Yasir Qadhi – Islamic Finance Q&A

			Bismillah Alhamdulillah wa salatu salam ala Rasulillah Ali, he was a happy woman who Allah Hamad Al
Hamdulillah. We're very honored and pleased to have a colleague, a friend and mentor of mine,
somebody who have known 15 years or at least six plus, plus
		

			for quite a while that hamdulillah and I have benefited from immensely from his lectures and we meet
almost annually at the annual conference and he is one of the members and the Executive Committee of
the American Muslim jurists Association. But a more formal introduction. Dr. Mann al cola is an
experienced Lecturer in Islamic Studies, in his teaching career here has provided an instruction and
training to many hundreds and 1000s of students and even scholars across the world, and he has
served as an imam of several Islamic centers throughout the United States. Additionally, he is
certified as a half of the whole Quran with an ijazah to teach unto others. He obtained his PhD in
		

			2004 in science and technology of economics in Islam from the American Open University, and before
that, he received his master's in Islamic Studies from Yarmouk University in Jordan and his
Bachelor's in economics from an Azad University Islamic economics from the University in Elkhart,
Hira and he has. He is currently the assistant professor of Islamic Studies in the American Open
University and an imam of mass KT Center in Houston, Texas, and he is the acting academic dean at
the American Islamic University and a research assistant in Yarmouk University. The main courses
that our chef teaches at the University deal with Islamic fit, and especially Islamic economics. And
		

			it is a speciality that he has written a number of papers about and he has given a number of photos
as well, in the American Muslim jurists Association. I'm Jeff, and he is well known for preaching
and teaching and lecturing about Islamic finance. So we welcome him to our community. This is your
first time here correct? Second time, the second time where was I when you came the first time
thanks two years ago, three years ago before I was not here that I missed out on so my by this is
your second time at Epic and inshallah it will be the second of many, many more times at Hamlet.
Thank you for so chef Anna, we will get directly to the point everybody is very interested in
		

			Islamic finance. But I'm going to ask a very technical question. My first question to you sheriff.
Anna, can you please define what is from our perspective Riba? And why is it about so problematic?
So what is the technical definition of Riba? And why is it so problematic? According to our Sharia
900 out of blood, I mean, almost nobody was selling more Vatika Muhammad Ali, he was obvious main
lamona were over Nebula was a in a flap and I will help with the vein and Avena Coleman I will have
to antiviral fats from our nadat. When it comes to Reba, we have different categories. If Reba if
you go to any classical book, you will read about triple fatherland ribbon NASA and ribbon sia and
		

			the Reebok pom and ribbon code. To be honest with you, it's very confusing for the regular common
reader because the vast majority of those definitions and practical examples captured on those facts
books do not exist nowadays. You read for example, exchanging wheat for barley or date foods for
data fruit, right? Those examples are absolutely correct, but they are very, very relevant to our
society. And this is actually where the confusion is coming from for an average Muslim American who
lives in this society wants to like you know, conduct transactions according to the Sharia, without
being involved in riba let me just answer the question, the rebar that that we are referring to in
		

			the American society is the most severe level of river, which is something prohibited according to
all my their head all the time, which is a big deal, it says it is the is the premium or premium,
that has to be paid by the borrower to the lender, along with the principal amount, either as a
condition for the loan or for the extension of its maturity. Very, very simple example, you go to
Bank of America or to chase and you apply for $100,000 Personal Loan or investment loan or student
loan, whatever, you know, from day one that this is a loan, and you have to pay it back plus a
certain amount, right? Could it be APR, it could be a lump sum, it could be flat feet, what I mean
		

			whatever the formula they use might be. So we have we have a principal amount and we have surplus,
or premium on top of the amount
		

