Intellectual Seerah Part 9 – Isra and Miraj (The Night Journey)
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Channel: Mohammed Hijab
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AI Generated Summary ©
The speakers explore various topics related to the Prophet Muhammad sallam campaigns, including the church's actions and interactions with the prophets, citing the Quranic concepts, and the potential for "hasn't been" to affect people in a different way. They also explore the concept of "quarantine" as a way to avoid failure and discuss the origins of the term "harvest" and its significance in context of the discussion.AI Generated Transcript ©
Salam Alaikum Warahmatullahi Wabarakatuh How're you guys doing? You're welcome to the ninth session, where we're going to be discussing the life of the greatest man who ever lived. The most influential man who ever lived the Prophet Muhammad sallallahu alayhi wa sallam. And indeed today we're going to be covering probably one of the most spectacular events that's ever happened in human history, but certainly happened to the Prophet Muhammad sallallahu alayhi wa sallam himself, which was Alyssa Well, Mirage, which is we're going to be translating exactly what these words means, but effectively, is a night journey that the Prophet Muhammad Sallallahu wasallam experienced. And this
is a very important thing, not least, because actually, in the new atheist movement, I've seen this many of you have seen this as well, I'm sure many people actually use this as a point to ridicule the Prophet Muhammad Salah Salem, and attack the religion of Islam, we're going to be looking at today, some of the key moments in that in that particular incident. So just some key words that I think we need to cover before we continue is the words Ellison that we manage. So at least it means a night journey, this is what the word means. And manage means elevation, and Mirage. And these verses are these words are mentioned in the Quran.
So look, I mean, when you look at the Hadith relating to Aristotle, Maharaj, there's actually a lot of Hadees, relating to any sort of Maharaj. However, when we're talking about the authentic Hadees, from them, there are not that many at all, which is actually quite interesting. When you as as a whole, there's a lot of heavies, but the absolutely authentic ones is a handful, maybe a dozen, maybe more than a dozen, more than a dozen for sure. Or a few couple of dozen, you know, Hadees that we're talking about here, which you could say authentic, and then obviously you have repetition of those hobbies, and so on. Probably one of the most extensive of those hadith is this one here, which
I've put all in English. You can see here, the long Hadith and this isn't Buhari. So, before we continue, maybe we can have Othman read that long Hadith for us to get his an our juices flowing. Go ahead.
So narrated Malik been salsa,
salsa, and the Prophet sallallahu alayhi wa sallam said, while I was at the house, in the state of midway between sleep and wakefulness, an angel recognized me, as the man lying between two men, a golden tray full of wisdom and belief was brought to me and my body was cut open from the throat, to the lower part of the abdomen and dead right before you continue. There's two ways on this.
Two parts of versus the golden tray was full of wisdom, wisdom. There's another narration which says full of zamzam. And what does this remind you of quickly?
What incidentally, is this similar to that we've already covered? cleansing? Yeah. And this happened when the Prophet SAW Salem was how do you remember, he was six years old. So when he was when he was a boy we spoke about at length. So if those who we spoke about even the scientific aspects of the heart and the neurology and all that kind of stuff, the neurons in the heart and the heart and the brain and all that. So for those who have missed that they can go to that I think there's a third session where we spoke about that, so I'll continue with my
lower part of my abdomen and then my abdomen was washed with Zamzam water, and my heart was filled with wisdom and belief. Al Barak, a white animal smaller than a mule, and bigger than a donkey was brought to me and I set out with Gabriel. When I reached the nearest heaven, Gabriel said to the heaven gatekeeper, open the gate, the gatekeeper asked, Who is it? He said, Gabriel, the gatekeeper, who is a company who is accompanying you, Gabriel said, Muhammad, the gatekeeper said, Has he been called? Gabriel said yes. Then it was said, he is welcomed. What a wonderful visit his is. Then I met Adam and greeted him and he said, you are welcomed Olson and the Prophet. Then we ascended to
the second heaven. It was asked, Who is it? Gabriel said, Gabriel. It was said, who is with you? He said, Muhammad, it was asked, Has he been sent for? He said, Yes. It was said he is welcomed. What a wonderful visit his is that I met Jesus and Yahia who said you are welcomed, oh brother and a prophet. Then we ascended to the third heaven. It was asked
Who is it? Gabriel said, Gabriel. It was asked who is with you? Gabriel said Mohamed. It was asked, Has he been sent for? Yes, so Gabriel, he is welcomed. What a wonderful visit his, the Prophet sallallahu alayhi wa sallam added, there I met Joseph and greeted him and he replied, you are welcomed old brother and a prophet. Then we ascended to the fourth heaven. And again, the same questions and answers were exchanged, as in the previous heavens. Then I met Idris and greeted him. He said, you are welcomed, Oh, brother and prophet. Then we ascended to the fifth heaven. And again, the same questions and answers were exchange, as in exchange, as in previous heavens. There I met
and greeted Aaron, who said, You're welcomed, Oh, brother and a prophet. Then we ascended to the sixth heaven, and again, the same questions and answers were exchanged, as in the previous heavens. There I met, I met and greeted Moses who said, you are welcomed or brother and a prophet. When I proceeded on, he started weeping and On being asked why he was weeping. He said, Oh, Lord, followers of this youth, who was sent after me, will enter paradise in greater number than my followers. Speaking now, Musa
then we ascended to the seventh heaven, and again, the same questions and answers were exchanged, as in the previous heavens, there I met and greeted Abraham who said, You're welcomed, Oh, son, and a prophet. Then I was shown a bait more. I lost house. I asked Gabriel about it. And he said, This is Al Bayt Allah Muhammad, where 70,000 Angels perform prayers daily, and when they leave, they never returned to it. But always a fresh batch comes into it daily. Then I was shown cedrat monta
a tree in the seventh heaven. And I saw its nub fruits, which resembled the clay jugs of hunger, which was a town in Arabia, and its leaves were like the ears of elephants and four rivers originated at its root. Two of them were apparent and two were hidden. I asked Gabriel about those rivers and he said, the two hidden rivers are in paradise. And the apparent ones are the Nile and the Euphrates. Then 50 prayers were enjoined on me. I descended till I met Moses who asked me, What have you done? I said, 50 prayers have been enjoined on me. He said, I know the people better than you. Because I had the hardest experience to bring Bani Israel to obedience. Your followers cannot
put up with such obligations. So return to your Lord and request him to reduce the numbers of prayers. I returned, and then I returned and requested a law for reduction, and he made it 40 I returned and met Moses and had a similar discussion, and then returned again to allow for reduction and he made it 30 Then 20, then 10. And then I came to Moses, who repeated the same advice. Ultimately, Allah reduced it to five,
reduce it to five. When I came to Moses, again, he said, What have you done? I said, Allah has made it to five only. He repeated the same advice, but I said that I surrendered to Allah's final order. Unless messenger sallallahu alayhi wa sallam was addressed by Allah, I have decreed my obligation and have reduced the burden on my slaves, and I shall reward a single good deed as if it were 10 Good deeds. That's right now just read the next Hadith as well whilst you're at it, so I can speak about the whole thing to go in the next
slide. So, in Sahih, Muslim 172, it is narrated, that I found myself among the group of the prophets and the time for prayer came, so I lead them in prayer, according to a report narrated by Ibn Jerry debris in his tafsir 17, free fringe and 42. Then we went on until we came to bait al mock this in Jerusalem, where I lead the prophets and messengers in prayer. Even cathedra said the correct view is that he only met with them in the heavens. Then he came back down to beta like this and they accompanied him and he led them in prayer then then he rolled an old Baroque and returned to Makkah. Okay, so there's a lot going on here. So let's describe it maybe in a bit more in a bit more detail
on that in more detail, but try and break it down. So there was two journeys, okay, there was two journeys, says one to Jerusalem, as we've discussed, or as you saw that in the in the previous Hadith, and then one up
to the heavens. And in both of those journeys, different Muhammad wa salam had interactions with the prophets. And we'll see as we continue the slides, not only did he have interactions with the prophets, but he also saw
people in heaven and hell. Now we're gonna discuss how this could be the case, because there's two issues here that we need to kind of look at. Number one, we need to look at what is the Quranic cosmology? Meaning how does this make sense? What's going on here? How is this working?
We can even try and correlate this with modern day physics. And that's why Shamir should have been here today, because he's really should go on the phone or something. He's our physics guy.
