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On Student Loans – A Detailed Discussion

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Yasir Qadhi

Channel: Yasir Qadhi

Series:

Episode Notes

Ask Shaykh YQ – EP 270

Episode Transcript

© No part of this transcript may be copied or referenced or transmitted in any way whatsoever. Transcripts are auto-generated and thus will be be inaccurate. We are working on a system to allow volunteers to edit transcripts in a controlled system.


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One

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hour to sell me COVID Iike in the Jalan no he him first.

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lickety in

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June

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Salam alaykum Warahmatullahi Wabarakatuh Bismillah Alhamdulillah wa salatu salam ala Rasulillah Welcome to another episode of our regular Tuesday series in which we select some of your questions and answer them and the email address as I have said is asked why queue at Epic Masjid dot orgy ask why queue at Epic Masjid dot orgy and I have as I have said multiple times, I select the questions that I think will be of the maximum benefit. So please understand I do not answer individual questions at this email. Today inshallah Allah we are going to tackle one of the most commonly asked questions that my email has been bombarded with. And it is of relevance to so many, especially

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students, and that is the issue of student loans. That is the issue of the permissibility or impermissibility of students, especially here in America and generally speaking in the Western world, because again, these types of photos, these types of discussions I have, generally speaking, it is meant for specifically an American audience, or if the topic allows for it for a western audience, generally speaking, and the question that I'm going to choose today is basically a generic one, called from many dozens of emails, literally from across the country, dare I say, across the western world, and the gist of it is the same. And that is that the student is not able to pay his

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or her fees, or they might have been accepted to a vocational school or medical school. And obviously, you know, the fees that are required for those are typically not affordable for the average, you know, person. And there are alternatives, there are ways to acquire that money, some of which might appear to be dubious or might actually be dubious. So the question arises, is it Permissible or impermissible for a student to take loans in order to educate in order to complete his degree or her degree? That will be our question for today? Now, obviously, the issue here we're talking about are those loans which have riba or appear to have riba we're not talking about taking

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a loan from family and friends, we're not talking about a grant that might come from a benevolent charity or maybe even some governments might give you a grant that if you qualify, they might just give you some money to educate yourself and they don't expect to be paid back. We're talking about a loan in which you are going to pay back more than what you took. And there is no doubt my dear brother and sister that the default when it comes to riba when it comes to interest when it comes to you serious transactions is that it is haram, and the proofs for this are well known and there is unanimous agreement amongst all of the scholars of Islam that Riba is haram, Allah Subhana Allah

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says in the Quran, what a hell Allah will be what ha Rama riba that Allah has permitted trading, bartering and Allah has forbidden Riba and Allah says in the Quran, you and Adina ama know Lata Kulu riba although I offend Medora alpha, who you who believe do not eat Riba in multitudes taking more than what you have given and the evidence is for this are well known. So the issue is not therefore, the issue is not therefore whether Riba is halal or haram. It is haram. The issue is this type of contract that the student is getting involved with, firstly, is it Riba? And secondly, can an exception be made? Is there some mitigating factor? Are there circumstances that in some times in

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cases, a something that is haram might be lowered just for that person? Or for that circumstance, as we're all aware, that in dire situations, that which is haram becomes permissible, but the default ruling is that remains held on but in dire situations, a person might be allowed to do something that is otherwise how long? So the question therefore, should be rephrased, and that is that, firstly, are these are these loans that are given actually Riba? And secondly, if they are, then is there a mitigating factor that might allow such a person to take such a loan? So to respond to this as as usual, I go into a lot of detail and I try to, you know, give the perspective of many odema.

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I've gotten some complaints in the comments that I spent way too much time talking about all these so can I just give the answer and then explain. So I'm going to give you my quick answer, and then I'm going to explain. My quick answer is that the fatwa that has been given by a number of reputable fifth councils in America and in Europe is that it is permissible with conditions and therefore

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That is the quick answer with conditions that if you can afford it is not permissible. If you can get loans from other people that are non interest, it is not permissible. If you can get a grant, which has no interest it is not permissible. However, if you have no other option to be educated at a level that show, generally speaking, the presumption will be that you shall live a better life for you and your family. And that this is an education that will benefit you in this world in sha Allah Allah. If there is no mechanism to finance that education other than such a loan, then it is permitted, but you must pay it off as soon as possible. This is the whole loss or the summary. Now

