Interaction Of Civilization

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Taha Karaan

Channel: Taha Karaan

Episode Notes

Truly Islam is fascinating. Sheikh Taha takes us through the civilizations of time in this talk thus drawing our attention to the role played by Islam within it. He draws our attention to researches and scientists like Huntington and Darwin  and their theories and then expands on why these cannot gel with logic. He goes on to explain about the fall of civilizations and the coming of others to replace. This is a swift in-depth talk you ought to make time for.

Episode Transcript

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hyleri kay

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shadow La ilaha illallah wa sallim

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ala Moana Mohammed Abdullah he was so rude I mean Allahumma salli wa sallim ala Sayyidina Muhammad wa

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ala Yomi de Nova Salam Alikum warahmatu Allahi wa barakato. Good evening.

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I had jotted down a number of points that I wish to address you upon initially

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in a quite legalistic fashion because what I was called for or what was called upon to do at the symposium was a very legal kind of discussion. So I jotted things down, tabulated them and said that I'm going to be speaking in this staccato fashion speaking about speaking of that. But after sitting here this evening, or rather, yesterday, after listening to the introductions, and this evening, listening to the speakers, I have overhauled my entire presentation to something completely different.

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I have been privileged in two engagements thus far to have seen a presentation that is symbolical. And that holds great value, I think, for all civilizations or communities to benefit from that has been the introduction in the welcome given by the First Peoples of this country. That has been

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a humbling a very warming, a welcoming experience, to see the manner in which civilizations can interact with one another. I haven't seen it anywhere else. This is something which I have come here and being enriched by. Therefore, my first point of discussion is that when we speak about living Islam, today,

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we have to speak about the interaction of civilizations. We are living in an age of interaction of civilizations, I want to speak of interaction of civilizations, it is not something that came in came about in the 18th, or the 19th of the 20th century, men in his various civilizations has been interacting with one another. Mankind has been interacting since time immemorial. But more often than not interaction between civilizations has been a matter of conquest and domination. The last few centuries have probably been the highest have represented the highest levels of this phenomenon of interaction whereby one civilization conquers another dominates another brings another to its

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knees,

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we have something very important to look forward to, we have something very important to look forward to as Muslims living in this time, in the early 21st century, where we have gone in the 20th century in the centuries line immediately before we throw that kind of interaction of domination and conquest, we have to look forward to a period in which a paradigmatic change will take place whereby in interaction will no longer be that of conquest and domination, but of mutual enrichment and learning from one another, and benefiting one another. And this, to me has been the central message that I've heard in the presentations by Auntie Deborah and others. This is how civilizations have

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interacted with one another all along. This is how people have lived together with one another all along. And this, I believe, is the message that has to be not invented, but revived as we're sitting here today, and from photos such as these should emerge to just about any geographical region, any space that it could possibly reach to. There has been

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interaction between mankind that has been characterized by war that has been characterized by violence that has been characterized by conquest and domination, as I have said, as I've said, but one thing that characterizes a Muslim,

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and by extension, everyone else, one thing that characterizes mankind is his eternal optimism. Not for a moment as a Muslim, lose sight of the fact that there is a better morning ahead of the night through which we are living at present. I want to be salatu salam O Prophet Muhammad Sallallahu Sallam tells us about that, about the spirit of optimism within a Muslim. You know, when

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We believe that the end of time will come when the angel will blow on the trumpet and everything will

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become disintegrated, to be resurrected and recreated thereafter for what lies ahead, which is the real existence of the hero after that moment is an extremely important serious moment, termination, the end of everything as we know it. But our Prophet sallallahu wasallam teaches us that if a Muslim happens to stand with the second CD in his hand, and he hears the trumpet blowing, he shouldn't give up and say, Well, time is up, take that sapling, put it into the ground, have that optimistic hope that something will come of it. Even if that moment, when it seems as if all exits have been closed, there is nowhere else to go. And there's nothing else to do, do not, do not ever despair, of the

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mercy of the Divine Lord, do not despair of the mercy of Allah law to the law, don't ever lose hope in Allah has always something better, that lies ahead, whether it's one step ahead, or whether it's gonna take three centuries to come today. So even though we have lived through a period of great devastation, we have lived through a period of great exploitation, which is continuing up to the present day, we remain as our Prophet sallallahu Sallam indicates to us.

