Channel: The Deen Show
And they said, Why do you want to go back to Iraq? I said, I'm not done killing Muslims on two tours in Somalia, Bosnia, Afghanistan and Iraq. Yeah, you know, I wouldn't have been called a terrorist, which is what I would have been. Yeah. Because I'm white, because I don't have religious affiliation as far as Islam. Now, if I would have been a Muslim, and did something like that to a supermarket. We know how that goes. Yeah, stories easily predict Oh, yeah. So so but she goes, What do you mean? I said, they're all Muslim.
Like, it didn't matter. They're the other. Yeah, they're the other because she knows I hate Muslims. Yeah, I'm reading the Quran. What is going on? Right. The famous saying, that's usually always said by a bigot is that I don't want my family around those people. Yeah, I would be considered a criminal. I knew that.
But I saw it as doing one last thing for my country. And I knew I would end up in federal prison, I knew I would end up with the needle more. I knew that. And that's why I felt if I got rid of this hatred, I would die because it's the only thing keeping me alive. So literally, and I was like, bam,
I want to see what they got to say about this. So didn't explain it. And it was an historical passage. That was I decided, without telling anybody, I'm gonna go visit these people. I'm gonna give them a chance to prove me wrong. God. I mean, I was raised with Christian values. I guess you'd say my, my mom was fairly religious in Christianity. So you would have been in my life at least America was my religion. Eight weeks later, from the first day I stepped foot in that in that Islamic Center. I took my Shahada
Welcome to the deen show. And we got an exciting episode as always, I don't think just looking at your resume that we could have found someone who is more Americans. I mean, we're stem American right background Bosnian.
You were in Desert Storm Desert Shield. You were deployed all over the place you spent Marine Corps. Who are
you serving your country? American is American Pie. America by Yeah, yes. I guess that'd be on the show. Richard McKinney. Thank you. Thank you for having me. How are you? I'm great. Did I hit that right? Desert Storm Desert Shield? Desert Shield and Desert Storm actually started in Panama and
Just cause Yeah. Shield storm. two tours in Somalia, Bosnia. Afghanistan in Iraq. Yeah. So that's, I mean, that's it was like country and loyalty and patriotism at the max. Oh, yeah.
America. At that point, my life at least America was my religion. It was everything to me meant everything. Yeah. And we say God Bless America because you want the best. May God guide America make all Americans may God Almighty bestow His mercy on all human beings. And this is something that's so important because we're mentioning this, but some people attribute this loyalty to hating another group of people. So you went above and beyond and now it wasn't channeled the right direction. You're like, let me be a little bit more loyal. And I'm gonna go blow up some moslems? Well, yeah. To be honest with you say I was wounded in Iraq. Yeah. And wounded, wounded in Iraq wounded, right.
You got even so now you got even worse cars. Right? Right. Yeah. So when that happened, they decided to medically retire me.
I wasn't done. They came to visit me in the hospital. And they started talking about retirement and all these benefits and this then the other sudden, and then I'm going back to Iraq. And they looked at me kind of weird, you know? And they said, Why do you want to go back to Iraq? I said, I'm not don't kill Muslims. American Sniper. No. Is that you know, that was not me. No, gosh, that's not you American Sniper on the beach. Oh, no, my patient gonna be a sniper. Okay. Are you heard of Americans? Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. So say that again. So you're like, I want to go back. Because I'm not done killing Muslims. Wow.
Even in Bosnia, I remember. We were there. And we got called in for an operation to do some security. They had like a international CSI team. Basically. They had gotten information located a mass grave. 200 Plus, maybe, I don't know some odd bodies, men, women, children, some clothes, some not. And, but at that point, they were all skeletons. And they were going through doing their, you know, criminal findings, whatever it is they do, okay. And I remember being the leader of that team. I was in the center. All my boys were out doing security and I was in the center by the Humvee.
And lady come up to me and she goes, isn't it just terrible what human beings do to each other sometimes? I says, I had a cigarette, and I just took a puff. And I said,
She goes, What do you mean? I said, they're all Muslim.
Like, it didn't matter. They're the other. Yeah, they're the other. So even though we were there more or less at to keep the peace, to make sure that
the ward and start up again, and Muslims weren't being persecuted and killed, and you know, all that.
