Nouman Ali Khan – 3 Types of Muslims & Their Challenges

			After completing the Quran week program in Kuala Lumpur will start now a man was invited to visit
the Mufti of the federal territories offers inputs Jaya, for he spent time with the executive staff
there and delivered a talk on contemporary Muslims and their challenges.
		

			I'd like to first start by saying it is an honor to be here. And I pray to Allah azza wa jal that
this brief conversation is of some benefit for myself and for all of you. And we pray that Allah
azza wa jal accepts this as an act of a bother and a means of our forgiveness. The second thing I'd
like to say is, I am the farthest thing from a shape,
		

			not at all a shape, I am not a scholar, I am not, I don't claim to be one, I know that I'm not one.
I am a very enthusiastic student and researcher in the study of the Quran, to the best of my
ability, and Hamdulillah, I have the benefit of working with some very remarkable scholars that
helped me in conducting that research. Also, I am not going to share some deep knowledge with you,
I'm going to share something based on experience with you and Chava. As I've traveled the Muslim
world and met with communities of Muslims, and also non Muslim countries, more and more, I see that
there is similar trends. So instead of seeing the world as Oh, there's a very different situation
		

			here and a very different situation there. Yes, there are differences. But the common trends are too
common. And we have to observe them. And if you don't understand a problem, you cannot work towards
a solution. So I want to identify in this brief talk at least three categories of Muslims that we
have to be aware of, of course, we're all one oma in now have the humor to cometan Wahida. But it's
good to understand segments and within the OMA. And the way I would like to divide these segments
today is by way of their relationship with Islam. So like if you if you think of Muslims, not by
their ethnicity, or by their school of thought, but you think of a Muslim, in terms of their
		

			relationship with Islam, I'm going to offer you three categories. So the first category, and I think
the most important category, I like to call them, Muslims on the edge, Muslims on the edge. So this
is inspired by Anya women, nse, menyambut, Allah and a half. Right. So among people, there's
somebody who worships along the very edge. So these are Muslims, that they may be born in a Muslim
family, they may have been raised in a Muslim family, but they are very much a part of the modern
world. And many of their ideas have been influenced by university media business, the outside world
to the point where their connection with Islam is reduced to my parents are Muslim, or we have eat,
		

			or, you know, in Ramadan, I'm not supposed to eat in front of my mother, or something like their
relationship with Islam has been reduced to almost nothing. But they still identify themselves as
Muslim. A lot of their practices, a lot of their life priorities, life habits, they don't seem to be
corresponding to Islam. And this is similar to there are lots of Christians in the world who
identify themselves as Christian, but only in the sense that they belong to the Christian
civilization. So they would call them civilizational Christians. So there's a there's a growing
population of Muslims that are civilizational Muslims. And when when you speak about Islam, or their
		

			attitudes towards Islam,
		

			the answers are very similar. And the attitude is, look, religion is a personal thing. You can have
your Islam, I have my Islam, in your Islam, you pray five times good for you. And my Islam I have my
connection to God is in my heart, he knows what I feel. So, you know, this is not something that you
should be forcing on me. I can figure it out for myself and slowly but surely this category of
people, they're good people. I'm not you know, as we hear that it sounds disturbing to a practicing
Muslim. These are good people, but they never really had a real reason to practice their religion
because their religion was only given to them as a culture. And because the culture of the world
		

			changed. They can say, well, I don't I don't talk like my mom or my dad or my grandfather used to. I
don't use the same technology as them anymore. So I don't have to follow the same religious
practices. That's for the older generation, times have changed, right so this
		

			is a very large population of Muslims. Sometimes they have very serious doubts about Islam itself.
But they don't see it. And they don't see it because if they see it, their, their mother will have a
heart attack. So they they keep it inside, they'll their mother will say go Jamar time tomorrow time
job, right? So they'll go to genre, and they're sitting there, why am I sitting here, it doesn't
make any sense. I just want to get back to work. But I'm here because my mom or my dad, or my
brother, or whoever, or everybody's going, everybody from the office is going, I'll go to but I
don't really care. So there, these are the Muslims on the edge. And this is a very, very large
		

			population of Muslims. They're very large population of Muslims. Okay.
		