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with that summary, I'm going to go the longer route. And I will begin by stating that the issue Dear brothers and sisters when it comes to this is that so many people make quick judgments without understanding firstly, the sole or the parameters or the evidences and the can and the issues of our Sharia. And secondly, without understanding the context within which within which to apply the basic rulings. The average person who wants to know these types of issues and questions has not studied what Riba is in the Quran and Sunnah. They're not aware of the categories of Riba, the types of Riba the causes of why riba has been made haram. And because it is so confusing, as I always say, do your

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brother do sister, choose the scholar that you think knows the best and fears Allah the most, and follow that scholar, don't get involved in the issues between the dilemma you are well aware that for most modern issues, there is a spectrum of opinion, realize, when it comes to student loans, you have, again, a spectrum of opinions. And for some reason, when it comes to these types of loans, whether it's for houses or or studying, and when it comes to, you know, certain very few issues for some reason, I find that many people get very emotional, they get very quickly angry, and they pronounce verdicts about the opinions they don't agree with. We're using adjectives that is simply

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an Islamic and unbefitting choose the opinion and the scholar excuse me, choose the scholar don't choose the scholar based on opinion. Choose the scholar that you trust the most choose the scholar whom you feel is fully understanding the situation and fears Allah subhana wa Taala and that is your judgment call. You have to make a judgment call and then simply follow that Adam and that's exactly what the Quran says. Ask the people of knowledge if you do not know. Now, I have been asked this question by a lot of people so I will give you my take on it. But if you don't care about my take, then don't worry about it go to the scholars whom you do care about. So if you have asked me, I will

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tell you the long answer.

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Realize broadly speaking that there are three main genres of answers three main philosophies out there three main camps of scholars when it comes to this issue of student loans. The first camp says that student loans are haram and they don't really go into a lot of detail over conditions or whatnot because in the end of the day, they consider it to be haram and they say that such loans are riba because you are basically given an amount of let's say 100,000 for education, and you're going to pay back over the course of 1020 30 years 110 120 150,000 So they say this is cleared riba they say rebar is haram and haram can only be permitted in in case of life and death. And since education

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is not life and death, since you don't have to go study at a university, therefore, it is haram to take advantage of a loan that has this type of riba for educational purposes. You cannot educate yourself based upon a loan that is haram. And this is the fatwa that and again, I'm just being district descriptive here I'm not trying to be pejorative, I'm simply telling you as it is, this is the first word that generally speaking you will find from most of the scholars from the Salafi school and most of the scholars from the Deobandi school and I say this again with respect and you will find many dozens of scholars of this persuasion who will give this type of a fatwa. And

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generally speaking, the fetch will be very short and very straightforward. It's an open shut case because they say and again their philosophy is very sound from their perspective, a student loan is Riba and riba has been made haram in the Quran. And Allah has said that Riba is equivalent to waging war against Allah, His Messenger, and therefore you may not take a student loan because this is waging war against Allah and His messenger. Now again, this is the first school and you will find plenty of Islam websites, q&a and Islam, you know, asking Islam and whatnot lots of these websites that have these these factoids, and again, that's a good school out there if you follow it if you

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subscribe to it and hamdulillah no problem and take the fatwa and go with it. And I do not doubt the sincerity of these odema and I do not doubt at all for a second their desire to protect the OMA from the punishment of Allah subhanahu wa

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Hello. So I have no doubt about their credentials and their sincerity and their desire to be pure. May I simply say that when you look at the other philosophies and the other schools out there, one does, some would see that there's a sometimes perhaps a little bit of disconnect, as I say this with respect, between the context and reality of the OMA, between the reality of life, if you study versus you don't study, and the hardships that might be imposed by such a fatwa, and between the ideal or the utopic, you know, ideal that they strive for. So, you know, I think that one needs to take into account the fact that such a fatwa will impede the religious folks, because the irony,