			Why it is problematic from a Sharia perspective? When I mean, this is a very good question. You take
a loan from the bank, for example, and the bank charges you let's say 3% or 5% interest, you take
that money, you indulge it in a business, you make a profit 10 15%, right? You will pay the
principal, you will pay the interest and you keep the rest for yourself. If everybody is happy, if
it is a win win situation, then why Allah subhanaw taala is still prohibiting Riba? It's a very good
question. Well, the example that I just mentioned, is just one example of different examples that do
happen in the real life. Sometimes you make believe it or not, you're here. So you make not 100%
		

			profit, you make 10,000% profit, it does happen in real life, and I'm responsible for what I say,
right? It's absolutely unfair to give the bank only three or four or 5% APR or interest and you keep
the rest of the profits for yourself. It did happen especially the last year in March 2020 Just a
few days before the pandemic started you know, hurting the economy in the USA, that that you are
unable to make profit for sure, because the whole economy actually got frozen, you are unable even
to maintain your your principal, right, you lost the principal, the principal amount, you know, the
amount that you took the loan that you took from the bank has been lost because of the economy and
		

			by the law of the land, the bank is still actually can go after you and ask for the principal amount
and ask for the interest on top of it. So, in both cases, there is a lot of injustice
		

			happen in the real life, sometimes real exploitation, when the bank is not taking any risk
whatsoever. Okay, the bank actually is shifting just putting the risk in your shoulder, here is the
loan you do whatever you want, okay, you will make a profit you are your, your break even you incur
loss, we do not care about you here is $100,000 you bring it back next year 150,000. After two years
106,000 This is absolutely unfair because the bank is not taking any liability or responsibility or
risk, if you wish with the other party. And this is this is why Islam actually is a strictly
standing against riba because of the injustice actually implemented in the Islamic finance system.
		

			If you go to Islamic Chase Bank or Islamic Bank of America, for example, and you apply for a loan,
they would say, Well, we do not have money for you. We do not we don't give you a loan here, you are
in the wrong place. If you want to finance for your business, let's sit down and talk business.
Right you want to build a house there are something called Moraga or Masaryk or Ijarah you want to
construct a building there is something called a Cessna.
		

			You want some cash money to upgrade your business there's something called Mudaraba. So, we sit down
together and we discussed business and we go with the model technically called risk sharing model
versus the risk shifting model right the prevailing economic finance system is going with with with
the shift with the with the risk shifting model, you take the money you are by your own within us
care about you, okay, the Islamic finance goes with the risk sharing model, we are partners, if
there is any profit, everybody enjoys the profit, if there is any loss acid everybody will be will
be losing. So you see the huge difference between the injustice implemented and happen in real life
		

			when you go with the traditional system versus the justice and the fairness that Allah subhanaw
taala actually is calling for through the prohibition of riba. So chef it is can we say therefore,
that even though the general rule is that any transaction the two parties agree to is halal if it is
done by mutual consultation? Allah azza wa jal has made a specific mutual consultation haram even if
they both agree, and that is Riba. And that is because the Riba by its nature is exploitative, can
we say something like this? That's absolutely correct. We have a lot of flexibility when it comes to
conducting business and partnership, transaction between people, we have a lot of flexibility. Go
		

			ahead and do whatever you want. As long as you are staying away from riba as long as it is proven
that no one is advancing money to somebody else. And that's a principle and it's retail or
guaranteed, right? This is actually the most fundamental component that we have to take into
consideration. As you know,
		

			there is a lot of that has to be avoided. There's uncertainty that has to be avoided, but the most
like the most prohibited and the most important matter that we have to pay attention to, is to stay
away from riba which is which is a kind of exploitation and social can we also then define the Riba
or at least the type that we are most interested in is every loan
		

			That guarantees some type of benefit upon the lender is a type of Riba. colocado, camelphat and
fortiva. Yeah, every every loan brings a stipulated benefit to the to the lender, not to the
borrower, the lender. Yeah, yeah, the lender will be counted as, as Riba. When we say stipulated
benefit, it is with the understanding that the lender actually is not taking any risk. Yes, or of
its own business. Exactly. Absolutely. It is a loan loan means that you are by by your own, take the
money, do whatever you want, I don't care about to come back after one year you pay me the principal
and the interest and I can go after you by the law of the land, because that is the agreement
		

			between you and I, that is that is the Rebbe jolla photography. So chef, can you give us some
examples of riba based transactions here in America, and however much time you want to spend,
everybody always asks about the issue of mortgages? So can you summarize your position about
mortgages in this? So examples of Riba and what do you think of the reality of the mortgage
situation?
		