And then we also need to speak about chronology and time. Because there's a question that can be asked is that when the Prophet Muhammad wa salam, okay, as we'll come to see, there's many narration saying that he saw people in heaven and saw people in hellfire. How can they be people in heaven? And how can there be people in the Hellfire if they have judgment hasn't taken place yet?
Do you see the question when you go into how can you see anyone there? And obviously there's a classical response to this is that he didn't actually see the people there. That was he saw kind of like a representation of the people there. And but we're going to investigate that in a bit more critical detail, since this is the intellectual Syrah. So that's the first thing in terms of the Buraq. And this whole journey. And let's think about this for a second.
I'll say first and foremost, I remember a discussion with Richard Dawkins and Mehdi Hasan, I'm not sure if any of you have seen it. And of all the things he could have cited, I mean, Richard Dawkins, is sitting down. And as soon as Monday, Hassan and he said, Look, do you believe what he said?
He said, Do you believe that your Prophet went on a winged horse? And you flew in the heavens? Okay.
And then Maddie has some roots resulted in a kind of kind of tentative ways. Like, I believe in miracles. He didn't want to say yes to that, because it's want to put his neck on the chopping board. And then and obviously, we should have pushed him on that. So there's this is how can you believe that?
And basically saying, kind of incredulity,
impossible. credulity meaning like, it's amazing how this could be the case. It's not something which is likely yes.
How can a man of the 21st century believe even something like this? So let's investigate that for a second.
First of all, it's not a horse.
If they read it properly, it said, it's not as big as a holes, and it's not as small as a donkey somewhere in between.
So this is not a creature, we have access to this Borak. So it's not something we can go ahead and analyze. Because, as scientists should be asking the question, what is the point of falsification? Okay, so if I want to say something is wrong,
then I have to say, Okay, what is wrong because it's against this law, or it's against this fact. At this point, there's no falsification going on. There's only incredulity. And many of you will know, there's a fallacy called the fallacy of incredulity, the fallacy of incredulity say, I can't believe this could be the case. Therefore, it's not the case. You see.
He said something like the 21st century is very interesting, because let's assume something for a second, we're in the 21st century, right? There's many things that we have seen that people in history have never seen before.
You agree, right. The camera that's recording me
is something this mobile phone. Now they have like, as hologram technology, effectively. I mean, I've went to certain places. I think it was an Heathrow Airport. And it was a woman that just came out of nowhere. And can What the hell is it and it was a hole, it was a hologram. I don't know if any of you guys saw saw this. But there's, there's now hologram technology, like you've seen it. Maybe maybe in the next five years, your phone will have a hologram attached to it. Maybe the iPhone 20 is gonna have some hologram that comes out of it right. Nowadays, I mean, you've seen the neuro link, which is a shocking, development, development technology, right? They've tried on a pig. Where
you can you can effectively, I mean, the development of this is where you can walk, you can put memories on a computer. That's what the effect is. It's not impossible to think that in our lifetimes, that there can be some technology, it can be installed into your brain, which can download thoughts, images, and put it on a device. That's not an impossibility to believe that. In fact, we're closer now to believing that than any other time in human history. Nowadays, like for example, UCM I've seen a meta have this thing where you put the goggles on and it's like, what's it called the thing VR
This is meta universal mutual. I suppose the thing was the metaverse, and they're buying land in this Metaverse and all this kind of stuff. And maybe they have a relationship there as well. multiple wives, multiple whatever. They don't even need to do the contract maybe because they consider it to be isn't that's not human being right? Can Do we want.
This is the life that we're living right now. Now, let me just say this, okay? Imagine the following. Imagine if I took my phone using your phone somehow. And we've already spoken about time travel that it can and we'll talk about that a bit more. But somehow we can go into the past. Although it seems a logical impossibility to go into the past going into the future is different. They've made films about interstellar being the main one really in the in the last 50 years.
But going into the past,
if we took our stuff with us, and we went into the past, okay, took our phones and stuff. And we showed the seventh century man, this is what we've got.
Okay.
We've got phone, we've got car, we've got this Lamborghini, we've got this. I don't know Bugatti Veyron. We've got we can go from here to the Bugatti Veyron like a rock. I mean, effectively, how long does it take really to get?
If there was one road? And like, from from Jerusalem to Mecca? How long will it take? As fast as you can on account? Maybe we'll do I don't know, how long will it take? You can check on Google Maps. But on a plane, how long will it take two, three hours, maximum two hours, two and a half hours? You're lucky. I mean, if you showed an ancient man, a plane, even a train, if you showed him a mobile phone, he'll think as well.
He'll think it's magic immediately.
You'll think it's magic. Today's magic. Today's technology is yesterday's magic. If you bring to this technology go yesterday, it becomes magic immediately. No one believes them. They'll even doubt their own sanity.
If you even told them of a possibility. Like if you went to the seventh century man or eighth century Metalizer. And you told them of the possibility that there can be this, these machines that can get you from Australia to this. And that way, that way, you can see this person holograms, and even synthetic drugs that you take that can put you into a different state, they'll say this isn't they'll 100% say this, and many of them will deny its possibility.
What I'm saying too, is that we're in a place in human history, where it's the easiest time to believe in these kinds of things, not least because the equivalent of the rock has almost been discovered.
Actually, the equivalent of the Baroque has almost been created, frankly.
There's nothing special about the Baroque city.
I mean, there is in one sense, okay, yes.
Slightly with that, I know it's unlikely for people to believe a subsidiary man, what's up, it's no philosophical impossibility, there's a probability atheists believe is something that's it's contradictory. It's impossible, because I find that weird from his aspect where he makes the belief exists was actually in any world is impossible. If you if you had the same parameters and use quantum physics language, they'll believe much more than that, like, you know, like, sorry to say, like, you know, in quantum physics language, right? Have you guys seen the double slit experiment? If you look at it, and if you don't, yeah, the observer effect and not the observer effect and the
particle in the wave? And if you if you ever have time to see something, which is bizarre, like, it defies scientific norms fully. Like, if you look at it, like I said, the observer effect, if you look at it, it does this. And if you don't look at it, it doesn't do this. So they call it the observer effect. What is me looking at something got to do with this effect.
This is the language that is being used in quantum physics today. One particle in two places at the same time, you have something going through something, you might as well call it Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone. I mean, that's what you might as well call it I mean, quantum physics is effectively Harry Potter and the Philosopher's. In fact, Harry Potter, the Philosopher's Stone is more coherent
than quantum physics, because because it doesn't contain contradictions. Whereas with quantum physics, you have these contradictions going on. And that's why they want to they find, and then they use this term, almost half seriously. A Theory of Everything, right? But the point is, is that when you when we say, Okay, well, God is all knowing, all powerful, all wise, we have this deity called God who's managing the universe. And he took his slave who took a human being from one port part of the universe and transported him to another part of the universe, and came back. I don't see the incredulity on that to be honest with you, Richard, tell me what, tell me where the
contradiction is, Richard.
This is the question you have to answer my query. Where is the contradiction in that notion?
Your scientists, right? So instead of telling me this is that because if you had the incredulity
You behavior and apply that to quantum physicists. they'd laugh you out of the classroom. they'd laugh, you're out of the laboratory. Like even when I was in University of Oxford, right, and I was speaking to a lot of the academics about what it was, even if you mentioned the word Richard Dawkins, there's an eye rolling effect. Like, you know, this guy, he's a he's an ideologue. He's a demagogue. He's a, he's a what do you call it? dogmatic man.
But but the attitude, the Richard Dawkins attitude permeates the minds of the week.
So the question we have to ask ourselves, so can we've heard the story?
Or those who attack this story?
is simple, which is where is the contradiction? Okay.
I think part of the issue is he's trying to judge it from his paradigm. So he doesn't believe in God, he thinks, you know, sciences consistent what he was before it will be in the future. And then he sees it as like, Oh, this is not going to work because it conflicts conflicts with my paradigm. He's not really looking at it. Okay. And the Islamic paradigm, there is a God, and God created the laws of science, therefore, he can break it, like, you know, like, so this is where it doesn't have it's not logically, here's the question, Does this break the laws of science? Because I know this, I know, this sounds like,
you know, maybe I'm pushing you here, but let me explain.
The Brock is an animal, okay. It's not the bullock who took the Prophet Muhammad wa salam all the way up.
In fact, it wasn't even the angel Jibreel because there were times in the hadith of orange tabby, is used in a passive sense, where like, there's this discussion among the scholars.