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Wonderful is the state of a believer in Rahho hula hula, no matter what condition he finds himself in, he looks for the positive, and he finds the positive in it, he always find the positive in it. It is senseless to go back and point fingers as why have we come to where we are now who is responsible for the colonialism that has earmarked as has been the hallmark of civilizational interactions over the past few centuries? It will not make much sense because it won't get us anywhere. But the spirit of eternal optimism that characterizes us as Muslims, and which we have to offer to the rest of the world says, Where do we hit from here onwards? What do we do next?

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We live in a world where Muslims specifically find themselves either in Muslim majority countries, or in minorities such as ours here, such as my own minority back in South Africa, the existence of some minorities have been the direct product of forced migration under the colonialist in the colonial period, forced migration. other instances have been that of voluntary migration, where people have chosen voluntarily to live in another country because of what it offered, because it offered in terms of liberty in terms of opportunity, and all of those things which might not have been left available in the countries of our origin. When we live as minorities, then often

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we asked ourselves, what are the advantages? What are the disadvantages? We have to ask ourselves these questions. One of the disadvantages is that you find yourself under constant pressure to assimilate and become like everyone else around you. That's not an option. That is not an option. Because a Muslim is imbued with a spirit that tells him I have a message for the rest of the world, I have something of value to offer something that has been left to me by my ancestors by the prophet, megalopolis, Peace and mercy be upon him, he came to this world with a message which is of significance University, and when I become assimilated with everyone around me, then I betray that

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particular trust, I am unable to then convey this message and thereby to enrich those that are around me with this particular message in the manner that nations and tribes once upon a time interacted with one another, as the elders have spoken about, we have heard how it has been that people interacted with another one another and that those have been peaceful interactions, meaningful interactions, interactions of mutual enrichment, it is possible to revive an age, it is possible to make the 21st century and age in which civilizations can interact with one another, in a manner that brings about this mutual trust, mutual confidence, mutual enrichment. This is one of the

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ways in which civilization can interact with one another, we do have, the potential is there. And I believe the willingness on all sides of this particular divide, the civilizational divide, it is there. But we do find that there are some hawks, the Hawks would have believed that there's only one way in which civilizations can interact. And that is the clash of civilization that Samuel Huntington has spoken of that very pessimistic worldview, the one that says mankind will always go to war with one another. So it's inevitable that the world of Islam will have to clash with the world of the West and there's going to be this great cataclysmic war, the end of times, well, there

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is a possibility of that. But the extent to which we negotiate the interactions between civilizations will determine whether that does happen in the short term, or it will not happen It is a matter of responsibility is a matter of voluntarily choosing to interact in a way that brings about the mutual interaction. That brings us also to the point of a minority. You know, when you live in the Muslim majority country, then society as a whole automatically steers you in a particular direction. It is like this great river that simply draws you along you do the things that you do. You act in the way that you do. You interact in the way that you do because that is what

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societies around you does, but when you find yourself as a minority

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In such a case, being faithful to your tradition becomes a matter of choice. It's no longer a method that you are simply being coerced into by the society in which you live. In a certain sense, therefore, you are at a disadvantage in a minority because you have to make that choice. in another sense, you have an advantage because someone who did it out of choice is so much more superior to someone that did it because he had no other option. minorities therefore have a unique role to play in the world that lies ahead, this world that we wish that we hope and that we play will become the world of mutual civilizational. And Richmond, minorities have to make the choice that I'm a Muslim,

