back. They say NES who we were the one playing games. He was the one looking after the luggage. Hang on. You said you're gonna take him so he could play games. contradiction.

You see, and this is Paula the son of illogical Allah. Yeah, as they say there's no perfect crime right? There's always gonna be evidences indications. And we see this Hey, in the speeches go on his speech versus deceitful speech. Yeah, the just examining the speech itself, can give you an indication about what's going on. Now, if it's that obvious, that they are telling the truth here.

Then why why does jacobellis lamb dad say the same thing he said the first time round. What do you say in verse number three? Yeah.

Of course, this is the plan, which outlines by a useful lesson to bring them all together.

Boy, do you mean, like that's the reason why Binyamin was kept it

Oh, yes, it is going according to according to the plan. Definitely. This is. So the thing is if we can see the differences and say look, this is seems a lot more honest than the first time around and why is it that jacobellis now when he hears what they have to say? He says Carla belser wallet COMM And Phu Kham maracas Oberon Jamil same thing, so how nice and when it came to useless now, he says Carla Bell, meaning rather, I don't believe what you're saying. Okay, so wallet telecom and Phu Kham amaura, you have made this we have this matter that we said, it is when you make something seem fair minded to you in order to justify it. You know, this is how criminals behave when you do something

wrong. Is it Why do you do that? They say are you know, I was born in a broken home lived in the ghetto, all my life never had nothing to my name. That's why I did. So when he's doing the crime, he's saying I gotta go rob that person's phone. Because I had such a bad life hard life, need to get my stuff.

This is the sweep. People do that all the time. Yeah, justify what they're doing by making it seem beautiful in their minds. This is what it means to make something beautiful in order to justify. So that's it. Same thing, this armor this matter. You've just beautified it in your minds, meaning I don't believe what you're saying. Yeah. However, then he goes on to say something more, he says is a long way and yet he and he beat him Jimmy as panela Now even though this is the second time around is happening, double trauma and double trauma. You would think that he'd now maybe, you know, break, snap. No. Same thing happening again. How comes? He gets strongest Pamela? He says, perhaps as for

trilogy for hope, perhaps a law yet he

need be him Jamia perhaps Allah will not bring Binyamin back to me or the eldest of them. All of them use of Islam as though perhaps Allah is gonna bring them all back to me in one piece all together, so hon Allah in that critical position Yaqoob displays hope in Allah and trust in Allah amazing. If anything you think maybe he started doubting himself will start thinking you know is this, let me just not say nothing. The opposite is even more hopeful of Allah. Perhaps Allah is going to bring them all back to me so useful is that I'm the eldest of them and Binyamin, all trapped somewhere. Yeah. away from that. He's saying Allah will bring them back to me in an alley

when Hakeem indeed he is all knowing all wise. Meaning Allah knows why this is happening. And even though all this seems so bad to me in is such a big calamity. I don't know what's going on. I can't work it out. Allah knows. And whatever is happening is happening through his hikma through his wisdom. So he's expressing trust and reliance Allah in a critical moment.

Okay, now

this is when Subhan Allah, we see just how badly all of this has affected jacobellis ROM. He said, Allah Allah then says eight verse Psalm 84, what's our LAN whom will call us if you suffer? Then tala he turns away from them. You just imagined his sons or their their pleading with him. Dad, you got a buddy of this time, seriously, this will happen to what land we turned away from them. He doesn't want to hear them anymore. I can't listen to this anymore. I'm so confused. I don't know what's going on r&b by myself. Just me. And Allah. What's the one? Who McCall SFR use of wall or? Yeah, as of all my SF over use.

So he just been told Binyamin has been enslaved, you just lost your second son.

His response is to think about use of it is that his love for use of Islam is so strong, that this calamity only serves to remind him of his last son, Islam. So he's thinking, you know, this is so bad was useful. And I still miss him so much. Yeah, I suffer as of means, briefly.

And a very intense form of grief. And it's not just SF SF, with the Elif at the end, to say, my intense grief. But the thing is, he then allegedly then says what they are, but I know that his eyes his two eyes turned white, something. You can't even imagine someone's eyes sending white dislike saying now the black pupil area in your eyes, that just kind of fades away. And the whole eyeball is just white here that's speaking about his tears, that he cried so much so intensely over such a long period of time that his eyes turned white, either that means that he became blind totally and couldn't see anymore, or that his eyes had began to diminish so bad.