Did the angel Gabriel take him up beyond the sixth? And Seventh Heaven? Yeah. So there are because there's one Hadith that says that I was elevated. So it's using the passive authority to be using the passive Memnon module and the passive sense. So some say that, even Gibreel didn't facilitate all of that, right. So effectively as Jubilee facilitators, some of it was the
pilot. Yeah, it was a guide. But Allah subhanaw taala, directly managed the process of him moving from heaven to heaven. It wasn't the warlock that was managing that process. Barak was more from from geographic location to geographic location. So
definitely agree. But this is where like, if I'm Islamically, there is no contradiction in this paradigm. But this is where like, the response to an atheist would be, you believe that consciousness came out of particles that lack consciousness. So even if we were to accept your paradigm and the fundamentals of your pirate paradigm, there is a contradiction here, which is how can consciousness come about? Without God, basically? Yeah, like, the argument of consciousness is I wouldn't link it directly. Because, look, I mean, even here, you've got you've got one a materialist paradigm. Yeah. I'm saying even on a materialist paradigm, what's happening here, like the movement
is not incredulous. Not impossible to believe. Because if we're talking about the speed of light, if something's moving at the speed of light from one place, or beyond faster than the speed of light, you know, it's what contradiction is being mentioned. So unless they're able to bring something even from their own paradigm, I'm being very charitable to them say, okay, even from your own paradigm, I'm not even telling you to be a dualist, an idealist here. I'm saying even from your own paradigm, where's the contradiction as a as a methodological materialist? Right. But going to another point here, which is the following, right.
In fact, before I go to that point, I think we should just quickly look at the map. So this is I got this from our website. I don't know what that is. But it just gives you an idea of kind of where things are moving. Can you see like, you know,
it's, this is this and they say the 27th of Raja, but we don't know for sure. Because there's nothing that is authentic. That tells us when that took place.
I was gonna say
this is obviously without goes without saying, part of the reason why we believe that
while Jerusalem is extremely important to us, it was actually this reason I mean, this is the this is the main thing that happened, apart apart what we're seeing now with Gaza and all that kind of thing and Jerusalem and why Jerusalem is the most, I mean, in many ways, the most valuable land to the most, the biggest number of people in the world. Obviously, for us, the most valuable land is Mecca, Medina as Muslims, but to the Christians and the Jews and the Muslims. Jerusalem is the center of everything right. And this is where it all started. This is where it all started from this Alyssa on Maharaj journey. Now the question is
posed
First. Yeah, that as well, of course, yeah, so it was the first Kibler before
before that, but I was gonna say to you that the question begs itself now, which is, well, the product I sold, I'm happy, led all these profits in prayer. Okay. And he had interactions with all these profits.
So how can you have in this gonna sound like a basic question, but let's just put out there. How can you have interaction with prophets who are buried in debt? I mean, what did they were they raised when there was better life. I mean, that's what's going on here is Ali Salaam. So what? How did he because he's meant to be still alive. So how does the dynamic work here? How, what was it? What's going on here? So the way to answer this question is to say,
Allah knows best how it happened, but they are alive in Heidelberg, haha, we know that every single person when they die, they're alive in another
realm. And this is called the highest, the higher. And maybe it's important for us to explain this handlebars here. The Prophet Muhammad wa sallam told us, yes, he told us that
sleep is the brother in some Heidi's the sister, but this is the brother of death, asleep is the brother of death. And if you consider this for a second, I mean, what happens when you sleep?
Your consciousness is lost, you lose consciousness. Okay. But once you've lost consciousness, but you continue existing, and you still see visual things like these are called dreams. I mean, everyone can attest to that.
So if you lose consciousness, the only experience that we have when we lose consciousness is the experience of being in another world and experience a different reality. And that is when we're dreaming.
We have never had an experience of being out of existence, when we're losing consciousness out of existence in the full sense. That's never been what we have.
Now, if it was possible, for us to continue living, going to your point right about materialism, and problem of hard problem of consciousness,
then we could be immortal quite easily on the materialist paradigm, how all you need to do is download my DNA, my memories, and put it onto a computer. And then when I die, I like press play, or whatever I have to press. And I can just continue living in the computer. But the problem is, is that the computer doesn't have what you refer to as first person subjective experiences. The computer can have a love for real, it can never get angry for real, it can ever feel for real. You can ever have those interpersonal experiences. And so immortality has been a problem that humankind has never been able to solve, and will never be able to solve, because of the consciousness problem.
But if it's the case, that effectively, the only thing that we can have is a relationship with our DNA and information through a third person experience.
And therefore, we will never be able to tap into the first person experience and a subjective experience and the I feel experience, then we still have to ask the question, how when we lose consciousness, are we still in a reality?
And if it is the case that when we lose consciousness, that we're still in reality, then when we lose ultimate consciousness?
What makes anyone guarantee that the reality will not continue? So I'll answer that question is that the secret ingredient of all this is consciousness, which we believe
is due to the soul. That is a reasonable explanation, in fact, is the only explanation. There is no materialistic explanation of this. So if there's no materialistic explanation of this, which is the point you're trying to make, right, then
the question is,
if we die, and we're Heidelberg, here, we're in this virtual reality.
It's not really virtual, because it's a reality as good as ours. Let me tell you something before I can proceed. What makes what what is the difference between a dream and in this world? I don't want to sound like matrix guy, you know, but now what is it? If there's two, there's only two differences tomorrow, they're
the actions we do in this world will affect as Muslims will affect. Now, I don't mean that as Muslims. I mean, in a general sense, what is it? What are those two differences between a dream and our
ecosystems? Maybe? Yeah. Yeah, no, if your screen is, okay, so there's two differences, right? That's one of them continuity. So like, for example, today affects what happens for me tomorrow. If I have a hair cut today, I'm gonna wake up with a hair cut some hair cut tomorrow. And the dream is not necessarily like that. Unless some of you guys have that. Think it's like our dreams or like some kind of like, you know, it's not a thing. It's impossible, but I'm saying it
It's, it's very unlikely that our dreams are gonna be like Netflix series, you know? So when you go to sleep, you know, go to sleep tomorrow and you know your dreams.
Right. But if it was like that it would be quite similar that could drive a person to insanity, in fact, because they wouldn't know what it would be on the verge of not knowing what reality is and what really is not. But that's the first thing. What's the second thing?
So we said the first was continuities, the second one is
interactivity. So say I'm speaking to you right now, and you speak it to me. So you have different minds that are interacting with each other. Okay, in a dream, you don't necessarily have that. Now, it's once again, it's possible that you can have the illusion of that, or you can even think that you have that. In other words that you can, you're speaking to people. But if you eliminate those two things, or if you add those two things, then you have the dream world becomes the same as the actual world, which is why we have two hard problems, the hard problem of consciousness, and we have the hard problem of solipsism. solipsism is the matrix world. How do we know we're not in a matrix?
And no one can tell you, there's never been a philosopher in the world that can solve these two problems. That right now you're in a matrix, you cannot solve that issue.
So the point I'm making is, if Allah is capable of bringing about a world for us, which is both continuous, continuous, and interactive, and this is called has dunya, then why is he not capable of doing that in a different realm to happen here? Is that different realm is this continuous, and it has interactivity, so it qualifies as a world item.
It qualifies Ireland. Anything with those two things? Is Ireland now is a is it's a world. It's like this worlds world. That's a world where two birds are here. Now, here's the thing. Can you have interaction between higher tubers here? And this world? The answer is usually no. Usually, it's not the case. But Allah can allow that connection to take place.
Now, we don't want to go into this non issue is, we're talking about two issues. Yeah. Two different worlds. Yeah. Which do you see what I mean? Which can we can cross pollinate. There's an interesting, if you look at like virtual reality. And the theory of, you know, this is all simulation, I actually quite started out like similar timelines. And the idea is that virtual reality right now is so strong, if you put it on and you experience it for one hour, and you take it off, you're kind of have a shock of reality, like, oh, I have to go back that's it's good that you bring in virtual reality into because the only thing that would make virtual reality any different
from any other world, is that is, is primarily contingent on this world. It's continuous. And there's interaction in virtual reality. Yeah. So what I mean is, it's not separate. It's completely contingent on this world. Without this world, you won't have the virtual reality. But the theory of that we're living in a simulation, it kind of died down now. But a few years ago, yes, very, very popular. But it was because of virtual reality. They thought that in the future, sorry, in the past, there was a very advanced civilization. And they kept improving, improving, improving this technology VR, until they created a simulation, and now we're living and they're virtual. And there
were actually a scientists who were, you know, like, contemplating that as if it's like, yeah, sure. This could be the case. Why not? Like they couldn't argue or disqualify this argument. They were considering it, but it kind of died down. Yeah, no, but as we say, like, you know, if we think about all that we just said here, the point we're making is simple that there's nothing inconsistent about these things, right? So if, if we if we assume all of that stuff, then this becomes very easy to believe, frankly, it's it becomes completely easy to believe that God moved Muhammad Salah Salem, from the first heaven to the second heaven to the third heaven at all. And what does it mean to have
the no heaven doesn't mean heavens, like Janna heaven means universals really effectively. That's what it is. So in the Islamic cosmology, there are seven heavens.
