Lowkey – Palestine, Piers Morgan, Ben Shapiro, and Armistice Protests

Salam aleikum wa rahmatullah wa barakato. How're you guys doing? You're welcome to the most irregular and inconsistent podcast known to man, which is the MH podcast. And I'm joined with none other than low key How you doin? Loki. Thank you, Shauna UK. And you might not need an introduction from you guys. You've seen him on Piers Morgan. He is, I would say one of the leading voices in the pro Palestinian activism, Formula rap, I'm not sure if you still do it, if she still got the lyrical abilities. But you've been using your words in a different way. And we want to talk about that. Actually, let's start with that. Yeah, let's start with we've dropped it on Piers Morgan, we've what

was your first of all, your overall experience? And what how would you? How would you characterize his overall positionality. So what I would say, with Piers Morgan, that people need to be aware of, is, ultimately when you enter into an interview with him, he's seeking to do things to destabilize you, to discomfort you to disrupt you. And unfortunately, in this particular case, I feel he was successful. He wasn't successful.

With with any of us really, so far, I think because of the power of what has happened, yeah, so are people ultimately, he's he's coming up in quite a synthetic way. Yeah. But as a sort of outrage merchant, what he's seeking to do in this case, and this scenario, is kind of put you into a space of almost being

against the law in your view. So obviously, they know with the situation in Palestine, support for a particular resistance faction is illegal in this country. So they seek ways to try and bait you into a place of discomfort, and unfortunately, kind of try and ruin your life. Because this idea of you somehow supporting what is beyond the pale morally, is meant to actually, ironically cancel you. So you know, entering into that space, you have to be assertive about what it is you want to say. You have to be willing to use his own words against him. And you have to sort of be able to think fast. So I think that ultimately, both of the interviews we did had some use to the cause overall. But I

think with him, I think the important thing for people to understand is that the channel itself, talk TV, is founded by Rupert Murdoch. Rupert Murdoch is was a close friend of Ariel Sharon. He's also someone that through the News Corp Foundation, had funded the Jerusalem Foundation, which builds in illegal settlements and Chef Tara.

And also in addition to that, Rupert Murdoch, formerly had a place on the board of something called Genie energy, which is an oil and gas company, which has deals in the occupied Golan heights of Syria, it's occupied by the Israelis. Now, work has to be depopulated, and the gas which is there to be exploited, it's entirely possible that the Israeli subsidiary of Genie energy could get that contract. I've been seeing that on the news recently, as well. And it's been something that people have been speaking about that they got natural gas in Gaza, and one of the

intentions of the Israeli state is to move. Obviously, depopulate displace the Gazan people so that they can go and take that, yeah, because obviously, the people in Palestine in Gaza can't do anything with that gas, they can't export it, they can't do anything with it. Well, there was supposedly supposed to be a deal between the Israeli government and the Palestinian Authority,

represented by a factor to exploit that gas, which is about 20 nautical miles away from the coast of Gaza. However, when Hamas won the election, what that did was and then took control of Gaza. Essentially, what that meant was, there could be no negotiating and sort of shared arrangement, and particularly also the Israeli government changed from the Labour government to the liquid government. And that was also a government that was more intransigent on that issue. So therefore, it could not be exploited. So certainly, I would say that is an aspect of what they're doing. And because one other point about Piers Morgan that I think the viewers should be aware of, is he has

worked extensively with the Norwood charity. Now Norwood was founded and is led by Jonathan Mendelsohn is in the House of Lords is somebody that used to head the labour friends of Israel that currently has a Israel lobby group with incidentally the former head or

of the conservative friends of Israel called the Abraham accords. And also, Norwood also features Trevor chin, who's a key

officer of the Israel lobby in this country on it. So to say that Piers Morgan just enjoys that kind of seamless objectivity, I would say is a mistaken point of view, or many people have been calling him money over morals, Piers, because it's really as simple as him being afraid of losing his job. Because if he goes too far in the direction of condemning Israel, which he hasn't done, by the way, since until this point, you know, then that would mean that his boss will let him go, just like he was fired before. Well, I mean, and also the thing is, is that he has these personal relationships with very well established, energetic, Israel lobbyists. You look at Trevor chin, for example. Yes,

who is behind the Norwood charity? Funded Castorama. Funded Lisa Nandy funded David Lammy, key figures within the Labour Party. You look at Mendelssohn, Mendelssohn's funded were streeting, and he's funded loads of others in the Labour Party in particularly during the Blair years. So that's the sort of strand of the lobby that Morgan has tapped into. So you know, whether that affects his journalism or not, I couldn't categorically say, Yeah, however, I would say that, certainly his antagonistic way of interviewing both yourself, me and sort of anyone that he has a whiff of being pro Palestinian. Also, what I find interesting about him is he takes it's something Peterson does as

well is they take macro issues and structural issues, and turn them into individual personal and almost ego based issues. So with the Piers Morgan thing, what I found is that he constantly is trying to get you to talk about your own morality, in comparison to his morality. And actually, we're dealing with the thing that is affecting 10s of millions of people, and far more serious and far more, I don't mind I can be a moral monster for him if he wants me to be. But but my, but there are far more pressing issues at hand, you know, I mean, we're seeing we're seeing people die on mass killing and mass death and human suffering. And he just wants to sit around and talk about who will