And then how did that happen, meanwhile, shows that happened due to or out of grief, for who will kill them. However, Allah said, even though he felt that bad, and it got to him that much he was holding it in swallowing it up and not showing it to anybody else. Now the word SF, very interesting difference between us and chosen as the machete experience. He says that SF is three emotions coming together over a prolonged period of time three emotions chosen hasta la and Jessica. It is a combination of grief coupled with regret coupled with worry over a prolonged period of time. So yeah, of course is all my stuff over use of how I've been feeling for so long. And you know what's

happened my eyes have turned white because of that, meaning I've cried so many tears over him. And now it's just got to a breaking point. When I found out about my second son now.

This is all out of reef however Allah says For who are Colleen, Colleen comes from the word cover. And cover means to hold back on something to swallow up something and is usually used regarding

anger. So yep,

communism also being very angry with these children, that How could you do this to me for a second time? Yeah, anger, but he's kaeleen he's holding back on that anger. Interesting as part of the process that is reported to us in a hadith which he said is hasn't that there is no swallowing up, which is yields more reward than the swallowing up of anger for the sake of Allah for the sake of Allah as if to say, you know, when a person is full of anger,

then he needs to show it expressing you know, in either behavior or speech, but a person who can hold on to the anger not show it for a loss sake not because people are gonna think bad of him or because on TV, a guy in front of the camera he got calms down. No, no, no because of the camera, but because of a law

then he'll get more reward than holding back on any other emotion. Yeah, he hasn't. So here Yeah, populism being praised. He's being praised by Allah for not showing this grief. Now, the thing is, what did we say was sovereign Jamil? Anyone remember the definition of sovereign Jimmy when he became a sovereign Jimmy is how is it different to just normal sovereign?

Yes.

Okay, not that wasn't the definition that was the fruit of it was a definition

more suburban Jamil a beautiful patience is received?

No,

come on.

Southern sablon Jamil is the

patient of useless and shall not diplomatic answer Mashallah.

No one remembers all suffering Jamil is

in favor of Allah said sablon Jamil a sobre Bella Shaka patients without complaining

patients without complaining and this is very difficult, but it's going to be patient on calamity in their life. But they need to go and speak to someone you know. For my friend it goes speak to my mom need to go speak to the shrink need to go speak to the counselor to get off my chest. Yeah, it's too much. I need to complain to people by it why it won't.

If you don't do that, then that's what's called Southern Jimmy. The problem is, or the apparent problem is the hair jacobellis annum he starts to kind of complain no yeah, so far the use of what Bill but I you know, who has never worked with him?

He's saying this out loud now. So how do we reconcile between the fact that he has sovereign Jamil but at the same time he's complaining about the calamity?

Uh huh. What do you think?

You know, if I had a better prize, I'll give you a prize if you get this one.

Got to two offers three offers Anybody else? And he was not answer the question today.

No, do you see that there might be some kind of conflict. You know, you're saying that Southern Jimmy's not complaining but jacobellis

seems to be complaining Yes, he

is complaining to himself

or to

to Allah yes to Allah.

Yes, even to martial law says that complaining to Allah, a shockwave the law. It doesn't negate subaltern Jamil? Yeah, doesn't negate Southern German and highlight any, this is a natural response that when you go through tough times, you need to let it out. You need to speak about it. You could speak about the creation, or you could speak about to the Creator. If you spoke about to the Creator, then you still maintaining Southern jimmied. Okay.

So it's quite amazing that he's feeling this SF, which is a combination of all of these emotions for such a long period of time that is caused him to cry so much. So that is affected his eyesight. It's quite unimaginable, isn't it? I mean, do you know anyone who's gone through something like that?

And I'm crying that much. I mean, how much do you require to lose your eyesight? That's the question.

