Adnan Rashid – Desperate Qadiani Cant Defend Mirzas Failed Prophecies
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AI: Transcript ©
You will have two minutes to respond to
every point we make then it will be
our turn to speak We will speak for
as long as necessary because this is a
Q&A just like your stream.
I was respecting your time It was it
was five of you And you were all
speaking and I was responding in my little
time to that.
So you will have fair time We will
know and we will not interject what we
request from you is brother Ahmad my brother
in humanity That you need to stick to
the topic the topic today is false prophecies
Oh, yes, so we have raised a question
and if you have a response, please do
put it forward We have given references that
Mirza Ghulam Ahmad Qadiani said that after his
advent as the promised Messiah Yeah, he will
he will live for 40 years.
So now over to you your two minutes
start now Allah So as I was mentioning
whenever you guys start your streams with with
with with any allegation What you tend to
forget is is the fact that you're representing
Islam here and when you're representing Islam you
need to be bringing You need to explain
from Islam.
What are the school with regards to prophecies?
This is not a prophecy the prophecy that
comes from Silas at the slam receiver Samanina
holen or Kareem Amin Dalek That 80 years
or thereabout Here the promised Messiah has quoted
a hadith Underneath he says it appears that
the tenure of my mission will extend to
40 years and it is Allah who knows
best It is Allah who knows best.
So we have to Conclusively study where else
the promised Messiah is that the was Salam
has spoken about his age And what has
he what what has he said with regards
to it?
But before that the most important thing is
is the or solar prophecies and is it's
interesting that Abnan whenever he starts his Stream,
he's he mentions all these verses, but he
never discusses the school from the Quran.
You're meant to be representing Islam here So
I think I have to sort of teach
you today and I'm going to ask you
a few questions and please Reply to them
as well as it is also a Q
&A There are two types of prophecy in
the Quran known as Vada and Vahid Vada
Allah the Almighty says in the holy Quran
in the law Ha now you feel me
odd that Allah the Almighty does not go
against his Vada his promise with regards to
the Eid Allah the Almighty states what and
it is mentioned the holy Quran is quoted
What in Yakut Sadiq and you see become
bad?
Oh, let me I do cool, but if
this prophet is true Then some of that
which he promises you will come true and
I'm gonna ask brother Adnan and brother Muhammad
Imtiaz why Allah the Almighty has used bad
hair and not cool Okay, moving forward now
some prophecies regarding promises are meant to be
fulfilled in the lifetime of the Prophet Just
as we know a lot was the Holy
Prophet sallallahu alayhi wa sallam.
Wallah.
We are simu coming and us Then there
are others where Allah the Almighty told him
Well, let the Arsala Rasoola who build who
that would mean in hockey You'll hear a
whole lot of the equally the Allah the
Almighty has sent this messenger of Rasul Allah
sallallahu alaihi wa sallam So that he may
cause it to prevail over all religions and
Rasul Allah sallallahu alaihi wa sallam had told
us in soon I'll be the whole while
you look a lot of his Amani him
Mila La Kulaha in the Islam that Allah
will perish all religion all religions except Islam
So I have a simple question and I'm
replying to that is Was this prophecy fulfilled
in the lifetime of the Holy Prophet sallallahu
alaihi wa sallam that all of religions Christianity
Judaism Hinduism that we see In today's world
what they all perished or was there another?
understanding given by Mufasireen Okay, moving forward We
also Your time is up.
Okay.
Yes, I'll listen to you.
Okay, okay So I'll quickly say what I
have to say and then brother to ask
and come in Okay, when we pose a
question about miserable of Ahmad Qadiani's To the
Ahmadis they have to understand that they cannot
come back to us with Responses like this
the one you have come with you start
No, no, no, it's not two minutes from
our site.
No, no This is our stream and we
are answering questions or all Ahmadis are welcome
all including yourself Okay, can you can you
meet I've met you're already interjecting man I'm
asking you music after he finishes.
You can do that.
Okay, but I have to mute him mute
him No, it's okay.
He'll be respectful.
Go on.
I'm not no, no, just just be respectful
because the thing Making the flow that I'm
brother Brother Harsha mute him.
Okay, he's mute.
Yes.
Okay.
Yeah mutants now The reason why I asked
for the Hashem to mute him is the
other day.
I attended the Ahmadi stream Okay, I was
being challenged repeatedly on Twitter and elsewhere to
come and face five Ahmadis alone.
