Imtiaz Sooliman – A look at the economics of migration

Walk me back. You know, it's a force, the

threat, the use of threat as a force. But you don't actually use

the Force. Just, you know, we can use it if you want to, but we

don't want to use it. We don't see any more loss of life. We don't

want to see any further development of the conflict. We

ought to see the end, because one more life lost is a life lost too

much. And people inside today. You see it. They come to your

hospital. They're anxious, they tense, they're traumatized. The

kids don't know what's going on. They're hungry. At one point,

they're eating cats, they're eating rats, they're eating grass.

There's no water. They go and live on the banks of the river. And I

tell my teams, why are you putting them on the banks of the river?

When winter comes, the river is going to swell, they're going to

move again. He said, My Friend, find me a place. Where must I put

them? It's there's no safe place in Syria. For now, they'll have to

stay on the banks of the river. When the water comes. We'll worry

about the movement then, but for now, we can't do anything. And

there's migration all the time. Kids never know when they're going

to move next. I met an old lady in a school. She said, Look, I'm

staying in the school, but I now want to die because as its forces

know where the school is, you're going to bomb it soon, and you're

going to die. But I'm tired of running. It's just mind boggling.

It's just crazy. If we move to Europe now. So the fact is, these

people are on the move. There's some taking this incredibly

treacherous journey, but then we have these frontline states, so

Hungary, Greece accepting a lot of the refugees. They're feeling

burdened. Germany says the there should be a quota system. It

should be shared out. What do you think about the not the economics,

the human element of the way this is being treated and should be

treated? Look, the response is reasonably good, I would say,

given the crisis in Europe, what the bailout required for Greece?

The economy is suffering. Spain, Portugal, Ireland, you know,

Greece all had problems in in Europe and finances, the cash is

not there as it was before. And in times of all, Europe has supported

refugee situations throughout the world. And there's two issues

here, one is the government and one is the people. Germany has set

an example, both the government and the people said, Yes, welcome,

come to the country. It all depends on who has economy,

because Greece has is battling to meet the bailout. They need

bailout and not even have these refugees burning them. It's very

tragic situation. I'm not saying they must not accept refugees, but

you understand their situation. They have problems from their own

population, where austerity measures have to be taken and they

have, they have going to have revolt in their own country from

their own people. Are they going to deal with the revolt from the

people? Are they going to deal with the refugees? So if richer

countries, Britain, Australia, Germany, can take more refugees in

and and as the Pope said, please take them in your homes. Once you

take them in your homes, homes, and the civilians and the

residential population comes in and say, Okay, we will take them.

The burden is taken away from the government. I don't know if the

government say, Okay, I'll pay you 1000 euros or something for

keeping them in your house. I don't know. But if families take

them, it takes the burden off the states. And if that can be done in

Europe by more affluent people, it will help relieve the burden on

the governments. The problem, however, is, and I'm so interested

in the change of heart that's happened after the publication of

a picture of a dead little boy, which the media is cautious about,

and should be. But an incredible change, it seems, in public

sentiment. So like you say, people saying, come into our homes. But

what in years to come, when, when? Maybe the costs are rising. Maybe

there's a bit of social unrest, division, new communities rising

up. Do you think this goodwill can can last? Depends on circumstances

in the country. If the economy is get bad, it is job losses, it is

unemployment. If the Chinese Fallout causes a big problem, you

know, and shares and stock markets collapse, and you find the world

economies are we go back to 2008 it's going to be a serious crisis.

People, well, want to take care of the refugees, but they'll find the

stress of looking after them is going to become a problem. So

there's not a permanent solution. The solution really they have to

go back home, and the only way to do that is to stop the war in

Syria. And if you ask any refugee from anywhere in the world, his

country, if his country is stable, he wants to go back home. So your

hope, I guess, is that the world will focus on Syria and deal with

Syria. That that's what you're saying. That's what we have to do.

I'm saying use Europe. What has happened Europe as the door to go

back to Syria. Don't say everybody come out of Syria and go to

Europe, that's wrong. Use this as a means of educating the world and

say, You know what? We're running away from the crisis that's taking

place there. We need to refocus and get back inside there and

stops. Because, of course, Germany saying we will accept refugees

from Syria again could encourage a huge outflux. I was interested

today, an NGO, calling itself air refugees, I think, is saying, Why

should we make the ensure that the way is perilous? Why can't we set

up a charted flight? Because you won't get on a commercial flight

and help Syrians to move out. But again, then you have the problem

of a country being dead.

Summated and failing to recover in the long run. No, we're not. We're

not solving the problem. We just want to encourage more and more

people to leave. It's going to encourage further fighting in the

country. It's going to say the world is looking the other way

whilst we bombing and killing. It's giving the wrong message.

You're giving a totally wrong message to us. Attendance forces.

You have to send the world into Syria and use use the UN why is it

that this country, I mean, this is the first country in the war

situation. I don't see media in the country. When I walked into

Syria, I asked, Have I come to the right place? They said, What do

you mean? I said, when you walked into Bosnia, you saw all the

satellite dishes, the vans, the UN every type of aid agency do what?

In the middle of a war zone, you'll have to dig for them to

find them inside Syria. They're not there. It's like a silent war.

Journalists have been killed, and it's, it's scary, I guess. As

well, journalists have been killing every other war, too.

Journalists love stories. They go into war zones. They're not afraid

to go into war zones. They look for that kind of stories. For some

reason, the world has moved away from Syria, and it's a silent war.

Yeah,

there's a final thing, if we, if we talk about the economics, and I

don't know if, because I guess you're always in the battle rather

than in the aftermath, but there is a theory that that migrants, in

the end, help create vibrancy, vibrancy in the in the economy.

They are people who are very resilient. I saw a Western German

town say, come we're stagnating and we're old and and tired, we

meet our young people, Steve Jobs, the the son of Syrian migrants. Do

you see that? I guess that that human spirit? Yes, that can

happen. It depends on the type of skills the migrants bring with

them, and they bring bring screams. They can benefit the

economy. Yes, they will benefit the economy. But what millions of

people coming out. Everybody doesn't have that skill. Many of

them are women and children, which then becomes, you know, like a

burden. For a better word on on people. And then I'm afraid it may

turn around and people may get angry, as we spoke about earlier.

All right, well, we'll have to follow this dire situation. Thank

you for your insight. That was MTS Suleiman from gift of the given.