They interestingly enough, they said that tears, okay. They have different types of people cry out of emotion. Sometimes people cry because of an irritant. You know, like, onions can make you cry. They, so there's a difference. Even they said that the chemical composition of tears that coming from emotion are different to tears that coming out of

irritant so you know like a brother, your friend maybe watching something gets a bit sad tears starts to come on. What's wrong? Good You cried over this NASA down fly man

that if

we can take those days

and test them that's emotion bro

because any time people believe me crying is

unmanly, you know, it's against a man crying. It's not something good to cry, you know. But in certain contexts, in fact, it's praiseworthy to cry, right? crying out to the face of a law makes you one of the seven under the algebra one on Yom Okayama. May Allah make us from those people. So crying, not necessarily a sign of lack of Eman or lack of, you know, Muruga manliness, not necessarily.

So jacobellis on cried that much that he lost his eyesight or his eyesight became that bad. And that was all out of grief over use of Islam. However, in other let that be seen by anyone, less even more amazing, isn't it? To feel that bad, that the grief has got to your eyes, physically making you look different? Yet you don't show it to other people

as like coming together of two extremes, isn't it? Like the worst type of calamity

and feeling that much grief over it? At the same time? the magnificence of holding that back and showing it to anyone that's coming together to distant emotions are two different extremes. Right? And this is the way the only the Allah teaches us in the Quran, that He gives us the worst case scenario, and then gives us the best case response. You know what that does?

When it comes to the worst case scenario, no one can say I can't be you know, act like that. Because you don't know what I'm going through. is so bad. Let me tell you how bad my situation is. Worse than this. Worst case scenario. yopu. Okay, not as bad as that. I'm going why.

In the worst case scenario, someone can behave as like this. It means in less than that is possible to some behavior other is the way Allah Genoa teaches us No, hold on. Thank you, for workholding now galuh to lie now they say they say something in response to what jacobellis Sam said, but jacoba Sam said that in private, so how do we understand this? They're going to say, What is going on here? Why are you saying that for but we just said that? He said in private? Well, the understanding is that Yeah, populism said it to himself, in private,

complaining to Allah, but they overheard, they were just like most of the Islam, you know, story booster Islam sort of passes. He goes, Okay, he runs were the fugitive from Egypt because he's accidentally killed that man around and these people after he flees to Medina, on the way he sees those two women wanting to get water, he goes and helps them.

And so he doesn't ask for anything instead.

As in, he's got nowhere to go. He doesn't even know where he's going got nothing to his name. And he doesn't want to ask the two women or the people around there for any hope. He just sits in the shade and it makes it automa the women happen to overhear what he says. Then they take him to their father. Same thing here jacoba doesn't complain to anyone they overhear What do they say? That Oh does guru use they can lie.

To law he is to take an oath different to a lie. Anyone remember the difference between saying to lie and will lie?

Yep.

Okay, more emphasis more Really?

No, no, it's not in fact will lie. He has more emphasis. will lie is Memphis. de la he is to have as

he said tag is like shock. To lie. Are you serious? Yeah. C'est la de in shock. term lie. Deaf. Does guru use of Deaf that means to continue on. unrelentingly. You can gonna continue on making mention abuse of at least up until takuna head on out. akuna Minal hadn't up until two things going on one of two things that happen to you. Either you're going to become held, or you're going to become someone who's from the Harley Quinn handlebar, interesting word. It means when something decomposes, okay? Something decomposes.

So in the context of this verse, they're saying that you're going to grieve so much over useful Islam that is going to consume you. And whether you're just going to wither away. Or the alternative is that you're going to be of those that become destroyed halakhah to destroy it, as if they're saying, either you're going to keep this inside, up into a consumed, you're going to wither away, or you're going to snap and explode. Yeah, either one of these things dad, so they can see the effect of the grief on their father. Yeah, they can see it. Now they're not complaining. They're saying what's wrong with you, dad? They're saying don't do this to yourself. That's the way they're saying

it. Don't do this to yourself. Don't do this anymore to yourself, don't let this eat you up inside.

So jacobellis ROM is not going to respond to what they're saying.