You know, I did what the? At that point, I was in the army, and I just did what they told me to do. You know, I didn't have to like it. So,
you know, there's this this, this hatred started to, to infest me
and build, and I've actually compared it to an organ in our body. We don't ever want to lose an organ, but we'll die. Right? And that's why I felt if I got rid of this hatred, I would die because it's the only thing keeping me alive. So literally, this was fueling your life you felt your heart was Hate, hate so you can be feeling with love and understanding and you know, other beautiful things, but you are fueling with something so toxic hate and it was just keeping you like you said alive, alive. Yeah. So so you're in Wait, so you're in the Marines or army? Well, I I joined Marine Corps retired from the army. I still claim the Marine Corps because they're the Marines. Yeah. And
I'll always be a marine. But after my second tour in Somalia, I decided that it was time for me to make a break and try to be a civilian and at 25 I had no idea what I was going to do with my life. I didn't graduate high school. I got a GED when I was stationed in Japan
reason I didn't graduate high school as a as a teenager runaways involved in drugs I got expelled from my last High School simply because I was selling drugs. So because of all that, I just the military is my life. But now I had to put that on the back burner because it was starting to affect me emotionally. And when I got out, I tried to get work, but I didn't have any skills. So I decided I'm gonna go into the army. And that was it.
Does does it does invite vironment there few this kind of hate. Did you feel that this condition you like where did this come from? Was it the environment of being in the military before the military? Did you have this hatred towards Muslims? Oh, no, even why, even even after 911 I didn't have a hatred towards Muslims. It's just something and it's something that happened. And I think when it really took off, was when they told me you're done. You've got to get out. You're done. So I got out that was because of your injury injury. You got shot. I've blown up blown up. Well, that's what but I tell people I don't really know. I don't remember any of it. I was on the second floor of a
building in Ramadi, in oh six. And I was looking out on the street to the security teams, and make sure there wasn't anything going out because we was going to leave this building. I want to walk my guys into a firefight. So
last day, I remember I woke up in the hospital.
The guys who came to visit me in a hospital says Dang, Sarge, only thing missing from you was a cape because you flew straight across the street. I don't remember. My backup broke my shoulder.
You know, you got blown up. Yeah.
You're flying. You're blowing blowing somewhere. Yeah, thank God, you're still here. Yeah. hamdulillah we gotta get you I want to get him on the Joe Rogan show and hook up with. They got the David Goggins and Jocko was selling Jocko Jocko who willock we gotta have you heard of Jocko willick. David gigant these are all military men, and they're doing some good they got some inspirational motivational material that's out there. But you're at another level man, this is another level because you really, you know now what's your story and we're getting we're getting more deep into it as more of a positive message because you can actually with this message, help
change hearts and minds and prevent people from going to a whole nother level of thinking or taking their patriotism to that level that you thought because you are actually almost at the MOS with a IE D that's a bomb and ready to kill 200 300 Plus, I mean Juma can be like I don't know how much they hold it that model you can have hundreds of people it depends on us and men women chosen or not if schools in and yeah, we have to pray out in the hallways. Yeah. So you were one of those guys that were now plotting. Some have actually done it. You are actually on your way to do it. What's going through your mind, man? Well, it was this is like I'm sorry. This is like man, this is like some
can't make this stuff up stuff like I have one of those guys right next to me. You know, that was plotting. There's some out there right now that hopefully they're tuning in, and we can get them to unplug and have him do what you did to actually rewire somebody's circus and Awaken your heart, you know, and so, inshallah God willing. Uh, so what happened was, I didn't have any more wars. My wars are done. Now I know that I'm done. So So what I did, I guess, because I'm asked, Where does he come from? What was it that made you go to this extent? And as I thought about it, I created a war for myself. common enemy, Islam Muslims, right? Nobody in America likes them or, you know, in with the
my is telling you right writing program. Right, right. And
so, that's when I started this plan.
And I knew, I knew that by law, I would be considered a criminal. I knew that.
But I saw it as doing one last thing for my country. And I knew I would end up in federal prison, I knew I would end up with a needle Mom, I knew that I was okay with that. I was okay with that. Because it didn't matter. Because see the whole thing, what really upset me in the military, I wanted to die.
I wanted to die. Because here in America, if you're a soldier, if you're a Marine, whatever, and you go to combat and you die, you come back and a flag draped coffin you are for ever known as a hero. No matter what you did in your past, all your sins are washed away in society's eyes.
And that's what I was shooting for. And it never happened. Was it connect it was so it wasn't connected to God, it was just country. What were you religious? Did you believe in God? I mean, I was raised with Christian values. I guess you'd say my my mom was fairly religious in Christianity. So you would have been linked back to Chris being a Christian? Yeah. Uh huh. I probably probably, I mean, the headlines probably would have said something like,
veteran suffering from PTSD, you know, has a breakdown or something like that. Right. You know, I wouldn't have been called a terrorist, which is what I would have been. Yeah. Because I'm white. Because I don't have religious affiliation as far as Islam. Now, if I would have been a Muslim, and did something like that to a supermarket. We know how that goes. Yeah, stories easily predicted. Oh, yeah. So so but but but I've just been known as, you know, poor veteran that had emotional issues from the war that had been so. And that's and that and that was what led me to, to create this plan. And I had been planning it for over well over a year, almost two years, and piecing everything
together. I wasn't in a hurry, patience, because I didn't want to raise any alarms that would have that would
cancel this out. So I took my time, took the time, and I was close. I was close, I only needed a couple more items. And I mean, I could have got those any day. Just it was a matter of going to get them.