			In America once once we comprehend the definition of free will, the challenge that we are facing
here actually, is to implement that definition? And to figure out whether a certain transaction does
involve riba or not right, this is the challenge that we are facing here. I'll give you an example.
What is the difference between me offering us Yes, or $5,000? Loan? Right. And I asked you that you
have to pay me the 5000 5500 within one year, that's a straightforward interest bearing Well, am I
correct? Correct. Okay, what if I have decided to go to Bank of America, and I opened a savings
account, and based on the agreement that $5,000 has to be paid back to me 5500 Within one year,
		

			what's the difference between this scenario and the other scenario?
		

			Technically speaking, there is no difference. no difference whatsoever. This actually means that
opening a savings account is an interest bearing loan, believe it or not, it's not introduced to you
as an anticipating loan. But that is the nature of the agreement, right? You will give your money to
Bank of America, your principal is guaranteed your return on their investment, which is deliver as
guaranteed by the FDIC, the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation. That's actually the very
confusing part, that the vast majority of those transactions that we are getting involved in are not
introduced to us as Rieber as the extra plus a three by that we know they are like you know
		

			introduced to you otherwise. And your job as a practicing Muslim is to investigate and to unlock the
secret of the agreement and find out again, if someone is giving money, and that's money, the
principal amount and its return both are guaranteed, that is delivered that Allah subhanaw taala
prohibited whether it is called Riba in the real life or it is called otherwise we do not care. And
this actually brings to our attention shift the world known the fifth Maxim by the mafia Alebrije to
follow a coup Dilma Casa de Waal, Mani lallande al folly, Wilma, Benny, what matters and
transactions is the essence and reality not the warding or the formality. So, even if the if the
		

			charge that you are charging others or you are charged by others is introduced you as otherwise,
right, if it is if it is a premium that has to be paid on top of the principle, that is the Riba
that Allah subhanaw taala prohibited and based on that, based on that, opening a savings account,
the default rule of opening a savings account is that it is not an option because it is a straight
forward interest bearing loan. Give another example, on the deed life,
		

			you have only $500 in your in your debit card, your checking account, and you stopped by any point
of sale and you made a transaction of $700.
		

			Usually it goes through Usually it goes through. Okay, in the bank statement next month, you will
see that you have to pay back $200 And on top of that there is $35 overdraft charge, it's not the
river No, this overdraft charge. Now your job is to interpret or to unlock the secret of what
happened. When you when you do a transaction of $700 It means that you have taken $200 from the
bank, Mike Correct. Is it like a gift for you? Sure. So why did you look as we say an RV? No, it is
not right. So you have to pay back the $200 If this is the only thing you need to pay back, then we
get to go I mean, what is the concern you borrow 200 You pay it back 200 The problem here is that
		

			you pay on top of it. $35 just giving random numbers, right. That number is introduced to you and
		

			As overdraft charge, well, you borrow 200 and you paid it back or you have to pay it back. $235 You
see, well, that overdraft charge by default by default is the river that Allah subhanaw taala
prohibited. Now, you can maybe prove otherwise, I mean, there might be some justification that there
is some logistical work and paperwork has to be done like to, you know, get that to 100. That is
very possible. But the default rule is that you pay on top of the principle that you have borrowed,
that is the river that Allah subhanaw taala. prohibited. So exactly, I say can go on on maybe, you
know, you can see the pattern, you know, Chef, let's be literally give you the opposite example. How
		

			about the cashback?
		