One interesting thing about this verse is that these three strange words the rea words in Arabic you don't use words like to lie usually say well lie. defecto definitely is another very strange word. And then Harold Harold is another very strange word here. And why are they using strange words because the situation is strange. They're seeing strange things dad is gone. What has happened to daddy's eyes the Commonwealth strange. You know, when you see a strange thing, you start expressing that strangest strangeness in your words by using sometimes rare words. Okay, now that explains call an enigma in them as if to say, I'm not complaining about usage. And I'm not, you know, just

lamenting over usage. I'm not doing that. I'm actually talking to Allah.

Allah in a school bestie what shows me a lot I'm actually making, you know, I'm complaining to Allah, about two things. Beth, the

birth, also translated sorrow. chosen also translates the sorrow but there's a difference. And Beth, council root of betha, which means to spread here. So I'll Beth here means that my grief has spread to every corner of my body, even to my eyes. And that's why you can see my eyes gone white, because this birth this grief spread to every corner of my body.

And you know, that process for the grief to consume you It takes a while, right? So he's talking about useless thumb like over all these years, the grief has finally got to me, our shows me and this new grief of mine, what you just told me now about Binyamin and the eldest of these two griefs, I'm actually complaining to them to Allah, I'm not just lamenting over them. And you know what, what Allah will mean allow him Allah tala wanna know something about Allah of from Allah, rather that you don't know what he's talking about.

The Dream very good. He's saying that I know that dream that you've told me about a long time ago. And that dream

gave me the hope in order to deal with this, because I know he's not dead. Because that dream showed me there's gonna be someone great. But I don't know where he is. He's kidnapped I don't know, is he safe way is what's happening with him. And that was, you know, really making me grief. But I know something about Allah or from Allah that you don't know. And you're going to see what's going to happen. So he's kind of saying that I don't understand what's going on.

I don't know the full story. But I'm very hopeful in LA, that there's going to be a positive end to all of this, a positive end to all this. Okay, now, we're going to take this little tangent on depression and Islam. Okay, depression, Islam. And it kind of fits together very nicely, because, you know, these words are used to describe jacobellis and some

different words to explain his grief. Yes. But

what do you have right in the beginning, we had the word

for the word no.

As

I said, and then we had chosen, then we had Calvin.

And then we had

Harold. So Allah spoke about his grief from many different perspectives.

Kind of giving us an indication of the emotional state that he was going through. And it's not just a one of those words symbolize that he was going through them for a long period of time. Okay, a long period of time. And then obviously, there's a taste as well, the taste as well that's also been made mention of. So the question arises, that

is this depression and how could this be classed as depression

If so, what does that mean? Exactly? Can I believe a be depressed or not? Or if a believer is depressed, does that mean he is not a true believer or his belief in Allah is weak? What is the case?

Now, we need to first understand what is depression? Okay, we will talk about depression, we don't even know what it means, clinically speaking, what is depression now, besides what we learned in the Quran, I will also be using my knowledge as a pharmacist to help me try and discuss this, obviously, we are to study depression, in university, and also I'm taking help from my my mother, as long as he's been a counselor for 2025 years. So she's got a lot of experience in dealing with depression and people with depression. So, overly inshallah, we can try and shed some light on this matter. Now clinically speaking, what is depression

according to the nice guidelines, okay, which is like a benchmark. In in, in the medical world for for for medical treatment intervention. These, they cause depression as follows. They say it's a combination of one of two core symptoms plus other symptoms over a period of more than two weeks. Okay? One or two core symptoms plus other symptoms over a period of more than two weeks. Some other definitions are there, but they kind of are very, very similar to this. So either is one of these two core symptoms, okay.

First core symptom is either persistent sadness or low mood nearly every day. So patient comes in. He says, I'm depressed. Okay, let me work out whether you are actually clinically depressed or whether you're just going through a bad time, low mood. Now this happens, you know, people flew up and down, sometimes this is normal. This is something that is touches every single person. Sometimes you feel really good. Sometimes you don't feel good. Okay. That's not what we're talking about. We're talking about a actual condition. Yeah. Which has been medically defined known as clinical depression. Okay, so you say you feel bad. Okay. Can you tell me? Have you felt sad? Every single