daughter came home from school. She was like seven years old. She comes home from school, and she talks about this boy that sat next to her. And his mom came in guarding
from school and she was dressed all you know, she's just like a Muslim woman, you know? And when she started to because, you know, my child, children don't have prejudice. Children don't see differences in people like, like adults. Yes. And when she was describing this woman, I went off, I just exploded. She's describing a Muslim woman, a Muslim woman. Yeah. And
the famous saying that usually always said by a bigot is that I don't want my family around those people. Yeah. And so my daughter looked at me like I was totally out of my mind.
And somehow, someway, for whatever reason, a light bulb came on, and says, my hatred is mine. But now I'm pushing it on her. That's wrong. Do you see this where people are becoming victims of this Hate Machine? That is this this hate that's perpetuated? Because now the war machine you got to go and create this, this this perception like they are the other so now it's easier to kill the other because naturally, we're I mean, we're all human beings, nobody. It's just in our innate nature. We don't i don't think people just they're not born racist. They're not born with this hate that this hate is, like Nelson Mandela said, People aren't born hating, you know, they're taught this. You got
to teach them how to love. So now you know to go well, you see a lot of wars happening. And now this this false persona
this is misinformation is created. And now the average person through the media and through the hate provocateurs, corrupt politicians, and you name it, the list goes on pushing out all of this. And now the average layman like you is just watching Fox News. And now he's just getting probably becomes a victim to this hate. Absolutely, absolutely. I put those pieces together, it's
safe to assume this is what you you fell victim to that. We call it. We call it the echo chamber. What does that call the echo chamber? Or echo box? It's where when it comes to especially medium, you only associate yourself with stuff that is like minded to the way you already feel. Yeah, so it just reinforces it. Yeah. And but what why does, but most people when you ask most people, they'll be like, you can't believe the media, even Americans. But why would this they believe the media?
selective ignorance. Well, I you get my point. Yeah. Yeah. And and and, you know, I'll be the first one to say that, you know, Americans by nature are is a generalised statement, but they're not the go getters that they want us to be. Yeah. They're the ones that sit back and let it let them come to them. And and that's the way they they filter their news and their beliefs is, you know, majority rules, kind of thing. Yeah. It's the social norm. We're going to go with a social norm. We're not going to detour from that at all. Yeah, and it's easier that way. So the herd mentality, just following whatever. And you can link this back also, because you talk about drinking, how much vodka
a day, you have gallon every two days, half gallon every two days. So you're already bitter. You're already angry. And now you got to blame somebody. Yeah, yeah. Why not blame the Muslims? Yeah, and as if that's gonna make the economy better if that's gonna make everything just all your problems go away the pain in your heart? Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. And
because you know it, you look at things and things that bother you and things that hurt you and things that, that hold you down. Okay, that you, once you overcome those,
the pain that you felt is still there. Yes, it's still there. It's still there until you're willing to give up yourself. You have to give up yourself and go into something greater, which is the end result of what happened. I ended up becoming a Muslim. So Oh, wow. This is like, you know, we got they got to make a we need some Hollywood producers out there that to make a skit, we got the script ready. And this needs to be there. And they're actually in the crosswalk about that this needs to be made. This is like, this is a direct
film to to challenge this American Sniper. I mean, this is the American hero right here, man, I'm sitting next to you. Right? That actually, you know, Joseph chose or chose love over hate. And it's the story that everyone needs to hear that so we got our brother here on the D show. So you're making plans to kill innocent human beings. And Muslims are simply those and houses of worship that you were about to attack. And now I always like to define words because now you know, in these words, people think moslem, I say Hold on. They asked me, are you Muslim? I say, by Muslim, do you mean someone who has chosen freely to submit his will to the Creator of the heavens and earth and be
the best? morally Alright, person, I'm a Muslim. But if you associated me with some crazy stuff in your mind, you could take that and have that and keep it all right and change. So you are going to kill those types of people. Yeah. So what happens then? Well, after I had the the bow up in front of my daughter, and she, she created that light bulb in my brain, I decided without telling anybody, I'm gonna go visit these people. I'm gonna give them a chance to prove me wrong. And to prove my plan as invalid, she softened your heart.
opened it, I won't say softened. It opened it opened.