			cashback the Discover card is where you go, you have a credit card, right? And you use it for $100.
You get $5. Cash Back, a lot of people actually say is the cash back River? Well, before you jump to
a conclusion, you need to again, unlock the secret of what's happened. What does it mean for you to
use your credit card for purchasing it means that you are borrowing money from the credit company?
Am I correct? So you borrow 100 $100? Okay, and you benefit from the $5. Right? So you borrow 100,
and you pay it back? How much 9595? No, $95 Because Because the cash back is $5. So 100 100 minus
five, that's 95. So you borrow 100, and you pay it back less. Now, this is absolutely the opposite
		

			of freewill. We just said colocado, Jarana, fanden mchardy for Horiba every loan that brings a
stipulated benefit to the lender, well, who is benefiting here, the lender or the borrower, the
borrower, the borrower. So the cash back actually is valid. And as always say that if you have any
problem with the cash back, give it to me, I mean, I'll do sell more than happy. Some people are
happy at that.
		

			Alhamdulillah but yeah, we didn't answer the issue. Sure. Hajra and Laura and mortgages I mean,
palazzetto I know this is very detailed. But if you can just summarize your anomalous position, or
yeah, we'll we'll discuss it actually in details tomorrow shall on our seminar that's between Laura
NASA from 215 to 515. Inshallah, we will be having salad and we're lucky enough to discuss it. But
to
		

			briefly briefly, what does it mean to mortgage your house? Again, you have to unlock the secrets of
the transaction before you jump to a conclusion. When you mortgage your house, you get involved in
three different transactions simultaneously, there is a sale agreement where you as a customer,
okay, buy a house from the landlord. And there is a loan agreement because of course, you do not
have half a million dollars or paid cash for the house. So you apply for a loan from the mortgage
company, that's a loan agreement, right? And there is a mortgage agreement where the mortgage
company actually puts a lien on the property to secure their money. So three different transactions
		

			are going simultaneously. Sale actually is halal mortgage according to the definition of the Quran,
and Tamara suffer and voluntary ducats even ferry handle Macola like it is the right of that is
absolutely the right of the lender to mortgage the property of the borrower to secure its money. So
mortgage agreement is fine. Sale Agreement is fine. loan agreement is not fine. Because I mean, you
borrow half a million dollars, you pay it back six or seven or even $800,000. Within 30 years, some
people get confused. They see like the name of Bank of America on the deed of trust, thinking that
oh, the bank is owning the house No, wrong us. The bank actually is the lien holder of the property,
		

			not the owner of the property. So the bank is not owning the property bank is just putting a lien on
the property to secure to secure his fund. So we ended up having three different transactions. Two
of them are halal. And one of them is haram. If you want to be like a very American democratic guy,
you go with the majority, right two against one, some are just huddled Here you go well in their
stomach finance system, it goes the other way around. Right? If it is proven that one deal is haram
within that package or combination of three different transactions, then the whole deal actually is
ruined. The whole deal actually is not, you know is not valid based on that. The default rule of
		

			mortgaging a house in the United States according to the traditional way, is not a halal option for
Muslims. Now, the chef is asking about Amgen position we do have some some attempts, okay by
different Islamic mortgage companies who try to offer an Islamic alternative. There are not in the
same level of seriousness and diligence and applying genuine and sound Islamic mortgage options. If
you go to our website I'm on
		

			Lonnie, just just Google it MJ MJ
		

			systemic mortgage companies, you will see a very long detailed declaration showing those five
different major I would say stomach mortgage companies, and the status of each one of them.
Inshallah so tomorrow you have a longer discussion on this citizenship JCF
		

			let me play not devil's advocate because we don't do civilizer But let me pay play, what do you call
them? Angels? Let me just play them what material the the person who's coming with the other
opinion, as you are aware here. So now there are a number of academics and even scholars, they are
not mainstream, but that's simply because mainstream doesn't accept them as being mainstream, but
they are rude AMA. And there are academics who are arguing that Riba and the rulings of riba have to
be rethought for fiat currency. And that is, for multiple reasons of them is the inflationary nature
of fiat currency. And there are other reasons they bring as well that these academics would say we
		