day? For the last? Let's say two weeks, have you? So the person says no. Okay. But there's another core symptom. That is that? Do you have you lost interest or pleasure in doing things that you always like to do? For example, you'd like to play football every week? Is it suddenly the case I don't like play football anymore? You like spending time with your kids? Our constant time my kids anymore? You like watching movies? You go to the cinema? Do you do that anymore? Now I don't do that anymore. Oh, see, there's another core symptom there. You don't like doing those things that you used to like doing? He lost interest in them. Okay, one of these two core symptoms, coupled with

some other minor symptoms, like fatigue, always being tired, like aches and pains, like suicidal thoughts? Or like changes in appetite? Yeah, go on a binge studying so much. While that coupled with either one of the two core symptoms may mean that you are clinically depressed. Okay, maybe they according to according to doctors, they This is depression, clinically speaking, essentially, you feel very sad persistently for more than two weeks. Okay, more than two weeks. And one of the ways we can tell that is because you just don't like doing the things that you used to like doing anymore. All right, all these other factors that you start eating a lot of aches and pains, all the

rest of it gives you an idea of what clinical depression is. So essentially speaking, is to do with your psychology

as well as your behavior

with your, by yourself and with others social interaction. So they kind of look at all these things. There's all these kind of problems that revolve around clinical depression. Now with that in mind, some questions rise number one, can a Muslim be depressed cannabis can actually be diagnosed with depression?

You might think that's a silly question. I know Bravo has got depression, okay. He's on the medicine. And I don't mean it like that. But is it possible? I mean, by implication, that if that Bravo sister's got depression, and he's on medicine for depression,

then Is he really a river? It's not for a lot.

That's what I mean. Oh, what does it mean and he hasn't got his mind is really weak. That's why he's got depression. If he had strong Eman, no way, would he be depressed? Okay.

Now the other question is, does Islam recognize the existence of depression? Let's start with this second question. First, does Islam recognize the existence of depression? The question is always the wrong question, because it assumes that Islam in the Quran Sunnah, at least medical

conditions like you know, cold is fine flu.

Okay, depression No, no, no, no, this not having any of this in Islam.

This is, is wrong from this perspective, Islam never came to give guidelines on what a believer is allowed to contract and what believe is not allowed to contract. Okay, this The question is not really right. Maybe it's more accurate to say does Islam find blameworthy? The feelings associated with depression? That's more of an accurate question, isn't it? That Okay, depressed people that are depressed they chronically sad? Yeah, why the country? Sad? Let's put that to one side for that. But the fact is that the chronically sad for at least two weeks, you know, on the draw,

and start doing some things like the lawn, they don't like doing things they used to do. Oh, does Islam say feeling sad, consistently for a long period of time is blameworthy.

Haha. Now, if you look at in light of what we did read about jacobellis around that, you know, in a school bus, see what shows me in a law where bus means a prolonged state of grief until it surfaces to the, you know, to the top.

Then,

if your cover is not filled like that, that is a prophet of Allah, that not only does it mean a believer can experience those feelings. But on top of that, Allah said, he held back on expressing them, meaning the feelings weren't blameworthy.

The feelings weren't blameworthy, but kind of expressing them in the wrong way. That was blameworthy. Ah, okay. So we already can say that Islam does recognize the feelings associated with depression, essentially, long term, a long standing sadness or grief. Easily said,

Now that the thing is the other question, which is kind of Muslim did to be depressed? Okay, that's the real core question.

Now I have found an alarm knows best is that there seems to be too, like distant answers.

One answer is that a Muslim can't be depressed because then Allah say, Allah basically like takoma

that, you know, barely bother in the remembrance of Allah to the heart's fine tranquility, peace, and repose. And now using a believer can be depressed. If anything, he is still a believer, but he's got problems in his Eman. And that's why he's depressed.

Now counter reaction, this is what I found. And you can correct me if I'm wrong, is you more Lana's man? You don't know what's going on? You think that someone depressed? And then you tell him there's not a good believer that's gonna make them worse. The reality is that there is such a thing called depression. And the Muslim can experience that. And and this is why this is a problem to say. Like, as they say, not only can Muslim be perfectly fine in Islam and develop depression, but a depressed person,

you know,

kind of have to excuse him for doing some of the things he does. suicidal thoughts.