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again, is that perhaps the bulk of the Ummah, you know, under that's a sad reality, doesn't really care about this. And that's a sad reality. But what we are doing is that those who care, we're asking them to have a standard in this issue that is actually going to impair them and their progeny in all likelihood. Now, of course, I know the response. And the response will be there should be telecoil. The response should be that we don't care about these hardships of this world. We want to save them from the Wrath of Allah subhanho wa taala. It's not why job to become a doctor is not why did you become an engineer, it's not why job to go study in university, they can go find a job in

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some you know, odd, you know, our job or some manual job that does not require any education. And they can obtain Hala, who's I understand the response. And as I said, I do not doubt for a second, there's sincerity, and whoever wishes to follow it Alhamdulillah. All I'm pointing out, please, brothers and sisters, understand, as usual, the religion of Islam scholarship of Islam is much more vast than the one strand that you might have been exposed to for the last few years. And the majority, I would say, of rulers that are engaged with these realities, and are actually living in the West, because again, many of those who are giving such fatwas again, with love and respect to

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them, many of them not all, but many of them, really are not even living amongst us. And one finds that, you know, these types of scholars generally are not quite aware of the realities of how life might be here in America, for someone who's working an odd job, and he has the potential to go study, he has the skills, he has the mind, he has the grades, and then he is told he cannot go study, because it is not allowed how that's going to impact the rest of his life, in all likelihood, because again, we base our fatwas on the reality, not on statistical oddities. But on the mainstream, generally speaking, what will happen if you get a solid education, and what will happen

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to your career versus generally speaking, don't quote me, the Bill Gates, dropouts don't quote me the, you know, the icons that have become multimillionaires. These are the exceptions, the general rule, if you have a solid education and a solid degree, that will help you attain a level of livelihood that will bring about the respect and dignity and goodness for you and your and your progeny in this world, now, does the shady I require you to give that up? That's really the question if there is such a loan involved. So this is the first school and again, utmost love and respect, and you will find their foot was all over the internet, because they have a lot of websites out

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there, especially the first branch, they told you, they have a lot of websites that have the same type of photo. J, this is the first school out there, the second school out there actually has a very interesting pushback. And they say that not every loan that you get is actually a loan that is riba we based. And there are many scholars out there who actually say that some of the loans that are given, and this, by the way might apply more in Europe than in America. In Europe, by the way, for those of our American audience, you're probably not aware, in Europe, many governments give specific type of student loans, including England, including many of the countries. In Europe, they

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give types of loans that have many different conditions to them. So I'm not going to go into all of the details of which country in which not that's something you can look up. But I just want to point out that there are quite a few significant scholars who say that just because it is called a loan doesn't make it alone. And that especially if there are some key conditions in there, for example, I'm just giving you an example. In the in the United Kingdom, if you're a citizen of that country, and you wish to take a student loan, the government will give you not give you the government will directly pay the school you will never actually obtain the money. The government will pay the school

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your fees intuitions, and the government then gives you a lot of different you know, scenarios or conditions in which you don't have to pay back that that student loan if you die if you're in a severe accident that debilitates you if you earn less than a certain amount even if you graduated, but you didn't get a good job you're earning less than their particular they have a BB they have a number if you earn

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Less than that amount, right? The government says you don't have to pay us back until your salary is above that amount, and the loan is not transferred to your worth or to your inheritors, right. And also, the loan comes from their own government money, the taxes that you paid. So the loan is really it's coming from the collective pool that the citizens themselves have given to the government. And so many other issues and conditions are added here. So a group of scholars basically says, given these conditions, now, again, I'm being very clear, I'm talking about specific types of loans. I'm not talking about a loan that you get from a bank here in America, I'm talking about specific types

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of loans that are given from governments and they have certain conditions that forgive the paying back of it. A number of scholars, prominent scholars simply say that this is not a shutter a riba we loan, it's not by short, I mean, it's not the definition of a rubber loan, the shady I will not consider it you this is not a loan at all. On the contrary, it is in the vested interest of the government to educate the citizens, and the government is taking your own taxes, and paying you the student some of those taxes, but it's not giving you cash, it's actually giving the institution directly. And the government is basically investing in you to be a better citizen for itself. And

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the payback is not just the money, it is your education. And so there are a number of prominent scholars, including Shia itemId, headed in England, who basically say that this isn't a loan in the first place, you can call it whatever you will, from the shutter a perspective, it's not a loan, it is a type of investment in you. It's something that the government is doing in you. Now, I'm aware of some people in America who hold the same view about government student loans, not the loans that you can take from a bank. And some scholars allow this I know. But generally speaking, there is a market difference between the American versions and the European versions, nonetheless, you should