			all agree, the classical hedonic Ribba is how long we all agree, but this cash that we're using this
paper currency that we're using, given that it is different from gold and silver, and that it is
actually dealing from gold and silver, that's one argument and then the other argument, which I
think is very interesting, and that is that the value does not remain stagnant. And a long term loan
does not retain the same monetary value over the course of 20 years. So, currency by its nature is
inflationary. And so, these group of academics, some of them outright, say there is no ribbon field,
but others say that traditional field has to be rethought. And we have to have a more nuanced
		

			response to the realities of modern finance. So, without getting too technical, what is your overall
position about this yet at all this objection, right, there is a minor one and a major one, the
minor one if if we ask those scholars that academics, yes, I mean, if he has one, he does not have
an intrinsic value. And gold and silver do have How can you buy gold and silver nowadays?
		

			You have to use coin,
		

			you have to use money, right? So fiat money actually is used to purchase gold and silver, it takes
the same rules of gold and silver. So all the life rebel rules apply to gold and silver, they do
apply to fiat currency nowadays, this is actually the minor issue. The major issue here, sir,
		

			it is, it is really a fundamental one, what we believe in is that loan is not a mod to finance to
start with. So the inflation issue does not even exist, according to our theory, okay, if someone
actually is approaching me asking for $5,000 to pay for the tuition fees, or the interface
apartments, or to you know, whatever surgery or I mean, something that's really, you know,
necessary, I'll be more than happy to give him $5,000 for maybe a few weeks, few months. And a part
of that as it is that I'm willing to take, you know, to take the inflation or to incur the inflation
because giving giving alone is that is an act of devotion and charity, I give it you know, for the
		

			cause of Allah subhanaw taala So, I'm not allowed to take any single, you know, penny on top of the
principal, I give him or her $5,000 I get it back 5000 no more or no less. Right now, if that person
actually is approaching me asking for $100,000 And I know for a fact that he wants to upgrade his
business, right? Okay. Well, even if I have the you know, the $100,000 I will not give it to him. I
mean, based do not with all due respect, I'll give you $100,000 as Portugal has an interest free
loan, you take my money, right as a loan, okay, because I do not charge an interest and you're a
practicing Muslim like me, you do not you know, pay interest. You take my money, you invest it in
		

			your business for two three days, you'll make 10s of 1000s of dollars of profit. And then you come
back to me after three years giving me a big hug. Just Dr. Walker here's your money back. Seriously.
Is this a good business? Of course it is not. So if I want that you want my money to do business?
Well, let's sit down and talk and talk business we can go with Donald autobahn, right I give you the
money because I know that you are the experts in the car dealership business here is the money here
is the shirt on the condition and the situation is go ahead and work on my money on my behalf.
whatever profit you make net profit I will take. So my point to share is that
		

			inflation is an issue when it comes to giving the lawn as a more definers. Well, if we disagree on
the on this fundamental issue, that loan is not even more defined as to start with then then the
inflation issue does not exist to start with.
		

			Fair enough. Yeah, I mean, shut up.
		

			I would say theoretically or correct, but realistically, people will be taking loans for various
reasons even let's say medical school, for example, there's something of this nature where the loans
do become quite large and
		

			there is a Hajah amongst the people but you're correct from an ideal perspective, we should not be
taking large amounts of loans for business purposes or even for you go within of those like Islamic
modified depends on the nature of the business that you want to finance for. But loan I'm going to
start with is not a more defined as period. Inshallah head so move on to the second to last
question.
		