And Allah says in the Quran, like I did say in the summit, dunya be Masabi Jana rojo, Malaysia 18. Now we have certainly adorned the lowest heaven with stars and we have made them a pelting thing for the devils in chapter 67 verse three, four. Yeah. So it shows you that wherever there are celestial bodies, that were in this, this universe,
and sort of the fossils, it tells us that there are seven heavens and each of those heavens, you know, is a particular affair. So they're different from each other, that each of the seven heavens are different. How big are they whatever, we don't know exactly how big they are. But if you look at these kinds of videos about how insignificant we are as this planet, compared to the rest of the universe, it's quite shocking actually, how insignificant we are compared to so Allah
has created seven heavens and then above that is the Colosseum the option all these kinds of things are
And so he made the Bahamas Arsalan ascend all of those.
Now someone may ask the question, well, if you send it and you own a
round earth, how can you be going? Is it goes like, is it like books? Like, it's like this? Is it like, you know, this would indicate that the, you know, the heavens are like, you know, like a book. It doesn't have to be like that. In fact, it could be like an onion.
Like, you know, the onions.
Because if it's like, if everything is circular, or round, if everything is spherical, from wherever you start off, you're still be ascending, like Yanni. Do you understand what I'm saying? Or do you need more. So
if you're, if you're in, let's say, you got a ball here, let's say Gobo.
Got a ball here, someone, you don't need a bullet, you just imagine a ball right here, right? And if you're somewhere here on the earth, you know, which is also a ball. Wherever you are in Australia, or the United Kingdom, you'll be ascending, if you go any any part of these doesn't matter where you are, you'll still be cutting through all of the seven heavens. Ascension, either way,
doesn't matter.
Yes, it's like being the center of the earth. And you coming out to the periphery of the earth, for example.
Like the basic of the argument, like let's say, I'm a developer, if I develop a game, and in this game, there are different levels, and someone just created an account, what would stop me as a developer from bumping him up to level 77? And then following him? Exactly. I mean, it's a good way to put a developer, you can do that if you could do as a developer, why can't I love it?
It's the case where like, and the thing is, obviously,
there are some things which we need to think about, which we're gonna think about now in terms of the timeline. And the I asked some questions that haven't answered yet, about the day of judgment, and all these kinds of things we'll come to, but just we're getting an image because the thing is, in physics,
and philosophy on this, there's, there's a flesh that joins,
time and space are linked.
In fact, in many ways, time is spaces. I mean, in many ways, time is space.
And distance.
Or time is distance divided by speed. That's what time is in physics, right? T divided by distance divided by speed, or movement. So time and space are and they call it space time continuum for a reason. Alright, so let's get back to it.
So
we haven't got a problem now, what's the cosmology they got seven heavens. And then above that, you have
Sidra Tillman Taha. Now, as you've mentioned, you mentioned that you'd read it out. So the last one to have so basically, you have heaven and hell are located effectively above the seven heavens,
like six to seven, they're located within the cosmos, not the first universe but above and beyond that. Now, does that mean? What does that mean?
It means that the laws of physics in those areas, anything above the first heaven, is something which is we don't understand is we don't understand it, because we don't know how it works. Like, for example, I'll give an example. The Quran says
to God, Treasury, mentality, Hill and heart Have you very, very common verse that keeps coming rivers, underneath which rivers flow? How can you have a river flowing in the skyline?
I mean, what are you talking about? I mean, what's going on? And if you read the Hadith on heaven, a lot of it doesn't,
doesn't actually
it's not commensurate with what we are accustomed to here in this dunya. And that's what the process Salam told us, he said that there are some things that Mahatma Allah called be Bashar, literally, no human being has never felt or experienced it. And the reason for that is because the laws of physics may be different.
Like the three dimensional, it could be whatever it is dimensional. And it could be that directionality is different. And it could be that time is different. And it could be that all these things are different.
If the life is permanent, if there is no horizon, if there is no something that we feel here in the laws, and everything could
be different. And if we say that these are not havens, that we feel that gardens are let's agenda. So how did the professor's meet Musa Ibrahim Ali Salam and others? So yeah, so let's get to that. So when the Prophet Salam was leading them in prayer, it could very well be that Allah has put a representation of these prophets on the earth
and allowed them to interact with them in a real sense by bringing their souls from headquarters are here to do to interact with the prophets.
But how would that happen? Exactly? The homeless is unknown to us to be honest with you. So yeah, okay. Well, we don't know how that how that happens. But is it possible? If we're talking about the possibility of us downloading our DNA onto a computer? And we're taking this possibility very seriously, I don't see how anyone can take this. And seriously,
do you see what I mean? Like, Why is this hard to believe? If Elon Musk can do it? Are you telling me God can't do it?
I mean, is this is this how far we're taking the situation? So Elon Musk, maybe in 20, or 30 years, if I promise you if he makes a YouTube video, and he says, Look, I have been able to download the memories of a human being from this part of the brain now, onto a machine and we can see it, just like if you're recording with your phone, or video. And he shows a few examples. Even if it's a bogus thing, I promise you, the population will believe in it, because it's shrouded in language of science. But if Elon Musk can do the Tesla, man, then what you're saying God can't do stuff like that. Of course, he can do that. He can bring the souls of these prophets and made them inhabit
container, a body, which is delightful, like like their bodies in the dunya.
And then bring them back to the handlebars if it's very, very possible and plausible. Sorry, isn't? Isn't this just a category mistake fallacy where you're using philosophical naturalism? To analyze the metaphysical? Yeah, that's a good way of putting it as well, let's say, Yeah, very good. Very beautiful.
Summary, does that represent, like his status or difference of opinion among the scholars? Does this because it results in the fourth heaven?
I mean, it's, he's not really seen as last minute, Russell, but how could it be above ISIS? So it doesn't seem at all to be? That's why would be in the seven heavens anyway. So that's a bit of a different question. Um, because a lot of the scholars didn't say that, that because, you know, on the front of Solomon, he met different prophets and each of the heavens, they're seeing, what's the relevance of the Hikmah of these particular prophets being in those particular heavens? The answer that question is, no one knows.
Maybe no one actually knows. I mean, there's there's no reason some people even memorize in the first seven, he made this one. The second is, I see that that is always the time if people are saying is based on like, some kind of ranking in terms of like, most favorable, which kind of level of heaven they are in, and why is hell and heaven above the seven heavens, I can see the arguments. There's also that it's, we're talking about the prophets rather than, you know.
There could be a question that why the prophets are divided into humans, like when in one heaven and other another one? And that's
to be honest.
Who knows? You know, who knows? The why these ones were there.
So, you need to believe when we come to a different question, so we asked if we answer the first question, it could be a visual representation, the souls of the prophets were taken into our contain of their bodies or like for like bodies, and there was a solemn, lead them in prayer, no problem. Okay. So what the process was made to see some things that happen in help.
And he saw
some people being, you know, tortured, and I put the Hadith in hellfire.
But or some of them are doing the Mima. Some of them are doing bad sins and stuff. And you saw, that's how could you see. So basically, the way that the scholars of the past classically, have understood this, as they say, it's just the same answer as the previous one, which is a visual representation of the future. However,
let's take it on face value for the sake of argument.
So you went and actually saw
I'm not gonna ask you guys but there's a film called Interstellar, very famous film, I think it's up there in the top 20 or 30, or 40 on the IMDB top movies of the of the era. And this guy, basically, in the film, he got it takes a rocket and goes into the future, goes through a black hole or something.
And he goes into the future.
Now, if you think about it,
how fast must the province ascending traveling like, he must have been traveling well beyond the speed of light.
Now, if that was the case, in Hillsborough County, traveling well beyond the speed of light, then he would be in physics terms going into the future.
And if you weren't aware into the future, for him to see what's happening after the adjustment is not logically impossible. So you could take this on face value and still have no contradiction.
