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Islam, Government, and Rebellion

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Hatem al-Haj

Channel: Hatem al-Haj

Episode Notes

Episode Transcript

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I love I embrace our tradition, beyond your imagination. And I believe that it is beautiful.

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But when it comes to our political philosophy, I think it is very underdeveloped. And you could notice the frustration on my tone. But please don't misunderstand this a bit mean any disrespect, they were working under different circumstances, whatever it is that we,

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our failure to develop our political philosophy is what makes me frustrated, I understand that they work under pressure, I understand that they have different circumstances, I understand that, that they have accepted,

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sort of that they have some that are or is sort of exceptional circumstances

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that we have turned into over centuries, and I'm not talking about contemporary people only. But over a century, we spent centuries we have turned into collateral into faculty, our we have turned in the exception into the default. And we have turned that into why as well.

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If you look at how they, how they sort of establish procedures for a membership, it is about 30. It's about you know, between between between us, and then, you know, whoever dominates it study, it is that if that is being justified.

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And certainly, certainly

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you will

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have with hindsight, you will, retrospectively

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or innotrans, respectively, when you want to justify this, he will find textual reports, some people made up textual reports, we know that what used to exist, but you may find the extra reports that are actually traceable to the prophets, Allah and interpret them in a way that fits your worldview. Engineering, reverse engineering, that completely fits your worldview, and completely, completely allows you to be at peace with your reality, you know, because it's just, you know, these are times where the whole world

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lived under monarchies, and you know, you know, the, the evil triad in Europe and, and all of that stuff, which made people rebel. And so that was the world around them. Now, you're looking at it from a completely different perspective. So, you know, and you're looking at, you know, democracies here and there, and people holding their leaders, accountable institutions, separation of powers, and all of that stuff. But during the time of Mr. Wagner, Kodama, where was that, I mean, you know, separation of powers, I guess, uses all that these were monarchies, they were being attacked by the Crusaders, they were being attacked by Richard the lionhearted. They wanted to maintain the

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solidarity of the Muslims, and they wanted me So, that completely different perspective. So, we have, despite our frustration with the departures that our tradition have

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seen or experienced from the scriptures, and from the Islamic ideals, we have to maintain our respect for our Imams and scholars, if you if we compromise that it will, you know, it will be a snowball and it it will end up

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we will end up in a very, very perilous, dangerous undesirable place.

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Okay.

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Now, then, these Baja, these are the rules for these Beauvoir. And then we can come back and talk about

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what we think about, you know, the way forward for these Boca who fulfill these conditions.

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The Sheikh said what I thought about what I would do better, while I O'Hara what I have I'm sorry, Allah Ji Han Yogananda man. Well, I just met Andrea woman putting them in her home was sila coffee and I was only Ali. those of them who are a treat should not be pursued and those who are wounded should not be killed. their property is not seized as war spoils and their families are not enslaved. those of them who are killed the should should be washed, shrouded and half adjourn as a funeral prayers offered for them.

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Very quiet.

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Because many times those Beauvoir that were considered baja were of the best of this oma you know, because at the end of the day, and Jose in rebelled Avenue barrier rebelled of the Ramadan as has rebelled, him and the Pura the best the cream of the crop of the tambourine.

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Mohammed bin Abdullah Al Hassan rebelled Sahaba nurses akia

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you know, whose rebellion has been supported by Abu hanifa and Malik, Ibrahim, Eben Ebon, Abdullah Hassan rebelled.

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So we're talking about the cream of the crop, the people who are a build during the time of the writers generations, were the cream of the crop.

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But anyway, so what are the minor had I hadn't, I hadn't for a tiny female Atala for hallel harbor magnificent, oh, man, neither of the two parties is held liable for damage to lives and properties that the cause the during the war.

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Now, whatever you have caused, during the war damage you have caused, this is basically like the civil war in America, when they decided that the way forward is basically to just move forward.

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And this was extremely smart America would have never been one country. Had they have the North? I mean, and certainly,

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you know, there, this has many aspects, I guess.

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But But in general, in general, had the North use the their victory to humiliate the south,

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it would have never been one country. Hey, likewise, they say that if there is rebellion, the way forward is basically not to look backward. Whatever happened, this happened, let's move forward, let's subdue the rebels, the insurgent rebels

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in the interest of the Union, and move forward. So neither of the two parties is held liable for damage to lives and properties that the cause the during the war.

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In fact, MMR era Viola and who or Alia viola, and who said Whoever finds their matter with someone else, they are more entitled to it. So, you know, after Jamil, some of the people who were fighting against Saudi Arabia law animal,

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they found a tribe, like a part, a huge part that the people who support is the value we're using to cook food. So someone from the opposite army recognize that it is theirs. So they demanded to take it back. So they said to them, now are they one, they said to them, give us time to finish cooking, and we will give it back to you. And they insisted to take it before they finished? So they spell to the food and they took their pot.

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So it just shows you that

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they were very visionary people, by the way, because that is it takes a lot of courage and it takes a lot of forbearance and I've had to do this. Now we want to bring healing.

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Not more division.

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Then the SEC said when alcohol Bova Highland deny him is a cat and lgct now krogen lamb you adalah em? What are all adelphia la him? What a young casu or while I own Kudu man help me hack me him Illa my own cudham in Hackney viry

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whatever the rebels have taken while and power, is it God

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or jizya

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or courage is not collected from them or from those who paid them. The judgments issued by their judges are not reverse reverse except in the same way as judgments of any other judges would be. Okay. So these people were in control the bocce were in control over a certain area. They acted like rulers. They had those rebels were in control of a certain area. They acted like rulers

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They collected the jizya fraud, and

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they set up judges, those judges adjudicated over many cases for years. Now we recapture that region. What do we do with all the judgments that were passed? By the judges? We keep them?

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Unless they

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unless they can be revoked by any, you know, even by our judges?