			We talked about Riba and back and forth, let's get to the broader question. Can you define what
makes Islamic finance Islamic what is Islamic about our version of Islamic finance? I'll be honest
here, a lot of people think that it's a type of numbers game or word game. The and you yourself just
said the ruling is we don't care about the words us we care about the acid we care about the
overall. And it is as if some of these Islamic mortgage companies they're taking from Fannie and
Freddie or they're taking from the same people, and they're even charging a little bit more and in
reality, it seems as if the contract is constructed all in their favor. So what exactly makes
		

			Islamic finance Islamic?
		

			Well, in the same way that we have like a Muslim family law and Muslim pin along Muslim economic
system, we do have an Islamic finance system. If you avoid like certain defects and the agreement in
which one of them are the most important one as it is riba then this is by default, understandable.
And by the way, I do not think it is fair enough to call it Islamic to start with, you can call it a
Jewish Finance, believe it or not, you can call it the Christie and finance because Allah subhanaw
taala don't have prohibited us from dealing with interest is disabled who prohibited the Jewish
community from dealing with interest, well, after the hem will rebel opposite. Look at the one. So
		

			revature is prohibited in Christianity for fact, Riba is prohibited and the Abrahamic faith, for
fact, in Judaism, for fat, so I do not mind at all, if you call it the Jewish Finance or Christian
finance, I do not mind at all, the most important thing is to make sure that you go with the just
and fair and ethically responsible, responsible finance. Now back to the maybe mortgage, Islamic
mortgage companies.
		

			What makes it Islamic or what makes it different? Well, if you are looking for a genuine sound 100%
Islamic finance practice in the USA, with those companies who deal in the secondary market, we are
wasting our time to be honest with you, you won't find it you cannot find it, period, right? Unless
you operate offline. And Hamdulillah. We do have a lot of attempts here in the US Islamic mortgage
companies who do not who do not deal in the secondary market. For those who do not know what does it
mean secondary market banks, usually mortgage companies do not have the financial ability of waiting
for you as a customer for 2030 years to pay them back the principal. They just take that out next
		

			day and they sell that contract to Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae, if it if it is worth let's say $1
million dollars, they take nine $970,000 cash and that's it and you start paying your money to
Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae again, they do not have the ability in order for them to make those
contracts. Okay, sellable to Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae they have to go with the book. So they all
actually are Freddie Mac compliant way more than to be Sharia compliant. Now, to be honest, and And
fair enough for those companies, they are not in the same level of diligence and dedication to
implement an Islamic Finance Finance model problem he or she has that problem the fundamental
		

			problem is that the whole system is an understanding one. So, in order for you to incorporate a
genuine and sound Islamic finance practice within an understanding finance it is close to
impossible, right? Because of the severe incompatibility between the two differences in this damage
one, you have to own the property you have to be alive and responsible for the property, you pay
maintenance, you pay tax, you pay insurance, can you take the risk of like any increase or decrease
in the market value and the traditional finance system you cannot do any of the above? So to do all
the above or not to do all the above? I mean, it is it is impossible. However, however, we do have
		

			some serious atoms who were able to navigate through the system and find a way that is I call it
halal enough option handling of Halal enough of a new category
		

			option versus just just like traditional mortgage on Well, I mean, if you have Halal enough versus
absolutely haram which one you go with, like back home we say that
		

			armadura llama, right? Like, you know something is better than nothing. So we do have a handler some
some attempts. Again, if you go to MJ, just Google MJ, instead of warriors company you read like a
very detailed declaration about those five major companies operating in the US. J Shekinah. It's
Friday nights, I'm going to conclude with one question shall loads. It's a bit of a blunt question
shift. But I mean, I, you are the person to ask this too.
		

			Isn't it a little bit overwhelming then like what can we do against the global financial market
then? I mean, is there any hope for us Muslims, impacting the system, the whole world functions on
Riba? The whole world is based on a version of capitalism that from its very soul and fundamentals
contradicts our ethos and our spirit, only for us, giving a loan is an act of worship right then.
And there, we changed the entire paradigm of, you know, the Western version of capitalism for us,
you know, as a business partnership. So what can we do to affect the system? I mean, we're a small
minority in this country. And even in the globe, no doubt, you know, Muslims are much larger, but
		

			still, the system is totally antithetical to us. So can we as Muslims really produce a version or a
product that is so solid, it will insha Allah to Allah, supplant and replace the other system or
maybe even make a dent in it?
		