So I did went there on the Juma, you know, I knew Fridays was was prayer. That was when I was planning on doing the congregational prayer. Yeah, I knew Friday was when most people would be there. And so I went, and I went early. And I walked into the, to the Islamic Center, and there was a African American gentleman used to play pro basketball back in the 70s. So it took him like three minutes to actually stand up straight. And he looked at me he was in a shoe room, taking off his shoes and, and he looked at me and he smiled. And I looked at him, and he knew I was kind of out of place. Because I looked confused. Yeah. And he said, Can I help you? And I said, Yeah, I want you to
teach me about Islam.
He said, He smiled and kind of chuckled a little bit. He says, Well, how much time you got? I said, Well, I looked at my watch. I said, I got a couple hours, which still makes me laugh because I think you know, you can't teach anybody anything two hours, but especially
theology right? And and Islam is too complicated to teach in two hours. But he smiled. He says, we'll give it a shot. So I stayed for Juma and even still, I I thought, well, you know, the the the the Hooda or the the the sermon the message that was being presented that day was a good one. Oh, it was good.
I told myself they were just saying that because I was there. Yeah. You know. And they were doing Takia. You heard? Yeah, yeah. Crazy. Yeah. So So, you know, it was just, they were just doing it because I was there, right? You know, they want to portray this peacefulness. And if it's brought for people that I know, because many of the Islamophobia, they use this, this, they throw out this word, you know what I mean? They're lying. you're eventually going to find out the line is going to anger you even more. Right, right. Yeah. So obviously, there was no lie. You like, what you're hearing and what happened? Yeah. And so so then I get introduced to another gentleman, nother Muslim
brother. And he takes me in the library. There's a couch there at the time, and we sat down, we started talking, he said, Do you ever read the Quran? And
said, Nope, nope, never, never have man. He went over to the bookshelf, got a copy handed to me. He said, I want you to read this.
And when you get questions in your mind, come back and see us man ask us.
And so I did. Now, to jump back just a little bit. I didn't tell anybody, my intentions. I went there presenting myself as somebody who wanted to learn a little bit more about a religion that few people knew about outside of Muslims themselves. So they didn't know I was just Mad Bomber. They didn't know that. And they had no clue about no clue. Nobody. Nobody knew about my plans. Anybody that knew me knew that did not like Muslims. What do I hate? No man, FBI. You know, CIA? Yeah.
So what happened was, as I went on, I read the Quran. And my wife started to freak out a little bit. Because she knows I hate Muslims. Yeah, I'm reading the Quran. What is going on? Right? She's getting really worried because she's thinking after I told her, I went to the Islamic Center, that I was going to do something. Did some of this rub off on her when she started to hate? No, no, no, she was pretty much do you know, people were people. Yeah, they're good. And there's bad. Yeah, that's just the way she let her wife. Yeah. And
so I read it, and I come up with questions. I read passages like the famous kill them kill, kill all the non believers, right? and stuff like that. They throw out? Yeah. And I was like, bam.
I want to see what they got to say about this. So did they explained it? And it was an historical passage that was presented to explain what was going on at that time. Yeah, the non believers were not the Christians. They were not the Jews. They were the pagans. So it had nothing to do with you being a man of combat, you can understand those are combative verses for combat in historical context. Yeah. Yeah. And sometimes you got to feel that way. You have to? Uh, okay. All right. I like that makes sense. That makes sense. And then I and then I stumbled upon other verses, that that stuck out. And the two most To this day, that filled me with love, and really, really opened my
to take one human life is like killing all of humanity. But to save a human life is like saving all of humanity. Chapter five, verse 32. Yeah, yeah, there's nothing like that out there that nothing. I mean, you're saving all of humanity by saving one life, right? That's how great it is in the sight of God Almighty. And I was like, wait a minute.
What book are these insurgents, and he's and these al Qaeda members and these ISIS members, what book are they reading?
Because the way they're acting is totally against everything I'm reading right here in the book. This is it. If you don't pull it as a Muslim, for whatever reason, you don't believe in anything else. You have to believe in the Quran.
What book are they reading, you know, because of their actions, so that as a semi intelligent person, I had to I had to rationalize.
They do not speak for Islam. That's not Islam. And in the meantime, these people are so nice to me, welcoming inviting me to their homes for dinners, not knowing that I have plans to blow up this building with them in it.