			The second category is Muslims seeking answers. These are Muslims who used to be on the edge, like
the first group, but something woke up inside them. And they decided, no, I want to be consciously
Muslim. I want to know about my religion. I feel like this is the truth, and I want to understand it
better.
		

			The problem with this group of Muslims is that they wish to learn about Islam, but they are because
they're coming from the edge. The language they speak, the language that they're used to, the
culture that they're used to is almost like the non Muslim cultures. So they have a very hard time
adjusting in Islamic environments. So even when they want to learn about Islam, they feel a little
bit awkward coming into a masjid and sitting in a halacha. Because this is not, they've never said
in something like this before. This is not their scene. They're very comfortable in the lobby of a
hotel. They're very comfortable even at a bar. But they're a little bit awkward inside the masjid or
		

			the Islamic convention, or if they see too many beards, and too many hijabs, they get a little
intimidated. Like, these guys are all way too more, much more Islamic. And I'm just starting, and
they're already super level 10. And I'm basically at zero. So they, they feel like they don't know
where to begin.
		

			They also feel like the rest of the Muslims who are practicing, they judge them a lot.
		

			So even though they want to learn, they feel judged, and they feel they don't fit. So they are left
with only one choice, they're going to find their Islam online.
		

			So instead of finding Islam physically, in a masjid, in a HELOC, or somewhere else, they're going to
go online, and search and find videos. And then of course, whoever they they end up liking their
watch more and more of their content. That's what's happening with the second group. So the first
group was Muslims on the edge. And the second group is Muslims that are seeking Muslims that are
seeking. Now there's a third group,
		

			this third group, and there are more groups when I'm only talking about three groups. There are many
more groups, but I wanted to focus in this talk. So the third group, I will say is Muslims with
harsh views. This is what I will call them Muslims with harsh views. So what happens is somebody was
seeking and they found online somebody who's teaching Islam and they started with a this makes
sense. And they started listening to them and listening to them and listening to them. And when they
listened to them, they said, This is the rightest lab. This person has the right Arpita this person
has the right understanding of Sharia, they have the right understanding of sunnah. So they give
		

			their complete trust to this, follow the person they're following this influencer online, the shake
online, whoever, or a group, and then they've developed a view that this is the right way and
everybody else is wrong. Everybody else is going to jahannam these are the only people that are
saved. And it's on. On every issue. It's not even, like overall on every single issue. So it could
be like for example, they develop an idea about how long the beard should be too late. For example,
right now, if somebody doesn't fit their definition of the length of the beard, they are part of
Johanna they are made for you know, this is a encouter Sana This is DataCo Sana this is, you know an
		

			ad BB even you know, wajib something like they're going to develop those harsh, harsh harsh views.
Their views could be about the rights of the wife. There could be about the beard, it could be about
clothing, it could be about the definition of halal and haram it could be anything, but they start
developing very, very harsh views. And because they develop harsh views, these people are not fun to
live with.
		

			So they develop a lot of problems in their family and among their friends, they become more and more
isolated. Okay, because their family sees them as too extreme. So now I've given you three groups of
people. This is the these three
		

			populations exist in the millions and millions and millions. This is not one person. Each one of
these is hundreds of millions of people. So this, understanding this, and what to do about this is a
very serious global problem. Right. And sometimes when people talk about global problems and global
solutions, we think about government level policy level funding level issues. But at the at the end
of the day, actually, the global structures are made up of individuals and individuals have these
tendencies. So I'm going to suggest some things for each of these groups. I don't have the complete
solution. I don't think anyone does. But we can think about some solutions for each of these groups
		

			to help with this problem. So the first group, if you remember, was Muslims on the edge. There are
two things I think we can do. Muslims on the edge should be engaged in conversation about why they
are Muslim to begin with. Why they're Muslim, because right now the answer for them is I'm Muslim,
because my parents were Muslim. That's their answer right now. Okay. Or their answer is, I don't
know.
		