and won't condemn this and condemn that when he himself is not condemning. You know, that's the other thing that's I've got, I had to try and be careful with him. Because if you do what he wants and allow him sort of to drag it to his level, it will just come about me and him sort of comparing our own morality and Yeah, well, so what moral monsters another person who's,

who's who I would consider, I would characterize with that with that kind of label is Douglas Murray. And he's recently been coming out making all kinds of erroneous statements about Islam, that Muslim people,

all kinds of very weird justifications, like nothing of concession at all coming from his mouth relating to the Palestinian people and to the actions of Israel, or anything of condemnation, of course, no way. I mean, tell us what do you know about Douglas Murray? So I think to understand, Douglas Murray, obviously, we set into sort of the context of the background from Hammersmith went to Eton. already has this particular class positions in Hammersmith before? Yeah, used to live there. Yeah. Okay. And so he has this, this is coming from this particular angle of society, middle class snobbery, yes. And also a kind of

provincial outlook on others.

Certainly pines for Colonial Era near India, smoking a pipe.

But to be more specific, when we understand his baby, which is the Henry Jackson society. This was a joint project between him and Alan Mendoza. Now, Alan Mendoza simultaneous to leading the Henry Jackson society with Douglas Murray is on the board of the JNF, which is the largest settlement building body in Palestine. It's been the key body through which Israel has denied people their right under UN resolution 194, which is the right of return, because the basis through which Israel is able to use the JNF as a quasi state organization. Their argument has been when Palestinians have said I'd like to return to my home. Their argument has been no, no, no, that land is owned by the

JNF. But the JNF is actually a figment of the Israeli state. So when we also this also takes us full circle to Murdoch, is when you look at the founding statement of the Henry

Jackson society, which is Douglas Morris think tank, which he's used as his vehicle for many, many years. You have on it one of the signatories is Erwin Staedtler, who was the right hand man of Rupert Murdoch. And so therefore, you'd have in Murdoch's newspapers like the sun, the times, people from the Henry Jackson society who would write their Islamophobic ideas. The other thing that Henry Jackson society were essential to, is prevent, because through their student rights campaign, they were able to astroturf which is where you make something appear grassroots when actually it's an expression of,

of power, from above the idea that there was a need for something like prevent in school, so he lobbied relentlessly for that. But then if we also look at who were the other signatories to the founding statement of the Henry Jackson society, you also have James Woolsley, who was the former director of the CIA, really also have a Richard Dearlove, who was actually the Mi five chief at the time that the WMD claims about Iraq, were in place, and Dearlove was believed to be implicated in that process. As Chief of the Mi six, you had general Jacques Jacques Sheehan, as a former NATO Supreme Commander. And you have other kinds of figures of the military and intelligence elite, that

this is the Mulu, in which Douglas Murray pontificates. However, he was somebody that was a very public facing figure who was regularly platformed on the BBC, on Channel Four, as if he was some sort of Oracle on cultural matters when really, you know, you take it back to who was Henry Jackson, he was a senator in the US Congress known as Senator Boeing, because he always supported the arms industry, Boeing, of course, an Arms Company. So when you also look at the funding of Henry Jackson society, you see, for instance, the Hertog foundation Hertog Foundation also fund the building of settlements. In in Palestine, you also have the share funders with the Quilliam Foundation, they

share funders with the Friends of the IDF. And even if you look at who are the political figures, who have emerged from the Henry Jackson society, you've got people like Michael Gove, of course, well known for the Trojan horse scandal and other Islamophobic policies. You've got Amber Rudd, well known for the Windrush scandal and other racist policies.

Priti Patel was on the political counselors in the Henry Jackson society. And, you know, I've done a research into Henry Jackson in Henry Jackson society employees, and several of them have come out of either the Israeli military or Israeli military think tanks. So Douglas Murray's orientation is towards encouraging Islamophobia domestically, but lock in step with the trilateral security state of the British, the US and the Israelis. Very, very praising of Netanyahu. He's close and has met Netanyahu several times at least. So you know, when you see him on the Piers Morgan show he was there, the protection of the IDF was precisely he was embedded with the IDF. And, you know, it was a

bit of a publicity stunt, because when he jumped for the invisible rocket, did you see that? Yeah, exactly. But But what's good, what's scary and sort of worrying is the power that has been wielded, and also the extent to which him and his organizations are taken as experts by the British government. So for instance, there's something called the extremism Analysis Unit, which is an institution within British government, which actually

analyzes social media output and tweets for extremism and defiant extremism Analysis Unit. And that is de facto run by the Henry Jackson society. I also have people who formerly worked for the home office. And what he told me is they were directly issues and as his unit extremism Analysis Unit, what is it? What is that? Is that part of Hendrickson? No. So Henry Jackson society is a key part of it. So they will rely on our for their Why is Asia? What was it what is a government institution that basically will serve as part of government? Yeah, and it's the way in which government designates in an invisible way, but it's actually a sort of informal internal blacklisting producing

organization, all right. So it will have analyzed your videos, it will have analyzed your social media output and it will have collated information about you to try and define you in one way or another. To be honest, it would be the kind of organization that would be related to depriving people of particular jobs, okay, that would potentially have a role in bank bank accounts type of stuff. So it is quite an important and

The way in which the society

uses Islamophobia as a state practice, but does it in an implicit way, you know, essentially we have implicit and freedoms in our society. That's a really good point. And it's not just people like me or you or public figures. I'm sure they're doing that. Exactly. All kinds of people. Right, exactly. Another person who we're talking about moral monsters or people that just don't seem to get it is BS, Ben Shapiro and this useful acronym because most of what he does say is BS. Tell me, what do you know about him? So Ben Shapiro, is broken journalist.