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when can they be revoked by our judges, even if they were passed by our judges? If they are in complete conflict with, you know, the clear explicit text or the consensus?

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But if there is so much they had possible it's they had we don't reverse the rulings.

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We do not recollect if there's a cap current or does Yeah, that they collected, we consider them to be just

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sort of we consider all of this to be valid.

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Now, as a cat, all you need to do, like what if what if the FBI agents of the rightful Eman come to you, you only need to say as

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they took it

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up normally used to pay give us a cat on it.

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You know, like some Harry died, who took over for first for some time, and he used to send the agents and they will pay there's a captain of that hurry.

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So all they need to say they took it. We don't have to establish any proof karats. And this year, because they are compensation for something, you need to establish proof, you need to show

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proof that they collected the jersey as a cap is an active portion anyway.

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But that's it.

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So we don't reverse the rulings?

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Can we validate whatever sort of

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sort of

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practices,

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government practices

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of theirs, when they were in control, and when they had power?

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So let me

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go over,

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drawn line now. Now I'm going to speak my mind.

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So what is

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what is this, like what?

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Certainly, the Muslim Ummah, has been in a constitutional crisis for about 400 1400 years.

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So it's not It's nothing new.

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Because the legitimacy of that the dominant sort of ruler will make, you know, the legitimacy of the governance, the government up for grabs all the time, whoever can dominate.

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It's such a prescription for like, crisis.

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Because the fact that we are calling faster today because they are rebelling against the rightful ruler will become the immediate meaning tomorrow, that you will have to pray for, and so on. And that is the dominant, sort of

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that's the dominant view in that tradition.

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As we said, or let's just go back, and anyone who wants to be please go ahead, because I'm gonna take some time to explain this issue in some detail.

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So

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now,

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does Islam have any system of governance?

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People have different ideas about this.

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We have, just like usual we have three different categories of people. We have people who are secular

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and Messiah that would

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basically also

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support like a more secular perspective.

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And they are my say, they are trained to be Messiah. So we will have to call the Messiah

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so according to

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This line, there is no system of governments prescribed by Islam

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and who would pioneer or champion this?

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in that tradition, you don't see a lot of people. I mean unless you're talking about people that you know philosophers and you're talking about Aquinas suffer you're talking about also had a jeyes that said that there is no Imam ship and there is no requirement for Imam ship in Islam and so on and so forth. But,

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but in general,

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now, this is more of a secular discourse that is supportive samish if she if any of the rise of Rahim Allah

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is the one who is usually remembered here to be in support of this position that there is no system of governance in Islam whatsoever.

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As shake it up the Razak oohs and ahhs, how do you shave a good decent as Harry shave? who learned in Oxford as well?

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You know,

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and,

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and he was from the Upper Egypt and he was known to be righteous by the way like people who will have met him particularly closer to the end of his life. They have basically reported that this was a righteous man, a good man, righteous man, half of Allah Salawat you know and so on. So Shikari Razak wrote a book after the is the khilafah was basically avoided or the falafel was terminated by

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has been at the heart of therapy in Turkey. And he wrote a book called that Islam also helped him and Islam while also and how come.

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So Islam and basically theories of governance or ways of, of governance. And in this book, she

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argues that there is no prescription whatsoever in Islam for how

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to rule. There is prescription for justice, there is prescription for kindness, there's medicine for this or that but there is no prescription whatsoever. Islam does not provide guidance in this regard. khilafah is not, does not have backing in the Quran and the Sunnah, the system of khilafah does not have any backing in the Quran and the Sunnah.

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Now, it is said that the shefali Abdur Razzak, it is said that she

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was under the influence of sort of party politics in Egypt. And because Malik Fuad, who is king for the king for the time was an Egyptian king wanted to claim that he left after turkey gave it up. So King flat said, well, it's about time for Egypt to resume its place in the Muslim world, as the center of the heart of the Muslim world. And then he had interest in claiming the khilafah after turkey gave it up. Now, there was a sort of internal sort of politics in Egyptian politics, and psychology of the Razak was against King for ad. And he did not want King squad basically to get that honor

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of being the halifa. And they say that he wrote that book, it is quite clear that Shekhar abdulrazaq, saying, who is a sort of

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a controversial moderns figure in Egypt? Let me say,

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we're friends. And it's quite clear that even tossin himself admits to have contributed to the book. Now the thomasine write the whole book or contributed or just contributed to the book. It is controversial, but I don't think that he just wrote the whole book, there are different reports here. And people narrate different things, even from personal communications with shikata abdulrazaq.

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But let us say that the thoughts in contributed to the book or the moderns in Egypt contributed to the book, and there were and Chicago abdulrazaq towards the end of his life, basically,

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this about much of what was written in the book.

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Now, to be honest with you, the tortoise or the Dinos, Manny or Sardinia, osmani, who was a prime minister in Morocco, who is an Islamist and a good man.

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Certainly, he has great history,

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wrote a book called double Islamia, Mohamad Mkn, and wrote a book called The dmcs at Amazon lovers.

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wrote several books that are very close to the classics thesis, his thesis, and those books are very close to

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his thesis theses and those books are very close to Chicago abdulrazaq. thesis. So should we put him here? Or should we put him here? Or should we put him in the middle? You know, why is it that Islamic in general were much kinder to him because he is one of them.

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And although his thesis is counter to sort of

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Islam as the agenda

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is just that he

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usually, you know, personal relationships, don't think that everything is is just merely intellectual, there is a huge room for sort of personnel.

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And that may also be a little bit unfair because sub Dean was Manny.

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And his response was a righteous man, you know, it's difficult anyway. But, but savviness man is trajectories of the North Manny's sort of work was trying to bring Islam normalize Islams place in the public space. That was his agenda. That was his life calling to normalize Islam, place in the public space. So that is why critics are kinder to him, I would be kinder as well, because history does, you know, your, your own work and your own sort of

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calling and live should affect how we perceive your thesis, but the curse of the last man in thesis is very close to shefali otherwise, so it is Han and there are many people.

