Daring Jew Avi Yemeni Confronts ‘giant’ Muslim
Channel: Mohammed Hijab
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Episode Transcript ©
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Okay, I've asked him a question. Because when I speak, I'm proud of my culture. Excellent. Don't believe in God. Alright, so you're so you're you're Jewish person by not your Jew by I respect everybody's right to believe in whatever fairy tale as long as your fairy tale doesn't tell you to kill me, no problem. So okay, I haven't got a problem with that. Now I know where you are in terms of morality. So in terms of objective morality, we can't say that you have a definite set of moral principles that you adhere to or do you.
Western Judeo Christian values. Yep. Okay. So do you accept, for example, the Old Testament as as divinely inspired on
our values as Western civilization is founded on the Old Testament? So in one way or another? I do but there are parts of it that I find.
I'm not sure what your what your particular stances? Well, I've seen you. I see you in conjunction with Tommy Robinson. That's how I got to know who you were. I saw you kind of doing like a run with Tommy as well. You bashed a cop or something? Yeah. and northern Ambassador cop, if you go back to the footage is on us on a public record. But here's what I'll say to you. Is that yes, I saw you in conjunction with that and what it seems I'm not sure. You can obviously correct me if I'm wrong. It seems to me that your position is is it anti Islam? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Can I can I ask you? I'm not sure I'm once again, I'm just asking you.
Yes. Yep. So I was gonna ask you them.
If you're, if your position is anti Islam, that's not a problem. I mean, by definition, if you're something other than Muslim, you're going to disagree with parts of Islam. Can I ask you specifically, what do you find repugnant about Islam that you feel like you need to address that?
The anti semitism, Okay, go ahead. So tell me what you owe. And particularly thank you denying that Islam is anti semitic. Well, the thing is, you'd have to look at the paradigm.
I don't mean
well, Moses is a semi
Jew hatred, all right. Okay. Does the Quran declare hatred for Moses?
Your Moses in the Quran is not the same as the Jewish knows no problem. But he was. He was a junior, what about today's Jews?
Because Moses, for us is the most commonly repeated oft repeated prophet in the whole of the Quran. He's repeated in over 75 minutes. He said he was a Jewish prophet. Yes. And who did you know that Moses?
Muhammad, in the beginning, was claiming he was a Jewish prophet to try to get the Jews on to convert? But why was he represented, you reckon that the depiction of Moses in the Koran is is an anti semitic one?
Okay, thank you very much. So then to answer your question, then by extension, I'll say one of the heroes of Islam as a Jew, and not just one version, but your version of
answering your question, right? If we're looking at all of the Quran also says very lovely things about Jews. abrogation tells us that in the beginning, he liked the Jews later, when he realized Who's he your prophet. Okay, well, that tell me where it says that in the beginning. He liked the Jews, and later he didn't. If you look at the historical, the fact is, by the way, you know, the law of abrogation, sorry to cut you off. There's a verses in chapter two verse 106 of the Quran minutes from Nathan omens.
It only applies to African which are rulings it does not apply to a bar which are narrative. So here what you've talked about abrogation, which is something people who don't know much about Islam, I'm not trying to say specifically you use all the time, the law of abrogation only applies to legal rulings, it cannot apply it cannot they cannot be a narrative that, that aggregates rulings are pretty much fundamental to the
I don't think Jews should be allowed to talk. Now it's a quick question.
It's a similar view to Timothy in the Bible, which says that women are not allowed to talk in the in the church, but what I was gonna say to dismiss it because you were saying Mohammed can be anti semitic.