And allegedly, he's a religion. Yes, yeah. But But what he does have is an article that was wiped from the internet that he published in 2003, in which he says, We need to stop being squeamish about genocide. And we need to depopulate Gaza and the West Bank. Obviously, he's drawing really Yeah. And obviously, I will send it to you. Have you got that? I have it? Yes. So the Wayback Machine. squeamish about genocide? Yeah. He said we should stop being squeamish about genocide. Yeah. And we should if if we, if we want to do what's best for the Palestinians, we should relocate them. It's not escalation transfer. Absolutely. Yeah. I'm assure as anything, and why would you publish this on

two and a half? And I'll send it to you. So we've got the way back, sort of mushy if you want to. If you have, if you deny that this? No, he doesn't deny it. No, no, he published it. Really, bro. Yeah. Exercise strategy right now. So please do I mean, can we put that on the screen as Yeah, because that one there is going to definitely require squeamish about genocide. Yeah, my God.

He said it's population transfer, not genocide. And the thing with population transfer in terms of Zionist thought there's an incredible book by Northern masala, called the expulsion of the Palestinians in which it traces

Okay, you go if you believe that Israel has a right to exist, then you must allow Israel to transfer Palestinians and Israeli Arabs from Judea Samaria, Gaza and Israel proper time stop being squeamish transfer is not genocide. Ben Shapiro, in my article now White from the internet, here it is. Transfer is not a dirty word. And then I've so he probably paid somebody he was your thing. What's your analysis? Do you think you paid somebody to give that article? Well, from the website, it's possible that because it's such an old articles from 2003 is not impossible, that either the website sort of lost. Its its,

its web space, it's not impossible. What I do think is most likely, though, is that he probably did ask them to take that on the article because he's trying to get a bit more mainstream acceptance, but essentially, what he is, is a sort of Jabotinsky, revisionist

part of that thread of Zion. So just to for the, for the viewers, Jabotinsky was one of the early Zionist thinkers, one of the early Zionist leaders, he was trained by the British. He was, you know, idolize Mussolini idolize East European fascists, worked with Ukrainian serious anti Semites responsible for killing 10s of 1000s of Jews. And he himself was a militant. So at one point, he was imprisoned by the British despite being trained by them, and then led a campaign fighting there. But essentially, his belief was the Palestinians are indigenous. He was not in any had no qualms about saying that. And for that reason, we have to push them outside of what we want as our idea of

Israel, and build an iron wall to stop them from coming back in because he said no indigenous people will accept alien invaders. So there was an honesty about those sort of early Zionist thinkers and writers, but Ben Shapiro, ultimately, let's look at his sort of trajectory in terms of what he did. So when he was starting, as far as I've been able to identify, yeah, he was a Shillman Fellow at the David Horowitz Freedom Center. At the same time, Tommy Robinson was, so what is the center just for that? So David Horowitz, Freedom Center is a key Israel lobby group in the US but slightly more forward facing propaganda that will based funded by several organizations that also fund settlements

by organizations that also fund for instance, the Center for Security Policy, which came up with the Muslim ban for Trump.

But the David Horowitz Freedom Center had within it a Shillman fellowship, and that was when Robert Schulman who was a

The big tech billionaire, but also a board member of the Friends of the IDF. So that means that Ben Shapiro was on a program was funded by a board member of the Friends of the IDF, at the same time as Tommy Robinson was funded by a board member friends at the IDF. And so then the next step in terms of Ben Shapiro's career is of course, the daily wire before that Friends of the idea seems to be a common link and a lot of us Yeah, yeah. How big are they like massive, I mean, you know, they pour hundreds of millions of dollars every single year into the Israeli military's activities. Unfortunately, they have quite a lot of widespread mainstream acceptance you've had for a Williams

go to some of their events. You've had Brad Pitt go to some of their events, possibly donate. You've got some pretty high ranking figures within the music industry who have gone to their events as well. But ultimately, Ben Shapiro, then was involved in the setting up of the Prager University YouTube channel.

That's very well known.

But when he and his partner Jeremy Bowring was setting up Prager University. Dennis Prager is an open Israel lobbyist. He said, I've set up this channel to fight Israel's battles, who was the director Marisa straight, Marisa straight is an alumni of unit a 200. In the Israeli military is the signals intelligence unit of the Israeli military, which is kind of the equivalent of GCHQ. So this is who Ben Shapiro worked with. And then he went on to funding to founding the daily wire with Jeremy Bowring. And the daily wire has, you know, within it, their chief 115 employees, isn't it? Interesting? Interesting. Yeah. I mean, that's, that's pretty big for a media company. Monday, they

offered Steven Crowder, so he came out and said that they offered him 50 million a year. Are you serious? That's what 50 million. So that's what a lot of people said someone like Jordan Peterson is probably getting extraordinary. Yeah, that's a huge amount of money. And so their chief operating officer is John Lewis, who's former US Marine. And then they've got another gentleman there who's former US military intelligence. But in addition to that, they are funded by ExpressVPN. And we're opening possibly another can of worms in because ExpressVPN, the sole owner of escape technologies, and Cape technologies is

on a saw that from my phone, Well,

check this because this is interesting about about possibly also some of the activity of Peterson as well. Yeah. Is the CEO of Cape technologies is either Ilitch and either. Ilitch came out of the dove divan unit, the dove divine unit, or what they call Mr. Bean, in the Israeli military, so they are people that go into Palestinian communities discret disguised as Palestinians speaking Arabic like Palestinian, yeah,

there's differing, or that happened a lot in the in the Egyptian wars as well. And there's lots of now films in Egyptian language, Egyptian Arabic, like portraying us as