I was being called a coward was being
called I mean people were posting memes of
people running away Things like that that are
non Rashid is running away at non Rashid
So I was in my bed and I
received messages that you better wake up because
you are a coward So I woke up
and I asked myself this question, am I
am I a coward so I went on
the stream and I saw very nice Rosy
-looking gentlemen nicely dressed talking beautifully very nicely
to their audience And I was pleasantly surprised
that are these the same people who came
to a stream the other day shouting screaming
Interjecting saying all sorts of things and not
allowing us to finish our speech Sentences, I
mean it turned into a war zone the
other day the stream right Hashem.
You can remember that right?
So so I was surprised I was actually
thinking are these the same people Rosie and
Brother Ahmed there now you come to our
stream and the behavior changes completely as you've
already shown.
Okay Please try to understand that.
We want to have a very decent conversation.
The purpose of the stream is to Educate
people not confuse people So we want straight
answers in your own time when you are
given the chance to give answers in your
own time Straight answers.
No waffling.
No beating around the bush.
No, no changing the topic.
No start indulging in Discussions that are not
relevant you talk about a soul.
You don't have an a soul You have
no a soul you change a soul as
you go along you change colors like chameleon
lizards Okay, when we pose a question you
start changing the topic you start raising questions
about the Prophet of Islam You start talking
about the Quran you start raising questions about
Hadith.
This is what you do This is the
game you play when you know, you cannot
defend the middle zone or not I'm at
the Annie the game you start playing is
change the topic Start talking about the Fatima.
See it start talking about Khatam on a
mula start talking about that And then what
happens the real question is unanswered the question
is again Mirza Gulab Ahmad Qadiani Himself said
if one of my prophecies was to be
false one out of a hundred One was
to be false.
Then I am a liar all we have
to show today is one false prophecy one
of which we have already shown and Clearly
you don't have a response and you're throwing
things to us from the verses of the
Quran and this verse means this this was
Means that this hadith means this what about
the Prophet of Islam Prophet Muhammad?
So let's look that's not the answer.
The answer is defend Mirza defend Mirza Mirza
said I will live for 40 years after
I announced my messiah ship After I am
Appointed on my messianic mission over to you
brother.
Yes, and then we can go to Ahmad
Inshallah very quickly without wasting anybody's time Basically
in principle in usul We agree with this.
Okay that it is the ulama the scholars
They can tell us that what any prophecy
mean, but the problem here is in the
last stream or as he said That according
to Ahmadiyya Ghulam Ahmad is Hakam and other
they are not going to take Hadith as
the Muslim take rather if any Hadith is
confirmed and accepted by Mirza Ghulam Ahmad.
They will just take it as a authentic
Hadith now first of all, it is a
prophecy and secondly because Mirza Ghulam Ahmad is
saying and he is basically referring to a
Hadith now They have to prove this because
Mirza is quoting the Hadith not us he
said that Hadith is telling us that when
Masih Maud will come.
His mission will be 40 years now If
brother Ahmad is trying to say that this
prophecy did not Completed in its apparent form
that it says 40 years But Mirza sahib
did not complete 40 years.
So my first point is Ahmad has to
admit that what is the wording of the
prophecy?
It was not fulfilled and after that if
he wants to give it a second meaning
go for it very quickly You can give
it a second meaning we can discuss that
is this second meaning within the scope of
the text because the problem is you cannot
just give meaning to a text which cannot
be Substantially from the text itself, so we
have no problem, but just two points Okay
number one you need to concede if you
want to That the prophecy was not fulfilled
in its apparent form number one after that
Give us a very quickly the secondary meaning
which you want to give and then prove
that me from the text.
Thank you very much Okay, I might do
you want to come in yes, thank you
so much so brother Hashim there has to
be some fairness I can't just be given
two minutes to reply to an announcement one
second one second one second, but that's not
enough to be honest It one second.
Okay, go on.
You said one second stick to a second.
Listen to him.
Come on Yeah to repeat brother Muhammad Imtiaz's
point if you are saying now that the
apparent meaning of the words is not fulfilled
Then you have to admit it be honest
about it because clearly do not fulfilled Mirza
did not live for 40 years after his
advent as the promised Messiah This is a
historic fact.
No one can deny it on this planet
So I'm clarifying this so that the audience
follows us the audience knows where we're going.