But I'm asking Christians,
everyone has the propensity to be
let's do this. Let's keep this keep this going. While I was gonna say something really interesting about Jewish people. Okay. I'll tell you exactly what the Quran says In summary, not that interesting. You know, you're focusing on the boring part, the part that doesn't bother us objective. Well, you asked me a question which is scriptural in nature, and I'm giving you the answer. The Quran, it says, mean Al Kitab, in chapter three, verse 75, that there are those of the Jews and the Christians that you can trust them and there are those of you
Contrast or in other words in the same source has led to so and then all the same. That was the one first before it. So in other words, the attitude towards Jews and Christians seems to be in line with its attitude towards Muslims because in the Quran Chapter 35 of the Quran, it says minimum valuable nfcu minimum of tacit minimum salary can be a lot, that's a hold on, no problem. So just just to keep going. The Quran says that there are some Muslims who are oppressive to themselves and some of them which are on the middle path and those who, who excel. Likewise, the Quran says about the Jews and Christians, they're not all the same. There are some good of them and there are some
bad of them. Likewise, the Quran makes that kind of has that sentiment to all of humankind, that humankind you find good people, and you find what you find trustworthy, and you find untrustworthy. So I think if we're talking about the Quran, what we need to do is we need to look at the text. It's easy to say what Muslims believe in this and Muslim and I would agree with you, Avi right. If you said to me, look, Muslims, anti semitic. Yeah, I would say to some of the Muslims are anti semitic. Now, let's be honest, yes. A majority. You'd be on any Muslim forum online? No, hold on, you might be writing depends on the location. I'm from Egypt, okay. In Egypt, anti said, I would say anti
semitism is the default position. If you're not anti semitic in Egypt, it's irregular, whether you're a nationalist. It's because of I will tell you,
I can't wait for you to
know. I'm not saying that. It's because of the wars that ensued should have been the rock 967 973 these wars heighten the anti semitism. But then on the flip side, the piece like the Brexit, it's called sore loser. No, no, no, no problem. But and no problem. I don't disagree with history, right. History is something which is that, but what I'm saying to you is that on the flip side, you may you do disagree with history, because when it comes to Israel, I've seen
He made a pretty strong statement that you don't you don't disagree with history, but you actually do fundamentally disagree. Okay, well, maybe you're right, maybe, maybe it's because of my compounded ignorance. You could you could illuminate and educate and edify no problem. But what I'm saying to you is this, I think we have to, we have to stick to the topic. You say, you started off by talking about anti semitism in this in the Scriptures, right? Yep. We talked about verses of the Quran which explicitly mentioned good things about Jewish people, I'll tell you some that don't, because I want to be balanced. I don't want to be you know, I'm biased. It talks about this Jewish
scholarly class in chapter 62 of the Quran. However, as far as donkeys that have, that have scriptures on their backs, what does this mean? The Quran makes a criticism about Jewish scholars that they have a lot of, actually, they have a lot of knowledge. It says they have a lot of knowledge, but that they don't implement that knowledge. And by the way, what's really interesting about this criticism of you is that it's the same criticism that the Israelis had when recently I was looking at her out it's one of the Israeli newspapers that's that let's just be fair guys is not very Israeli they and that's your position as a right wing but it's a left wing paper right there.
is a paper in Israel hating Jews No problem, but they were talking about they were talking about something interesting. There was those two you can maybe to me Yes, subjective. I was wrong. I was gonna say is that the scholarly class because the clerics refer to as the shots in Israel, yeah of them in Parliament in the Knesset. They were photoshopped. But outside, there's this totally cost of Jewish people. They've been criticized by their own community for being exempt from the army. In fact, the Quranic criticism of the of the scholarly class of Jews is the same as the Israeli one, that you have a lot of knowledge, but you don't have any action that you're not doing.
Let's get back to the beginning of
this one where it talks about Yes. And and it's not, because I get the argument all the time that its historic, historic is that one is in the future? Yes, absolutely. This, we need to get rid of that. No, we don't need to get rid of that. Because what this is telling us in explicit terms, is that there will be a war between Muslims and Jews, by the way to be fair and clear. at that particular time. Yes. And this is an apocalyptic Hades, it's talking about in the end of times, it's talking about the Day of Judgment, there will be a war between Muslims and Jews, or some Muslims and some Jews, and then the tree will lay down and it doesn't say some. Well,
I'll tell you what it says. It says a tree called a hard cut. Yep, which is a tree, it will become animate is an inanimate creature, which will come animate, and it will help facilitate and guide Muslims to be able to destroy the Jewish enemy. That's all it is, at that particular time in the apocalyptic period, not in this is not a hadith referencing. Yes. Like you said, a past event.