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And I make it just here, like somewhere here, because it's it comes, it has different motives, different incentives. And

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also slight differences between the the the two

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feces. Now,

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you have then, on the opposite side, you have people who say that Islam gave us a detailed prescription of

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in terms of governance, and that would be many of the traditions, many of the Messiah,

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whether they are called the duck lady or saharawi, many of the traditional Messiah, whether they are the conventional or the sort of the people that are called Islamic or they are all Islamic, let's call them Islamic, because whether they are traditional, or whether they are awakening type machine, if they are still coming from that paradigm, they're coming from the same paradigm. And they say that Islam actually provided a very good sort of detail.

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manifesto for governance, like you could just and you know, some of those which I went as far as saying

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like and this is one of the, you know,

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one of the goodness if the very brilliant mesh if contemporary mesh, I have a Dr. Muhammad yesterday,

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who goes as far as saying that there are 12,000

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plus textual reports

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basically governing that area. slammin governance or this is the governance systems and Islam. Certainly, when you say this, the secular people who will be just completely frazzled,

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because 12,000 that means that there is no room whatsoever, except for fukuhara and mahadi seem to be looking at chains of narrations and sort of non human mukalla former former FACA there is and this politics will be dominated by fuqaha seen sitting in rooms talking about you know

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jehadi and matomo, Fokker mukalla and stuff like this, hey, it is like a scary thing to them. But that's a good sizable portion of the Messiah. Now there are Messiah that come in the middle and there are three

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speakers and Messiah can many people that come in the middle of this, and they want to say and keep in mind, we have to say this to simplify, it is never three prime. It is a spectrum. spectrum. When we say 123 that is us trying to simplify things, that is why I'm telling you, Saba Dino's many would not be here. So maybe here, somewhere, it's a spectrum. Put him on the spectrum. So, yes, this ambiguous, or

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the Rosa? Was there a certain threshold where afterwards they said that we can apply

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laws or statutes outside of the paradigm of Islamic

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tradition? For example, like was it after the application to the moon? No, it's not about Hadoop here. It's about Islam and system of governance

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you know, like

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monarchy, parliamentary presidential,

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you know, institutions you know,

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constitutional sort of stuff.

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Islam and systems of governance in general and when you will have no say of here like for instance the Sheikh Mohammed Abu

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who is six out of the last money or Victor Saavedra Diaz money is is influenced by him, but he took it a little bit further. And so if I'm going to have a laugh,

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I'm gonna have to actually is closer, you know, somewhere here also

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can laugh is here seven to two is always the shape of an answer.

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At some point is here.

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You know, one of the most significant people

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likely the most brilliant of them was not a traditional safe, but was a father of law in Arab countries, most of our countries and some Muslim countries as well. His name is Abdul Razak masanori of the rusnak, Basha sonori.

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So, this Egyptian fellow

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was actually extremely brilliant. And he

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he studied at Sorbonne and our friends, not Oxford, but as PhD thesis was about khilafah and how to bring a an alternative. So, he's building on the system,

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he is developing the system, he is not casting it away, he is not throwing it away, he is trying to develop it.

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And that is what he did in general. In his basically, approach, I mean, you could certainly there are things that determine the results and Maria can be wrong about of course, but in general, that was his approach. It is basically to build to adjust

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for the circumstantial variables. And his idea about the khilafah was a genius idea of Jamia must repay which is something like the European Union, he thought of this before the European Union by many decades, to bring the Muslims together and to have some semblance of unity, whether this is unified currency, whether this is you know,

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whatever, some semblance of unity cooperation under a union type of union, that will allow different Muslim states

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sort of enough independence, to not feel suffocated

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because certainly people in Bangladesh and Morocco, they have different sort of geographic cultural, contextual, like variables and that

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to be ruled from one area by someone who is in the other area is going to be

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difficult. So, he wanted to say bring them under one umbrella, there are certain things that will give us that semblance of unity

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you know, maybe ma da da masaka you know, so So, how do you say, in English, like defense treaties, among themselves, maybe unified currency. So the Organization of Islamic Cooperation is actually harder as a person who is idea, but he wanted to develop this more to become more

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meaningful and more significant. Likewise, when it comes to Islam and also the ogmore of Islam and Muslim and hockman systems of governance, he had the same idea. This group of people are saying that there are

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signet, there are general principles that are significant, that make some systems of governance compatible with Islam and some incompatible with Islam. So, you could say that there is guidance, Islamic guidance concerning systems of governance, but they are a guidance belongs to the

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the principles, not detailed, specific,

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you know, restrictive rulings, although, in some things there will be specific rulings.

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Of course, you may notice that this is where my inclination, that sort of group in the middle I'm inclined to their thesis. This comes from a concept that is established that there is a difference between and that's an idea

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if you read the tours or the Dinos man, his book on Islam and Islam, Al Mohamad in can, he does actually have a chapter on this that is

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nice, helpful, he quotes me they may and shorter be analogous early on the difference between the by that and a lot he had, that in the acts of worship, you have detailed specific rulings that are straightforward, and there is not much room for rationale

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sort of what

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departures you know, from the detail the specific rulings?

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Because that is just about you know, seeking the pleasure of Allah subhanaw taala, but when it comes to the area of a hobby towards comes in the area of usually translate customs, which just means wherever the affair

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there is not that you know, and there are guidelines that sort of, you should not

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rails on both sides, guardrails, but no specific rulings and us is what the default is, if you just do whatever you want, unless there is prohibition, whereas the default here is have

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you can't do anything unless you have proof on its validity.

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That area of the should the systems of governance belong here or belong here, of course belongs here. How but, but in the area of are the Is it one uniform a category one on differentiated category?