Okay.
Thank you Once again, I'm at once again.
I'm finishing right now.
You will have your two minutes So Mirza
Claimed that after my advent as the promised
Messiah, I will live for 40 years So
if the apparent meaning was not fulfilled, which
it was not because he died before 40
years after his advent Okay Then what is
the meaning?
Okay, first you accept what you admit?
You're breaking up with meaningful fit and if
it's not then talk go ahead over to
you two minutes And you know the thing
is whenever I've spoken to you and I
think my time begins there's a revelation The
revelation of the promise of Islam where he
says mana mania I mean a summer it
seems as Allah the Almighty put something on
your tongue that you know You every time
you come something happens to your stream.
It's been like three or four times So
you have to look into that as well.
I don't know what is going on Well,
every time you come with these allegations something
happens to your stream, but let's let's get
back to the point I mentioned with regards
to this reference The promised Messiah is of
Islam is courting a hadith Okay, and he
says underneath the Allah according to the prophecy
mentioned is a lie or harm Amanina howlin
or Kareem Amin Dariq Which he has courted
numerous places 80 years or thereabouts We have
your own scholars more or less more honest
and our Lambert say if you want to
see it those were his opponents They themselves
admitted and accepted that that the prophecy has
been fulfilled We are and if you want
I will show you on the screen foot
foot foot for the viewers to see But
the point that I'm making here and another
beautiful point with regards to Samanina howlin or
Kareem Amin Dariq Is the fact that the
promise Messiah a salatu was salam Allah the
Almighty informed him about even about his demise
In 1905 he receives the revelation and Allah
tells him two or three mouthfuls of water
has has remained Three mouthfuls of water has
remained exact three years later in 1908 he
passes away Okay, so so so what you're
saying what you've come up with you think
you're very clever You've come up with this
thing is but this is not even a
prophecy.
It is you started off with a prophecy
This is not a prophecy is quoting a
hadith and he's deducting a meaning from it.
Okay, he's not prophesizing it There's a different
thing Okay, otherwise I can mention you mentioned
to you many a hadith of the Prophet
sallallahu alayhi wa sallam Which would go in
line with this Thinking of yours, but why
I'm bringing you back to the usul is
because then I'm gonna cover that in those
usul Okay, so please as scholars first of
all, let your listeners understand.
What are the usul of prophecies?
What does Quran say about them?
What does a hadith say about them because
you are claiming to be scholars here brother
Imtiaz as I said, he's sitting there You
I know you you love going to the
you know To the writings of my society
and take bits and pieces from there like
the Jews did But what I'm telling you
to do is explain to us whether the
prophecies of Of a prophet right they are
to be fulfilled in its actual word or
can there be another understanding?
Can you answer that point that whatever the
Prophet says it has to be it has
to be fulfilled word for word Is that
true or is that state is this a
statement of coupon this is my Q&A
I'm asking you this question, please answer Brother
Ahmed, it's better.
You complete your time and then we'll talk
Yes, come time is over.
His time is up Please take it take
it.
Okay.
Okay.
So this is know how we treat brother.
It's okay.
It's okay.
We know how he is Okay, so I
was saying to him brother and my simple
question is this and I'm going to repeat
this question Whether the understanding of a prophet
with regards to any because it's not a
prophecy.
First of all This is his statement with
regards to what he the prophecy or the
revelation the promised Messiah Islam himself Received was
the manina howlin or Kareem Amin Dalek We
have his opponents who accepted that the promised
Messiah Have lived that time he has completed
that time So this statement the the furthest
thing you can say is is his misunderstanding
Right and I can present to you numerous
example from the from the Hadith of the
Rasul Allah.
Salaam where he said something Right, wait, for
instance, let me give you one example.
Yeah your time The last one I'll request
for 10 seconds, please Rasulullah sallallahu sallam saw
in in a vision that Abu Jahl has
accepted Islam Okay What happened it was never
fulfilled in Abu Jahl.
It was fulfilled in Ikram.
Ah, so the fulfillment of the prophecy Fulfillment
itself explained what the revelation meant Okay, so
what ikram I accepted Rasulullah sallallahu sallam only
accepted Islam later on the prophecy and the
understanding became apparent to Rasulullah sallallahu sallam and
the companions This is just one example But
let's continue this and inshallah people will realize
how flawed Your usul are with regards to
prophecies and I only asked you one question
with regards to Vada and why even you
don't even know It you don't mention a
single verse from the Quran or a single
Hadith of the Prophet So, why how are
you okay, I made your time stop come
on let Mohammed MTS answer now go ahead
So Bismillah, so first of all brother Ahmed
Alhamdulillah We know that what's the meaning of
Vada and way but brother?