Do you think you don't think we should get rid of that Hadith that talks about? Well, killing Jews? I'm ask you a question, right? Yes, I don't. And I'll be completely honest with you. I'm a traditionalist, I'm a structuralist which, which means fundamentally that I believe in the Koran and then I believe in the authentic sooner, so I wouldn't ever you would never catch me saying that we can get rid of any authentic hobbies just to be completely honest. But then I'll ask you a question. You know, Deuteronomy chapter 13, verses six to 10. It says if you have someone in your home, that what is the work, I'm saying and I
A couple you know what it says here? Let me just say if your brother or your your son or your daughter, or your friend or your wife, if they entrust you with something, yes. And they tell you Naboo Eleonora worship other gods. Yes. Then kill them, and stone them in their own homes. Now, this isn't the Bible that will told her, I condemn it. You want to get rid of it to get rid of it? Okay, fantastic. I want you to perfect. He said he's sorry. He said he condemns it. If it's in the Torah, yes. If it's in the Torah, yes, get rid of it. And
that should be the
JOB, JOB complete. You know why? Because for the first time, I think in history in your life, you've condemned a different scripture. I'm very happy that now you've looked at I condemn Nazis him. No, no, no, no, I'm talking about scriptures. In the same way. I've listened to me, have you perfect with the same vigor that you have against talking about the Quran and the Hadith? Because of its what you would refer to as violent verses and we wouldn't disagree?
I want you to use that same standard.
Bible, the Old Testament
Because you don't see Jews killing Jews, or Jews killing Muslims in the name of the Torah? You don't see but it is just Muslims targeting Jews anytime there's a God attack around the world, okay, now.
And then they get the Jews on the side.
I see what you're saying. I'll be I appreciate you coming from. There's two important problems. One of them is according to Pew Muslims account for about 1.8 billion people, which means that there are about one quarter going on to according to them, 2100 will be one third of the world's population will be Muslim. One out of three people in the world will be Muslim according to what Okay, now, coming out. And let me just say I made the point. And then you can you can now Jews account for about 30 million people maximum, maybe 20 million. Yeah, that means to say that there are more people in Cairo with a choice and with no problem. Yeah, you know, now you're going to Scripture
with the chosen? No, no.
There are more people in Cairo than there are Jews in the whole world. Yep. So it's a false comparison. Because if you have more people, there's no way Yes.
Yeah. So what I was gonna say is that it's a false comparison. Because when you come if you have a knife,
let me just make the point. And then you can you can come back. If you have 2 billion people, you have 2 billion people in the world versus 20 million. Yeah, you're definitely going to get more violence from the 2 billion whatever phase they're for. Okay, so let me put this to you. Yes.
Let's, let's agree on a number a percentage of the 2 billion that jihadi violent jihad is what? Give me a number. And I'm sorry, I can't give you that.
I don't know. I don't know. Let's say, let's say 1%. No point. Doesn't matter. My point doesn't try. Well, okay, let's get
let's get my point. My point here is that it's not the gross number that counts. Yes. It's the fact that in no other religion, in no other religion, do you have even the matching percentage that is killing and targeting others in the name of their religion?
So what's the source for that? What source you have what evidence you have for this? For what for the point you just made? Because I can give you evidence? Just lie.
I'm going to say to you, that's not an academic way of making. I don't need you to give me academic.
Okay, I'm making it very clear.
There is no, there is
no other religion, I think the
Jews we get no problem. Yes. And obviously there are going to be many more violent ones, because the numbers, but percentage per capita come back to you. Yes, because there is no fundamental thing that teaches any religion.
I will tell you something, right? If you look at the book of Deuteronomy, as a book of Numbers, chapter 31, verses 18. And verses 32. It's very clear that there was there was a very clear command to Moses to go into the village and yes, to go into the village if the Canaanites were here today.
virgins and take them as slaves.
They predated Islam. Yeah, maybe it was maybe maybe that's
what I'm saying to you. It's
not it's historically happened. I condemn it. It's a command from God, according to the Jews now, if they were Canaanites today, I'm Malik. You're talking about the Malik? Islam because
if you're taught if they existed today and Jews were targeting him, I will be at the front condemning them. Well, yeah, like that. Okay. So let me let me go back to the irrelevant because it doesn't, you know, I appreciate your *ing tall. It's annoying.