Yeah. And the thing with them is it kind of differs the amount of time that they may be exposed. So you might have a divine unit that just enter a community, kidnap someone and take them out. But what you might actually have is somebody who spends six months, a year two years marries in, and then people arrested. Wow. And so the divine unit are very effective. You know, if you look at like the Imam unit in the Israeli military, it's not respected. It's not, it's not careful. It doesn't have experienced fighters in it. It's mostly people that have been in there a year or something and they're sent. You look at unit a 200. You look at divide, these are the pride of the Israeli

military. And so out of unit eight, 200 and divan, you will often see these figures that go on to be sort of enterprising entrepreneur printers and able to assert Israel's agency in other places. So in my personal estimation, I would say that it's highly likely it's highly likely that at least Ben Shapiro, if not the daily wire operation is some type of insinuation of Israeli intelligence. And I'm not saying that in a and I do believe it's a shared in City Light. So it's shared between us and Israeli influence and a push.

But I believe that what they've sought to do is to have a variation of two things. So the Royal Institute, which is a key Israeli intelligence, think tank, published a study of London, and found within it that London was the hub of the hub of the hubs of de legitimization of Israel. And what they did is they categorized people like us who support the Palestinians into two capitalist system.

Okay, the ROI Institute ROI Institute, right? Yeah, right. Yeah, R E UT. And basically what they did is create two categories, criticizes critics and D legitimizes. Now, what I would say happens through an organization like the daily wire is they will

aim at critics what they call strategic engagement strategy. So that's what they deemed to be critics. That's what they deemed to be critics. So people that are possibly salvageable or at least treadmill alized. At least you can sort of put them on a treadmill and kind of slow them down a bit. The D legitimizes they go directly to war with so they do everything they can to discredit, I think in the situation with yourself and Ben Shapiro, and he, he hasn't tried to do any of the heat, he fears, he fears the

venom.

He fears direct confrontation in that way. So for instance, if you look at his interview with Andrew Neil, he wills, He wills, he's very good at sort of passive aggression. He's very good at

kind of trying to talk down to people, but he's not very good at Raw aggression. And I think in the case of Andrew Neil, and in the case of your possible, hopefully, future running with Ben Shapiro future debate with Ben Shapiro, this is kind of his. He's also seemingly ducking debating Norman Finkelstein, as well. And I think that's partly because of the knowledge gap. Yeah, Norman is a very meticulous scholar. And there's a whole lifetime of study and research there. Whereas No, but he makes the blunders and Shapiro, absolutely, like historical blunders in this and it would be eaten alive really by someone like Finkelstein is, yeah, it's for the last 50 years or something. He's

been he's been researching. We've got a book here of his he's been written so many books on this topic, but that's really, really good. Let's, let's talk about some other figures. I just Yeah, because you've got the files on them.

You've got you've got this information. And it's good that you're exposing them to the public.

Because this is pretty good information. People like let's start with Tommy Robinson. He's come back now him and Katie Hopkins, as

these guys are not really serious academics, they don't have any money. Like they're not big business people. Worcester use, do you think because they've also been linked to some of these groups that you've mentioned the Israeli groups, haven't they? So I think if we understand Islamophobia through the lens of what was described, in the book, Islamophobia, social movements from above, Tom Mills, David Miller, and a few other writers, they argued that there were five pillars of Islamophobia and that you had the obviously, the state being the start of it, which is, which in engages the wars, which then trickles down through think tanks and works with a sort of

symbiotic relationship with the other five pillars. For me, I've always seen the Tommy Robinson side of it, as the street fighting, or at least aspiring to street fight, the sort of pogrom pushing side of the Islamophobia movement, which is about defining Muslims in the way that he did, as combatants. So as the internal outsiders, you know, and something I've always found fascinating about Tommy Robinson is obviously it's not his name, is named Stephen Yaxley Lennon, a quintessentially Celtic name. So this is somebody from Irish background. So I've wondered if there is a sort of with other hood comes brotherhood type of mentality where he's trying to camouflage his own outsider status,

and adopt a basically Anglo Saxon name, which is Tommy Robinson,

to try and kind of force his own belonging to this society. But you know, in psychoanalysis, what do we really know about what's going on? It's an interesting realization.

I never thought it was his name. But he's become really quite irrelevant recently as an absolutely, I think, with him, the period when he was able to really kick up a lot of trouble, Speaker's Corner and other places and take to the streets, by the 1000, around 2018 2000. He had algorithmic dominance. And this was the period when he could mobilize people, but now I don't think you could do that. He couldn't. And this was a time when he was funded by Robert Sherman, who, undoubtedly he's a tech billionaire. So what do you think is happening? If not, algorithmic engineering? Yes. You know, there had to be a reason why his Facebook