We need to stick with the topic said
that we don't want to waste people's time
because in the last stream This is what
happened.
There were many tangents and the actual topic
was lost So we want to stick with
the topic inshallah If you want to have
a discussion on the We can do it
separately.
Okay Mentioning many times Samanina howler I just
want to explain people don't know he is
referring that the age of Ghulam Ahmed was
Predictive according to Mirza Ghulam Ahmed is going
to be 80 years are are close to
it.
No problem Inshallah, we'll discuss their prophecy as
well.
No problem at all We are simply saying
and by the way I don't know if
you made any new point in the in
the last five minutes because I already said
Already said that we already accept the usul
that if you want to give a text
a secondary meaning We accept this this usul
Okay But the the only thing we need
to stick with is there the text need
to permit this it has to be within
the scope Interpretation of the text, okay We
cannot give a meaning to a text which
cannot be inferred from the text itself number
one okay, and number two my brother is
that Please I'm asking you a second time
if you want to give it a secondary
meaning go for it But but please first
you need to accept that the apparent meaning
is not full Okay You can see then
inshallah give a secondary meaning we can discuss
that much that The primary meaning is not
fulfilled Okay, are you there?
Yeah.
Yeah.
I'm listening.
I just want Just one point to add
in this one.
Yes.
Go ahead.
Okay, the point I want to add is
this Please please follow the logical order first
can see that the apparent meaning is not
fulfilled and then You are more than welcome.
Give us a secondary meaning we can discuss
that and my second point is you are
saying again and again It's not a prophecy
my brother when something about the future is
said, what is it called?
Okay, and now in this one We did
not we are not quoting this Hadees Because
if we will quote the Hadees then as
ready said last time that for them the
school of Hadees are different We are simply
saying that Mirza sahib in his book has
accepted this Hadees He said according to this
Hadees Messina mouth after coming in this world
and after making the claim he will live
for 40 years It is something about the
future when something is said about the future.
It's called a prophecy Go ahead Yeah, yeah
I'm gonna I'm going to if you're going
to just stick to this thing right with
regards to this as I've already explained to
you You can't take a single statement and
just say, you know this is all it
is if the promise Messiah did not have
other revelations and And and and and and
and prophecies with regards to his end because
it was not just about Just about 40
years or so.
He spoke how his ending will take place
He specifically mentioned and allah the almighty of
informant even but brahman Ahmadiyya wallah.
Oh, yeah See, we're coming in not allah
the almighty would protect you all of these
things in his lifetime You are you are
like, you know, the the disbelievers who go
towards?
Mutashabihat and leave muhkamaat.
There are countless prophecies of the promise Messiah
Islam that you are Intentionally avoiding as I
said, this is not a prophecy.
He is saying here.
He's quoting a hadith But underneath he sings
the money now how long I'll carry them
in Dalek What does it translate to 80
years or thereabouts did the promise Messiah?
Is that the salam live near the 80
years or thereabouts or not?
That's the question.
I'm asking you He lived in 80 years
the plague took place in India, which killed
millions of people He was in the epicenter
where the plague took place yet Allah the
Almighty killed those 10 million people But the
Messiah was not killed all of his opponents
your scholars from ahl-e-hadith Rashid gangohi
and all of these people were killed in
that those who made prayers against the promise
Messiah So the salam you're not going to
mention that Because this is the deceit of
the Jews and Rasul Allah Said that in
my umma will also be will also remember
the Jews who would oppose the Messiah and
this is this is exactly what Happened and
we're seeing it in front of our eyes
that the Jews just as they take the
aspect of a prophecy from Jesus Jesus is
the lifetime and they say it hasn't been
fulfilled and They're waiting for thousands of years
for him to return Similarly Muslims you are
waiting for for peace on a set up
of a salam to descend and I'm gonna
say this last thing the promise Islam said
in his time you will die and not
see the descent of Christ your progeny will
die They will not to see you see
the descent of Christ They brother this is
this in itself is a prophecy when the
vows to the cousin Khan in in in
in extravaganza And and his son was speaking
about that the that the Mahdi should appear
in in a few years or so Right
and you you made other than many videos
about him as well.