You know, that happens when you're depressed, you know, you need to understand that

complaining about why me? What has happened to me. What could happen to somebody else? What did I do wrong? You take it easy, don't you know you I can see you're trying to advise him and telling don't say those type of things. But he's depressed, you know, you'd appreciate that. Okay. That's what happens to those guys. Okay, or worse than that, which is that brother, he never came to Juma. And I saw him in university. I mean, why didn't he come? I'm going to go speak to him. Bro, what's going on? You know, whatever came to mind today?

Is everything okay? You know, you can't miss you do my you know, if you miss three Yamazaki. Niala seals of the heart of that person. Another brother comes along this is look to leave him alone. Right? He's depressed. All right. It depressed. So, you know, you kind of got to let him off the hook. You know, this is so caught up in his from you know what he's going through right now. It's terrible. Okay, just give him a break. Hmm. Seems like that might be problematic,

isn't it? So what is the answer? Is the depression or is it not depression? Any what is the deal here? The answer is as follows.

That the real religious question in the discussion on depression is

does depression ever justify doing heroin? That is a religious question. It's not a medical question, is it? You can't ask that to a doctor can you?

is a religious question.

Can depression ever justified the depressed person doing something hot up? For example, having suicidal thoughts? Not just passing thoughts, entertaining those thoughts? I'm going to go to the underground station right now. I'm gonna choose a busiest time. So I'm gonna jump for as long do you have

too much?

Will? The will? Is it justified for that person to have those thoughts?

What about what he says? What about not praying? What about not fasting? Any? Is it justified for them to do that?

Is it we're not looking at it on a case by case scenario. We're talking about the theory. We're talking about the theory, okay, don't get bogged down over. Okay, come on, where's your heart for that person? And we're talking about a person right now we're just talking about the theory. The reality is that there is no justification for doing harm.

Even if you're depressed, agree or not.

But at the same time, a person can feel grief for a prolonged period of time, for whatever reason, that is not blameworthy. So this is the if you like the middle ground, and we find this in, you know, captured in the incident in the life of the Prophet sallallahu alayhi wasallam, where he lost his son, Ibrahim, yeah, he had a son, Ibrahim second son, and this son grew up to be you know, just a small infant, you know, maybe you'd like a toddler. And at that time, a lot decreed that he would pass away the profits or the sun was seen crying at the loss of his son, crying, grieved by that agreed by the competitors. In fact, some of them were surprised that they said, do you cry? Like, we

didn't know that I knew you cry over these type of things. So maybe it's not manly to do that. They asked a curiosity and innocent curiosity. And the professor sort of said, What is it? He said Indeed, the eyes shed tears. The heart grieves but this tongue doesn't say anything except what pleases Allah see the coming together of both these things, the feelings that you feel even if they for a prolonged period of time, Islam doesn't censor them. Yeah, but at the same time, he said this tongue doesn't say that which except please Allah meaning I'm not going to complain wine, you know, question the mother of a law, talk about committing suicide, etc, etc, etc. that now that's a

problem. Yeah. So therefore we can say that Yanni a person, you can feel depressed in his life.

But at the same time, he shouldn't let that depression lead him to do haram things. Okay, lead him to haram things. Now the thing is a lot spoke in the Quran about people doing things because emotionally in emotions get the better of them allow sadness or at least a lot in the summer, while basora wonderful other kulula can argue masuleh that indeed the hearing the sight and the heart all of the will be will be my school that will be held accountable. Okay, responsible. Interestingly, Allah use the word for heart for odd here, not called different for us and called visa for art is an emotionally charged heart and inflamed heart. You know, because people when they do bad things,

sometimes you know this word someone, probably Fabiani, and he tackled him he swore him Kolonaki. Why do you swim? What do you say abroad? You know, my emotions got the better of me the you know, just overcome by rage there for a second you know, can't hold me accountable. He can't put me in the same vein. You know, the same when we have this referees put the burden the sin is gonna go outside because this will let you go home in the same vein, okay, emotions got the better of me. Allah Allah saying, even the emotional heart of us can add homeschooler even that emotional heart, depressed heart, whatever you want to call it.