It was growing at the same time as Britain, first Facebook, were growing to millions, when everyone else's was kind of slowing down. And there's arguments about what happened internally to Facebook first actually had, like it was this disparity with the numbers of views and the engage as the number of followers in the engagement. Interesting, because one of the ways that a lot of people don't buy, like, you know, followers and stuff like that. So we've done a quick analysis, it's not, it's not hard to, there's these websites that do it. Now, Hive manager doesn't come up with the names of website, but you go on them, and they'll tell you the engagement rate of a particular

because I want to have, you know, 10s of if not hundreds of millions of followers, but then if they've got an engagement rate of like 0.5%, or something like that, in terms of the likes, in terms of the comments, it's likely to be fake. And so that's what if you go to Britain's first Facebook page, all the markers have bought followers and stuff like that. That makes sense. That makes sense. I mean, with the Tommy Robinson case, when he was imprisoned, the organization which organized not only paid his legal fees, but also organized the free Tommy campaign was an organization called the Middle East forum. Now Middle East forum is so Islamophobic that Anders Brevik quoted it 10s of

times in his manifesto, and he cited it. So they funded his legal fees. Now who's behind the Middle East forum, none other than Greg Roman. He is a former employee of the Israeli Ministry of Defense and the Israeli Foreign Ministry. So you've got a significant push.

Going behind Tommy Robinson, that without a doubt, was coming from Israeli sources very close to the Israeli Government and the Israeli military. So in a way, there was an attempt to push this pogrom kind of you know, Douglas Murray is a legislative legislative Islamophobia he is make things more difficult for most of the board. Justify he's said that he said then one of his books in precisely Yeah, Tommy is hurt them. It's firebomb their shops. It's they are combatants. That's exactly what Tommy Robinson said, which is a direct justification of violence against them. He said, all the people in these houses are combatants. So you know, as you say, it, it went it had its time. It

fizzled out. He's trying to make a comeback. He probably won't. He's seen as too crude for the mainstream. So he was never going to be given the kind of platforms or have the longevity that Douglas Murray had. What about Katie Hopkins, she has also been reinstated. She has and she's a fascinating figure because there's a lot of possibilities that are quite difficult to kind of confirm. She also has worked with the David Horowitz Freedom Center. She's met Mark reg as the former IDF spokesman and former Israeli ambassador to London. But she also claims in an interview with The Guardian, that she the only reason she's not in the army now is because she has epilepsy.

So when she studied at Exeter, her education in economics, actually her degree was funded by the British military. And then she says upon finishing uni, this is what she claims she signed a 35 year contract with British military intelligence. It seems a sort of fantastical claim. However, either way, I find it fascinating to think that the level of astroturfing of Islamophobia could have been so strong that you would have somebody on a contract and British military someone like someone like her publishing the kind of stuff. This these are some of the figures that in the UK, I would probably on the UK in the US really well considered like the loudest voices for Israel and against

the Palestinian cause and against Islam, or Muslims or Islamophobic figures. And I'm glad that we have something of you've opened the files the dossier on all of these people, which is really, really, really good.

Let's go straight into the conflict now and see what's your kind of first of all, your overall assessment of what's happening. I'll tell you something that we've got a obviously the critical content news, we have a team now handler which are comprised of people who go to AI good different kinds of specialisms, we've got a new YouTube channel, which has like daily news and stuff like that, which maybe we can provide the link for. But one thing which has recently come out, which I found quite fascinating,

are the figures by the IDF of the 1400 people that they say have been killed on that day and they are pre released figures to

harlots, left wing newspaper and in Israel and maybe I'll leave the the article will be up on the crew continues.

However, just some of the key points is that they say this 1500 names, they said we have the 1400 names on x, sorry, that have been killed, they said this on x. And then they provide much less than that.

That's the first thing to disparities in the numbers. And then even according to their figures, we're looking at the amount of children that have been killed under the age of 18. That's how they define a child. And it's 25.

And we look at the amount of babies that have been killed and as one not 40, as they previously claimed. So that's one aspect of it. But what I found even more fascinating than that,

was that according to them, something like anything between 300 to 340 military personnel have been killed just on October the seventh, anything between that numbers, depending on whose numbers you go in with, where we're going with ads numbers are going with the ones that they put up on X on Twitter, which one a which one, are you going with?

340 That's an October the seventh that's not including, okay, the numbers that have been killed after close and after the the land invasion right into Gaza. If you add those numbers, we're talking well over maybe, according to their numbers, which are obviously disputed by Hamas. I mean, a Barbados has just recently said that the director, the leader, General of Hamas, maganda, is a spokesman spokesperson.

He said that they destroyed 140, tanks 138. To be exact. This is yesterday, it said that we destroyed 140 tanks. And that the numbers his claim is the numbers that they're saying had been destroyed as much less than actually that had been destroyed. That's their claim. Obviously, in wars, we got to take everything with a pinch of salt. But according to the most conservative numbers are the numbers that the Israelis are going to give on their own troops and military men being killed. And we're talking about anything between 320 118 to say 240, on just October 7, if you add the numbers, then maybe goes up to about 370.

That's a conservative number. Now, a Guardian article has been

has stated, right, that they say dozens, dozens of people have been killed from Hamas, in terms of the actual combatants, which is shocking, because if we're talking about dozens, let's say, for the sake of 60 seconds long.

This indicates if we say 360,

you know,

effectively, the amount of IDF that had been killed comparative to the amount of hummus is one of six.