Eight weeks later, from the first day, I stepped foot in
And that Islamic Center took my Shahada. So now eight weeks from when you made the human connection you actually stepped in brave enough you came into mas teach me about Islam eight weeks later, now you're doing what Jesus did with Moses did what the last and fundamental problem Mohammed did with the best of humanity Did you submitted your will to God you took the Shahada, you declared there's nothing worthy of worship except the one God. And Muhammad is His message. That's simple. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And I'll never forget, because, you know, there's always this thing that Muslims are telling you, if you're not Muslim, we're gonna kill you and stuff like that, you know, all that
craziness, right? And when I went there and told him, I said, I want to take Shahada. Yeah. And they were like, whoa, hold on. Are you sure about this? Man? It's not been that long, you know? And, and I says, No, it, it's what I need to do. I I don't, it's not a want. It's a need. I have to do this because I have to start living my life by a different set of ideals. And I like the doctrine that Islam teaches that Islam presents to humanity. It's important. And I want to be a part of that. And so I did, I did.
Six months after that. I told them, who I really was, and what I was really planning to do.
They were blown away. Totally just wow.
And I took that story. And I started telling other people telling other people, as I'm telling people, I'm at home one day, and I get a knock on the door. Six months, half a year later now. Yeah, I get a knock on the door. Let me guess who
the FBI is one of the brothers calls it the FBI. The FBI. Were you guys, man. And because somebody had, you know, called them. Yeah, they were concerned, you know?
And especially now, because I'm a Muslim. Well, they didn't know that as, as this as this nationalist that I was, yeah, that I was going to do this as a Muslim. I'm totally against that. So, you know, everything had been gone. You know, so there really wasn't even a case because they they had no evidence I had already disposed to things the way they should have been disposed of. And, and there was nothing left. That was it because it didn't need I didn't need it. You know. And so that that was open for a while. That's when my wife found out what I had planned. She didn't even know. Nobody knew. And when the FBI and the bomb dog came to the house, she was four. She didn't talk to
me for a couple days. Yeah. You know, so
she knows you're Muslim now. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I remember. I came home after I took Shahada again, I didn't tell her, which is something I'm still trying to work through in the military, because I was I belong to a groups of people that you just didn't tell anybody anything. You don't do that. Yeah. So I am still working through that not telling my wife things, which, as you know, can be pretty devastating. And in a marriage. So
you know, I told her, I said, Hey, I took shots. She was the one.
She didn't know what it was. Yes. I said, I'm a Muslim. And she goes, What?
It was so funny, she says, Well, I'm gonna tell you something right now. I'm not wearing a bunch of scarves on my head or anything like that. I'm not covering up and I said, Well, this is you're not a Muslim, I wouldn't even expect you to, you know, and she says, And another thing, if you want four wives, I'm not gonna be one of them.
And I and that kind of made me laugh. And I was like, you know, and to myself, I kept this in. I was like, you know, I don't know if I really want the one now.
Before I I just think that's that's masochistic. I don't know. But, uh, yeah. So and it was four years later, she became a Muslim. So now your wife also she accepted Islam. Islam. Yes, she is. She obviously she did her homework. She, she researched. And that's what we're just asking people to do. Do what you did real simple. Make the human connection. You know, go experience things for yourself. Go to an open house, you know, read the Quran. And look, I mean, man, this is just amazing. You are courageous enough. I mean, it's true. But American, you know, and you thought that you were taking it to another level by going to you know, have you ever met one of these people that heard your
story and said, Man, I was about to do the same thing until I heard you.
Not necessarily those words, when when the video came out.
Out of curiosity, I read the comments.
And I read a lot of them. I didn't read all them. There was a lot of comments, and some but most of them were good. It was a nine to one ratio. I was told Good, the Bad
Which is pretty, pretty crazy. Over a million views, so nine to one ratio good or bad. One of the comments stood out to me. And I won't say exactly what he said he had a very colorful tongue to him. But basically he said, if, if a bad dude like you can change the way he thinks, I guess I can't do Americans can be serving his country. And look at exactly what you said, Look, they might be hating, but now you are at the top of the hate where you're going to go more above this, right, and there was nothing there. Well, and and that's and, you know, my soldiers, if they if they were still around, or they were here, they tell you the same thing they they thought I was, they thought I was
something else, because and it made them proud to be for me to be their Sergeant third platoon sergeant or team leader, their squad leader, it may start Sergeant Sergeant Yeah. And so it made him proud because his fire broke out, we'd start getting shot at, I just stood there and handed out commands I didn't run for cover, and
like one of my soldiers curl up and suck, his thumb actually happened. You know.
And I didn't do that. Because
I wasn't done. I didn't, I had this sense of immortality to me, I wasn't done. And I still use that today. You know, I I tell people that that I'm not going anywhere. Not until I'm done. That's what I say not until I'm done. And when I'm done, he'll decide. And then he'll take me.
Nobody else has that power. It's amazing how the Creator of the heavens and earth law, how he's able to change hearts, and then use that person like yourself. And as a amazing example for others to really reflect and think over. Tell us you're you're in the supermarket. And you see a couple women, they're just wearing what Jesus's mother would have been wearing, you know, the job imitating
Mary, who there's a whole chapter named after in the Quran, you see these women, and you're ready to snap a neck.