I'm coming back.
To go back to the social extrapolation, in terms of in terms of raw data, okay, raw data that we have,
in terms of raw data that we have for that coffee,
I'll be pleased to continue with it.
In terms of raw data that we have in front of us, according to
according to Daniel paper, who wrote the book, dying to win, looking at the period of time from 1980, up until it goes 2000 was the 30 year period you looked at Yeah, and it's probably regarding academics is probably the most accurate survey of suicide bombers in the in the in the modern period. And he said that in terms of ratio, the number one group of people that did suicide bombing was the Tamil Tigers. That's that's his finding. Right? What was his problem? What what is what what he looked from 1980 until 2005, I think in 1985, which is about 25 years. Yeah. So he looked at that period of time, which is pre, obviously 911. And post. Yep. Yeah. Okay. So here we're looking at
very, so here. The point is, is that when we look at the academic data, yeah, it doesn't substantiate your claim it does. Because the Tamil Tigers,
I condemn any mec nothing, you know, I've done with you today. Hold on.
Yes, but it is in a specific war zone. is suicide bombing? The war? No, I'm condemning it, no problem. But what I'm saying is the reason why you don't see me out there taking up the cause of the trauma, because the fact is, they are no threat to us here in the West. Okay. So your focus is that which is a threat, he was your religion call
that the fundamental basis of it, yes. And Islamic caliphate worldwide. Okay. No, they believe that one day, that's your interpretation of that. No. Why are you denying that? Yeah, I'm denying that I don't see the fundamentals.
Sorry. Okay. Fine. No fundamental. Do you believe? No, no, I I believe that the fundamental message of Islam, no, forget the word fundamental right. I like it. I can see what Yes, yes, I will tell you clearly right. I will tell you clearly that.
I will tell you clearly.
I will tell you clearly, there is no there is no specific construction in the Quran. And I dare anyone to define me. There is no specific instruction in the Quran telling ordinary Muslim layman to establish a caliphate and you can get you can give me the opposite. So what am I asking you?
After you've made a claim?
you're denying Yes, I'm the idea. I'm denying that you need you need a worldwide telephone. Oh, I'm not denying that.
I'm not denying the existence of a caliphate historically, no, no, no, no, there's a need for it, or the need for it. The
advantage of it? I didn't ever say that. In the Quran. It says you have to your message is yes.
I'm not going to use the word fundamental so much. Why not? Why not? What's the message?
One of the things within Islam is to create everybody's gonna have an active role.
I mean, here's the thing every Muslim has to have the will. Okay, whether it's through violence gi
is the belief that the world needs to become a worldwide caliphate. Well, absolutely not. I don't think that Sharia law should be imposed on every every person, especially non Muslims and the evidence and the evidence of that is in the Quran. You know, the Quran says like Rafa Deen, Katarina rostova like that. There's no compulsion in religion. And when it talks about imposing the jizya on me, I'm getting there before you get them. Yeah.
was gonna say to you is that when it talks about imposing the jizya on Jewish people and Christian people in chapter nine, verse 29, if you look at the Tafseer, or the exit Jesus of one person could
be, he says about this, that when you impose jizya is just a text. No, it isn't. Okay, tell me the opposite. that the text is a part of it. But it's second class citizen on every level. Okay. Hold on. Mike, my family.
Well, you know,
You know that too. You know how to build churches, synagogues.
He's watching. You're talking about the Arabian Peninsula. Okay. Now talking about the idea of being a dummy. He's not
there's no evidence of it. I'm telling you. In the Arabian in the Arabian Peninsula. There were specific commands that Yeah, you can't build a church in that area because look, people say you don't even allowed to go into Mecca as a non Muslim. Did you know this? I know that let me tell you why. Okay, do you know that in Mecca now when we go there now? Yeah, I've been there. I've got video online if you want to see me go to macro interesting. Can I come with you to Mecca? No, you unless you Yes, you can actually on one condition.