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I have something to offer, I choose it willingly, not because society brings pleasure to bear upon me. But because I believe that that is my mission in life, we have to choose to do so with not simply we don't have the option of assimilating and casting away everything that we stand for, because in that way, we will not be contributing to the joint building of human civilization, Islam and Muslims have been an A very important, very important factor in the manner in which civilizations have interacted in the past. They are the meeting point, they are the mediating civilization between the ancients of the Greeks and the Romans in the in those that have been before

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that had developed the sciences that had developed the arts have to a certain level, and then came to the natural end of the cycle, because civilizations have a sell by date, and then it comes to an end, nothing goes on forever, and everything is cyclical. And there's a time when it'll come to an end. So at the time when ancient civilization had reached the end of his tether, there was this newly resurgent civilization of Islam and Muslims that took up took on its on its shoulders, the common legacy of mankind the scientific and artistic legacy of mankind, and preserve it for the rest of mankind. So that Europe, which was at that time in the throes of the dark Middle Ages, which was

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undergoing a period of obscurantism, where science and the arts were not being developed at all. Europe could then simply wait during that particular period, until such time that it was ready to become the new carrier of human civilization, the legacy of human civilization, but for that interim Intermediate Period, for that Millennium and a half, it was Whoa, Arab Muslim civilization. And Muslim civilization is so much more than than just add up civilization, but because the Arabic language is what characterizes, it is often referred to as Arabic civilization, but it is farming civilization, comprising of Persians comprising of Indians, comprising of Africans, people of all

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using colors, people of various different languages and shapes, all of them contributed to this particular civilization. It was the one that carried that joint legacy, that common legacy, the times in which we live, it is also therefore a time when this civilization has passed on the burden of human legacy, not a burden. The burden is a privilege, the privilege of human scientific advancement is taken it had developed it further, and then pass it to the new the new kid on the block, so to speak, which was Europe, resurgent Europe arose during the 15th century, 16th century, to great heights, to great heights, it took this scientific and artistic legacy of mankind from the

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Arabs from the Muslims, and developed it further, it developed it further. And then the sciences developed probably like never before very rapidly, very quickly. And he took directions that people hadn't even imagined before he took the legacy of Aristotle and Socrates and have a V center and azaadi and everyone else, and he built upon it, it brought about the Industrial Revolution, it brought about the voyages of discovery, it brought about what we have seen in the 18th century, the 19th century, but it also brought a lot of grief. It also brought a lot of grief in

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colonialism in the First World War in the Second World War, the manner in which science developed during the 20th 20th century, it was a period in which a line that represents human advancement in sciences if it was running a bit flat once upon a time, suddenly, it was running very steeply during the 20th century. Suddenly, we find it in the late 1800s, early 1900s. Down comes along with a certain idea. Thereafter, you'll find the likes of Rutherford and Einstein, and Heisenberg and everyone exploring the mysteries of the atom and reaching levels never before each. But what happens when a civilization is not characterized by a belief in a higher God in a higher power. What happens

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when a civilization does not believe that it has a mission to serve all of mankind, rather than dominate all of mankind? barely have they penetrated the secret started annotating the secrets of the atom. The Atom was used to destroy Hiroshima, Nagasaki, that is where civilization is headed for if we do not, if we do not steer it in the direction that takes cognizance of the existence of art

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About that will definitely call men to responsibility one day.

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So while scientific advancement has been wonderful, the problem with scientific advancement has been that it has led men away from the highest political realities of existence yet upon our existence, these major existential questions when we ask ourselves, who are we? Where have you come from? And where are we headed for? When these questions get answered in a very realistic fashion, when we start telling ourselves, well, it doesn't matter what I am, it doesn't matter, no matter where I come from, eat, drink, and be merry, and conquer and dominate because tomorrow you die. Is that what human civilization is all about? If that's what human civilization is all about, then you'd probably

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have been better to be have been born a flower on and if man has been born, to dominate, to conquer, to oppress, then you'd have been better to have been an inanimate object, but men has not been placed upon this, for that reason. So while scientific advancement has been wonderful, for this will realities, existential truths have been lost. And we as Muslims, together with all people of faith, have a mission for mankind, we have a message for mankind, that as you advance, as you traverse the path of progress scientifically and otherwise, do not forget, do not let that arrogance rise to such a level where you imagine that man is the sum total of everything, man is not the sum total