I actually broke down and cried, actually broke down and cried. It wasn't in a supermarket it was in a D SW shoe store.
Big shoe store. And went there because I have a wife and that's what wives do. Yeah, they go buy shoes. And so I was there with her and and there was these two
Muslim ladies wearing black Barker's really stood out. And so I told them, your I sat down on the chair and I started crying and my wife got all concerned, she goes What's wrong? Because I was still having some emotional issues with being back and being away from the wars, you know. And I just started crying. And I says, Well, I won't say what I actually said. But you know, it's those two women over there.
I'm trying to drum up the courage
and the intestinal fortitude to go over there and break both their necks.
Because they're in my store, and they shouldn't even be in my country.
And, you know, it
it's shamefully, that I I tell the story. And, you know, I'm not I'm not proud of any of this. But I tell it,
because it needs to be told and people need to understand, you know, like I've said, you know, a va had a plan for me.
I think he could have come through a little bit sooner, but that's not up to me. That's up to him, you know, but I had to be all the way over here to the right.
Be this hardcore person that had this hatred in his heart. That didn't even
flinch and I have taken a life
to be this person over here.
I had to experience that. Because otherwise, how can I talk about it?
I lived I wasn't, you know?
And and since then I've I've tried to reach people and people don't have to like me. I tell people many times, you know, I'm not looking for more friends. I friends take time. I don't have time. I got a message and I got to deliver that message. And this is what I planned for me. So I ended up
resigning from my job.
My nine to five I was working with homeless veterans. very admirable job, you know, very rewarding and I think you know, a va takes took great pleasure on me doing that job.
But if I had to make a choice, and a choice was made for me, that's the whole thing. It was made for me when I was at the JFK library speaking. And I stayed around a little bit afterwards, I was out walking around the library and a guy came up to me.
And he goes, I just wanted to tell you, thanks, ISIS, okay, if for what
he has You saved my life.
And I was like, dude, how do I save your life?
He said, Well, long story short, my wife left two kids. She's with another man right now.
Tonight, I was going to commit suicide.
I listened to you talk. And it made me realize we all have a purpose.
We all have a purpose. I just need to find out what mine is. And that's what I'm going to commit my energy to now is finding what my purpose is.
At that point, I knew what I had to do. I had to quit.
And so I went back and I told them, told him what happened, exactly what happened. And they were like, yep, this is what you need to do.
So here I am.
That's amazing. Couple more. Couple more things. I just wanted to ask you. You met you mentioned it was very interesting that you you spent some time in Bosnia, which is where one of the the greatest genocide happened after World War Two. And there was many war criminals there. cuttlefish was it most of the Milosevic codename Elvis, codename because it was hair. They called him codename as code name was Elvis because this hairdo. So you were your Tell us about that.
April 15 2004, we went on a raid to pale Serbian and to grabbing
and bringing back most of it, yeah, but most of its to grab him and bring him back for trial, who's gonna send him to The Hague, and for trial for war crimes.
Got the Intel that he was going to be here meeting with this priest and the priest son. And like most Intel, it was wrong. And he wasn't there. He had just left.
But the priest was there and the priest son was there.
We burst through the door did when we had to do the priest and his son came at us with weapons and we
we eliminated the target
and I used to jokingly just say well that's that's my pure at that. That's my speed ticket to to the fire got a shot a priest.
But so they came shooting at you with weight actually didn't get a shot off. Yeah, this came at us with weapons. They came at you with weapons. Yeah. So you're defending yourself? Yeah. Yeah. You're American. You're American. This is you're in the military, American military. Yeah. So I like to bring this up to to the our Christian friends who are watching out there that in this part of the world where my roots come from Bosnia, we were the original Christians that accepted Islam, Unitarian Christians who believe they were called the book of meals, those close to God, as they were nicknamed. They believe that Jesus is a mighty messenger like Abraham, Moses. They worship like
Jesus, did they prostrate like we do put their heads on the ground. They didn't go in to the churches. They were, you know, disconnected from a day work considered heretics. But most people today would be considered a Reddit because most people they don't, you know, they don't fall in line with Trinity God being three what they believe in, there's one guy to worship Him alone, right? And that's what these Bosnians believed. And when Islam came like when it came to you, and so many, millions of millions of people now who are accepting Islam, that pure monotheism, of only worshiping the Creator, not the creation, those Bosnians accepted it. This is how you have it in the heart of
Europe till today, you actually visited that country also. And now and now you're also someone who, who went into a mosque, you've connected, and you turn this hate into love. But some people now the watching here in this beautiful story, what would you say, in conclusion, to a person is out there, and he might be right now plotting and planning, and he's thinking of doing what you were doing. And taking it to that. What you would say being he thinks he's being more American now. And he's about to do something like that you were planning on doing but he's tuned in and what would you tell them? First of all,
America, American is not a geographical location. This is what a lot of us misunderstand. It's a philosophy.