MSA is nothing right? It's a city which is quite small. There's about 3 million people that go there every year. Yeah. Now people die being trampled over and things like that. And the reason why they die is because of overpopulation overcrowding, right? Yep. Now imagine if we made this a tourist resort for for Christians, what I loved most about you Now besides your height, I found something else. You find a way to justify every barbaric thing. We'd like
some sort of sensible explanation
Okay, no problem. Let's let's not let's not go that route.
of wondering, sorry, let me let me let me make your life easier. I'll give you a verse in the Quran that gives you a reason. Yep. It says enamel enamel Mashallah Kenan nijssen fella caribou mosquito Hama badami. It says that that certainly the polytheists are impure, so they should not be allowed in the sanctuary after this year. What does it mean to be impure as a as a polytheist? it there's two opinions. One opinion is that they are impure in the sense that they they are not Muslims. They are not monotheists and this is the strongest opinion. So someone who does not have monotheism should not come into the sanctuary, where there is monotheism. So this is the Quranic explanation.
I'm not gonna apologize about that. It's polemic. I'm just saying that at this particular sanctuary, we are not gonna apologize for defund that. I don't find anything. There's some places I can't go to pickleball I can't go to San Diego in certain places in Spain, I can go to the same places in Spain establish a mosque, I can go to the Vatican and establish a mosque. Is there any place on earth that yes, yes. Oh, two? Yes. Yes. Because
the Wailing Wall bull*.
liberal brothers, if you look at me, look at me, I'm a philosophical liberal. Yeah, so in my estimation, it does some things with you at one point, this goes against your pack of righteous No, I don't know if anyone's gonna be confused. The racism is gonna be the chosen chosen race, but it's not gonna be the
Finish off with
20 minutes left.
No problem. Here's what I say to you guys. And I want to say openly, I don't want to seem like an apologist. I'm gonna give you that sound like an opponent and I'm not an apologist better shut up.
Here's what I'll say to you then. Yeah, I'll say to you, generally speaking. Number one, my premise is not philosophical liberalism. So if you think that there are some things because you said yourself I believe in like the Judeo Christian Western You said you should use the word Western philosophical framework. I don't believe in that. I believe in that why do you live here? No, I don't need to believe in that to live it
please let me let me let me let me correct him join Yes. IV according to liberalism itself. I can believe in whatever I want so long as I don't harm you. You know what I love about that is yes, use within ideals to yes justify
it No problem. I'm gonna say to you if you're a true liberal, yes, I'm not really liberal. Also, wherever you are, I don't care if you if you believe in philosophical liberalism, what is your base? What is your premise? Who am I speaking to? You seem to be just I think if you live in the West, yep. Western values.
Well, Western values are liberalism, as far as I'm concerned. Okay, fine.
Now, you don't accept them? Yes. No, I don't accept. That is an ultimate truth of
Islam. No doubt about it in my mind, no doubt about it.
No doubt about it. In my mind. I will say can you understand why people want to say to you, then get out.
When I'm in Australia,
when I'm in Israel,
listen to the statement.
Listen to me.
listened to me
She's my final say I'm gonna
I'm gonna send you this Hold on. I'm gonna say to you that me if you're on a philosophical level and you want to see what parts of the Quran we should, quote unquote take out. I am only concerned all of it. I am only concerned with my discourse Yes. About statements and questions which have creedal disproving implications, okay. Now if you don't have anything, all you're doing now is applying liberal Western value judgments and say I don't like this. I just
haven't disagreed with you on that one. What I'll say to you is this if it doesn't have treadle this previous degree
Let me finish off my
point being is, here's, here's why I think you should stand. I appreciate two things you've done today. Yes. You condemned parts of the Old Testament based on your idea of morality. Yes. Good. You condemned parts of in general the Bible, right? And you said that it's relevant to the rabbi.
So he's not he's not a Jew by religion. Here's the point. Here's the point. Why I think you should do my advice to you. If you want to apply a morally coherent standard. You should be as active. You should be as active. You should be.
Okay, can you get him away? Don't let him get a shot.
You should be as active in condemning
biblical scripture. As you are condemning the Quranic scripture. I want to see that
you stop flying planes into buildings, while I have him with you. Okay, okay.