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everything man serves a higher cause. Man is a servant, he is placed upon this earth as the custodian, he is a shepherd, he has a duty, he has a responsibility. When the shepherd starts regarding himself as the owner of the flock, that's when you start having great havoc. That is what we have witnessed in the past few decades. When man discovers when Newton laid down the rules of physics and became the father of physics, he set down a set of rules, which domain that I can now become the master of the world, becoming the master of the world is not a problem, but then using the same world to dominate and oppress others. That is where the problem comes about. Something

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comes to mind when I speak about Newton,

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at the same time that Isaac Newton was working at Cambridge University in discovering the laws of physics and so on optics and all these other things. At that very same moment, during the very same era.

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In Muslim civilization, there was a person called Mohammed bin Sulaiman Neruda and very few remember his name. Those who are aware of him will probably be people involved in Hadith studies, because he wasn't Mohammed he was a hadith that came from Morocco and came to settle in Makkah and was exiled from there to Syria, and very few if he would know his his life story. But I want to use his life story to demonstrate a certain point, he was not just simply a scholar of Hadith, he was not simply a scholar of prophetic tradition. He was a polymath, he was a master of just about every science. And one of his achievements at that time was this was 500 years ago, he bought a model, a

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astronomical model of two circles to watch according to Globes, made of metal, what markings in such a way, that if you choose the one within the oven in certain way, then you can determine the location of any style and find your direction? He both practically what is

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a kind of a machine a kind of a? What should I call it a galactic GPS, both at the time, 500 years ago, the world doesn't know him. Despite the advanced nature of his discovery of what he had invented of his invention, the world doesn't know him. On the other hand, Newton, Pascal and others in the West had the discoveries and everyone recognizes them as the father of the sciences. What is the difference between these two, a person on the one hand, making this great invention person other than an equally great invention, the world recognizes the one the world forgets about the other. The difference is that the one was part of a civilization whose sun was setting, the other was part of a

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civilization or sun was rising. History is cyclical by nature. So if you're part of the setting, you know, I'm starting to use the ticket kind of thing again, I used it the other day, but it's good to demonstrate things these days. So that we can see they can get together except to speak about cricket. But if you if you bet the way, you know, in the tail end, and you're just trying to make things happen, you blast things all around, you still part of a losing team. You might score a century, so part of losing team. Mohammadi was ramanagara Danny was backing in he was coding and simples injury. He was part of a losing team, his son had said, the world could know him, I believe,

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Allahu Allah, Allah knows better. I believe that the time has come where the wheel is turning the other way around. It has come full circle around and we are in sha Allah once again part of a winning team. We are once again part of a nation resurgence, but the nation and oma that has to learn not to make the same mistakes of those before us. If we are part of a newly researching team, then we need to take our youth and steer them in the direction to become the Einsteins and the Newton's of tomorrow, but not to allow the message to become so distorted as to become

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has to be represented in the cloud that hangs over Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Science must not be used to that those machines, if there is going to be a civilization that is going to advance from here onwards lead this civilization be a benign a human civilization, that is the ultimate gift that we can give the world that is the manner in which can come back to the origin of civilizations interacting in a manner that allows for mutual enrichment and advancement, that it also be a kind of interaction whereby sight is never lost of the existence of a divine creator, who has placed man upon has given him whatever he has required to find his way in his darkness of this world. And

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remember that there is an exit point and an exit point, everything does not come to an end, everything does not come to an end. It's only upon death, only upon the destruction, eventual termination of this earth, that our real existence will begin that is our message as Muslims to this role. That is the thought that I leave you with? Was Allah, Allah, Allah says, No, Mohammed,

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I'll open the floor to questions.

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Once a violation.

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Thank you.