I got this idea when I saw a little girl crying in Syria.
was more of an American at that point in her life than most Americans that have lived there their whole entire life. born here raised here,
it was simply because of her desires. And we all have desires, each and every one of us, and we try to accomplish those desires. Now some of these desires might be hateful, like mine was, and my plans might take us to take some of us to other levels, to where we're actually going to create these atrocities, to other human beings, other human beings. That's the word you use. You don't use the word Christian, you don't use the word Muslim, Jewish, Hindu, human beings have are made human beings.
That's it. It's up to us to understand
and through positive action, propel human beings to a different level. And I've told many peoples that these dreams that we have dreams are great. Dreams are great. Martin Luther King, Jr. had a speech. And he talked about his dream. Beautiful, beautiful, articulate words.
I asked you, I plead to you, all the people.
Think about these dreams you have? Are they positive? Are they negative? What is the outcome? How does it affect human beings. And when you get to the point to where you can say this is a positive. This is going to help human beings to go forward in our society and our world. Then quit calling it a plant or quit calling it a dream. Call it a plan.
Thank you so much. You'll be you'll be on your way. You're Indiana, right? Yeah. You ever see that big sign you come in and says on one side it says, Hell is real. Jesus is real. He didn't see that side. I didn't see it coming in. But there was all kinds of you know, you know, that's amazing now because many people don't know that now. How was your relationship? Final question with Jesus. Now. He's a man, he's love Jesus. I Well, actually, it's better. Because being a nationalist, that was my religion. I didn't I didn't pray to any anything. Because I was the one. I was the one I even
remember, in Somalia. I even use the words when I was when I was I grabbed a hold of a of a lady that was that was struggling with us. And I grabbed ahold of her and just gave her that look, and I grabbed her by her shirt, and I says, Allah would you say, Allah?
I am God. Wow.
You got to that point of arrogance. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I was. I mean, and and and being at that level I was at in the military, it that's really it's really less arrogance than it is survivability. It's how you survive.
Because you got to believe that you know, you're the one you know, otherwise you're not gonna that's that's what gave me gave me the courage to when bullets are fine. I'm staying in Oh, yeah.
I'm not gonna get hit. Yeah, my done.
If people want to reach out to hook up with you is you know, to invite you to, to a university or campus someone to a church wherever the case to hear this story live, you know, where can they?
I, while I'm still working on social media, yeah. I've gotten a few a few tips from your assistant. And so he's helped me out a little bit. I'm kind of
taking up there now. So, but
I have a manager, smarty pants productions. There. They were the ones his secret life of Muslims. His name is Josh Seth tell smarty pants are in Brooklyn.
He, he, he's Jewish. And he's the one who put this secret life of Muslims together. Yeah. second season. That was the video the one that went viral. That was CBS Sunday morning. Okay. And because he will see it's a it's an interest. It's like yours. It's an internet show. Okay. But he took my episode and gave it to a friend of his who happens to be the president CBS it says you need to watch this. Yeah, she put it on that Sunday morning program to CBS Sunday morning. And we were actually worried if it was gonna air or not because the molar report just came out. We didn't know if it will get bumped because the molar report you know, because I mean, you know, the molar report or human
But now they they they aired it. And it just it blew up after that. I might my even my parents.
When I became a Muslim shortly after I became a Muslim actually it was been a big
I became president of that Islamic Center.
Not Yeah, we're gonna have to have you back now we, we got things just the story keeps evolving. You actually became president of the US three years after I became I became president, I'm no longer president.
Aye aye II, election came up. And I didn't run for my for another term because I was finishing my last semester in college. I just really didn't have time to visit. Yeah. And and I didn't want to shortchange the center at all. I didn't want to shortchange the community. So I basically stepped aside. And the person I nominated was the one who got elected a female, as first female in that community. And I'll never forget, it was like a drop the mic moment. After Juma? You know, I got up to give announcements. And I says, and I just wanted to let all of you know that the elections coming up soon. And I'm nominating somebody, I'm nominating somebody because of who they are. And
what they what they do in the community, inside the Muslim community, and outside because she was very involved in all of it has been for years. And I says, I want to nominate bb bahrami. And that was basically a drop the mic moment because
the population there and in our community is mostly Afghan Pakistan is a lot of culturalism that I did, I did a lot to try to get away from, because culturalism is not religion. It's not Islam. And it's it's it's taken a lot of weight from Islam, and is given by giving it a black guy in a way, you know,
especially the treatment towards women and the way we you know, look towards the women. The women are precious gifts from a law man. Yeah, people are people confuse what people do culturally. And then mix that up with Islam. Right, Robert? J. Two, two, yeah. So, you know, I, I, I made changes, you know, I I believed in the separation. I believed in the separation men and women. I did not believe in segregation, where we had a community events, they put up a a divider in the room, women on one side, men on the other side, it's bogus, that's wrong.