I've seen it What do you say about
you know, all of those things the point
is brother?
You don't have a Messiah you don't have
nothing your you you have an hypothesis in
your hand and You're basically defending the hypothesis
and you can do that.
You'll still be day of judgment.
I Challenge you you mentioned one.
I would I would mention the the the
the prophecy about plague about Lake Huron You
know about his message reaching the corners of
the earth about him being protected and not
being killed.
What about though?
What about those prophecies?
Why are you not mentioning this based on
this based on this Last thing nothing based
on this criterion that you you've already said
your last thing.
You have already said I'm at you you
were given two minutes.
You always want to finish go over time
Is it and then you say we are
unfair is it finished out of is it
finished?
It's finished.
Obviously.
Okay.
Okay Go ahead Yeah, go ahead Yeah, so
my brother Ahmed first of all Everybody can
see Sometime you're calling us like the Jews
sometime like the Kufar so people should see
this.
I never I never said so far.
Okay, don't don't Use the last their Jews
You're interjecting, can you let him finish on
me but he's lying about me, please Yeah,
you can you can make the correction afterwards
You're the one who said to stick to
the rules and you're breaking it every time.
Why don't you don't do this on your
streams?
Why are you doing it on our streams?
Is this some sort of a trick some
sort of a tactic?
It doesn't work like that.
Please.
I'm just Respect the decorum and then we
can all have a nice dialogue and something
that is productive inshallah So I think brother
nuns suffering with this Internet again.
Unfortunately, he's in Africa and Can I just
talk now?
Yeah, go ahead.
Okay, so brother I'm not no problem I
don't want to waste people's time people can
see that if you said as Jews or
not, whatever Let's not go to on that.
Okay, if you said may Allah forgive you,
okay, brother So what I'm trying to say
is brother Ahmed you said that they are
other revelations as well Which needs to be
considered when understanding and interpreting this revelation Once
again number one Have you conceded or do
you have the courage to concede that the
apparent meaning of?
completing 40 years Was not fulfilled and after
that you are more than welcome We have
to be fair and inshallah will be fair.
You can give us a secondary meaning We
can discuss their secondary me no problem at
all Secondly as you said that there are
other revelations as well We need to consider
that my question to you Please answer the
question first directly in your in your time
and then you can add something on the
top of that my question to you is
regarding these 40 years of completion of Messiah
Did Mirza receive any other revelation on this
40 year thing?
and if he did please bring it to
us because you are trying to say and
you are trying to give the impression to
the Audience that there are other revelations regarding
this point that Messiah will complete 40 years
and we are hiding those other Revelation, so
I am inviting you please bring those other
revelations in which Mirza corrected or Mirza added
or he amended the Period of 40 years.
So please you need to bring that now
You are talking about the age of the
of the Messiah not a problem at all
We have everything ready be it a Lekhram
big Abdullah Atom it everything is ready But
obviously you have to go step by step.
So just to summarize Number one, you need
to concede first that the apparent meaning is
not fulfilled then we can discuss the secondary
meaning a point number two is you are
you are saying repeatedly that we are hiding
something and and just Mentioning few of them
know if you if you think and if
your claim is that on this subject that
Messiah will complete 40 years after he will
make his claim if we are hiding any
of the prophecy of Mirza on this topic
bring it Let me very quickly come in
Hashim.
Can you hear me?
Yeah, I can Okay, let me let me
burst.
Let me burst the bubble the plague bubble.
Okay, let me but let me Kill the
plague Inshallah, but metaphorically because our friends here
love them.
They love metaphors.
Okay Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadiani in his book
duffel bala page five states Qadian Remained free
from the plague because the Prophet and Messiah
of God was residing there Is that clear
guys?
Yeah Hashim, is that clear Mirza Ghulam Ahmed
Qadiani in his book duffel bala page five
states Qadian remained free from the plague because
the Prophet and Messiah of God was residing
there Then in his book hakiqa to wahi
page 84 He writes in the days of
the plague when Qadian was under its attack
My son Bashir Ahmed fell ill.