			I just maybe because my luck was I was born in Malaysia, that's why I'm Muslim. If I was born in
India, maybe I would have been Hindu. If I was born in England, maybe I would have been Christian.
Like, so they're just saying, I don't really know why. For that category of people, we need to
create material resources, that even if they're not seeking it, because they're not trying to learn
about Islam, so they're not going to come to Islam, Islam has to go to them. Right? This is not this
is basically to believe, getting the message out to them. Okay, because if you invite them to a
conference, or you invite them to a program, or you invite them to a Halacha, no, thank you, not
		

			interested. That's not what I want. So we have to figure out a way of getting something to them onto
their device, into their ear, onto you know, in some way in the media and the subject matter should
be, I think it should be revolving around the foundations of Islam, meaning, why should we believe
Islam is the right religion?
		

			Why should we believe Quran is from Allah from God? Why do we believe this is the correct way of
life?
		

			Why is this in the Drina and Allah Alyssa, why? And it needs to be presented in language that
doesn't sound Islamic. This is important. Because if you sound Islamic, they change the channel in
their brain. They don't want to hear Islamic language, because they're not they're not interested.
So the message has to be presented, but it has to be presented in language that they can understand
and relate to. So it's not the language of the Halacha. And it's not the language of the hotbar
because that language is for Muslims who are already ready to listen. These are people that are not
ready to listen. I example of this from the Quran is slow to the ideas.
		

			When Allah revealed what idea to Bob huff and Moriarty called half a movie, lots of ideas. Everybody
knows here you guys are more knowledgeable than I am, is about horses. This is about horses running
fast. It has nothing to do with Accra.
		

			It has nothing to do with hate. It has nothing to do with alarm Allah saleha nothing. There's no
There's no in Tsar or timesheet there is no need. There is no that Allah and Allah there's no
there's no there's no nothing in the IATA good idea to have fun Moriarty called her fun movie. Lots
of Thornaby Hidaka for Sultana be hegemon five hours that have no no message in them except horses
running that's it. But you know what for the Arabs of that time they loved horses
		

			so when they hear what are the last half of Moriarty they're watching the trailer of an action
movie.
		

			Whoa, what are the RT love? Ha I like it. Moody articles How will tell you then what happened for
the movie dot word for 34 satrapy Jama. So they were Allah spoke to them in what you can call non
Islamic language. You see, and he got there and then he gave the drop the message in the lid santa
clara de la canoed. Right. So this is actually a Quran based strategy for people that don't want to
listen. And we have to develop that kind of media where they're watching and they don't even know.
Wow, this is pretty amazing. This is pretty amazing. And then at the end, you just, you get the
message out. I'll give you a shaytani example of this too. Okay, I shaytani example of this is a TV
		

			show. Very famous TV show. I don't think it's running anymore. It's called House
		

			Okay, houses about a very intelligent, brilliant doctor who works at a hospital, who, no, no other
doctors can solve the patient problem, the patient is about to die. Nobody can solve this problem.
And this guy always figures out somehow what the diagnosis is every test has failed. Every analysis
has failed. Not they can't find the problem. He finds the solution. And you know what? When people
are about to die in the hospital, if they're a Christian, then they bring the priest. If they're
Muslim, then the Imam comes. If they're if they're Jewish, then the rabbi comes and everybody's
praying because the person is dying, or they're making dua, they're reciting Quran reading the
		

			Bible. Rosemarys, whatever, right? And this guy, this Dr. House is a hardcore atheist. He's atheist.
He makes fun of all these people that are praying for the patient. Okay, the whole show several
seasons is about how stupid religion is and how stupid people of any faith are. And how smart people
because he's the smartest one, how smart people can solve problems. And religious people are just
looking for prayer because they they believe in fairytales. Okay? It is the best Dawa to atheism in
years. It's amazing Dalit atheism. But it's not a lecture by an atheist professor, presenting an
atheistic mess. It's a really interesting, intelligent, well produced TV show. And it's got the
		

			message embedded within. Well, we need to do the same thing. For the Muslims on the edge. We need to
present the message of Islam, in a sense without presenting the message of Islam. Right. So that's
the first category. The second category I said, people that are seeking, right there, they decided
they want to learn more about Islam. They're not really fitting in the masjid environment, the
Halaqa is too intense for them. They're going to find answers were online. Let me tell you the
challenge with online and this is after meeting with several scholars, even government agencies
around the world, there's a problem. The problem is online, you can end up finding something very
		

			good. Or you can end up finding something extremely problematic.
		