But I understood that there are women that if they, if, because of their cultural background, they don't feel comfortable sitting out there with everybody else. Okay. I mean, the women still had their own side, but we're all still in the same big room, you know, which is fine.
But the ones who didn't feel comfortable coming out there without the dividers, they could sit back and they there had a room right off of the the main room.
And so they had the choice.
There was a an instance, before I became president, that I went to the committee because what they were doing was they were having too many men, and it was filling up the prayer room for Juma. So on jimma, what they were doing was they, they they took the women's section, and converted it to the men's section also like a, like an overflow, and then put the women in the library. And I stood up against that their whole their whole thought was because of that famous idea that has been totally flip flopped and demeaning something that it doesn't and that's the one where where the lady came to the Prophet peace be upon him and said and said that, you know, my husband's jealous. He doesn't
even like me praying that it uh, you know, because he he he knows I'm talking to a man and you know, all this, that and the other i don't i don't know the actual
number numbers are even which which book, which book it is, but it's, it's a famous one. So the Prophet peace be upon him and all his wisdom, said,
Go to the closet and pray.
You don't have to come to the masjid because it creates conflict in your own. He told her that. So now somehow 1000 plus years later,
these men think that women don't need to be in a Masjid. They really just don't have to be there.
And so I explained this idea, I broke it down and explain it. That's not what the prophet was saying. Prophet was not saying that he was saying this woman, this woman because of her situation. Didn't have to come to the masjid.
ourselves. Sisters need to be in a Masjid more I feel that our brothers do because they're the ones raising our kids.
We want them to have that
That connection, we want them to have that, that that
philosophy embedded in them. Right, wrong, indifferent. And we want them to be able to to, to have that portrayed in the children, because the men,
the men aren't going to do that. It's because of the the family structure. It just doesn't work that way. And so
they said, Yeah, yeah, you're right. And when I nominated this female for president,
you know, they came to me afterwards, as President every Juma. I would always go to the library.
I was open to having questions. You know, people want to ask me something, people want to voice their concerns to me as individually. I'll be in the library. I stayed there for hours at a time. And a
bunch of the the older brothers, especially the older ones, they come to me and they, they they, they said, they said,
Don't you think that's a little bit progressive nominating a female to be president?
I said, Brother, why is it I'm always explaining your guys's history to me, or to you.
I said, it's not progressive at all. Matter of fact, it's regressive. I said How? I said brother, who was the first Muslim,
who founded the very first university and library, a Muslim woman.
Why? Because men were off bickering with each other and fighting wars. The women did all this, they built the society as much, if not more, than the Muslim men did. We have to give them their due.
And show them that respect.
So and I said,
Yeah, he's right.
thank you very, very much for this very inspirational story, you know, to see where you came from what you were planning on doing and, and to have you here with us, you know, sharing this it's a message of hope. It's a it's a it's beyond positive. It's something that if people really have that hate in their hearts, they really just listen to this with a sincere open heart. You know, it can change so many hearts and minds and, and that's a change for their better and humanity's better because we got just too much hate in the world right now. And because of that hate leading to violence, and we've seen like just in this year alone, over 500 you know, Muslims attacked, and just
in America and and we need more of this and I want to commend you, you know, my God Almighty Allah continue to bless you and keep you firm. On the deen and sha Allah, we can meet up again.
Be great salah and thank you guys for tuning in. And as I said, if you ask me or if you ask our brother,
are you Muslim? Now? You turn into what a terrorist No, I've submitted my will I've taken that free choice that I have to worship, a stick of stone money, materialism, or human being No, no, the sun the moon? No, no, no, I just want to worship One who created me and I want to be an upright human being. I want to help humanity, I want to make the world a better place. And if I happen to be American, which I am, I'm going to do it as an Muslim American, like the Muslim American hero, Mohammed Ali, but the best of mankind they were falling and our brothers now are the prophets that God Almighty sent out of his love to guide humanity. Just like Jesus, Abraham, Moses, and Muhammad
peace and blessings be upon him was just the last nail came with that same message, worship the Creator, not the creation, be morally upright,
and take it to another whole level of being the best human that you can be. We'll see you next time. Tune in here to the show every week. Subscribe if you haven't already. We'll see you next time. Until then. Peace be with you. Salaam Alaikum.