I will repeat In the days of the
plague when Qadian was under its attack My
son Bashir Ahmed fell ill so in one
place Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadiani is saying that
Qadian his city was protected from plague because
The Prophet and the Messiah of God was
in the city talking about himself Then in
hakiqa to wahi It goes on to admit
the plague did indeed attack the city of
Qadian Not only that his own son Bashir
Ahmed fell ill there goes your plague House
of cards there goes your plague claim or
your plague prophecy.
This is the reality That's that way.
Yeah.
Yeah, wait, wait, wait, wait.
Yeah, wait So so this this this is
the kind of Person we're dealing with who
is not only contradicting yourself.
He doesn't even know what he's saying Okay,
over to you.
There's way over to you Just in your
30 seconds want to say very quickly brother
Ahmed We are not going to discuss about
the the prophecy of plague Okay, because this
is exactly what happened last time and please
we are more than happy to discuss that
but after we will finish This first prophecy
because I said already Prophecy means when something
about the future is said and Mirza Sahib
is saying that Prophet Muhammad So all of
the Salaam himself has said now if you
will say that this prophecy is not fulfilled
Then you need to explain to us the
according to Mirza So I'm Saddam said that
this will happen and it did not happen
that it basically Mirza Sahib is Putting a
blame on Prophet of Salaam as well because
he said this is the Hadees Okay, and
this Hadees is and if you will want
I'll give you more references This Hadees is
accepted by Mirza side.
So there is more don't need to present
the Hadees So please point number one first
you need to concede brother that the primary
meaning is not fulfilled after that number two
the point number two is you need to
bring those Revelations on the subject of 40
years of Messiah ship, which I am hiding
a non-wise hiding Please bring all of
those references.
Okay, and inshallah After we finish this one,
we will discuss what we are saying again
and again Samadhi in a Holland We'll discuss
the age that this prophecy about the 80
years of age.
We have a lot of material on this
one We'll discuss that but please let's go
in a logical order Again lastly, I'm saying
please concede that the primary meaning is not
fulfilled Number one and number two give us
those revelation, which we are hiding from his
aside, please Okay, so we are for we
already one hour into the stream and I've
seen brother Mohammed MTS repeating the same question
over and over again for the last one
hour Ahmed you have not conceded whether the
apparent meaning of the Prophecy has been fulfilled
if it has not Please tell us so
and if it has then you if there
is a secondary meaning to it like brother
Mohammed MTS say say this is a secondary
meaning it hasn't been fulfilled and this is
a secondary meaning Otherwise, we're just repeating ourselves.
I will bring in the other Hamadis.
We are not going to respond This is
your last chance because one hour is more
than enough So I I mean I and
I did not avoid it I did not
digress from the topic I mentioned from the
very get-go that this is not a
prophecy.
You have to explain what a prophecy is
This is not a prophecy This is the
promise Messiah Islam Statement where he says the
money in a hole and over even in
Dalek and then he said it appears that
the tenure of my mission Will extend to
40 years it appears it appears I'm telling
you.
I'm reading for you So you understand it
goes into your brain and it is Allah
who knows best when we say well Allah
-u-alam It is not definite.
Okay, so to reply to you in another
form I want to say that a prophet
can make a mistake in interpreting a prophecy
This is not to say this was a
mistake because it wasn't even a prophecy first
of all He's saying Allah who Adam but
from the Quran based on your your criterion
Right has a new alaihissalatu wassalam when he
was building his his his folk But when
he met his people, they laughed at it.
Okay, and Allah said Allah you told me.
Oh Allah you told me you will protect
my son.
What did Allah say?
Oh Noah, he is surely not of thy
family.
He is indeed a man of unrighteous conduct
So what I'm trying to say to you
based on the criterion that you're trying to
make It always falls back on your face
with an arm the point I've answered that
I I haven't digressed from the topic I've
said this is not a prophecy.
This is his statement This is his statement
with regards to him and the end of
which he says did he say I will
definitely live for for 80 Years, he didn't
say that He did not say that he
said it appears and then he says well
Allah who Adam Okay, now the second point
but but the moment he has made that
I was Ahmed you know, this is
this is what I wanted to avoid, you
know The the reputation you kept saying it's
not a prophecy by the Mohammed Imtiaz clearly
read it in Urdu Which is the book
written by Mirza So I don't understand when
you say instead of using the term prophecy
using saying this is his statement Well statements
of prophets are prophecies Yeah, it's clear.
I didn't say no.
No, there's a difference.
I don't think any prophet.
Wait a minute No, I don't think any
prophet says, okay.