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What an honor to hear such

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a more sophisticated. And it gives me great hope for the future for all all human beings, all the glory, as the

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mind is close to the goal.

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And with this, there, something you said and it reminded me of after my boss told me that

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he talked about

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that particular event

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that he didn't hear of the basically,

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in my grandfather's language, when he talks about is an our word for.

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So

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there are some things

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for another time

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arises. So it makes me think that there are so many things that

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God has chosen.

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Because we, as a human civilization, have not risen to the level of

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the heights, that we need to

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take the point

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about the point of the excellence of humanity, that we cannot be

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the soul and the heart. So I temporarily heart from what you say, and I believe that we still get hurt before the angel blows the trumpet.

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Thank you.

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I don't think there is anything I can say to that. My inspiration originally came from Auntie Deborah. And that was just another inspiration. Thank you very much for that. I think that that kind of synergy that we have generated here in this kind of synergy could be replicated in so many other forums. I think that mankind definitely has reason to be optimistic. If people have optimism come together, interact with one another, then I don't think we'll see the kind of random running battles in the state of civilization that are that's happening out there. We do live in a world that is self destructing. We do live in a world that is destroying itself. But we have I believe the maturity to

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take the problem on by the horns and give a solution that will preserve this will preserve mankind and lead it to the ultimate realities White has been created to recognize its role is created and waited for

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to

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it is always

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expected to

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fail.

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To come from a position of superiority, or to dominance tend to have this kind of approach

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to those kinds of those types.

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would say that if that means it ought to dominate if domination means domination in the manner that others have dominated, then I'd rather be at the bottom, I'd rather be at the bottom then replace another human being. But I think there's a reason why, why Allah allows history to unfold in cycles. History is allowed to unfold in cycles, were the one that you have the top another view at the bottom. If it had been Islam alone had been meant to remain triumphant above everyone else, then perhaps we would have become the worst of a crisis. And I'm sure that in our 1000 years of domination, we wouldn't always the best of dominators No, we had our fair share of transgressions as

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well. And therefore we are taught this particular lesson that a time will come when you will find yourself once again at the bottom, think, look at the Hadith about NaVi salatu salam, better al Islam, or even Islam started out as this stranger stranger who welcomes in no one knows him, he's not welcomed into the inner circle. And then we'll come a time when there will be great domination. And then once a year old or even komaba. Again, there will come a time when he'll be the outsider when he'll be the stranger. And at that time, he needs to find it within himself. To know that the message, the mission that he has been entrusted with does not flow through the barrel of a gun, it

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does not flow on the edge of a sword, the mission can be fulfilled, the message can be conveyed under all circumstances. And there's a hadith that I started off by saying that no matter where you are, you can do what you need to do. So right now, I believe that our mission is let's work from the bottom up, if we eventually come to a position, where you are once upon a time, you know, at the head of world civilization, then we need to learn not to make the same mistakes, because this is why history is about one fifth on the history of what material can Yamanaka we do have the days which we turn which we bring about cyclic elements people says Allah is brought about in this way that the

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the one at the top must realize that I should not commit the mistake of the one before me. And if I had committed and I went down to the bottom, then I know that if my time comes in I sunrises once again, I should not go back to the kind of mistakes that I have made once upon a time. So if it means that we have to become dominant by trampling upon trampling upon others, trampling upon rice contaminations, then no thank you. That's not what we are here for. We believe our profit came from, for a reason. And the Quran explicit, most beautiful iwama or serenata. In mutton, Milani, he came as a mercy, not to a Muslim, not to the Arabs, to all, not even all of mankind, all things in

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existence, a mercy. And it is to take that mercy and spread it out as far and wide as possible. That is our mission. That is our message that we have for the world. So if we are going to, if we're going to spread the message of mercy through the barrel of a gun, I don't think that's mercy. I think that is the corruption of the essential message. And I believe that that is why the period of our being dominated has come about in order that we can discover how not to make those same mistakes, but martyred, we definitely will, for the sake not only of ourselves for the sake of mankind, because we have something to contribute.