Then last question, wishes they have a that's impossible either. Yeah, but I can make that happen.
Time works differently as well, in that you can make them go back and time is different.
This is not a problem. Going back into the past when we said that's the issue, like we got the grandfather paradox. If you've got, can you go back in time and kill you on granddad? How? How would you exist and not just because it creates contradictions. But going into the future, coming back to the present, is different to go into the past, the guidance said it went back in time. So we have to entertain the possibility of this being the case. And we could entertain the possibility even if one one wanted to take it on face value.
But then the question would be, then what is God's relationship with time, and I don't want to open this my left, because because there is a big discussion in the creedal circles about this.
Because if you take this on face value, it would give credence to the idea that God has a completely different relationship with time than anything else.
Now, it does have implications, it's not massive implications, but it does have some implications.
For example,
even Taymiyah, has this, this view, cool, you know, and he, he sort of he talks in that view about
God doing things within time.
And this view is about rule. However, there's something
not gonna say, changing and regenerating in the essence of God,
to God that the light goes.
But if that's the case, then if we take these Hadees on face value, and we don't do that, we'll have them right.
Then
the Day of Judgment, whether the Day of Judgment happened, or didn't happen,
it's all the same to God, in a sense, because God has a completely different relationship with time, because one of the Hadith that he uses is that God will get angry on the day, that he didn't get angry like that in any other day.
And he says, that shows you that God operates within time. That's even his argument. But if we're saying, Well, God moved the price of Salah, and he could move the rest of them to the future and bring him back into the present, then there could be a response to say, well, actually, his his interaction with time cannot be any way similar to the interaction with human beings or any other creature on time, because
clearly he isn't he's still got in his grasp the past present and the future in a way that nothing else does.
Can you see what I'm saying?
Pardon? When he directly spoke to Musa lucidum. Temporarily, I would take that up. Yeah, that's the argument being made like it is,
temporarily, but is God's way of speaking in time, the same way as me even even to say isn't, right, the way that we, but I'm trying to indicate to you that there are some things we need to investigate here, in terms of God's relationship with time. So it does have some treadle implications, without going too much into it does have some creedal implications, if it's the case, that the person went into the future and came back into the present, which, if we took it on private face value, these studies indicate that prime aphasia you'd have to do with you do have to do token on these bodies to come to the conclusion that that's not the case.
Which is something which is interesting, because it says that, you know, when I saw this and that, you know what I mean? Yeah. What does the non believers think about the studio first, how do they believe in this? I mean, it's not really a story that is mentioned in the Old Testament, for example, like
so, we know Ebola have is a kafir
Allah subhanaw taala said he will die a disbeliever. So this is where it becomes problematic. And Allah subhanaw taala is aware of the future. Yeah. So did he see it, that he's not going to change his mind? This is where it becomes problematic. It's not problematic. Well, that's a completely different,
different question. I was just saying, Allah subhanaw taala? Is he aware it? Does he have knowledge of the future or to him? Has the future happened? Or?
Well, I thought that the future look coming Kabuto in a sense to him is as if the future has happened, or he's got the future in his grasp, just as He as the president is grasping sort of buttons, but
it's only problematic if you take out couple compatibilism and that goes back to determinism discussion. Should I mean, that's like the freewill versus determinism discussion. But I will say this to you, right. I will say to you the idea of freewill determinism. I've written something about it. And by the way, sapiens thing you can read it it's more paradoxical, paradoxical than anything else. There's a difference between paradox and contradiction. A contradiction is when something clearly doesn't work together. A paradox where it seemingly doesn't like these these two opposite things seemingly come together. Because you have determinism and then you have freewill. So we put
as compatibilism we put the idea of
The coexistence of free will free will being an determinism of God in the basket of paradoxes not in the basket of contradictions. How do you decide what sort of contradiction? Yeah, Trinitarian just sit as a paradox as well as non contradiction, we decided, because we look at the, for example, the the truth value of the claim being made. So with, with it with the Trinity, for example, you have three, gods, Father, Son, Holy Spirit, their gods are not gods that they say, Well, you know, you three and not three at the same time. So it's easy for us to find the idea of contradiction. However, with with things like this, for example, if we say, first person subjective experience,
on the rationalist school of thought, you see, the rational school of thought it's the most basic thing you can come to is Cogito ergo sum you in fact, everything is built upon the idea of first persons do I exist? So and in fact, all morality is based on that. And then you have the idea of antecedents, causal chains. So you've got two ideas, which are very, very impervious to criticism, and then you're putting them together and say, like, how can you not have them together. But the the idea is that you can prove both them without a shadow of a doubt. So by proving both them without a shadow of a doubt, you have to go into compatibilism. Now, the only thing is we don't have the
mechanic mechanics of that. And no one claims No mechanics of that. So that's how, but before we get to that, just because I don't want it quickly, we'll do like little, maybe a question answer in the end. Because we might, you know, me, I can go into 1000 tangents.
And the problem was Hasulam. So we talked about some of the things that I saw in hellfire. But I also saw, as we mentioned, superato monta and you mentioned, you read out what he saw. And you said that the tree does big tree, which has these huge leaves of like, ears of elephants and stuff like that. Why would there be in a tree in the sky? I mean,
why wouldn't there be a tree in the sky? is, here's the thing, because what we associate trees is a soil roots, ground photosynthesis and these things. So it's a tree, you imagine something like that. But a tree is a concept that transcends the idea of its ground li connection.
Just like the river that you mentioned, like you mentioned, two rivers in heaven and two rivers in dunya, the Euphrates and the Nile. Okay, the two great rivers, you know, of the the two biggest rivers, in fact, and the two most important rivers to human civilization.
As we know, both of us are yoga rockers on the Nile obviously, being the number one.
But do you see what I mean? So, the point is, is that these rivers are extremely important. So the idea of a river transcends the worldly sphere.
Yanni Allah put things which conceptually exist outside of the earthly sphere into the earth, is not indication that okay, why something that is in the earth, outside of the earth? Like, in general, you have fell, okay? You have fruits. So it's like, what, but you only associate fruits with this world, this this earth? So you're saying what was a banana? And why do we have bananas?
In heaven? nominalism. Like, it's just a word that we use to categorize things. Let's say there's like a truth factor to it? Is that what we're trying to say that the fruits and Jenna smart what we categorize this is not something we know. It's nothing like true about it, that we know of. So is it like nominalism nominalism is effectively the universals are not, is to say that the universals don't exist in the real world. And it's against conceptualism, because it's not even in the mind. So it's just they don't exist. So it'd be bad for this aspect, we're saying completely different. It's not just the same words, it's, I mean, the only way I can see that this can be relevant is that if
you believe in your platonic forms, then you can say, well, there's, there's an idea, there's a concept banana, like, banana, like, you know, what I mean?
Or sword or something, it's the perfect sword out there, like it's a, it's a conceptual thing. So when you use that words in for agenda wouldn't have to be similar to the perfect form.
If you are a new, it's an interesting way of putting it, it's a good way to put it very good way of putting it maybe solve some issues. Because Plato saw a reason, you know, to have this world of forms. And his reason was that, you know, you had to have the perfect receipts or the perfect banana, or whatever. And if you have an agenda, then it solves that quandary solves that problem in many ways. Right? But yeah, I mean, let's go go My point is
so the idea of a tree or river or banana or pomegranate? It's not earth specific. These are not specific notions.
Allah has put them on the earth.
Like I was just thinking the other day Subhanallah that
we have all these emotions. Yeah, where we have love and more even states of being compassion for
etcetera, etcetera, if we didn't have them would know how to understand the law at all.
There would be no way of us understanding who or what Allah is, we would not understand.
There has to be what is referred to as Halal Masaryk. There's to be some level of overlap between what Allah is and what we are.
If there isn't any level of overlap with those no way of understanding what, who or what allies will be an absent concept. Yes. Is that what makes us different to animals? Can even even not even Oh, you mean knowing it? Yeah. Because if you feel like we have these overlap elements with God,
can animals have that overlap? Do they got do animals know God in that sense? Or? That's an interesting question. I mean, maybe I don't know. I mean, I mean, obviously, the Quran says, well, moment. Shaitan, Allah subhanho Hamza, he will, I can let and I'm gonna have a hornet's nest be how there's nothing in the dunya. That doesn't do test, you have a law, but you don't understand how to do it. So I don't know how it happens. But it happens. What do you say that this argument like, like this shed that we have attributes slash estoppel. I can,
we would say also called this is sort of the problem of evil slowly, because the problem evil helps us build these attributes. So we get close to this battle. Without some of the suffering we will not have some of these attributes such as forgiveness, compassion, brave, yeah, you can bring that into this problem of evil, you can bring that in virtue building, you can you can bring in. But if you see what I'm saying that these are not earth specific notions. So when we see sometimes,
descriptions of heaven, descriptions of certain Maharaj descriptions, what we just saw here, you say, so what's that? What is?