I'm now going to make a prophecy and
this is the prophecy Let brother Mohammed Imtiaz
answer I made him here, but he'd made
the same statement.
He said he's already said that before so
let let brother Mohammed Imtiaz answer that Right
So inshallah, this is the last time inshallah
I'm just gonna say on this prophecy because
then we have to move on we already
more than one hour into the stream We're
only discussing the first point.
So brothers inshallah This is somebody from my
side and please I want listener to understand
and to listen this summary inshallah in two
minutes and then decide That who was hiding
and whatnot.
Okay point number one Brother Ahmed is again
and again from the get-going.
He's saying it is not a prophecy I
want audience to please listen again When a
prophet is making a statement and in that
statement, he's saying something about the future What
is it number one number two in this
one?
It is not that Mirza is making a
statement only please understand that how important is
it is He is saying that according to
Hadith Please think about this He is saying
according to Hadith Masih Maud after he will
be appointed as Masih Maud I will come
second time.
He will complete 40 years It is not
just a statement of Mirza Sahib himself according
to Mirza Sahib.
It is a Hadith as well Okay, and
if this statement is something about the people
Everybody knows if a statement coming from a
prophet we say something about the future This
is exactly what is called prophecy.
Okay, and last point is Everybody everybody can
see here in in this last rebuttal brother
Ahmed was saying that even the prophets can
make mistakes in Interpreting the prophecies or the
statement now, hang on a second.
We are not going to discuss any profits.
We're not Anything we are going to stick
with this one.
Actually Ahmad has conceded.
Please note the point Ahmad has conceded that
Mirza Sahib made the mistake That's why he
wanted to bring the other prophets to hide
Mirza mistake brothers Well, I sometimes the Ahmadis
they say to us.
Oh Why we have to be emotional in
this case is brother when you are trying
to defend your profit Mahazala Mahazala by throwing
all the profit under the bus is is
that fear my brother?
People can see people can listen you already
conceded but you don't have the courage You
don't have the courage to say that the
primary meaning was not fulfilled number one number
two I tell you I tell you you
cannot give a secondary meaning to this prophecy
Which is within the text within the scope
of the text my brother you may be
thinking I'm just first time here I am
reading this topic for years.
Okay, I have How I'm with the I
give a secondary meaning.
I wish I wish you would have been
So people can see that how you take
those secondary meaning which have no basis in
the text.
Okay, my brother I'm Before before advance comes
in.
I just want brother Imtiaz to repeat the
prophecy once again Audience to make sure this
is not just some nilly-willy statement.
Somebody made it is something which is with
assertion Yeah, just please repeat it in Urdu
and also in English.
Okay.
No problem So my brothers are they are
many references for this prophecy.
I quoted two of them one of them
Which is the primary quotation for this case
and that is in Ruhani Khazain volume 17
page number 311 and this book is called
in Urdu so far.
Go.
Let me uh, okay in Urdu with a
sub, right?
Masih a more David a bad Charlie Sal's
in the Riga Hadees Sarah Hadees a syrup
easy cutter Maluma Ota a chemistry have moved
up in a David a bad Charlie's but
us dunia me rega Midas, I'll be saying
that according to Hadees When the promised Messiah
will come and when he will make his
claim of Messiah ship After that, he will
live in this dunya for 40 years and
in this statement Mirza sir is not only
making a statement.
He's saying it is a Hadees Okay, that's
point number one point number two is we
have references multiple references.
For example Mirza sahib has said in 1905
to 1907 because the book is called Burahin
volume 5 and this was written between 1905
to 1907 in this book Mirza sahib said
that my mission has been out there for
25 years and in 1908 Mirza sahib died
So clearly Mirza sahib said that the Hadees
says that the machine will remain in this
dunya for his mission for 40 years and
then he himself said that I have Completed
25 years in 1907 and then he died
next year So it clearly did not fulfill
this sign.
Please understand the point This is a sign
Mirza sahib is quoting And this sign is
not completed.
So now the only have two options We
only have two options option number one, please
Ma as Allah Ma as Allah Prophet Muhammad
sallallahu alaihi wa sallam said and something did
not fulfill We cannot believe this The second
option is Mirza sahib gave this sign sign
did not complete so he is not a
Messiah Okay, so to summarize what brother in
said already that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad Qadiani said
in 1907 that my mission has been around
for 25 years And he himself quote quoted
the Hadees Saying that the promised Messiah which
he claimed to be himself here from the
promised Messiah We understand Mirza To be claiming
himself to be the promised Messiah.