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be aware, the second category of aroma, and there are people like this and it is more common in Europe than in America because of their, you know, socialist version of governments. They're Europe, predominantly is

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socialist democracies, as you're aware, and they give a lot more perks because their taxes are higher. We in America, we are we are vacillating anywhere, let's not go down that tangent over here. The point is that a lot of scholars say that not every single thing that is called a loan is a loan. And many times that which is called a student loan, does not actually meet the definition of a loan in the Shetty out, and it is more of an investment than a loan. And so they would say, and again, this is primarily for specific European countries, that it is not a loan in the first place. Now, just FYI, here in America, there are some types of loans that the government gives you as well.

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There are two main, you know, loans, there's a federal government loans, and then there's the private loans. We are not talking in Category Two about private loans. When I say category two Sommaruga Ma said that it's not alone, we're talking about when the government itself gives you money, or even a benefactor party, I don't think that is exists in America, but a third party that has certain conditions that basically change it from being alone into a type of investment for the betterment of you know, there might be I don't know, I'm not aware of all the types, there might be a certain charity that says, hey, you know, people have this background, people of this race, people

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of this persuasion, people of this

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degree engineering, or whatever it might be, we want to help them only. So if you meet the criteria, they might say, we're going to invest in you and your education. And these are the conditions and if those conditions are such that go to a scholar of this category, go to a scholar who has this view, for example, and ask them, Hey, what is your opinion, is this particular grant that I'm getting? Is this loan I'm getting is this something that the Shediac considers a loan? Because in the end of the day, if you're forgiven the loan, if you're not making above a certain amount, if you're forgiven if you die if you're forgiven if you're divinity, that's not quite a loan, per se, is it? Right, it's

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actually a gift with conditions. And that's a different category altogether. So federal loans, there are subsidized loans, there's unsubsidized loans, there's consolidation loans, there's PLUS loans. And again, with utmost respect to those in the first category, utmost respect, they don't really think about all these different categories at all, and they simply lump them all together. And in my humble opinion, taking a subsidized loan from the federal government subsidized means that you don't have to pay interest throughout the duration of your studies. And that once you graduate, you have an interim period to try to pay it off. That if you feel that you're able to pay it off in that

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timeframe. In reality, that type of loan that's coming from the government, you cannot have the same ruling on that type that you do from a bank. There's really too much different you can say that is you know, a lesser type of haram if you want and if you want you can argue from the

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I'd agree with the second paradigm, the second group of scholars who will say no, it's the government taxes. This is not even, you know, it's not even a type of loan that is for profit, it's the government wanting to invest in its own citizens. So, some Obama have allowed this and that is a second category and camp, my personal choice, your opinion is the third category of rule AMA, and I find myself very much in line with this third category. And the third category says that the loan that is given

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that is given and you give back more than what is given it is added by loan, but, but in some conditions and circumstances, it becomes permissible for some people. In other words, what they are arguing is that the default ruling is that a ribeye alone is haram. That is the muscle that is the basis. However, for some people, in some circumstances, and some situations, an exception is made. And if those circumstances are met, then an exception can be made for this person, therefore, and now this is actually a large group of scholars and committees. And every scholar and every committee in this camp might have slightly different you know, conditions, slightly different

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conditions put there, but the gist of it is, again, category one very simplistic, open shut haram haram haram, end of story, Category Two. And by the way, category two and three are not mutually exclusive, because you can have some people who say that some types of loans are category two, they're not Riba. So they're completely haram, and other types are haram, but they will be allowed in some circumstances. So categories two and three are not mutually exclusive. IE, you can have a scholar who in some loans will be category two, and then other loans will be category three. And frankly, that's probably where I would place myself in the ones that the loans that are found in

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some lands in Europe, what I have looked at them, I am very much in agreement that they are not riba based loans in the first place. That's my humble opinion. I know some scholars disagree. And other scholars say the same thing that I'm saying. As for here in America,