And the amount that which means that the amount of civilians that we know has been killed is over 10,000. So that is an incredible disparity, which shows you that if we're talking about human shields, if we're talking about this, if we're talking about killing civilians or collateral damage, that Israel has been much more failure, they've had a much heavier failure than the IDF in terms of

not killing the civilians effectively. What do you make of these figures? And how does that make? What do you what do you think of that? Well, I think we should also speak a little bit about what the possible cause of the casualties on the Israeli side. Could be. Yeah, but what I would say is that in addition to that, they've lost over 40 soldiers on the Northern Front. That's right, according according to sources in South Lebanon,

but also, tourism has gone down 70%. Also, the Tamar gas field, which is run by Chevron has been shut down by the Israelis for fear of it being targeted by resistance factions. And that costs Israel something like $200 million

a month. Would you condemn that?

Yeah, go ahead, sir. Yeah. So in addition to that, when you think about Israel's success, for one side looks different from the other side. So the Palestinian struggle has been about staying power, and avoiding 2 million people being pushed into the Sinai desert. Yeah, is it is success in this equation. Whereas for Israel, it is finding a way to sustain the Zionist arrangement, which, in addition to you know, it's believed that during this period 13 billion has been lost by the Israeli economy. Don't forget with the Israeli military, it is an army of reserves, meaning they've taken 360,000 people out of the traditional labor market.

So what does that do to any economy? If you were to take 300,000 people plus out of that, that place on top of it, Israel has had to rely on US special forces who you know, according to

senior US military figures when they first tried to go in and the first thing incursion in his words, they were shot to pieces. Yeah. And they had to retreat. So which one is this as? Well, this this incident, this is in this instance, in the first shots was a pentagon advisor Douglas McGregor said on US News. Yeah, our special forces tried to enter with the Israelis and they were shot to pieces. Yes. Yeah. So ultimately, what you're talking about two pieces. What you're talking about is urban warfare. It's quite damning, isn't it is damning. And absolutely. The Israeli military is used to bullying children and grannies at checkpoints. And yeah, it's used to airstrikes from abroad

above is used to drones. It's used to signals intelligence, which is spying on people. It is not used to urban warfare in a terrain, which is this is what Al Jazeera Arabic have been what I've been following the news and stuff and one of the things they say is that a lot of the analysts, there's one very brilliant analyst His name is Fei is I forget his surname, but he's a very brilliant analyst.

One of the lot of the analysts are saying is that this was actually the plan all along. For Hamas, it would have been it would have been, I think it would have been anticipated to happen soon. Yes. That they came in earlier. Yeah.

I mean, you mentioned that in 2014, they had a bad time on the ground with Hamas. And in 2006, with Hezbollah, they had a very bad time in 2000. They left southern Lebanon because of the pressure of the fighters there. So they have a very poor track record. When it comes to ground fighting, don't they? I mean, absolutely. And anything but bombing from the sky? Yes. You know, one of the things that mache they and who was the Israeli Minister of Defense and key figure in the Zionist movement, he said, our job after 67 is to make the occupation invisible. We have to be able to control these people in a frictionless way. And in a way because there was the prototype because they were able to

control the see the land, the electricity, what goes in what goes out. And yet you found you have to remember that some of the rockets that have been used against Israel have been repurposed. unexploded munitions that were dropped in them by the Israelis. Yeah. So you really took it about alhaja Omen, etc. Yeah, Annie, man, and necessity is the mother of all invention. Yeah. And that has happened in as you know, I saw it also in Cuba, you know, people that are deprived of things, they find ways to

work for their interests under the ground, because the one place that Israel would not be able to surveil them would be in the tunnels under the ground. So you know, it's in the Israelis, obviously, talking about gassing it. But I think we should definitely touch on the possibility of the Hannibal directive being implemented, because there's a few testimonies that have come out from what happened on October 7, that I think are definitely vital for people to know. So let's just quickly define the Hannibal directive. So the Hannibal directive was developed by Israel during its occupation of Lebanon in the 80s, where it came to the conclusion that as a source of information, a captive of

one of their soldiers was far more damaging, the longer they were captured. So the implication was, you should seek to eliminate them, neutralize them neutralize everyone, yeah, in order to stop them taking someone captive. So the less time that someone was held captive, the better. And you see it implemented in 2014, particularly when there were several hostages taken, particular one golden huddart was taken, and the Israelis killed everyone, including him. What about Guillet? Surely, I should say his case is fascinating, because because the opposite kind of kind of is counter intuitive to this, they got 1000 They got upset because they couldn't get I mean, one would assume

that they were not able to get to him, or to the resistance that had him but in the end,

the Palestinians were able to get 1000 political prisoners released for one Israeli soldier. So that actually is illustrative of the extent to which Israel values its its soldiers, and it's awesome to know, but then the handle directive would say the opposite of that, wouldn't it because it would say that you can kill your own. But But my understanding, while it's certainly very limited, is that they wouldn't have been able to get in the position to do such a thing. Okay, so they use it as an exception to the rule because they were incapable of getting to him, as far as my understanding is but in the

case of what happened with October 7. So you have some very, very important testimony that I think especially English language, media should try and look at as much as possible about the kibbutz and how the you know that there were the IDF was bombing the kibbutz themselves these villages outside. Yeah, so three three particular cases that I think we need to look at. So number one is yes mean poor rats, who is a survivor of kibbutz Betty were some of the people in the Aspen. Yes mean poor rats. Okay. Were some were taken from the music festival. They were taken to this kibbutz. Now she gave an interview to Israeli state media on the 10th of October. Now, on the ninth of October, what

had happened, she had been taken and been held at that kibbutz for two days. Bear in mind. So this is, this is interesting information.