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Is there a difference between beer in knakal and

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cam in Missouri Urbana? Is there a difference between cross fertilization of palm trees and the rulings of we are basically or camel ri or horse enough? The rulings that pertain to selling dates and to basically guessing the sort of the amount of the dates on the the trees in exchange of flesh, the dates for

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dry dates and there is a way in which one hub

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which one did the promises and I'm say about antibiogram Morrisania komu now the affairs of your dunya better cross cross fertilization, what is the difference between cross fertilization and was that done and the

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one dealing with others.

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The one is just

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when there is a moral value when you expect that there would be higher unsure good and evil.

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Then Islam will have to have some say in it, because Metallica Ferran Illa de la Ilaha Rahman, the prophets Allah and leftists almohads obey the Allah can Aria as Yvonne hallahan whenever there was good the prophets of Salaam pointed us to it.

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And wherever there is bad there is evil. He warned us from it.

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But again, at the same time because of because politics is not like that. And there are huge circumstantial variables, then that guidance came in the form of principles

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and principles that are comprehensible or not in comprehensible, comprehensible.

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And in this case, the macaque acid are the objectives would be consequential or inconsequential, consequential.

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And you want to realize and cultivate those macrossan. So, you want to understand that comprehensible or effective causes, so that you're not limiting yourself to the rigid specific rulings, but you're able to accommodate the difference, the variables.

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So, in our the yard here, whenever you whenever you can think of higher and

00:36:02--> 00:36:06

then the Islamic, there is no Islamic guidance in this regard.

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There is no Islamic guidance in terms of, you know, chemical equations.

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You know, so if you add phosphorus to whatever,

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magnesium, what do you get

00:36:24--> 00:36:37

stuff like this, would you expect the Islamic guidance there? would you expect the Islamic guidance in terms of, you know, building bridges, for instance, or solving it problems,

00:36:38--> 00:37:06

or things of that nature? Not really. Okay, because there is no hierarchy there. It's not about failure and charter here, this is there is no moral value. Here. It's not loaded with any more value, but whenever there is more value and there is higher unsure, you will expect some Islamic guidance and this is when the guidance can come in the form of detailed rulings, such as an alibi, that or principles now CSS,

00:37:07--> 00:37:27

in terms of the things that are governed by governed by principles, not detailed rulings, the CSR belong closer to about that, like marriage, or does it belong closer to how the year you know, chemical equations

00:37:29--> 00:37:30

belongs closer?

00:37:32--> 00:37:38

It's not like marriage where it belongs closer tie, but that no, it is belongs closer to it yet.

00:37:40--> 00:37:44

So, meaning what, it is less regulated,

00:37:45--> 00:38:07

it is less regulated, there are general principles, but it is much less regulated by the textual proofs, there is much more room for rational thinking, for developing our political philosophy and so on and so forth. Therefore, whatever we talked about here about the issue of rebellion

00:38:08--> 00:38:10

against the hack, and

00:38:12--> 00:39:12

the problem arises and the contention between the different Islamic groups and secularists and Islamists and so on, is because of rigidity, and because of their lack of epistemic humility, lack of epistemic humility, particularly when it comes to them to religious people. You know, dogmatism is really a problem. And when you basically expand that a certainty that you must have with regard to the existence of God, and His Majesty and beauty to become a way of thinking for you, like you're always trying to look sort of so confident, uncertain, and so knowledgeable and so, on top of it, that whenever you find mush, I have different worldviews discussing issues. You think, you know,

00:39:12--> 00:39:19

these people are talking different languages, why is the dip gap between them is so huge,

00:39:20--> 00:39:28

because of this, because of the lack of epistemic humility, because they want everything to have the same sort of

00:39:31--> 00:39:32

certainty

00:39:34--> 00:39:39

that the rest of the you know the matters of our key the you know, are cannot be managed.

00:39:41--> 00:39:59

And then we have basically conflicting reports, you will find them not having nothing no matter where they're coming from. They will never have an issue because they can always twist it. denier sometimes lie sometimes

00:40:00--> 00:40:02

memes are basically cut and paste,

00:40:03--> 00:40:22

sort of leave out the little party that doesn't that is a little inconvenient, or that will require a little bit more work to explain. And that'd be like that is basically the the common behavior of people across the spectrum.

00:40:24--> 00:40:34

So, when it comes to horizontal hacking now, we said that you have a cafe, you have Ella del, and you haven't.

00:40:36--> 00:40:45

And when it comes to MJ F, you have the one who is consistently and you have the one who's randomly

00:40:48--> 00:40:50

they agreed on this,

00:40:51--> 00:40:56

although they still agreed on this, but it depends on your ability.

00:40:57--> 00:41:02

And certainly this applies to Muslim man's You know, this applies to Muslim majority countries and Muslim that

00:41:04--> 00:41:19

they agreed on this that it is impermissible. They disagree here. So, when our political philosophy boils down to Harrier juicer furusato, hakon, Zara juicy, juicy lucifers

00:41:21--> 00:41:25

and what do you dichotomize a very nuanced issue.

00:41:27--> 00:41:41

Then you will have the all the shouting and screaming between the two groups, and then everybody will be basically committing those sort of intellectual atrocities.

00:41:43--> 00:41:47

With without like an ounce of conscientiousness.

00:41:50--> 00:41:56

Okay, so, when we talk about this issue here, we have to ask who,

00:41:57--> 00:41:58

why,

00:41:59--> 00:42:00

and how.

00:42:04--> 00:42:06

And the final one,

00:42:08--> 00:42:08

cost,

00:42:10--> 00:42:14

consequences cost. So who's who? Why

00:42:16--> 00:42:23

should there be a difference between you know, and we're talking about the journey here, and we're not talking about random.

00:42:25--> 00:42:34

We're talking about someone who's like Jad, like consistently, or like bad for for the country. So should there be a difference between

00:42:35--> 00:42:39

individuals? Should the Hadees of the prophet SAW sanlam

00:42:41--> 00:42:42

be understood?