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that type of loan is not exactly riba free the subsidized government loan, I would say there is the condition of Riba in it, the condition of Riba is in it, but inherently it has nothing to do but we loan because you can be studying for six, seven years, and you will not have to pay any interest and the amount is going to remain the same. And they will give you six months. And in those six months when a person knows you have a job, you might even be able to get a loan from your brother from your cousin from your uncle say, hey, look, I need a loan now. Because I have my job as a doctor I have my job is something and I want to pay it off as soon as possible. So a lot can happen in those six

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months. And Allahu Allah, I think that's a very different category than a loan from a bank, which is category three, the scholars here would say if you're going to get a straight up, Rua, we loan because the loan from the bank really is a loan from the bank, you're gonna go to the bank, maybe our European brothers are not aware of this here in America, there are student loans from the bank. You know, a young man or young woman goes to the bank with the father who's earning a lot of money or the mother and they will cosign the debt. So the primary person is the student who has to pay off the debt and the interest is charged immediately that you have given the loan and if in case the

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student does not pay, the cosigner is obliged to pay under all circumstance, even if the student dies even if there's a car accident doesn't matter. The cosigner has to pay the bank back at the agreed upon interest rate that's a clear, open and shut case of riba there's no question it is riba again, please understand brothers and sisters category three are Allama are not saying it's not riba from the bank. It's clearly about by the way subsidized loan. I don't think it is a riba we learn. As I said, it is a loan with the Rebbe condition that's the difference between the two. But the loan from the bank is a riba based loan. However, this group is saying in the Listen to me carefully, not

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every riba transaction is the same level of haram and some levels of Haram are allowed in situations of need, and other levels of Haram are only allowed in life and death situations by unanimous consensus Haram is allowed in life and death situations that's unanimously right. Now the issue is if the level of haram goes down, right, if the level of Hajj if the level of need lower or higher, goes down as well, can this also then become permissible? And this is where the the third category of scholars come? And this is essentially the fatwa of the European Council. The European field Council, which at the time by the way, was headed by Cher Qaradawi you had great ruler Marcia face

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and Mawlawi Shahab de Lucia Judea, I mean, great alumnus of the world. They sit on the

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European field Council. This is what the fatwa they have given and also the American jurists Association Amager which is generally speaking, I say this with respect it is perceived to be somewhat on the conservative side that two has given a fatwa that is essentially the same with some minor modifications to the European Council. So both the European field Council and Amgen and I know also the full council North America is on the same wavelength, they have all given a fatwa that would basically be in category three, which is the default of such loans is that they should not be done. But if certain conditions are met, then a student may take such loans and pay back as soon as

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possible. So let us quickly go over some of these factoids. As for the European Council, so they were asked in a fatwa 81 dash four slash 18. That's the number they have here. That what is the ruling of a student taking loans in order to be educated

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in knowing that he's gonna have to pay back more than the amount that he was given. And the response again, I'm just making it short here, that that there is no hemorrhage there is no sin in the student taking such a loan without declaring the hydrator there are certain mental hijama that is because the need to be educated is a general need of society will have to either unmet xs Zela, Manzella Balraj, when the need becomes general, it is treated like a necessity, as many of the scholars of the past have and feel understood and felt have said and the rulings of necessity and the rulings of need are different and they are meant to lift up the necessity and the need to make

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life easier. Therefore, for your Jews in your body. And yet for them, I tell you, who did rasa tea it is allowed for the student to take just as much as he needs in order for him to study and so they are very clear in this regard. The general philosophy is that they consider they consider the level of him now again, so pause here let me let me explain what I'm saying here. When the Quran prohibited Riba, we need to understand what is the primary prohibition in the Quran?

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Oh you who believe do not eat Riba although alpha and modal Alpha multiple fold, and the GRE the concept of Riba, the primary Quranic riba that Allah azza wa jal revealed, then will be how to women, Allahu wa rasuluh was that a person gives another person alone for the exact same amount. Here's 1000 Give me back 1003 months, when that three months comes, the man is not able to pay back. The man doesn't have the money. So now the one who gives the loan says okay, I'll increase the time, but you increase the amount. This is taking advantage of a misfortune. And this is the Riba that Allah has said in the Quran, then will be how to be min Allahu wa rasuluh and it is the worst type

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of Riba. Now everybody admits there's types of riba people don't understand fifth point here and also, this is the main type of Riba, the worst type of riba that you take advantage of somebody's misfortune, and you squeeze somebody who's now bankrupt and he, you know, you had an agreement, he's gonna pay back the amount, you come and say, Aha, okay, no problem. You You You owe me 1000 I want back 1500 I'll give you an extra year, right? This type of Riba is blatantly taking advantage of the person's situation. Now, the types of labor we're talking about are forbidden, because they lead to the type that is explicit. And that is the type when you agree from beforehand, that type of Riba.

