Haitham al-Haddad – Uyghur Tribunal Vice Chair interviewed

			Okay, Mr. Veg, here we are in a church house in the second day of the week tribunal. So how it is
going so far? Well, it's gone very well. We've seen about 1516 witnesses, some fact witnesses and
some expert witnesses. All the technology has worked, which is amazing. Yeah, we've had witnesses
from Turkey and interpreters from the US and witnesses from the US. So, so far, so good. Okay. Let
me ask you a question. What is the outcome? What do you try to achieve of the tribunal? While we're
simply seeking the truth, based on evidence, and on evidence alone? So once we've received all the
evidence considered all the facts, will make a determination, in fact, and then in law, and then
		

			it'll be for others to use that for whatever purposes they feel fit. And that may include
governments, it may include corporations, it may include institutions, including academic art, and
also may include private individuals. Yeah. So the outcome is just to
		

			prepare a report for whoever wants to use it with politicians, whether academics will, whoever it
will require, depending on the judgment, and we have no idea what the judgment is going to look like
at the moment. It may require all those people to consider how they interact with the Republic of
China. Okay.
		

			To be honest with you, I didn't see much media. Is this intended, you did not want media to cover
the Tribune, although we had a lot of media. Did you look upstairs? Yeah. Well, now we've got a lot
of we've had a lot of media coverage. We I don't know whether, for example, Al Jazeera or
international? Yes, there was a piece from Algeria today. Yeah. Okay. Excellent. Excellent. Okay. I
was worried that it was not fully covered by the international media.
		

			A lot of
		

			ITV coverage, two days ago, BBC, and so on. Okay. There is another question. I know that they're
trying to be a critical question, but we need to be, you know, some people say that, why now? The
Uighur the Uyghurs
		

			situation is a matter of concern for Western countries for America and for the UK, but they have
been suffering for ages. So is there any political reason behind it behind the the timing for this?
		

			So we are completely nonpolitical. We have no interest in what politicians or anybody else does or
doesn't do. The timing for us was simply because we were invited by the world with your congress to
form this tribunal last year. And that's what we've done. So they invite you here. And there would
not be appropriate for us to start with this without an invitation from the weaker people. Okay, so
far. So I think we have completed two days. So, so far, how do you see things going? Do you see that
there was like, what we call genocide against the, the leaders there, or it is too early to we
couldn't I couldn't possibly comment on that right now. And only way we we don't have to we have to
		

			see all the evidence and then we will consider the facts and then we will consider the law and then
that will be the appropriate moment. To to, to disclose whatever it is, whatever do you have someone
from or represent the Chinese government? We've invited the PRC on four occasions so far to come and
give evidence. So far, they have declined, but we will continue to Yes. Well, no, they have not
declined. They just haven't responded. So we have no idea. But we will continue to invite them and
if they wish to come and give evidence that will be very, very important to the tribunal. Because if
we want to talk, I'm trained as a judge and I do judging. You need to listen to both sides, because
		

			someone might criticize you because so far the evidence that we have heard is just one sided. So
they might say, Well, wait, is it the other side? Yes, I'm will consider all evidence that comes our
way and including from the People's Republic of China. Okay. Okay. I think any other question? I
think that is very clear.
		

			Chinese authorities indicated that some somehow displeased or
		

			speaking out against this or as a complaint to kind of, as you know, they've sanctioned so
		

			Jefferey and the weaker tribunal. So we of course,
		

			make no judgment about that it makes no difference to the way we conduct this tribunal or indeed on
the outcome.
		

			Will there be any recommendation to the British government after this after the report? Now,
Nielsen, we will make no recommendations that will be an overreach. So we will purely provide a
judgement based on fact, evidence and law.
		

			We are not advocates. We are absolutely not advocates nor are we activists. We are just some
independent body, providing insofar as a impartial determination. I think that's okay. Thank you
very much. Thank you very much, and we hope all the best. Thank you very much. Thank you. Very good
job. I think we're halfway along day 14. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.