What is the river doing in this place? It's meant to be an earth specific notion, is because the idea of a river was put onto the earth because of the greatness of the idea, rather than is something that the earth brought forward that no one else can bring. You know, I mean, it's like you have to reverse engineer the idea of this and
yeah, you just have to think about it a little bit more deeply. Because what's a river doing on the earth? In the sky? Or in this place? So there's an assumption there, that the river only should be on planets on this earth or something like that? What if it's not skies, universe like Earth? Allah subhanaw taala creates are created and different universe like Earth. And there is everything possibility that now the river anything that we can illustrate it's easy for Allah Spano treaty Earth, creating another universal human being and the impact their absolute good point. I don't know why they struggle there. I mean, we know of different things in different planets like on like a
planet, it rains, diamonds, like Mars and stuff that human beings never saw. There's a river of like, a solid, that's molten. And that's like a river of like, it's still planet contact. Specific, right? So it's okay, we can understand that because on the planet, but what's the river doing in the sky? What's it? You know, gentlemen? Why do we have descriptions of heaven? And the answer is, why not? Nowadays, you can create your own virtual reality. You mentioned
that there's trees, there's ever there's even interaction introduction, there's payloads, there is bit, everything.
Gotta be the closest thing to something that's Earth, there's a river, so the word River was used. Like that's, that's the best way people don't understand it. There's a bit of that which is true. Like, if not best, he said, for example, that the only thing that's similar between what we find in our world and the heavens, and Heaven, sorry, would be in the ismat in the name itself. So and remember the process or Mahathir Allah called Bucha. So like you said, the river is not a real thing like the river that we domesticate. Fundamentally, there's there's Hickman behind using these words to describe these aspects of heaven in a theology, but we just don't know. We don't know the answer.
Only God knows the answer. That's like the simplest and most soundest response we can give to these kinds of issues. Obviously, we can speak if be theologians and hypothesize and philosophize and these aspects but yeah, when it comes down to this hikma behind it, we just don't know we're trying to figure it out. But we don't know. That's right, bro. That's exactly right. Yeah, there is one, just on the point of visual representations. A lot of the scholars, they use this particular Hadith, where the processor let me set you know,
that I saw in my salaat, that the heaven was the hell was coming closer to me, and that gender was coming closer to me. And the Greeks and all these kinds of things. So long Hadith, I don't recall thing. But the point is, is that they use this hadith to show that there can be visual representations that Allah can provide for the Prophet Muhammad Sarzana there's other things do a little outfight machete Oklahoma Alibaba no Michi cyberlaw Mocha, as well.
You mean visual representations. And nowadays, like I said before, it's the easiest time to believe in us. We have holograms, I can produce a visual representation. You have cinemas, you have, you know, whatever. Human beings are doing that now.
It's not a problem at all.
And
another part is obviously, we spoke about this a little bit already, but just to kind of touch upon it. We spoke about the the 50 prayers. So everything started with 50. And then the province I went back and forward back and forward to reduce it, and Musa was there giving advice effectively. And even the process of love, he turned to Gibreel to ask him, when Moses gave the advice, he turned to Gibreel as a hadith Musa Rama to see if that particular advice is correct or not. But at the end of it, he finished with five praise. Okay, so it started with 50. And then it ended with five we have to pray five prayers and Subhanallah it's like otherworldly, the prayer is our connection with Allah
subhanaw taala. Right. And it seems as both symbolically significant, and spiritually significant, significant that there has a solemn, he was given the command to prayer in his presence, as our gel in Allah's Presence. So it's like when we pray, we're connecting
with the Most High, and it was the process, Allah was given this great reward of all this great gift of prayer, in this very special moment.
So that's why a lot of scholars, they actually like him has this whole thing where he talks about when you're praying and saying Allahu Akbar, it's like throwing a log, but it means Allah's greatest, right? So it's like, you're seeing a log way and you put your hands up. It even has spiritual significance, because like you're throwing the world behind your back, as we say,
do when you're throwing the world behind your back. Imagine that the prophets of salaam he literally left the world when he was given the command to pray. And especially there's some spiritual aspects and interesting things here as well, which is that the last two A's of sorts of Bukhara amorous will be around Labor will be known, etc. That will revealed in this time they revealed when the salam was there, did the process from see Allah or not, there's a whole discussion.
The stronger opinion, let's say is that he didn't see a lot. But there's a whole discussion about that, when he went to someone to heart and all those kinds of things. And so he interacted with Allah subhanaw taala. And he was given these commands, and he was given these and he interacted with all the prophets, this is
a powerful thing.
Now, we've already kind of touched upon this, let's go back to another critical point, because we move to a spiritual point, there's a critical point.
Which is that
is this a miracle?
Would you think what do you guys think? From my understanding is, is a miracle? I think he also died in one of his lectures, he came to that conclusion. So what would you be wielding is a miracle only given to the Prophet no one else experienced that this level of
because you guys saw started to and he just said, like, he was able to experience God. He didn't see God but he had the he saw his hijab and stuff like this. So having that experience, seeing all the prophets it was a miracle given to only to the Prophet no one else just from my understanding, maybe I'm wrong, but that's that's my job as I remember what the classical definition of what a miracle is. We've kind of covered this already, by the way. Do you remember
just goes beyond the norms? That's one part of it, you
know, is it to convince people that he is something God like there was so there's a classical definition of what a miracle is in Islamic theology right which is how they constantly lie they actually ag Hello.
Yeah, the medina bow hunting. Okay. Haha, ladder is something which is denies the laws of nature opposes the laws and it goes against the laws of nature. God Allahu Allah, Medina,
an Ebola. So Allah allows this to happen on the hands of the claimant for prophethood. And this is the important part and a wedge at the hottie.
So I wish I had the means challenge. It's, it's a challenging thing.
Now, maybe the you could argue the first definitely was fulfilled to second maybe not yet fulfilled, but the third is not fulfilled here. Because the third thing is Allah which had D is that now I need to be able to analyze that. In fact, let me be frank with you for a second right. What this is more likely to make people believe less Yeah, yes.
then it is to believe more. I mean, and this happened when the famous Hadith actually, which is I've just put it on the slide
that Abu JAL when he came back, okay.
He came to the Prophet Muhammad Salah
and he said to him,
I heard that you know
such and such, and you want it, you want to tell the people what you told me like that you went up here and you went there and all these kind of things. And the process?
He said, Yes, I'll do it. Right. But he wasn't enthusiastic. He didn't go out and do it himself first. This guy, what did I will get? Wasn't that what I have realized? What do you think he realized about this situation?
This? Yeah, he realized it is favorable to him.
It wasn't going to be favorable to them. And of course,
book as well. I know that he instantly without question. Right. So what was said? What
kind of color have a cut saw that? He said that if if he said it, then he spoke the truth. That's what I've said.
As soon as he was challenged with it, he knew like he goes, You know, I believe in the things that are more awesome and delicate. Like he's talking about heaven and hell and all this kind of things. By the way, this is known to everybody, right? Islam would be much easier to believe the more materialistic is the less talked about agenda and hellfire Day of Judgment.
We think maybe the ancient people, somehow, the ancient people, they had more of a propensity to believe heaven and hell than we did. Heaven. And hell is as incredulous to them as it was, it's probably more incredulous to them as sauce.
Like you believing in a fire, that people are burning and crackling inside of it. And this and that, and coulomb and logic drew them, but the lamp doesn't look like that. And you believe in this and the river is on the air. And this one there? Isn't it?
Like, you know what I mean? Like? Do you think it knew we needed Richard Dawkins to tell us how incredulous this was, to the people to believe in this is when you see something, when you're told to believe in something which you have not seen? It becomes less and less believable. So if
the prophet Muhammad wa salam, and this is actually an argument for the veracity of Islam, because if he wanted to make people believe by any means necessary, he would reduce the burden of belief.