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Now, again, I'm going to say something that there are multiple opinions. I'm being simplistic here, one group of scholars, and this is the position that I'm sympathetic to. One group of scholars says the type of riba that we are accustomed to was not known to the jarhead the Arabs, they did not give 1000 and take back 1100 From beginning of the contract that wasn't known to them rather, they would give 1000 hoping that a disaster would happen and then they'd squeeze more at the end of that not having pre agreed now, the fact that you pre agreed doesn't mean it's not riba it is still Riba. But this riba as our share of Doctor documented we said and there's a q&a you can listen to it I give

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with him. Dr. Our community we explain this very nicely when I had the interview with him and he said this type of Riba, it is a labor that is forbidden because it is a means to the end it is not forbidden in and of itself. It is not forbidden directly it is forbidden indirectly. And the philosophy that this group of 11 group three have is that listen to this carefully, that which is forbidden indirectly. That which is forbidden because it leads to the bigger haram

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It is haram but it is a lesser haram and because it is a lesser haram therefore, it may become permissible for a lesser thing than Ebola than a life and death situation which is called a Hajra. So though Rudra if you don't have it, you're going to die a hydra if you don't have it, life will be extremely difficult Bonura if you don't have it, you're going to die. And Allah says in the Quran, if you have no option except to eat a dead animal except to eat pig except to drink something haram then if you're going to die, then go ahead, eat what you have to that's the Rura what these scholars are saying the type of riba that we find in the banks is a type of riba that is haram because it is

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a stepping stone to the worst type of Riba. It is still haram, nobody's saying is helot in this camp, it is haram, but because it is haram indirectly It is haram as it was sila at the point the technical term, it is meant made haram not leave that to him not because in and of itself, but rather it is a we'll see later that which is greater haram. So they say because it is made indirectly haram it is made haram because it is a stepping stone. Therefore, when there is a Hajah when there is a strong need not to life and death situation. The the hijab may overcome the Tarim level, the Haram level for that particular person, and this is the footwear that the European

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Council has given Dr. Acuna Louie has given shahada Lucifer Judea has given the as I said, the field Council of North America has given and m j has a fatwa that has a similar type of wording as well. And on its website, there's a nice paper by Dr. Miner Gula, which he wrote in December 2015. And he has a very nice fatwa, which again, with utmost respect to the first category of scholars, if you read this far too, and I would want to ascribe this as homework to those of you that are truly interested, go find a flat one, category one, and you will find it to be literally one two paragraphs is Hadith haram. And that's it. Now go read Dr. Monaco das fatwa, who I think has written

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a very nice photo in this regard. And you will find it in English on Amazon's website and contrast the two write with utmost love and respect to the first category. They're coming from a totally different mindset and paradigm. And as I said many times for those who know me, once upon a time, I used to be of that same mindset 25 years ago, 20 years ago, but life and experience and being with the people and reading and whatnot, I've shifted from that category to this one now and in all aspects of fifth as your for my q&a. And I think that this is the shorter a basis here is that it's really not that simplistic. Dr. Mind begins by talking about the problem he talks about, he talks

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about the modern reality, that the cost of a college education is increasing. And the need to be educated in the western world is something all intelligent people understand and agree upon. So looking at the fact that the cost is rising, and that really it is a strong need, then when will it become permissible, he also brings in statistics that

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Muslims in America are around six to 7 million, and in 10 years, you know, this number might even double and the average age is such and such, and the statistics of you know, education such and such, and this makes it clear that there's going to be a demand for higher education and a demand for loans. And then there's a brief our article or the brief paragraph about the rising cost of education. And he mentions that an average cost is around 23,000. In Texas, where he's reading, writing the article from then he goes on, and he says the ruling concerning student loans. Before giving a ruling on such a loan, one must have a complete conception of the need of these loans in