Not justify any harm what you do. Okay. So this is if you like, a conclusion, yeah, that we can make a conclusion. You see, some people think that if a person is depressed, it means that his demand is low. Is that really the case though? Can you say that the jacobellis demand was low? You can't say that again. You can't say that. Of course you can't say that. The other thing is, like brothers say the only person who's affected afflicted with black magic is a person whose demand is weak. Have you heard that?

Isn't it you heard this the only person who you know have probably black magic is people yeah, the default from online anyway. That's why it's easy for you know, jinn to possess them.

to affect them. But that's not true. Because the profits that are assumed towards the end of his life he was touched by black magic. Yeah, as in Oklahoma law said he was affected by black magic, but it didn't affect him to the extent that it

you know, it

encroach encroached on his ability to pass the message, meaning he was giving guidelines or something to do with Islam. And because of the black magic effect to him, he made a mistake in the law, the only extent they went to in affecting him was that he thought he'd done something when he hadn't done it. For example, He thought him in Houston from Geneva when he hadn't made it from Geneva, or the other way around. So if the professor center was affected by black magic to that extent, then it can't be the case that the only people in Africa have black magic are those that have low Eman? Kind of.

Same thing with depression. A person can Oh, but the thing is, does Islam have a role in helping someone with depression? That's the other question. Yeah, that's the other question. And here, this is where we find Islam does. Because, you know, as a pharmacist, I know that people diagnose depression, rightfully or wrongly, sometimes. And one of the main things that happens is they get they get put on these analytics with these drugs, which basically supposed to up the mood, okay. And the way they work is that they enhance the particular neurotransmitter in your brain, which is related to positive moods, okay, like serotonin, for example. So that's the way they try and cure

depression. But the thing is, people, they usually on that for a very long time.

And as soon as they come off, they relapse. Yeah. And sometimes they need to go from one drug to another drug because that drug stops working. Yeah, so they have to move around all the different classes of drugs, just to stay away from being depressed.

So is that just a solution that we say he suffered depression, you can take medicine for it. But there's some other things as well, because depression is not just a clinical state, rather than other factors, like for example, your relationship with Allah cannot help you come out of depression? Of course it can. Yeah. What about your social setting? How you are who you are spending time with can also help you? Of course it can. So Islam is presenting any solutions on many levels? Yeah, you can go for the medical or you can do the medical as well as look at other things. One key thing is to do with a creedal approach to do with educating and advising that person on a knowledge

level, and that advice will help them in the face of the depression. For example, explain to the brother or sister feeling depressed, that Do you know, okay, that Allah jello, Allah intentionally tests His servants and slaves? Do you know that? Like, let's get that clear right now. Allah wants to test you, Allah is going to test you and that's something alum it's explicitly in the Quran, will enable one nickel be shame, you know, hope you will jewelry. There's no doubt about it, we are certainly going to test you in many different aspects of your life here, who will lead the Holocaust moto hayata, yada loco, as you know, sort of balkar says we created death and life in order to test

you, in order to test us. Like that's one of the main reason you test the Creator is one of the main reasons I created you to test you to see how you respond in terms of tests. So let's, let's get that clear right now. Test a part of life along wanted it to be like that. In fact, a lot also says Roma or Saba could be masiva. And sort of Donovan law says that when a calamity afflicts you, and he used the word masiva, we'll see what comes from asaba to target, as if ally saying that each and every one of you are going to be tested, but I'm going to target you with specific test tests that are tailor made to your personality and your nature.

What somebody can bear may not be possible for another person to be triona people are different. So law says we're giving you masiva

targeting us specifically based on who you are and I know who you are created.

That's another thing that tests are tailor made for people. And another thing is while at 10 00 to 100. Sorry, well you can leave alone of sitting closer the law does not burn

burden a person more than he can be? Yeah. So there's not going to test you in a way that you can't handle this. There's no way he can handle what's going on this is the end of the road for me. No, okay. You know, you can't even shouldn't be thinking either for Allah, He tests us, but he never tests us more than we can bear. You need to know that. Which means therefore, you need to hope in Allah and never despair of His mercy. Here, let the corner to Mirage Mattila don't ever display of the mercy of Allah.