00:42:43--> 00:42:50

differently differentiate between other Hollywood actors? The old man, the old man that hired him?

00:42:51--> 00:42:59

Can the old method hire him fire him? Well in the hunt, but he must have no unless he asks to be fired.

00:43:00--> 00:43:03

So if you have a hacking job and Halliwell

00:43:05--> 00:43:10

must not fire him, unless he asks to be fired. Of course he's not going to ask

00:43:14--> 00:43:27

is so that they say that you use no money as you do? In set analyzed? Where lfl so they have the right to basically remove him.

00:43:28--> 00:43:31

If he asks for it, otherwise, no, that's added.

00:43:33--> 00:43:38

So you're basically holding the unmapped becomes a captive.

00:43:42--> 00:43:48

This is, this is there is you know, kizil quad kizil quad.

00:43:50--> 00:43:59

This is the Mexican mess. You know the Aztecs they have this God. And then when the Spaniards landed in Mexico, they thought, you know, it is like,

00:44:01--> 00:44:08

like a white big white God with white beard and so on. So they the Spaniards, they looked like

00:44:10--> 00:44:11

kizil quad,

00:44:12--> 00:44:14

and then then surrendered.

00:44:15--> 00:44:18

I would say that if we treat our rulers like

00:44:20--> 00:44:22

how our destiny will be like the destiny of the Aztecs.

00:44:25--> 00:44:26

It's just like,

00:44:27--> 00:44:28

it's amazing.

00:44:29--> 00:44:30

Anyway, but

00:44:37--> 00:44:37

I

00:44:40--> 00:44:53

think I think of the French Revolution, think of the French Revolution. Is there a difference between groups of people rebelling and think of the French Revolution, who started the French Revolution

00:44:56--> 00:44:58

the members of the Parliament, the parliament.

00:44:59--> 00:44:59

It was

00:45:00--> 00:45:15

started first at the parliament in the house of the people. You know, this was a revolution despite all of the atrocities that were committed to during the French Revolution. This was a revolution that was started by 100 100.

00:45:17--> 00:45:23

You know, so there is a there that's one difference, who's rebelling

00:45:24--> 00:45:26

or who's firing him, who's deposing him,

00:45:27--> 00:45:37

and why? And that is when an amendment Duany that makes the distinction, it has to be acid omen. Keep in mind that will come to it later.

00:45:39--> 00:45:40

But

00:45:41--> 00:46:05

according to the chef Kadeem, it is permissible to rebel against the unjust ruler, according to our hanifa according to just sauces, interpretation of Abu hanifa, the mother of Abu hanifa, clear macabre hanifa and his practice is the permissibility of rebelling against the unjust ruler, he supported Muhammad sahab enough says, aka he supported

00:46:06--> 00:46:08

Zeid nalli

00:46:10--> 00:46:34

his his statements, his actions are quite clear that it is permissible. The same applies to the man Malik who supports Muhammad Sahaba enough says okay and said to the people of Medina, that the buyer that you have given to a monsoon was by atmaca by under coercion and it is not a valid one. So, so, basically,

00:46:35--> 00:46:37

the question of

00:46:38--> 00:46:42

why and the distinction between

00:46:43--> 00:47:05

Java Albacete friend and occasional life not too bad, versus, you know, the shadow Lady stotra, and fist toward Livia motormen and so on, and this is the one that we're talking about, that you could rebel against, and how how is it is is

00:47:07--> 00:47:14

many times people who say that you can to rebel against the ruler, they want to suppress any dissent

00:47:15--> 00:47:25

without you know, asking that question, what is it that the what is it that they prohibited? Is it the armed

00:47:27--> 00:47:28

struggle

00:47:30--> 00:47:35

or rebellion or is it the puppy the puppy list or popular

00:47:36--> 00:47:37

uprising?

00:47:41--> 00:47:42

Is it several

00:47:43--> 00:47:51

sir, sort of this scent, like how how are you going to prevent this when the Prophet sallallahu Sallam said

00:47:53--> 00:47:54

if

00:47:56--> 00:48:04

ever Almighty akula does large amount of volume fucka to the Amina or you know hydro Jihad

00:48:06--> 00:48:13

say inshallah Hamza Raja Raja long commander some fun India famara one half a patella hybrid, you have kilometer How can Anderson fidenza

00:48:16--> 00:48:16

model

00:48:20--> 00:48:38

and that the the tons of reports about you know, condemning evil and commending and supporting God and even with with how can you know the best jihad or the best form of jihad is to speak the truth against the

00:48:39--> 00:48:59

unjust ruler and things of that nature. So, it this rebellion is it armed or basically civil dissent and popular uprising and so on, some people would like to extend this from arm to any form of dissent and that is just other nonsense.

00:49:00--> 00:49:12

So, these are and then at what cost, what cost, that is why the movements when he also mvrc, he makes the free eighth or between, he says

00:49:13--> 00:49:16

it will move from if a what is expected from

00:49:17--> 00:49:41

deposing him is worse than it walked out what that exists in reality, then you refrain common sense of course, you know, but if it is not, if it is believed that the Walker is worse than in water rocker, then you depose him. So, now this is who is the posing here, this is

00:49:42--> 00:49:48

the very people who gave him the contract, the very people who gave him the contract.

00:49:50--> 00:49:59

Why are we having so much disagreement nowadays because there was a switch in the fourth century and the first three

00:50:00--> 00:50:00

centuries,

00:50:02--> 00:50:07

the dominant view among Muslims was the permissibility of rebellion.

00:50:08--> 00:50:27

The dominant view among Muslims was the permissibility of rebellion. And we have talked about Hassan Ave by Mohammed Abdullah Hassan Ibrahim of the Roman Empire Raj and the para. So we're talking about the Sahaba, the cream of the crop of the tambourine tap.