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general, and the need for them by Muslim students in particular, notice this paragraph here. And this is I think, the fundamental difference between category one scholars versus category two and three, category one, like it's really they're not really thinking about the situation. And they're having a very again, I say this with respect, simplistic attitude of the verse says It's haram, it's always haram. No, the verse is talking about a specific type of Riba. And that type of rebar is not what we're talking about. We're talking about a different type and it is it ABA. I'm not saying it's not the scholars are not saying it's not it is riba but it is not the same type that the Quran

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mentions. And therefore, if it's not the same type, well then what level of headin what level of impermissibility Does it have and therefore, what will require that impermissibility To become permissible for various people what level of need is there that will overcome that level of to headin and then you know, Dr. Mann, basically, you know, has you can read it on his website, and he says that, this is Dr. Mann's fatwa This is not Andrews official position is Dr. manufactuer. That Firstly, a subsidized government loan in which the interest payments are covered by the government means that such a loan is not riba we in essence,

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As the government who gave the loan pays the interest as well, second interest does not enter into the subsidized loan through any other means, the student agrees to pay the interest on the loan, if he does not pay off the entire principal by six months after his education, so, Dr. Mann is saying this is not an interest loan in the first place that with that, what you get from the government that is subsidized, and then, thirdly, he mentioned the principle that is well known, you know, sort of that that which is prohibited on its own merit is permissible only in cases of dire necessity. Whereas that which is prohibited indirectly prohibited as a means to something else is permissible.

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In the case of overwhelming benefit. This is a maximum, this is a high though, this is a rule that many famous folk Aha, including Mr. Rafi has shown based on this principle, education is a need as we have shown, therefore, it is permissible for a Muslim student to receive a subsidized loan. If he believes that he will be able to repay all of it during the specific period. If he has a true need for such a loan, he would be a need. If neither he nor his parents have the money to pay for his education, he is not able to get a scholarship or be able to get a grant to cover his costs. Additionally, he is not able to earn enough money through work to pay for his schooling. In other

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words, she is a doctor mine is saying, a rich person who has access to wealth can't just go and take a loan because of convenience, or a person who has access to an education that if he works, he's able to pay it off that too, only when you really don't have an alternative, then such a loan would be permissible. Now, Sheikh Salah has sawI who I think is one of the senior scholars living in North America and the founder and the senior scholar of the American Muslim jurist Association, Sheikh Salah Hassan, he has the official am Jaffa tour and the position and of course I say this again with utmost respect I'm not trying to be but factually speaking, is viewed to be somewhat on the

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conservative side and I say this because even Amager is giving this fatwa. So what do you think then again, we have this dismissive attitude, especially amongst our youth Subhan Allah, may Allah grant us all wisdom and maturity, there is this level of cynicism and skepticism when effect welcomes that they deem to be a bit lacks as if, as if the Sharia wants in every issue to be stricter and stricter and stricter. And the Sharia did not come to make life unreasonable. The shady I did not come to make life almost impossible. And to many of our youth are flirting with types of extremism and fanaticism. That is dangerous for them, because frankly, they're not going to last in that bubble

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and is dangerous for the ummah. And my advice to them is to look to the senior scholars, people who are double triple their age people who have studied the Shediac so much more than them and who live amongst us and I've given you a number of names in this very talk here people that are senior to me in age and the wisdom and the knowledge and I look up to them, and they are all saying that with these conditions it is allowed. So what does your Salah ha saw we say listen to this, this is directly from Shell Salah has always website and he is the founder of Amgen and this is the factor that Amgen itself has approved and Oslo who are to remove or corrode arriba we're the default is

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that it is not allowed It is haram to take Uber we loans regardless of whether it is for a student or other than that because there's clear Riba in this. And in current situations in the universities in the West, there are many available opportunities for grants for those who are smart or for those who are coming from socio economically underprivileged backgrounds as well. There are opportunities to work and so basically, there's a whole paragraph try your best to get access to wealth in other ways possible, try your best to get to get loans that are interest free. Try your best to the best to get subsidized loans that you can pay off for six months without interest. This is the second