The last thing that you should be part of your advice to a depressed person is that this world and this dunya

is only the beginning. It's not the end. You know, and this is something very important that a lot of people they feel that they can't handle the situation, because they feel like everything that they have is in this dunya there is no,

they don't believe that, obviously. But if they unknowingly start to think like that, and you know what, just imagine that was the case, like,

you have a car accident, and other law, you become, you know, paralyzed.

And you gotta live your whole life as a paralyzed person.

can't walk anymore, can't work anymore. Can't go places anymore, you know, wheelchair the rest of your life until you die. If you believed that the world and the dunya is all I have, how can you not become depressed, this is all I have to for the rest of my life. And there's nothing after this, of course, the person become depressed. Yeah. As opposed to a person who believes this dunya is nothing compared to the Akira, there is still a hereafter to come.

Still here or to to come. This is just a window into the next life, which is for an eternity. Hope, coupled with knowing that the ark era is the real life can help someone come out of depression. Yeah. So any This is, if you like,

the way Islam recognizes the feelings associated with depression, how we can understand that on a theological level and also any what are the solutions? Okay, the solution is not just medicine itself. part of the solution, perhaps other parts of it is wholesome advice, hear from a caring person.

And those that advice is focusing around uplifting the hope of that person to place an alarm more to believe that there's a life to come and also to know that a lot of tests, but he never tests you beyond your beyond your means and capability will allow them.

What do you think about this? Any What's your thoughts on the whole depression issue? And what do you think was being said here?

Do you think?

Maybe low depression can affect a brother or a sister? Or what do you think?

The issue of depression? Hands up? If you know someone who's depressed?

1-234-567-8910 11 nearly 50% of you.

Wow.

Brothers coming to study they've seen in the mustard.

Yeah. So you know, someone who's depressed, maybe you know, more than

more than one person.

So

what do you think? Can any comments about depression?

How to help someone depression?

Or Islam and depression? What do you think?

on some cases, purely clinical, the thing is even the in the medical world, they believe that all depression, as far as I remember, goes back to a trauma.

Yeah, an incident that happened once in your life, either when you were a child or something happened, which triggered these feelings.

Do you see

it we're talking about one thing which depression? Have we defined what that is? But what I'm saying is that you said Is it just clinical, I'm saying that they don't believe that you can be born with depression,

or inherited disease is more that the Something happened in your life and it triggered you to become depressed. So that's why the psychiatrist or the counselor will try and get to the root problem. Because the idea is if we get to the root problem and deal with it, then this thing which came about because of it will also you know, kind of fade away.

Yes, honey, I'll come to yourself after.

Right.

Happy birthday.

Yep.

Okay, very good point. So as I said, you know, sometimes feeling depressed or going through a depression can be a positive in your life.

Just like any test, if you react in the right way for Southern Jamil and you know, positively hoping in a law, then that can increase your rank before law, we spoke about mocassin mocassin mc law before is all the higher objectives behind testing. So there's many many positive outcomes that could come about so being or going through depression could be something which saves you from the fire. Yeah, if you behave in a righteous way when experiencing that it's over there the back that you want to say something

Yeah.

Okay, we'll have a depressed life is is is maybe not an accurate translation. But even if we said that is you live a depressed life.

Then while July speaking about there is people number one who have turned away from him completely. Yeah. And as a consequence, they are continually and always going to live Marriott and banca a restricted constricted miserable life. Yeah, there's a bit different to just going through a period of depression because of an you know, some trauma that happens in your life.

is

same thing

exists. Sure.

Yep. I think I agree with the brother that is a growing problem around the world and the Muslim community is also been affected by maybe in to the same extent or to a lesser extent, but the leaders what kind of messages are they getting out there? What kind of activities are they doing to help especially the youngsters suffering from depression? It's it's something that needs to be discussed properly. And some solutions need to be need to be derived definitely. I agree with you.

But the thing is a problem or shall not the problem is that conceptually, if it's misunderstood, then they'll never come to a solution.

Yeah.

Because they they some people feel that there's no such thing as depression. Oh, there is such thing as depression but a Muslim can't get that. So if you got depression, it means you're lacking any man. So that's why I said we need to go to the root problem, which is how to understand depression, Islam. Yep.

So that time, okay. We have to finish in some kind of good

stuff. To wait what is