Alongside her husband, and 12 others she'd been held hostage captive. Which point is really tanks had come and shelled where they were. According to her testimony, they killed everyone, including the Palestinian fighters, and the Israelis that were with them. Now that interview was up on the website of the Israeli state radio, and then it was deleted not long afterwards, but it has been published about in Electronic Intifada, we got the recording and we put it out there. So it's well that we're working, we can work and get that electronic into father. I've done brilliant work on it. Now, another case is website Intifada. Yeah, Intifada, Electronic Intifada. Okay. Another case that

is absolutely important for us to be aware of is I'm also realm. The security correspondent for Haaretz, wrote an article about the area's crossing, which is one of the first military bases you come to when leaving verza. Now, when that was overtaken by the Palestinian fighters, general Brigadier Rosenfeld when realizing that he was unable to protect the base called in an airstrike. Now, what that airstrike looked like I don't know, who didn't who didn't die, I don't know. But what I do know is that in a high ranking Israeli military figure recording their strike on himself and his own base to avoid it, falling into the hands of what was the source for this were camos hurl in

Haaretz, her arrows, okay, fine. Okay. Now in the third case, which was a Hebrew her so English one English? Well, actually, it was first published in Hebrew, but apparently, it's unclear whether the

that particular aspect of the story remains in Hebrew version, but it was afterwards published in one device and other sources that are more support for the Palestinian cause. And they said, Look Rosenfeld, called in strike, what does that mean? The third case is we've seen footage put out today of Israeli Apache helicopters shooting at moving vehicles that were believed to contain Israeli captives in and we've had testimony in Wynette news, which is another Israeli paper, talking about the difficult decision that those pilots had to make about shooting on cars, which they knew also how had really kept inside. Yeah, so really, our perception. And then there's the other side of

this, which is our vision version of the death toll is further skewed, partly because it was believed to be 1500 to 2000 Palestinian fighters that got into the political entity of Israel.

Their bodies, were not only these were people were killed, they were urinated on, their bodies were stabbed and mutilated their bodies were run over by cars. Some of them were obviously imprisoned, some of them probably would have cooperated with the Israelis, you have numerous things that happen. Some workers from Gaza, were kidnapped and taken and tortured by the Israelis and now have been released back into your hands. So

you know, we're just talking about cruelty on industrial scale practiced as a status quo as a norm by the Israelis. I think it would also be good for us to cover Al Aqsa and what is being attempted there? Because it's kind of the core of this. Justin. Yeah, so the whole thing is called to funnel AXA. Yeah, that's how Hamas have have labeled this thing. Yeah. There is. One of the things that people are afraid of in this whole thing is all that had been spoken about for years and years, actually, is the destruction of Alexa. So what are some of the institutions that are working for that overtly? Yeah. And what's the connection with this with this confidence? You know, for a long

time, this story of the destruction of Alexa was seen as something that well the older generation are convinced of it being true, but is it true? Is it a conspiracy theory? What is it what we know for a fact based on the Israeli army investigation of 2013

You have particular organizations like the Temple Institute, and generally the Temple Mount movement, which believes in the building of what they call the third Jewish temple on the compound on top of the ruins of the massage it Al Aqsa. Now, the point with the Temple Mount movement is it's led by Yehuda Glick, who is a man from the United States who's former Israeli intelligence close to Benjamin Netanyahu. It's funded by some interesting figures, for instance, Henry SWACO, who used to fund the David Horowitz, Freedom Center, just Tommy Robinson, Tommy Robinson shared funders with an organization seeking the destruction of Al Aqsa. So, in addition to that, it's funded by a gentleman

who owns Duty Free America, so a lot of the duty free shops in US airports.

Now, the important thing about the Temple Institute, the important thing is that they have very well drawn out plans for once the compound is demolished, and what will be built on top of it. The Temple Institute, which is the main organization is so close now to the Israeli state. Two important things. It's funded by the Ministry of Culture is funded by the Israeli Ministry of Education. It used to be funded by the Deputy Defense Minister of Israel. But even more than that, if individual women do not want to take part in conscription in the Israeli military, the Israeli state allowed them to as an alternative to that join the Temple Institute. So this is the extent of it. And

historically, it wasn't like that there was an antagonism between the Israeli state and between the settlers that wanted to destroy Al Aqsa now, since at least 2017 to 18, if I remember correctly, there's the the military are working with them. Prior to that, though, this this organization has been funded by the Ministry of Education, the Ministry of Culture for decades, but in terms of the military now facilitate, you know, because daily will see settlers going in and people say, oh, you know, the settlers raiding AXA, is not that the settlers are in it AXA, is that they are laying the foundation for the destruction, you know, and that sounds crazy, but it would have sounded crazy.

Two months ago, if I said to you, they want to take 2 million people in Gaza and dump them in the Sinai desert Zionism as a maximalist movement with an argument that Jabotinsky, one, you know, if you look at, it's not Theodore Hutsul. You know, who's credited as the founder of Zionism, as the most Park schools hospitals, cinemas named after him in Israel is Jabotinsky, he won the argument, the revisionist one, the argument, which is maximalist expansion, at all costs. And one of those aspects is Gaza. One of them is pushing the Palestinians from the West Bank into Jordan or into Egypt. And the other one is an instructional relaxer. And unfortunately, what has now happened with

Reza has, I think, pressed fast forward on all of those processes. And within five to 10 years, pardon me, and I am convinced that within five to 10 years, they will use it on some type of pretext. Now, that pretext could be that there's resistance coming from an axis so they have to shell it.