00:50:29--> 00:51:02

These people that not only allow it, they actually rebuild, rebuild. And then came, you know, after many defeats of the rebels, after they were defeated, many times the insurgent rebels came up in the Mujahideen bursary emoticon them, and reported consensus that it is not permissible to rebel against the unjust ruler. He died in 360, after hedgerow.

00:51:04--> 00:51:50

He was a great scholar, but at the end of the day, he was mostly he comes from an area that is deeply traumatized by defeat, that of germanium happened to the kura, oven basara for 1000s of them, they were MasterCard, they were defeated very badly. And it's an area that is traumatized. At the same time, how could you report the consensus when you were extremely geographically limited, like, you know, you're in the fourth century, and you're reporting the census of all this issue, it in a manner hasn't says had he been mute, it would have been better for him to not speak that falsehood, because he knows that I mean, if ever, you know, what American hasn't used to have his own

00:51:51--> 00:51:53

way of expressing himself.

00:51:55--> 00:52:11

So he says that, you know, having known that, that moniker is Mark after having known that the one who did nice, and it's now a scaffold, and having known, you know, all of the all of the precedents, you know, from

00:52:12--> 00:52:24

the surveyor and etc, etc, etc. and claiming it as consensus after knowing this, it would have been better for him to be mute, than to speak this false. So

00:52:25--> 00:52:33

so then he, then we have a shift, where, traditionally speaking, the majority

00:52:34--> 00:52:44

sided with the prohibition of rebellion against the unjust ruler, the even within them, as I have that were

00:52:45--> 00:52:58

heavily, you know, they're a mams supported was money with with resources, the Imams recruited the mams recruited

00:52:59--> 00:53:05

insurgent rebels. And then you have this switch over time.

00:53:06--> 00:53:54

And then you have like, just as was reporting, what did the Mambo hanifa actually did and, and said, and so on, but you have someone like remember how he was a great hanafy as well, leaving, like a different interpret, sort of propagating or promoting a different interpretation. And then under pressure in every, you know, society, the scholars are under pressure. What would you do? Do you think that there would be pressure for them to say it is okay to rebel against the unjust rulers, they're living under unjust rulers most of the time, so, there has to be consideration for the pressure. So under pressure, it became as if it is a done deal, you know,

00:53:55--> 00:54:12

that it is forbidden. Now, am I saying it is not? Am I saying that you should we should rebel? No, I'm not saying this. Of course not. I am not supporting rebellion against unjust rulers. I am saying that this

00:54:13--> 00:54:47

is an mem Nur. this dichotomy is to unbecoming unbefitting of an oma like us, we have to develop our political philosophy to be more nuanced than just say India is remem nur, to take in consideration who, why, how, and at what cost, and to have a newest approach to the reports. Because if you claim that those reports are quite clear, extremely clear, whether you are on this side or that side,

00:54:48--> 00:54:59

you're not being honest. If you claim that the reports are quite clear, if you forbid, you know, rebellion against the unjust rulers, and you claim that they're the

00:55:00--> 00:55:08

Reports are quite clear and there is there is no room for controversy, then you are ignoring some reports.

00:55:09--> 00:56:03

And then you are claiming that those Sahaba and those tabular in the cream of the crop missed a very clear, sorry, the the clear implications of the reports that you have come to understand, and to be certain of, and to be quite clear on, things are so clear to you like the sun in the middle of a summer day, but they were not to Ebenezer Bayer and the Sahaba. And the terrain that were with him or her sign, or, you know, the Cora, decree shall be inside of Nigeria, and even Abby, Layla, and the people who actually fought, you know, themselves now, they get stuck. And sometimes they try to figure out how to answer this. And then we get into tech fee. Because, you know, and some people,

00:56:04--> 00:56:10

because the tradition is heavily slanted, particularly later,

00:56:11--> 00:56:24

in favor of prohibition of rebellion against unjust rulers, many people that want to rebel, they get sort of forced into tech field. Those rulers are not Muslim.

00:56:25--> 00:56:37

And then you get into this problem, because that's the only way basically, they have the freedom to rebel. Those rulers are not Muslim. So why are they not Muslim? They don't rebel by that which Allah?

00:56:38--> 00:56:40

Yeah. So.

00:56:41--> 00:57:01

Okay, and they promote secularism. Many Muslims sympathize with Erdogan, including myself, I sympathize with him. I think he's done great things for Turkey. But he's promoting secularism. And they say that, you know, he's just doing a graduate he spent 21 years

00:57:02--> 00:57:09

Okay, you know, grad, you know, one generation is 40 years, but again, at the same time, you don't have to promote it.

00:57:11--> 00:57:56

You don't have to, you know, that the whole system that you're using is basically a modern European system. The fact that you have, like, certain passionate speeches are the fact that you have some semblance of Islamism here and there does not change the fact that the whole system is this whole structure is not really so then then you fall into inconsistency or some people that like to be consistent and radical people always are very consistent. Because if you're if you're at one end of the spectrum, you're you're you're you're basically back is the wall you will be consistent. So

00:57:58--> 00:58:03

so then if you want to be consistent to make that we refer to as web and many people do, you know.

00:58:05--> 00:58:06

So if

00:58:07--> 00:58:11

that's the way you can actually continue to be consistent and be happy, consistent.

00:58:12--> 00:58:21

It's sort of atrocious and he likes like, how reckless and evil but but that's what some people do.

00:58:22--> 00:58:27

Anyway, so going back to this, you will have a hobbyist for instance, like

00:58:29--> 00:58:33

say a Coon O'Meara Atari when I mean who motoneuron say a goon Amara,

00:58:36--> 00:58:40

Daddy funan main home for Tancharoen

00:58:42--> 00:58:45

from nabasa home

00:58:46--> 00:58:50

nabasa home Naja woman

00:58:51--> 00:58:52

as Allah home

00:58:55--> 00:58:55

woman

00:58:57--> 00:59:00

Salim woman who a lot of home

00:59:02--> 00:59:03

hallak

00:59:04--> 00:59:05

say a call Hello.