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paragraph the last paragraph of the fatwa is an Adam at Kulu had the Hilda in what I entered through the river we're at Seville and Wahid and if all other avenues are shut, and the only way possible to study the Italian will geometry, the only way possible to get a university education is to take riba we loans then in this case, in the DECA, this is considered to be Bo Ra It is a need to refer who is more Riba is going to lift the sin of riba we're in Buckley or hook more to him even though the general rule that it is haram shall remain. In other words, it is haram, but for a student who has no other alternative, and there is no access to wealth, it is

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not going to be sinful even though the default remains if anybody will ask you what is the ruling on an interest loan? You say it is haram. Okay. May a student who has no other option, take an interest loan, that student is overlooked and forgiven, and the default remains to him. Do your brothers and sisters this is what you call the fifth. This is what you call knowledge. This is what you call wisdom. Not like some people who make everything haram and go for it and bid and share Subhanallah Calm down, calm down, the OMA has to survive and the OMA has to rise up in this world and the next and the type of riba that Allah has Lana and the curse of Allah and the war that is being waged that

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type of Riba is the one who is giving riba we loans the one who is taking advantage of the poor situation. As for the types of riba that are common in banks, it is also a type of Riba. However, this type of Riba, as Dr. Carlson will have that conversation, it is forbidden according to the Sunnah, and it is something that is of a lesser degree than the Quranic prohibition, and it is haram, but it will become overlooked or permissible or mobile for that person who is basically in that needy situation. And this is the third category and is the one that I am very comfortable giving a fatwa on in this regard. And like I said, don't take it from me take it from the European

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Council from the third Council, North America, from the American Muslim jurists Association, all of them and these are all councils, all of them have reputable odema, on board all of them or groups of people, and they're all in the same. Now again, to be a bit academic, each one of them has slightly different wordings. But the gist of it is the same. And that is, the student who has no other alternative, to get a wealth in order to pay for an education is allowed to take such loans, but still, they should try to find alternatives. And even if they take such a loan, they must prioritize paying it back. And that's something that they refer to I mentioned that even if they to to do take

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such a loan, they must prioritize paying it back, bottom line brothers and sisters, those of you that need to take a loan, try your best to find an alternative, by the way, you're going to medical school or something of this nature. There are programs that you know, if you sign up for the government, you know, they will pay for you. And then you have to, you know, work for the government for three, four or five years, something like this. This is without a doubt this is Hello. It's not even a loan, it's that the government is helping you so that you can help them. These are don't come under the prohibition anyway. There are, as we said, subsidized government loans. Again, in my

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humble opinion, that's not even a riba we loan in the first place, a subsidized government federal loan for you to study, it's your own taxpayer dollars coming back to you. And there are certain conditions which you know, the condition inside of it is that we condition but the contract the essence of them giving you the money in and of itself, you can avoid a river loan by paying it back in six months, and you make the knee I'm going to try Allah will find a way out for me. So try to get a subsidized loan, if you cannot get a grant, if you cannot get loans from family and friends, if you cannot get a subsidized in that particular order, right family and friends and grants is the

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same if you cannot get any of that. And the only alternative is to get a straight up loan either from the government and unsubsidised or whether you go to biller Yanni. And I say this because I don't want to open this door. But if you feel there is no alternative other than an actual straight up loan for an education that will potentially change your life and career. Again, that's another key point your your education has to be one that is going to benefit you. And the community in other words is sustainable jobs, stable income, as you presume it to be right. Don't choose a field that is, you know, not something that is going to be of a benefit in this world. If that is the case, the

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third group of scholars says it is permissible and indeed Allah subhanho wa Taala knows best. Last point brothers and sisters do think long and hard and praise to harder and ask family and friends about this issue because there are many issues that also come with being in student debt. It's not good being a student debt. And if there are alternatives and perhaps by asking around you might find such alternatives then that is better for you. Nonetheless, in the end of the day, if there is no alternative than indeed and Allah knows best, it is not going to be considered sinful even though the default ruling remains that such a loan. It does have a river in it is a riba we loan wala

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Italia item until next time, just like Kamala Harris said I'm like Morocco to Allahu Allah category

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Good

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evening, Mr. Connolly here. Me, ms de Heaton doll Seanie one doesn't show

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up

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You want to feel

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it

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feel

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free to mimic journey Tansa down to

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me down