Why would he put more and more hype yet? It was a more hyperreality put in that the more unseen type things you put in there, the more harder is to believe. And this psychological reaction of the Prophet to Abu Lahab coming to him and ask him this question, is indication that actually, he was sincere, because he wanted them to believe and he knew that this would make them believe less, yet he still delivered. And he still told them, I had to tell them
that he's not making the religion the religion is the message, he's having to deliver something which is, frankly, I mean, if you look at some of the Hadith, and some of them are weak.
There are some Hadees and said some people left Islam. Yeah. However, this hadith is problematic. The ones that say that he left Islam, because if you if you're not able to find in the first Hadith in party, when he was asked to people will leave his religion, it was announced that he will not leave his religion, apart from houses. So there are some weaker had had these say some people left original Islam. It went that far. But no, it didn't go that far.
People were still clapping their hands and putting their hands on their head and just kind of thing when that was started in March.
It's nice to hear that they left people leftist. Yeah. I mean, it's the strong opinion is that they didn't leave because of what we've also found, right. But what I'm saying is that these levels of hierarchy, you know, when he was asked the question, you might mention this story. If people were leaving. So Sofia might say that they
and people left
the big incident. Yeah, at that time, he was the enemy. Yeah. If he would have said it.
Exactly. So people didn't leave. But they did find the incredible. Like, some people were doing that I was like, What's this man was what we what we've been told right now it's like, well, what's this man's like, what now? Like, because this, you're given us more to believe. You're telling us more impossible things?
seemingly impossible. Yeah.
I'm not sure. So this, the strong opinion is that this took place about a year and a half before the Hijra. But you know, why? Because
if there's one narration by ASHA or Jalon, that indicates that it was basically one year and a half before the when the idea died, was after the husband, the husband and right before the hijra, so we're talking about a year let's say one year
Because between the two incidences in one year, some people say this is a gift from from Homicide and these are Alana died. He's uncle died doesn't disbelieve and this was yeah of course. 100% Yeah, I said like to strengthen this is more for the Prophet than it was for us so many ways because Allah who was strengthened in the heart of the Prophet SAW Salem, and you know, like for example, where do we find this in the Quran? We find this with who was another prophet?
No, not Musa actually. Okay. Delica
No, no, no, no, no the someone Maluku, so it
was you want to find the air
for the ship will be able to get that straightaway. I was waiting for someone to help me with it. It's been sort of rough.
And it's right. I mean, it's about a prophet who is the Prophet.
We showed him the signs of the heavens in the earth.
He said Abraham, what was your brain?
Because I like an audio whose it was secure.
I'm gonna get there get there. So April, Allah do you know like, for example, Allah. We know in the Quran, Abraham he said
show me how Kevin's Eddie Eddie. Nikkei photo hidden motel. Carla what I'm talking Carla Bella lackey, Leah Tama in kalbi. And then so on and so forth happened. So Abraham, he went through a process where Allah was strengthening him.
Nobody brought him
out of the well, yeah, akuna minal MacKinnon. So he Allah showed him, Abraham, no matter, quote, the possessions of the heavens and the earth, so that he can become what certainly strengthens him. Because don't forget the Prophet Allah. It's not like it wasn't certain. But if his wife just died, his uncle just died, these things are happening need to be strengthened. Now. Let me give you motivation.
Allah has now given the process of motivation.
It could be part of test Allah subhanaw taala test other people, whether he they believe on hype or not, because one criteria for being minutes. And Latinos, we don't know if we need everything based on evidence. So every month there was a submission. Where's the test? Yeah. Which is the main purpose of life. Exactly. That's it was assessed, according to the classical definition, then it's, it's not a miracle. Yes, it's not a miracle according to the classical terminological definition. Yes.
So it's, it's fair to say it was a gift to Yeah, it's a miracle from one angle in the sense that it was something which is incredible if fulfills one or two different thing, but it's not a little heady. It's not like when Allah says in the Quran for it to be solved in a mystery without Shahada. It's a miraculous gift. It's not a slightly you know, in the Quran, where it gives falsification challenges. That's these are the miracles because now I can try and disprove it because you give an example of a miracle then yeah, like I said, Before, I was affected by this sort of thing and mentally bring a chapter like this. So there's a miracle. Here's the Quranic, the inevitability,
challenge, the Quran, the Quran itself. So now I insert if a century can challenge the Quran, even with GPT, as I look GPT produced the Quran and see what God brings to the table. Don't say like, maybe you thought something new will do it after the session. But what I'm saying is, the point is, is there needs to be a falsification, like Quran says,
to be good Tabin Yeah, hold them at home, I had to be out and go to so they can bring a book that spring guidance is a challenge. It's something I can test. But it's not a matter of just not, you cannot even prove, frankly, you cannot even prove this happened. Now, the best you can do is when the process alone was asked, and we know, he was asked, What did you see? And he gave the answers, and he was given the vision representations. But to a skeptical mind, this is not going to be the evidence you're going to use to prove his lab.
This is certainly not gonna be the evidence. But what we do with this is we say this was a gift from Amazon. There's nothing which is contradictory to the scientific enterprise. Nothing, which is logically contradictory.
And it doesn't, doesn't doesn't Yeah, it's not there's no issue. There's no issue with it.
I was gonna say, next point. So yes, as abacus dear, how he responded to that was something which is certainly very powerful. There are some scholars by the way, of the self that believed that this was the whole thing was a dream.
There is there is there is reports that are basically narrated by ASHA and by Maria, that say that, but that's not We can't say for sure that that's their position. However, I have gotten I've gotten a makalah from a web
or would you? Who's it? Sorry, I said Dean, sorry, but as Hanafi as Hanafy Yeah.
In his shot here, someone want to read this bit long.
Do you wanna read it? Now?
In English
It was said that the Israa involved his soul only and his body was never absent. This was narrated by Ibn Ishaq from Aisha and Marwa. May Allah be pleased with them. And a similar report was narrated from Al Hassan Al Buffy. But it should be noted that there is a difference between saying that the Israel was a dream and saying that it involves his soul but not his body. There was a great difference between the two ideas. Asha muawiya, may Allah be pleased with them did not say that it was a dream. Rather, they said that his soul was taken by night, but his body was not absent. The difference between the two is that what a sleeper sees in his dream may be representation of
representations of things that are known in real life. So in a dream, it may be as if a person sees himself being taken up to heaven, and being taken to Makkah Mecca. But his soul did not ascend or go there. Rather, the angel of dreams caused him to see a representation of something, they I share my way up, may Allah be pleased with them, they're not mean that the Israel was a dream. What they meant was that the soul itself was taken on a night journey. So it left the body and then returned to it. And they regarded this as something unique to the Prophet blessings and peace of Allah be upon him. Because no one else could have could have the experience of their very soul ascending
completely to heaven, except after the
Yeah, okay, so that's the some opinions that
the vast majority of the scholars say no, the body was taken as well.
More of the younger Sahaba because the straw we said is like 10 years, they were very young at that time.
Would they say they say physical? I think one of them. Like I said, the only two notions that we have a fashion Marya, okay, so the dreams of the Prophet is also part of Revelation. So this kind of have us
take advantage these dreams of the Prophet is also part of Revelation. Part of what yeah. So if this could be a possibility, it could be closer to the reality.
As I say, I don't think it's a dream. Would you call it a Hanafy? Here is not seen as a dream. You're saying it's like a dream. It's not fully like a dream? Yeah, the same representation of? Yeah. If someone does come with that, they're not careful if they believe in that, like, if they're basing on somewhere.
It's no not dream, but it's like the body was back, back home and the mind was not covering it. Okay, because they can base on this. I thought, I thought, yeah, it's not. If it's a dream, I don't know if it's covered or not. But it's certainly like,
I wouldn't go there. That's now
dangerous. Now, you wouldn't say it's in a dream world. You say it's in a different it's using the word dream, as we said, it has problems because it's not interactive. It's not continuous. Yeah. And it's not contiguous semantics. So we'll just make sure the profit is definitely for example, the professor said before the Revelation, he would see some dreams and tomorrow that will be like a funnel.
That happened think that the dream we see in the dream the prophets he just wrote, yeah, it's from Allah. Sure. So dream is still a representation of something else. Rather than being the reality it's a representation of reality, rather than being the reality itself. That's that like we said before, there's this fabric of what a dream is. And what the reality is contiguity continuity and interactivity closely the prophecies the representation would they say, like the Prophet homesites I'm saying things the rule is representation was the thing like Do you know how you said the Prophet seems like representation will there? Would you say that opinion has the same thing but will the
Prophet Muhammad because representation was the police
I mean, it's now we're getting into a place where if it's, if the roof was taken, right, and all the things which make the difference between a dream and the real world are present, then it's not a dream anymore.