00:59:07--> 00:59:10

And in some reports O'Meara

00:59:14--> 00:59:16

so hello, Mara Mara

00:59:18--> 00:59:24

three different types of reports but this word is actually authentic. Chain wise is authentic O'Meara

00:59:25--> 00:59:27

yagoona Mela falloon

00:59:31--> 00:59:32

wherever when I'm out Maroon.

00:59:36--> 00:59:38

From India had a home pod

00:59:50--> 00:59:54

fee and Hulu for this very capital called me man and Amara. Man about

00:59:56--> 00:59:57

so

00:59:59--> 00:59:59

now do you know

01:00:00--> 01:00:05

How these are reinterpreted. They are reinterpreted, nabasa, here.

01:00:08--> 01:00:13

Oh, so there will be Amara rulers

01:00:14--> 01:00:30

that you will recognize as commendable or can they condensable some of their practices or behaviors, who will ever know better home who ever. And that will because that's the nature here, whoever in about the home will be

01:00:32--> 01:00:50

Once, when survive will prosper, whoever separated separates or distance himself from them, well be safe, and whoever mixes with them will be destroyed. And these are two authentic reports.

01:00:51--> 01:01:12

Mr. Mattila de authenticated this report, but the chain is authentic, can be figured out ways to reinterpret them. There will be uncertainly of the thing is in Bukhari and Muslim where that doesn't have the word O'Meara halluf isn't Bukhari and Muslim. But the word O'Meara itself. And even if the word O'Meara is not there,

01:01:14--> 01:01:23

it means generations. And certainly, if you're talking about fighting them, you're actually making it taking it a step forward. And you're fighting the whole society, not just

01:01:24--> 01:02:11

so. So there will be generations, or O'Meara rulers who do what they don't jacobina matter of our own, they say what they don't do, and they do what they don't say they're like hypocritical. In other words, whoever fights against them with his hand is a believer, whoever fights against them with his tongue is a believer ever fights against them with his heart is a believer, there is no belief after this. So the people who want basically to interpret this away, they will say, in a bathroom here, whoever This means fights against them, when I bevere is basically opposition, and it is actually violent opposition.

01:02:12--> 01:02:23

But they say nothing here. But he said he, he basically speaks against them. And then some of them will come back and say, you know, you're in a better home, but he said he only in private, you can't.

01:02:24--> 01:02:29

Like, so please get me an appointment with them.

01:02:34--> 01:02:35

won't return. Yeah.

01:02:37--> 01:02:46

Okay, so how do we interpret this away do interpret this, we figured out three ways to interpret this away? One way is,

01:02:49--> 01:02:55

is that is life. Remember, the you know, the authenticated that has the O'Meara apart?

01:02:58--> 01:02:59

And

01:03:00--> 01:03:02

and that's basically you know,

01:03:04--> 01:03:25

that that is basically it. And then another way, which is a little creative is no, it is it is actually not vive, but then to hire, you change the Moncure with your hand if you can, the specific Moncure not to depose the ruler, but the say the ruler, for instance,

01:03:27--> 01:03:49

set up shops to sell wine, you change that moniker if you can. And most likely you can't, because the ruler is there and unless you depose the ruler and you change that Moncure you'll get arrested and there'll be be thrown in jail. But they're saying that this is what the Hadith means, you will do not depose the ruler, but you change the specific moniker

01:03:51--> 01:03:53

that the ruler you know,

01:03:54--> 01:04:00

committed committed or other people who have committed. So then

01:04:04--> 01:04:05

then

01:04:07--> 01:04:07

and then

01:04:08--> 01:04:16

they have so what about all the history? They will have acrobatic ways of interpreting the whole history away.

01:04:17--> 01:04:18

acrobatic ways

01:04:20--> 01:04:32

their counterparts on the opposite side are not less dogmatic by the way I'm not listed Matic by the way because there is a genre of a hobbies that are established in Bukhari and Muslim against rebellion.

01:04:34--> 01:04:52

And, and there is you know, the tradition is heavily inclined towards the prohibition of your river of rebellion. So you will have a hadith like that smell to me if asthma auto Tia

01:04:53--> 01:04:54

lil Amelia

01:04:55--> 01:04:59

were n alpha Malak Wah bah bah bah

01:05:04--> 01:05:21

Well, have you thought about an assignment to Allah no nausea and Amara, Allahu Allah and Tara go from our hand and the comb men Allah hi fi his or her

01:05:22--> 01:05:24

hobbies my attack on

01:05:25--> 01:05:27

what anthem

01:05:28--> 01:05:44

Jamia on holla rollin why had you redo and yeah Shaka asar calm while you're Federica Janata calm factor

01:05:46--> 01:05:48

Hi this man

01:05:49--> 01:05:57

rah men Amelie shy and your CRO fan Yasser

01:05:58--> 01:06:05

Allah He for who? Man farakka al jamaah

01:06:08--> 01:06:11

fermata flamita to

01:06:12--> 01:06:15

me that on jr hey you

01:06:19--> 01:06:34

know we can go on and on there you know there's like a whole genre of hobbies and this halifa and Bukhari and Muslim highly authentic. So, you listen and obey to the ruler even if he took your money and flagged your back

01:06:35--> 01:06:42

you listen and obey to the people in charge unless you see golf

01:06:44--> 01:06:53

this belief clear cut that you have like proof from Allah subhanaw taala on it being

01:06:54--> 01:07:03

whoever comes to you while you are together under one man wanting to

01:07:05--> 01:07:11

compromise your solidarity and disrupt your union kill him

01:07:12--> 01:07:25

who ever notices observes something he dislikes about his ruler, let him show patience for whoever separates from the community.