			And extremism in religion sells. Actually Hindu extremism is very good sales. Christian extremism,
good sale, Islam based extremism, really good sales. So what happens online with extreme groups,
extremist groups, for example, groups that wanted to have young people join ISIS, for example,
around the world, they actually developed a media strategy they showed Oh, first we're going to make
really nice videos about aka Roseanne, the John The coming of the MADI, the Black Flag, you know,
all of this Yeah. And people really want to watch these videos. So Han Allah was also tell them said
this, and a young 17 year old is watching this, then they'll connect it they'll they'll the next set
		

			of videos is going to be the importance of Hijra in Islam.
		

			And is this kids already watching this channel is like, oh, yeah, Hijra? Yeah, we have to make
Hedra. And you have to have, you have to become people of Africa, and you have to leave dunya. And
then your family is a fitna for you. And so they'll have these videos. And the first one was really
small and interesting, then the next one makes you a little bit more extreme. Next one little bit
more extreme. Next one little bit more extreme, until they've successfully brainwashed after five,
six videos and is forced on you to pack your bags, get your passport and make a job. And there's a
there's a trend that's called a funnel in marketing, they call this a funnel. So the people that are
		

			looking for Islam online, they're looking for innocent reasons. But there are many attempts to to
direct them in different directions, you understand. And depending on the algorithm, if people have
done their good work in marketing and building their algorithm, they can take them in any multitude
of directions. I just give you an example of violent extremism. But this could be somebody wants
them to head towards one group, or one jump or one cult or one, whatever, they can push them in that
direction. Right? And so the population online, or this, this huge population that is seeking
answers. We are not if we don't give them real solutions on the ground. And the internet is far too
		

			dangerous. There's far it's too dangerous. And you know, and I'm not I'm a beneficiary of the
internet, like a lot of people only know me because they Googled something about the Quran, and they
found my videos and all of that, right, but they can just as easily find somebody else. And, you
know, and ended up in some very crazy ideas. Right? So what has to happen for this group is we have
to understand what it is that they need. What it is that they're afraid of, they're afraid of being
judged. They need a message that is simple so they can start at the basic steps and then go up
		

			going up and up and up and up. They're seeking but they're not advanced yet. There's a woman, she
wants to become more Islamic. She's not wearing hijab yet. But she wants to learn. She's taking her
first steps. If she walks in and people just say, you have to wear hijab, it's far on day one, she's
gonna walk away and never come back. You just lost a customer. Right? You have to grow that develop
that customer until they are ready. Right? So you know this also I said I'm was given the, the the
example,
		

			in sorbitol at the end, right? Uh, huh. Raja Shah, who Zara who started levar festival, I know Sue
Sophie. Lewis, also Salam is describing Allah is describing this also salam and the Sahaba, like a
plant that grows and matures. These are like very weak plants, very delicate plants that need to be
grown and matured. So we have to create those kinds of social environments, and learning
environments where people that are seeking can actually meet knowledgeable people, they can meet
others, they can meet a support group. And they can develop that easily. And they don't feel
intimidated that everybody else is so much more Muslim than me, I feel out of place, they are in
		

			need of this. And we are in need of providing that kind of an environment. For such groups. Even if
we cannot do this inside of the masjid, or inside of the Islamic University, maybe we can do this at
a cafeteria. Maybe we can do this in the university lounge. Maybe you can use this in open safe
spaces, public spaces, but those kinds of spaces need to be created and encouraged so that those
people can also have a chance, I was really happy to see that I had when I had done my story Night
event here. And I had done a large story Night event in Jakarta. A lot of people came a lot of men
and women came so many of them were non Muslims. And many of them were not observing hijab and all
		

			of that, and I was happy to see them. Some people saw that and said, stop for Allah, women are not
wearing hijab, and I was like Alhamdulillah, those women that are even not wearing hijab or here,
even because they're taking the step, we don't know where they are in their journey, that's our cup
would not have gone unterberg. So this is it, this is a solution that is needed. Because if we don't
provide that solution, the internet will provide its own alternatives. So it's a very dangerous
track to go down. Now the third one, this is I think the third one is where this office. And
institutions like these can really help disturb Muslims with harsh views. Muslims with harsh views
		

			believe they understand the Sunnah.
		