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Which is

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at the point of

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definitely, Islam spread most certainly. And the sword, we cannot claim that the sword played no role in conquest whatsoever, cannot claim that we but conversion is a different method for Islam to politically geographically split from various different parts.

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If we deny the fact that Islam militarily spread out of the Arabian Peninsula, and militarily came to dominate the areas of Syria, and Asia and then off into Central Asia and into eastern into Northern Africa, I think we've been very blind and we've been disingenuous, if you say those were not armies that went those particular parts of the world. We cannot deny that. But the conversion of the local people of Islam, how did that come about? That is where the limits are.

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said, back then civilizations, there was only one way to interact with one another. The defective state of coexistence was one of war. Dr. Mohammed Abdullah spoke yesterday about the difference between the dar will have been adapted Islam etc. In our classical literature, in the classical literature of just about any civilization with a legal legacy, the de facto assumption was that we are at war with the next state, ultimately, that war. It was only now very recently, in the 20th century that we had the League of Nations and the United Nations, international treaties, not individual treaties between nations, but international treaties, whereby 50 to 70 different nations

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will sign the same declaration that brought about a de facto state of peace. And obviously, the war. Nations also felt that for their own survival, if I don't, militarily vanquish my enemy, other side is going to vanquish me, it was a time of eat or be eaten. So in that sense, spreading out beyond the Arabian Peninsula was an act of military intervention. Yes, but was the local population converted by force, that very little evidence of that can be given, if any, I think the best example they have will be not too far from here, Indonesia, the most populous Muslim state,

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not a single army ever when they are a single army. When they a few traders, a few missionaries spread over those islands live the certain life, people thought they were like, and they became the most populous Muslim country in the world. So, the conversion, the Dawa, as such, the spreading of the message does not depend upon a sword or a gun or anything like that. It it can happen in any particular fashion. And I think it is lovely for to ask in this belated 20th 20th and early 21st century to discover the means or

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rediscover the means father of spreading the message without any military intervention. So yes, there had been and that was the world back then. There had been military incursions, excursions, whatever you want to call it had been that, but it was not at the edge of the sort of the local populations were forced into Islam as such, has that been the case, we wouldn't have found a sizable minority of Coptic Christians in Egypt wouldn't find all of those, what we call them Syriac Orthodox Christians in in the lands of Syria, the Syrian Orthodox Church in In fact, interestingly enough, at the time when the when the Roman Catholic tradition was busy opressing the eastern churches, it was

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those Eastern churches that Welcome to Egypt as a liquidator because of the internal divisions that they have. I had opportunity to speak about that earlier somewhere else. But I wouldn't quite repeat that now. So Had it been a matter of convert or die, the Guna had all of these minorities still living in those countries and a deeper reading and you don't have to go very deep, just about a cursory reading of the manner in which Islam was paid in the east. That will give a very clear indication that conversion at the point of assault

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is not a matter of simply did not happen, cannot happen in Islam is not permitted.

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We as

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Australia are one that we have to go to this That's correct,

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which is a virtuous quality, but also you have to be pragmatic.

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There is in trying to formulate an identity and Australians to market

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often we find young men and women

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find themselves in conflict when it comes to culture. What

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does this allow the adoption of certain cultural norms

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without beginning to feel a sense of guilt, that one has permitted a form of Apostasy

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without

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a sense of

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identity because he's adopted certain norms and values from his host culture.

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being influenced by the culture around you is an inevitable thing. It's an inevitable thing is in the same manner as the sand on the beaches get wet, when the when the waves leopard it is inevitable it can happen. However, when we look at it, the ease the other side with that we have to maintain the kernel, the core orthodoxy. How possible that is I think it is very possible it has been proven over and over. But in terms of a checklist of what should be done, what should not be done. I think there are certain things that are not open to compromise. And then there are certain areas where Sherry has left a very wide and vast open space for interaction.