01:07:28--> 01:07:39

Even the hand one hand span even to the extent of one hand span and buys his he will die in a state of joy halaya pre Islamic ignorance

01:07:40--> 01:07:41

okay

01:07:44--> 01:07:52

unless you see cough so that means Lj air volume is not cough then you don't rebel. If there is no cough

01:07:57--> 01:08:03

even you don't rebel if there is a transgression even if he took your money and flagged your back

01:08:04--> 01:08:07

if you see something that you dislike show patience

01:08:08--> 01:08:16

if someone rebels killin if you're under one man, and someone rebuilds given, so,

01:08:17--> 01:08:18

all of this

01:08:20--> 01:08:54

with the fact that you know, the same people that will this regard the consensus are the people who use similar consensus is also and that is inconsistent, you know, so, every month I have a boss report that this consensus and now we repeated that every time we have 100 repeated. So, if these are your icons, and if the you know, you will just have to get give respect to that consensus, because you're using seminar consensuses, unless you will, you will provide justification.

01:08:55--> 01:09:36

And it is possible to provide justification, but we're dealing with a genre of just stronger hobbies that we will have to talk about. So, the to give a like an answer of No, it is permissible to rebel against the unjust ruler, that is dogmatic, insufficient, not taking in consideration all of these hobbies, there has to be a lot of work, basically to find a way to reconcile between all of those. And so, you know, how can we

01:09:37--> 01:09:59

basically understand this? So, even a husband in you know, in more than one of his books, provides explanation for each one of those things are going to house in my house our rational argument, he says, okay, you're saying that unless he shows this belief, we will not rebel against them as you he took

01:10:00--> 01:10:04

As his supporters and AIDS Jews and Christians

01:10:05--> 01:10:22

only, and basically removed the Muslims from positions of power, took as his aids, Jews and Christians and killed every Muslim man and raped every Muslim woman. Is that this belief?

01:10:23--> 01:10:25

No, it's not.

01:10:26--> 01:10:31

Okay. So then what do you say you will let him do that

01:10:32--> 01:10:43

until he finishes you off. And then you would have sad like, like an Arizona Vicki you have made an positive like an insane position.

01:10:45--> 01:10:47

And when he said from as

01:10:48--> 01:10:49

a homeowner helped

01:10:50--> 01:10:51

men, men,

01:10:53--> 01:10:56

men, men, other men paddle paddle out like arrow

01:10:58--> 01:11:03

until we come down to one Muslim man being killed, or one Muslim woman being raped.

01:11:05--> 01:11:08

If they stop somewhere in the middle, there'll be inconsistent.

01:11:10--> 01:12:02

If they, so he, he has me in a really brilliant, so he says that this man is basically and certainly there will be brilliant responders also. So they will they may say, you know, it's not the same, you know, killing one man or one woman is not like an Angolan Muslim men and women if he kills all Muslim men and women, we will know that the the, basically the basis of this is their Islam now grievances against this man and one on what he says to them, what about 9/10? What about eight tenths of Muslims? What about one quarter of Muslims? Whenever What about like 100? What about 50? What about one? Where do you stop? So, you either say no, we will let him and we will naturally

01:12:02--> 01:12:12

about even if he killed us all or you will have to put a line somewhere. And if you put the line somewhere, there will be inconsistency between the before and after

01:12:13--> 01:12:15

you will not have any coherent argument

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we will not have any coherent argument and there will be some inconsistency. So

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then he says every one of those has to be understood within the context of everything else. So if he took your money and flogged your back, justifiably or even out of he had,

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so he made it he had how many times the judges can make her intelligent head or make mistake and that it's the hat. So if he flagged your back and you know that you are innocent, be patient,

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because he did this out of his tail. So that's what even Hospice is about this. And for everyone, he comes up with a reasonable argument. The bottom line is,

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this is not a dichotomy.

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There are many important questions to answer before you give, you could have a coherent

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position on this issue.

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Who, how, who, why and how. And at what cost, there is a difference between analog and the rest of the people. There is a difference between someone who randomly make transgressors and someone who's transgressing all the time causing corruption on Earth, there is a difference between armed struggle and popular uprising. And there is a difference between when d'amato aka is worse than the worker, or the expected, you know, after rebellion is worse than the present, or the present is worse than the expected. These are all things that have to be taken in consideration. Of course, the prophet comes, you know, to teach us

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about moving from the wilderness disability, of course, the prophet will have emphasis on these were feudal tribes, they have never known any stability. So of course, the prophet will be preaching to them about patience, and about civility, and about union and about all of these things, you know, to bring those feudal tribes under, like one system into a union. That was a huge undertaking. We do expect to the profits are starting to have said these things, but we have to understand them correctly. And we also have to understand that the circumstantial variables and the changes in work conditions and build a coherent political philosophy, I think

01:15:00--> 01:15:09

As Islamist change is huge, and we need to work on the more on the spiritual aspects, because this

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infrastructure, the more of and the spiritual infrastructure is essential for change. I think Islam is need to have

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changed their organizations into movements that spread.

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Basically, horizontally not vertically in the society, but permeate through the body

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through different institutions is we're not talking about the spending all basically teamwork or collective efforts. But we're talking about avoiding rigid hierarchies that will cause partisanship and counter sir efforts and responses. Let Islam permeate through the society like water and roses,

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oil and olives,

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move horizontally,

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organizations that share a common vision, move towards a common goal connected spiritually and emotionally, not

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not organizationally.

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And that is and then they have the, you know, focus on the spiritual and moral because these are the things that will

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connect us. And these are the things that are not controversial and needed as infrastructure to build on them, their social and political,

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social and the political and then defer ideological

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controversy struggles, until you have

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a good system of governance. A good system of governance is

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the the the aspiration of many, many people in the Muslim countries, not only Islam is the aspiration of many people, work with them towards that, and the ideological differences can be deferred until we have more civility and until we have mechanisms procedures by which we can resolve our conflicts without too much bloodshed and too much chaos.

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That's a prescription for my my prescription.