			They believe this, that hadith says this is what it means.
		

			And they don't have a lot of deep knowledge. Because you can only have harsh views, when you don't
have deep knowledge. And they believe that anybody who disagrees with them doesn't have real
knowledge.
		

			What needs to happen with those kinds of groups is instead of targeting the group, you have to
target the issue.
		

			If it's here, if it's bail, if it's mostly a car, whatever issue it is, whatever the issue is, you
have to as as scholars in the country, they have to get together and look at all the different views
on it, and get even, you know, representatives of the different views, and have a discussion about
the evidences, and present the solution to the ideas. And say, This is what the scholars have said,
this is our attitude towards each other. These are the differences that have existed for this long
the people who hold this view or this the people who hold this view or this and we respect all of
them.
		

			If something is based on HMR it's HMR we can't change that. But if there's an issue that's masala
fee, then we should not pretend that there's a Jamar when it's mustard a fee. It's it's more Salafi,
you know, and if we can create those kinds of discussions and then target especially the harsh
audience, and say, by the way, this thing that you think is the lead is not the lead
		

			or you're saying this is absolutely so he actually it's not it's like you know, like for example,
nourish an example of this is because marriage and divorce are sensitive topics, right? A lot of
times people develop very strong views about it without looking at the situation. Sometimes divorce
is because there are Mufti sitting here. You guys know sometimes divorce is the best solution. It's
anathema from Allah. Other times it's to you're rushing to judgment. But if you just start with in
Allah halali And Allah Tala, if you start with that, first of all the narration is not that strong.
		

			And the Quran is saying we're any other Farakka Yoni Allahu coulomb insanity. Yeah. So what are we
doing? We take this narration, which is not even say it's actually very a lot of color on this
hadith and we put it above even the ayat of the Quran.
		

			And then somebody who's coming with a real problem in their marriage. We're saying to them in
Guadalajara, Allah and Allah Tala.
		

			Now this is a lack of hikma. And this is where Allah, Allah have a big role to play a huge role to
play. Because a lot of times these narrations are being misused to create more and more and more
harsh views. And that is a misrepresentation of Sharia. It's a misrepresentation of the Sunnah. And
the only people who can defend against that are the scholars of the Shetty, er, and the scholars of
the Sunnah. And that's where even even people like myself are not even qualified. We're not even at
that level. But the 50s and the fuqaha, they have to now expose these conversations. Sometimes I'll
be frank with you, sometimes I get a chance to have dinner with a movie, or a group of movies. And
		

			we have just sitting chatting on the dinner table, and we have the most amazing conversation, right
on some issue.
		

			And I say, Man, the public doesn't know, you guys are so cool. Because when you come in front of the
camera, you're just Hamdulillah.
		

			And you're very formal. And nobody knows that you actually have some really incredible insights and
discussions and debate, those dinner conversations that you have with each other on issues, they
need to be filmed. I'm telling you, when that stuff gets filmed, and that stuff gets out the public
changes that harshness starts, extremism starts going down. So those are just some thoughts about
the trends that I've seen in in many Muslim countries and in many Muslim communities. And I'm almost
sure that those same trends, some level of that exists here too, because it's a worldwide problem.
It's not specific to Malaysia, it's actually worldwide. And there is something that we can do to
		

			address that and to help the Ummah come closer and closer to one another and actually become on
button Wacka like Eliza. So those are just some few thoughts that I wanted to share. There's a
couple that I'm already laid out, and if there are any questions or anything or comments, I'd love
to hear them inshallah. So we Malaysia, luckily, we have, suddenly esthetician Islam institution,
which is control and manage Muslim mentors, and do a talisman to avoid the deviation of religions.
So how about the Muslim community community in non Muslim countries like America and UK?
		

			Yeah, I think I'm sure they're
		

			facing some challenges, which is, for example, Unity fatwas
		

			decision of Islamic scholars, which is facing a diverse diversity of opinion and *.
		