			Well,
		

			are you talking about Muslim Muslim Muslim countries, authorities who do have the ability of
restructuring the finance system, or talking about Muslim minority in the US, let's focus about Jay
and focus on our symposium? Well, I have been in this field for for 20 years. God has, I
wholeheartedly believe that that the Muslim community in the United States does have enough
financial resources, intellectual, academic, human resources that are enough to establish our own
finance system in the United States. Wallah Do you know that that it is very very possible to
establish a federal credit union Federal Credit Union, you need maybe two or $3 million to establish
		

			it or just start at your accordingly and to start operating. In the same way that we have a lot of
challenges we have a lot of opportunities here. What we are lacking unfortunately, I wish will lie
I'm wrong, but this is this is the reality. We are lacking a vision lacking leadership, we can
establish our own our own system and I'm aware of several different attempts for example systemic
mortgage companies who operate of the system they do not deal with Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae
whatsoever very successful yes their financial capacity is very limited but at the end of the day
they produce why I mean why do not just copy and paste this this model and do it over and over? How
		

			about establishing establishing a federal credit union which is the alternative actually of the
traditional banking system? I'm aware of several LLC like different different corporations who just
to bring money from different investors and the work on the on the ground doing real estate business
or car dealership or whatever halaal business and they are doing a wonderful job we can we can chat
in the system we can on the other hand we can we can penetrate the system if we do the necessary
lobbying talking to like you know, public officials do you like doing our own we can change the
system a little bit and just establish some Sharia compliance you know,
		

			Islamic finance Institute's in the in the United States so Hamdulillah I mean, when there is a world
there is a there is a way the problem here yet is with well with the vision with the with the
leadership I tried myself and it's not a secret to establish a federal credit union And subhanAllah
I was I was like pushed back by by several not not like you know common Muslim no by several
scholars all be careful chef I mean, this is money I mean, we do not want to get involved in Why
stay away from just educate people do not I want her to like like bringing Islamic finance from the
theory to the practice. We said there's like acting as the bad guy this is haram or this is evil, I
		

			want to provide an alternative when I started working on the ground, there was like a lot of
pushback from within the Muslim community leaders Musharraf and and that's actually the the genesis
of the problem that we have.
		

			Otherwise, whereby the opportunities are there I'm, I'm responsible for what I say we can do a lot
		

			with Hamdulillah. So inshallah there is light at the end of the tunnel and inshallah Tada maybe
within within our generation Inshallah, we will be able to see a viable alternative where our youth
maybe even this people in the audience, you show them when they grow up and it's time for them to
not just get cash back but house back inshallah as well. That there will be viable alternatives to
Shala
		

			There's good news and hamdulillah Shana it's with Zack Allah said I know you've had a flight and a
long day today Zack Allah Farah for honoring us with your presence and tomorrow guys so that the
Doha inshallah be here and register and attend the class inshallah so let's me let's be can this
suggest that we do not ask questions like for tonight after I finish yeah just said all the
questions for two more like different that's why our ministry today yeah tomorrow between Laura and
Alison Shalom here inshallah I will do my best inshallah to answer questions tomorrow in sha
		

			Allah here you have dementia so when you come to panic alone
		

			zakat officials
		

			in LA Mussolini now almost Lima D one meaning Mina team one quantity now look on it that thing was
slowed in pain I was slowed in Ponte one saw the Rena was slaving over rod Do you want to for
sharing you know
		

			what unfortunately no one was watching The one downside BMP no one no downside being party was all
Amy now was all in
		

			one heavy Lina photo gentleman one Hatfield lot the ones that get enough along I guess.
		

			What's going on? I don't know hula hoop
		

			lien