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For acculturation can be, as long as that does not encroach upon the area that is textually said to be, what should I call it now immutable, there are certain things, if a Muslim, for example, to use a very, very mundane kind of example, if a Muslim finds that he lives in a society that consumes a lot of alcohol, and he decides, well, then I'm also going to consume, that is not an area that is admissible, that cannot be done, because that is one of the core prohibitions that is not permitted. A Muslim by nature is someone who believes that I have a set of laws that apply to me those laws govern not simply my conduct, but it seeks to govern my entire life in order to thereby determine my

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eligibility and worthiness for entry into into God's pleasure. So, once you understand that, that way, he needs to understand that when acculturation and things like that occur, there is a certain area where you can occur in a certain area, when it cannot occur, the lines need to then be drawn very clearly that will be a process of education, education is indispensable in this regard, he needs to know after he knows then it becomes a matter of choice, when it becomes a matter of choice. That is where ultimately, as we say, the boys will be separated from the men in a situation such as this, be prepared to have some losses inevitable this guy's gonna have to be some losses. the very

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earliest example there are before the migration to before the migration to Medina, there was a migration to Estonia. And in the migration, there was India, there was assimilation to a very small degree and acculturation that had occurred. One of the persons in there was already to live in Jackson, the first cousin of all prophets of Allah Islam, the first husband of

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Habiba,

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ohana. And while living in Amazonia, he had become attracted to the life to the culture to the religion and converted, that does happen, it is inevitable that in societies such as this, in situations such as this, there will be a few electrons lost to the other molecule on the other side, that is inevitable, it will happen, that needs to be minimized. However, when one wishes that you can simply negate it and wish it away, but a process of education, a process of instilling certain values, a process of building an identity that takes pride in itself and understands its mission, that process will minimize the loss of elements and electrons on the outside of this particular

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orbit, and keep the nucleus intact. That's what I believe is all that we can learn. Because what we cannot do is to enforce, there come a time of choice. And that choice, we hope that the choices that our upcoming generation like will be life choices, but be prepared, when it when the wrong choice is made, be prepared for some grief in that particular regard.

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What needs to be done thereafter, when there's going to be a remedial kind of action, whatever needs to happen, it is a matter of heartbreak, extreme and very, very deep grief occurs at such instances. But those are the things that we learn in the world today. And it's not a matter of being a minority, because the entire world is shrunken into global village, what happens on the streets of Los Angeles can be seen, you know, from any vantage point in the world. So that kind of exposure to a different way of life is no longer restricted to the situation where we physically live next to one another, we in a certain sense, we do live next to one another via the media. So this kind of

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thing is bound to happen more and more, it's bound to happen. We wish that we can minimize it. But these are the responsible kind of steps that we can take towards doing that

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ruling couple of days, having to speak many, many

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promises and

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respecting the fact that he doesn't

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deserve

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to be lost.

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To share, I'm just talking a little bit of advice to

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most

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people.

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A lot of times they have problems with their family.

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Also,

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we don't want to give up everything.

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Some culture that we've come across, quite often with the highest

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values.

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community, you have to now be out or you have to be pet or you have to be I don't think that's right. And I think that we are words of wisdom from you. When someone says something good.

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They should not feel pressure to be perfect. Five minutes, even with regards to prayer, it's very difficult.

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To now all of a sudden, rearrange your life. And sometimes

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my

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friends and family, it can be embarrassing to say, it's time to make that time. And then they feel guilty

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to grow in

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another area. And it is it's not very easy to actually delineate those particular dividing lines as to what the long way, but in a general sense, we speak about them, then there's a certain area where no one has a right to point the finger at one another because the Sharia is wide and open ended and those things it allows for such kind of interactions. Interestingly, one of the wives of a lot of Southern Muslim Jewish origin she was from Jewish origins, she was the daughter of a chieftain a favor. What kind of relationship did she continue having with a Jewish relatives sister lived in playboy thereafter, when just before she died, she made a walk one of the early forms of what

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endowment trust in mortmain, that the lawyers would speak of endowment, she made an endowment and the beneficiaries of endowment were her Jewish relatives. And you know what advice she gave him, say, my son, you're gonna become Muslim, please become a good Muslim, please become a good Muslim. recognition of the fact that there's goodness in Islam, my son, by all means go. Now, a mother that has given a son that advice does he shun her tomorrow that cannot happen is something which I find very, very disappointing in our or shall I call them born Muslims. The moment we come face to face with a person who entered Islam not too long ago, we become perfect super Muslims who pontificate to

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others that do this and do that and don't know the other, as if we have been doing it all along.