			Yeah. So, which is I, from my experience, I was living in England for four years for a celebration,
we celebrate.
		

			And me and my neighbors, we are celebrating I in different days, so we might miss my family
celebrating today and my neighbors. So everything tomorrow, so you can can you share for us about
your experience how to deal with this problem? Yeah, yeah. So exactly located and mercy for your
question.
		

			So the Muslim experience in minority countries is completely different from the Muslim experience in
majority countries. And there is no central regulating authority. There is no scholar that everybody
says once this pathway is given, everybody will accept this fatwa. It's not even by sighs like the
biggest Masjid says Adas tomorrow. The small machine says, oh, yeah, we think it's the day after
tomorrow. Sometimes they'll say it's the day after tomorrow only because the big ones had its
tomorrow.
		

			So the this is not something that I think can be solved the fatwa regulation in a Muslim minority
community, I don't think it's possible to solve it. Because in especially in Western countries, we
have this concept of freedom of religion, right. So everybody has their own idea. And they have the
right to choose whatever freedom or religious expression they want to choose.
		

			I do believe, though, that my advice in the Muslim community in America, for example has been that
if your community is celebrating, eat on a certain day, just go with the community. And if
somebody's like, you know, we're all Muslim in the end. So if there's one regulation, one authority
that says it's this day, it's okay, you can give up your faith for the, for the better of the larger
community. Right. So I think that that's more and more of that is starting to happen. Now. I don't
know about the Europeans as much but at least in America, there's more and more united like the
major mustards for example the city I live in, in Dallas, the the massager get together the IMA get
		

			together they say, You know what, we're gonna have
		

			Have a joint decision on read or start of Ramadan or whatever. And they'll they'll do that together.
That doesn't mean the whole city follows but at least a major Islamic centers follow. And we have to
know also that these, these massages and these, these are all private institutions, none of these
are government or regulated or a large authority kind of body. And even if they form a body of
Imams, or something like that, it's still a very informal institution, it's our government
recognized in any way. So it doesn't really have any authority. So it's, it has authority so long as
Muslims respect, okay, this group is respectable, we're gonna go with their opinions. So that's the
		

			reality of it. And, but I also think that
		

			issues like the start of Eid and the start of Ramadan and things like that they, I realize living in
America, I realized that is not the real definition of unity.
		

			Like you can have one, people sweat celebrating Eid on Saturday, and other one is celebrating on
Sunday. Right? But they can still be a very united community because they're doing good things
together. So a difference in difference in fatwa or FIP doesn't actually, in my opinion, constitute
division in the OMA division is something deeper inside the hearts. There are people praying in the
same slough and they hate each other. That's division. Right people are saying salam Salam aleikum,
wa Rahmatullah salam ala Cortana in the masjid and they don't know each other, and don't care about
each other. That's division. That's real division. So I think that our definition of unity needs a
		

			deeper look, actually, so allow you to add on lack of a higher
		

			insights on how to deal with Islamophobia. Based on your maybe experience from from the United
States.
		

			Is there some phobia here?
		

			It maybe it's not as, as critical as in the United States or in the Europe, but there are certain
groups of people who maybe felt, you know, very,
		

			quite afraid of what is, what is being preached, what is being taught in the masjid, maybe even
dimension of Islam frightens certain parts of society.
		

			I think that's our fault.
		

			What people don't know enough about when you don't know a lot about something, then you can be
scared of it easily.
		

			Right? So the branding, the branding of Islam, was supposed to be done by us. It was supposed to be
done by me and you, right, I go to I go to a library in Minnesota, and talk about the Quran with a
bunch of Americans, non Muslims, right. And I don't try to talk about how we're not crazy. We're not
trying to blow you up. I don't have a bomb in my belt. I don't say any of that. I just talked about
the Quran. And its relationship with the Bible. And its history, and its beauty, and all of it. And
you know, what, two minutes into the conversation there. Like?
		

			He's not extreme.
		

			This is what it was seems like he could speak.
		

			But they're not they're not great. Where's this camel?
		