Right? There's people keeping them weapons and all access to they have to do that. There's there's numerous different possibilities of how they're going to approach this. And Ben Shapiro is a key advocate for this a key advocate for the building of the third symbol. So we're in dangerous times, you know, ultimately, we're talking about

major unrest around the world over what they're attempting to do. That is extremely informative. And I think maybe we'll be taking notes as I have been doing the same thing.

I want to speak about just to kind of in this podcast, it's been, it's been brilliant, I think a lot of people will be, and this is very important. I think this is an angle of the conflict with regard to kind of, I've done a podcast before Abdullah Andalusi, about the historical aspect. We've done podcasts doing like political analysis. And this is a deep kind of political analysis, where you're going to each of the CEOs and who is funding whom, and all these kinds of things, and we do need to know that as well.

Thank you, they've got you. Before we started this podcast, you said they've got files on us so it's good that we have files on them as well, isn't it? Absolutely. Absolutely. And having said that, one thing that is making the news now it's gonna be a big thing, especially in London, you've mentioned it being at the hub of you know, the legitimacy in their understanding.

But it's also the hub of major protests, action activism. Yes. So one of the obviously the biggest one is Armistice Day. A lot of people are saying how can you do this an Armistice Day?

We're actually we're calling for an armistice anyway, so it's, I don't see the issue here. But

For the, for the sake of argument, first and foremost, is claimed to be one of the biggest probably protests in the last 20 years, maybe yeah.

Muslims are going to be watching this. And the question is, what do you recommend? How do Muslims keep themselves out of trouble? How do they make sure that they are complying within the law, that they're not caught out? That they don't do something that's going to ruin the cause? as well? What's the advice that you'd give people going into the process? I mean, I think in terms of the ruin in the course, then I wouldn't want to put too much pressure on people to feel that anything they could do, you know, would ruin anything, you know, ultimately, we are targets of pretty sophisticated campaigns campaigns to

engineer our ideas, but also campaigns to neutralize us as political actors, you know, there is essentially a hierarchy of political subjectivity in this country, and Muslims have always held a very low rank, in that regard in terms of what is permissible for them to be doing politically active wise, in terms of in the government size. So obviously, protect yourself, obviously,

you know, watch out for things, don't necessarily throw yourself at the frontline of all these things. Because ultimately, you are judged to a different standard by the law, you are more

vulnerable in terms of those situations and dealings with the police. So just be careful about that. But ultimately, I would say, what has to happen is we also have to focus on where Israel's vulnerabilities are in this country. And to do that we have to understand Israel's operations. And we also have to understand what is considered what is to ask the question, What in the past has been the most devastating thing to maybe Israel's operations in this country. So there's aspects of what Israel does, which are a bit harder to justify in the eyes of not only the law, but in terms of public perception. So one of those is the fact that Britain is a signatory to the Arms Trade Treaty,

which means that Britain has the legal obligation before it rubber stamps before the business Secretary rubber stamps and export of arms to assess how likely it is that that arms export will be used for violations of international humanitarian law. Now, in the case of Israel, you have an open and shut case, those weapons will be used to kill people and kill civilians, right. Therefore, companies making arms to be used by the Israelis in this country are not expressions of strength. They are vulnerabilities. And they have been targeted by Palestine action,

a direct action organization hundreds of times across the last three years. And because of that have seen the closing of at least two Israeli armed sites in this country permanently. And in addition to that, you've seen the British Ministry of Defence cancel 280 million pounds worth of contracts with this particular company, which is Elbit Systems, which is the largest Israeli Arms Company. And so because of the difficulty in justifying the production of weapons, and this, particularly with a company like Elbit, which produced 85%, of all Israel's drones that it uses, is, it's in a way a spot that once people are then put in the case of being arrested by the police. And in the case of

the CPS does charge in which often CPS doesn't, they then come before court, and a jury is very unlikely to look at a case of somebody saying, I

committed criminal damage on this factory. Yes, but I did it because the things in this factory are going to go and be used on these people. Here's some evidence of Israel's war crimes. So it's in that way that people are able to enter the court as the accused and leave as the accuser. And so you saw the example from Derry, in the north of Ireland, where they went into the Raytheon factory and shut it down during Israel's bombing of Lebanon. And essentially, Raytheon had to leave dairy because they just couldn't sustain their presence there in such an exposed way, these companies function of camouflage. So as soon as you remove the camouflage, you make their operations more

difficult. So I would say think critically, I would say study, I would say understand your target, demographic. And there are organizations who are working around the clock not only to

build data on you, but also to try and manipulate you in different ways. And so just think critically as much as you can. And like I say, seek to see vulnerabilities even in things that seem like manifestations of stress.

I will tell you what has been a manifestation of strength is your analysis. Thank you so much for coming. And honestly each year, you will come again, you must come again. Because I think many people would have been taking notes, copious notes as I as I have

learned quite a lot, actually. And it's actually helped me understand a lot of what's happened recently. And so I'm very, very happy for you to come over. And with that, we will conclude obviously, you can follow Loki on ex Twitter, who is doing some really fantastic work and some of the cutting edge arguments on this matter really has been from him. I'm sure you've already subscribed to him. But if you haven't, you're missing out. And with that, I will conclude with Salaam Alaikum Warahmatullahi Wabarakatuh