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That is a weakness in our own side, I think and I've discovered in my interactions, people like this, people who have speaking about those who have entered an MMA fight and become part of this particular brotherhood, we have more to learn from them than what we get with what we sometimes imagine a person who discovered Islam through our own investigation and own discovery, I think has greater depth has greater profundity than one was simply born into the faith. Having said that, having said that, the the immutable aspects have been will remain the immutable aspects of the that is divine, we cannot compromise on that, those areas, which are open to acculturation which are open

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to adoption and so on, no one has the right to close the door which Allah is open and in the in the in the middle, they will be that particular area, we temporarily for the sake of the difficulty that that particular person happens to experience in a temporary window can be open in order to allow for a climatization to new conditions. Eventually, the person is part of a new tradition, but a new tradition that is inshallah God willing, mature enough to understand that you do need that particular space for a little while.

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smilla Alhamdulillah wa salatu salam ala, that's not part of the program. I'm not meant to be standing here, but such as Dr. alley.

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First and foremost, our gratitude is extended to Allah subhanho wa Taala, low and mighty for allowing us and giving us this wonderful opportunity to be present, not only in the presence of two most wonderful scholars, but also in the presence of brothers and sisters. And also, we are indeed very honored to have our Aboriginal brothers and sisters with us. Thank you so much for giving us your time. And thank you so much for being here for sharing your wisdom with us. And I do hope wholeheartedly on my behalf on behalf of the Muslim community and our emails to enhance this relationship and to open doors of dialogue and doors of understanding between our culture and our

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people and your culture and your people. I'm very excited with the prospect of this type of engagement. And I hope that we can do it wisely. And that we can do it efficiently in a way that that is respectful to both your culture and our culture inshallah God willing. And I'm also grateful for the opportunity to stand before two eminent scholars Professor zelie her and of course our dear respected chef Baja. The interesting thing is that for both of them this is their first visit to Brisbane, Australia and in the presence of all of you they one of them at least committed to come back and that his progress is really happy. And I'm sure also she has no choice but he will have to

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come back inshallah Tada. So really we have we have been overwhelmed by your kindness and generosity and with your depth of knowledge and wisdom and we hope to continue this engagement inshallah Tada. When revival was established by a group of Australians brothers and sisters, Imams and scholars, academics and Nantucket

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Makes, the idea was to raise the bar, if you like for Muslims, to raise the level of engagement and the discourse about Islam, as we said in a polite, beautiful manner. And we have, we want to do this through engagement with wonderful people like yourselves, people who are well grounded in the tradition of Islam, but also have what Muslim scholars called

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the jurisprudence of reality or understanding the context and understanding the time understanding the reality of the world as we live in it. And it's not often that you will get a scholar who is well trained in the traditional science has mastered the traditional sciences, as Jeff Baha, who has also an overwhelming in depth of an experience about the world that we live in, to speak about history and science and civilization and the Greeks and Aristotle and Ptolemy, and those things, and at the same time, Quran and Hadith, and to bring it all together cohesively in a context that we can understand is a most wonderful gift. We ask Allah subhana wa tada to put Baraka in your effort in

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both of your efforts and to give us all the tofield to continue to serve the cause of humanity for the sake of Allah subhanho wa Taala with these words, I thank you all. Brothers and sisters, our dear guests. What an ode for coming and sharing this night with us.

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Mariela subhana wa tada bless your steps and bless your wealth and your health and your time.