Like for example, let me give an example right? We believe what happens to the Shaheed the martyr when he dies
Yeah, they're like where's the report? Where are they?
Then there's some very specific Hadith about whether the heart
the soul is going to the sky and the angels open the door and say who is this he's a pure knifes but where are they where their souls
in the in the bodies of the Greenberg and Jana?
I'm not sure you ever come across that sounds are they in a dream? They're not really in a dream.
That's not really a dream here. Now it's hard to hear.
Yeah, in a dream remember you are in your in Hatboro here in a dream. So every dream isn't hypertrophy but not hypertrophy is a dream.
A dream is a
kind of existence within the hacker was higher. But hyperthermia is an it's more general category, which includes the dreams as one of them. Yeah. So it's a whole different spectrum of elevation issue. And
they, they said, you know, the body stayed and the soul went, I thought,
that's what I need to look at. And do they give a reason? Because I think we're both young. Like, like, also, are we aware of how long this was in terms of Earth time? Like there is a Hadith that says that, you know, I need to do Bill's was
leaving.
Yes.
Because I will get that. Yeah, it was so
different when you knock the door with
something. Exactly, exactly. What my brother tried to say is they were both too young for this event. So how would they know? And if the point I had stayed or not? How old are they? How old was one? Oh, yeah. How old was Oh, right. Yes.
He was nine years old. Right, John?
She would, she would have been old enough to know
what occurred. He said this before Hijra. So she would have been maybe six, seven.
So now what's going on?
I'm saying the oldest hobbies didn't settle. So why don't we take that last bit? Yeah. Yeah, that's trying to assist you.
Having the belief that it sort of miraj was involved or hiatal bus rack, it would make a lot of sense, make a lot of sense. I think it adds, it solves that problem from a rational, logical perspective. And I'm not an expert at not all of it. But I find it interesting, this element of the interaction between these kind of two worlds and you mentioned earlier, like it's not unusual that these interactions can occur, they can occur.
Well, I know. I know.
We laugh about it. And if you can get into like, from my understanding, you can get to it being sober and fruity. psychedelics are Don't Don't, don't do this to us whether you're trying to try to sell us something.
Or anything.
I'm gonna show you anything I haven't tried. No, I'm joking. But look, it's interesting. And I think there's this this realm. It just shows how much of the how much we don't know. Yeah, and it provides a lot of it's to me, it's very inspiring and hopeful that that yeah, it's, it's good talking about these slides quickly.
Give to the ombudsman. Homosassa was there like the Salah, and then a few Quran boasts that one? As I don't know what you're referring to, but we'll come to that. Second. Let me ask some questions myself. Now, let me just see if you guys are paying attention to the class, start with you.
Let's start with a simple question easy. Would fabricating the story make the message easier or harder to believe harder,
more nuanced to really expand on that a little bit?
It's harder to be diverse, there's more unseen, which they can't test. So it's so hard to believe for the Muslims and show that America ran away believed instantly and he's high status. And it shows the truthfulness of the Prophet Muhammad. So I said, Well, he's not bringing what he was not like a pragmatic. He's like trying to make everyone believing his religion that he's building on himself. It's more he's just he's a messenger and messages are coming and he's giving it to the people. See, that's a good argument, bro. Like, I think that if you're saying things which people the end user would find more difficult to believe. Okay. That indicates sincerity. I wouldn't agree that it
wasn't like he was convinced or everyone's gonna believe it's more like I know people are gonna not believe spy stuff that said it is more like I say even last lesson where the prophets uncle died and he died the disbelief that shows his honesty, because he could just change the religion say a monk was a part of the religion isn't Muslim. But he stayed on the point that it's normal. So this shows what was the key word with S? Sincerity, sincerity, and it's not in his hands in noise in his control. Excellent. Good work. Good work. Next one next question.
What it says for pragmatic purpose if he did that, like for example, if he made the story up, or if so which one would it so?
So I think that if someone was not happy somehow he was concerned about the result of telling the story. Yeah. So if this was something that not happened, or let's say it's not authentic and it's fabricated Biller, so he would intimidate people because it was somehow he feared about the people who leave Islam.
And it wasn't sort of a pragmatic purpose. Yeah, exact Good, good work. Okay, next question of money radio.
Is the story harder or easier to believe today? As we discussed earlier, our fingers easier to believe from looking at the advancement technologies. If we went back in time, you know, that the the clean
When Fathom planes, perhaps in in Arabia, they'd laugh at us in the middle England had bonused a stake so, and they'd call us which witchcraft. And especially today, a lot of people, you know, there's, I think, as you mentioned earlier, atheism is the age of atheism is pretty much dead. from a philosophical perspective, and a lot of people from my conversations with them seem to be quite spiritual, spiritual, stiff, they think there's something out there, they don't know what it is. But there's something going on. And having these conversations about lack of a better term, the dream world and these kinds of interactions, I think, just from from, from my perspective, there's a lot
of potential in terms of Dawa and conveying this in a manner that perhaps secular people can understand be like, hang on a minute, this, this makes total sense. And yeah, this is very interesting. So yeah, to answer your question, it's way easier to believe now, for a variety different reasons, I think they will ask you this one. So if technology was presented, if our technology today was presented in the past, what would it be seen as?
I think you already said that you said they would see it as slightly magic. However, I would still a lot of them would believe that. Okay, there is something we don't understand how it works. But there is obviously a designer or creator behind this technology.
So even I would say people in the past will view it, as you know, like, incredible, but I still think they would have the bit of logic to be conscious that this level of technology requires intelligence. So whoever created it must be intelligent. Excellent.
We'll go to the next question, which is, what is logically possible may not be scientifically observable, can you expand on this point?
I think this goes back to what I mentioned earlier, about, we believe, for Allah, anything is possible for him to do is there's he's not constrained by this, but these again, are things that are medical, metaphysical, and you know, metaphysical things are not, not supposed to be,
you know, observed in a scientific method to, you know, in that in that particular way. So, if you say anything is possible with sound sound, say, like, God becoming a man is
logically possible, like, you know, we're not like seeing can produce a squared circle. Okay, but it's logically impossible. Excellent, sir. So what is logically possible is not necessarily scientifically what? Impossible? Sorry? Sorry, scientifically observable, beautiful. Excellent. Excellent. Next one, the last but not least.
Is this a miracle for the people? I think recently before,
I don't think it's for the, for the people, it's more, Enrico, for profit.
And for
you mentioned that, because he was going through this difficult
difficulty in his life. And it was more like,
a way to encouragement from, from Allah.
Yeah, so it doesn't fulfill that feel like you know, the classic definition of what a miracle is the terminal logical definition, because, especially otherwise, you've had the as we mentioned, as well.
Now, if somebody comes in and Christine says, this is a ridiculous story, I mean, someone says, tries to be Richard Dawkins, both from a Christian world, that it would be good to bring them Elijah and the Bible because a very similar thing happened to Elijah in the Bible. And it came to pass when the Lord would take up Elijah into the heaven by a whirlwind, that Elijah went with Elijah and Gilgal. And Elijah, Southern to Elisha. Terry, here, I pray thee, for Lord has sent me to Bethel, unless you send unto him As the Lord liveth. And I saw liveth I will not leave the but this idea of elevation, Elijah was elevated into the Heaven.
It's something which is impossible, then or is so incredulous. We're gonna say that. Maybe you took the story from the Bible? Oh, yes. We'll say listen, this, what God does with one prophet, sometimes he does with another, but also they have the doctrine of ascension. Don't forget that. That's a doctrine about Jesus was ascended into heaven, as well.
Last question, yeah. Very last question. The Muslim community, we have more and more people that metaphor, metaphor is the Quran and what happened to appease people like Richard Dawkins? Oh, it was just a metaphor. Yeah. So what is you said, you know, obviously, you know, Prophet's physical being ascended or his soul or it was a dream. What about people who say it's a metaphor?
Yeah, well, now, why why stop there? Why not go to heaven in hell, and they have judgment, because a lot of the descriptions in the judgment are more incredulous than this, the sun will be on the top of your head and this and that, and that's going to happen.
I mean, that's what I would say. And with that, I hope
We have been able to add something new to the table something new we've thought about it critically and with that we will conclude with Salam Alaikum Warahmatullahi Wabarakatuh