			So
		

			the idea is that we should, we should present a positive narrative of Islam. And the truth is, there
are people that are saying scary things in the name of Islam. That's the truth.
		

			And if you've heard one or two of those things, and you're going to be scared, if you go online and
listen to some things that are being said, In the name of Islam, I get scared. Like, I have that
guy's Islamophobia. Because what they're saying is crazy. That's crazy. And any reasonable human
being would think that's crazy. So we do have to present the message of our religion. We shouldn't
assume that because you're living in a Muslim country. Everybody should know what Islam is. No, they
don't. You know, I was, I'm born Muslim. I've lived my childhood through the year.
		

			And I moved to the United States. And I did not know anything about the Quran until I decided to
learn it myself after high school, after going through a phase of atheism. And I'm a product of the
Muslim world first. So there's hundreds of millions like me, that can be raised in the Muslim world
and are as confused about Islam as some white kid in Wisconsin in America, just as confused because
they don't have a connect a direct connection. So Islamophobia starts winning, when we don't make
public engagement accessible. I'll say one quick thing about this that I think again, solutions are
important, right? So I can identify the problem. We should identify the solution.
		

			Education is not the solution. People easily give that in speeches and talks, we must provide
education. Listen, education is boring.
		

			Nobody wants education. No, no, no to
		

			He just says, Okay, fine time for education. I didn't say it. You didn't say it when we were
teenagers. You know what's interesting tiktoks Interesting. Instagrams interesting. You know why?
Because it's short. And it's entertaining. And it's enriching.
		

			What do we have to do to present to undo the phobia? We have to present Islam in the way that the
world is consuming, enriching material. When they consume enough of that, then they will want to
watch something that's 10 minutes long. When they consume that, then they'll come towards education.
The first step first step is enrichment. Then there's awareness, then there's education. The problem
is we keep providing education, nobody comes.
		

			And then we say, How come nobody comes from providing so much education? Yeah, because you're not
interesting.
		

			Cuz nobody cares about you. And we're going to be we're going to spend billions of dollars and make
an Islamic channel it's the most boring channel look, even though Islamic guy changes the channel
		

			nobody wants to see that. You see, which is why I was saying about the show, right? But the house
show it's entertaining, but it's got a message. If you want to reach the people, you've got to reach
them at their frequency then if not, some of them small percent of them will come towards education.
The first step is not education. The last step is education. We have to concern ourselves with the
first two steps before that. Well, you know, I was I was doing my story Night event I did not use
any masala Tafseer I didn't say call up Luca Thea collagen or Abbas, you know, an hour nakusha who
had no issue. I didn't say any of this stuff. I was just it's like a comedy night. I'm just telling
		

			the story. I'm cracking jokes, and somebody came to me said you don't use any rain. Where's the
room?
		

			And I was like, not here. That's in the tafsir program. That's when I do education. That's the time
for that this is not the time for education. This is the time for enrichment. These people need that
step then they'll come to the next step then they'll come to the next step. Hollywood masala country
recording. We have to we have to we understand that now it's time to to be correct. We have to apply
that now. The application will be we have to create really interesting media really interesting
engagement that anybody the non Muslim would want to watch it and what's what's the how do you know
we're doing it right? If your 12 year old is interested, you succeeded.
		

			If you had to force them, you failed.
		

			easy formula. So we have to study the 12 year old girl and understand what what is it that interests
a 13 year old a 14 year old what is it that interests them and until we produce what interests them
we're failing inshallah
		

			not we're failing inshallah we
		

			will we will succeeded.
		

			I hope you guys enjoyed that video clip. My team and I have been working tirelessly to try to create
as many resources for Muslims to give them first steps in understanding the Quran all the way to the
point where they can have a deep, profound understanding of the Quran. We are students of the Quran
ourselves. And we want you to be students of the Quran alongside us. Join us for this journey on
bayyinah tv.com Where 1000s of hours of work have already been put in, and don't be intimidated.
It's step by step by step so you can make learning the Quran a part of your lifestyle. There's lots
of stuff available on YouTube, but it's all over the place. If you want an organized approach to
		

			studying the Quran beginning to end for yourself, your kids, your family, and even among peers. That
would be the way to go sign up for being a tv.com