So he's saying the promised Messiah after his
advent will Remain alive for 40 years according
to the Hadees.
He quotes the Hadees in this support in
1907 he acknowledges that my mission has been
going for 25 years and then he dies
The next year that makes his mission 26
years that means Mirza is a liar That
means Mirza was 14 years short of his
own prophecy, which he used Hadees for For
support, okay for which he used the Hadees
to support his prophecy So Mirza was for
14 years one for 14 years short of
the prophecy Therefore he was a liar.
No, it doesn't stop there I want to
quickly move on because Ahmad is clearly not
paying attention and he's not going to concede.
He's not going to say No problem, this
is not a debate Of course, of course
Remember the other day on the stream five
of you were speaking for 20-30 minutes
20 minutes 10 minutes 15 minutes and I
was listening patiently taking But but but but
this is not a Well, yeah that stream
Ahmed that stream was specifically Dedicated to this
arches this miskeen you were challenging me by
name on Twitter and elsewhere You were sending
out shots at me saying, where are you
coward?
Where are you?
It's it's getting emotional is getting emotional Ahmed
you and your company five of you were
sending shots at me Challenging me.
Where are you?
Adnan Rashid the coward?
Where are you?
So I was talking to five people and
you were talking for nearly 10-15 minutes
each time and then I was taking notes
and responding Patiently, so in that light we
should proceed now very quickly I want to
raise a very very important point before you
come in.
Okay, it does by go ahead.
I Just just for the sake of the
record of the stream.
I want to make it very clear Because
brother Ahmed was giving this impression that maybe
there are other Revelations on the topic of
that Messiah will complete 40 years and we
did not quote this I challenge any Ahmadi
brother can come even now that we have
not hidden any of those There is no
revelation on this topic.
These were the only revelations he mentioned that
he will complete 40 years and Everybody can
see and and by the and by the
way in all honesty in all honesty our
topic has completed Okay, we don't need to
move forward because Mirza Sahib said it's one
of my sign one of my sign is
Not proven to be true.
I am a liar and my claim is
finished Okay Now everybody can see they can
watch this last one hour We have already
established that this sign was not fulfilled and
no Secondary meaning has ever been given to
this sign which is within the scope of
the text because you can give any meaning
it has to be within the scope of
interpretation Okay, so I want to move on
from this very quickly and I want to
give a chance to other Ahmadis who may
not be As agenda driven as Ahmed was
so before I do that I want to
put my case systematically in front of the
Ahmadi community.
They don't know the avalanche we have they
don't know Okay, let me present my case
very quickly.
Okay Prophecy about his age Mirza Ghulam Ahmad
Qadiani writes about his own age Okay in
his book duffel was was page 288 he
writes God has commanded that not only the
people of this generation should be benefited by
the words of my prophecies But also that
the people of future generations should be provided
with a great sign Such as you will
be 80 years of age a few years
more or few Less than that.
This is what he says, but hold on
a second There is trickery in the world
of this prophecy For it sets no definite
age limit and is open to both ends
like Ahmed has been playing games in another
prophecy Mirza Ghulam Ahmad is more definite about
his age and He goes as follows the
words of the prophecy promised that my age
will be between 74 years and 86 years.
This is taken from Mirza's book But Hanan
Ahmadiyya Volume 5 page 97 we're giving references
step by step Systematically we are giving references
so that no Ahmadi can claim that we
are making these things up okay, we're not
just a bunch of fools who are going
to reject someone who's truthful or we're not
going to attack an innocent person of Lying.
We're not going to accuse an innocent person
of life.
We have evidence black and white evidence of
his lies and Keep following me.
This is going to be slightly long about
three minutes, but please follow Paying attention pay
attention everyone movies and non Ahmadis pay attention
So he said the words of the prophecy
promised that my age will be between 74
years and 86 years From the combination of
these two prophecies.
It is evident that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad should
have died within these two limits 74 and
86 He died in fact at the age
of 69 Even this claim of Mirza in
Burhan Al-Ahmadiyya was not fulfilled.
This is actually a prophecy because he himself
uses the word prophecy and I repeat again
the words of the prophecy promised that my
age will be between 74 years and 86
and We know Mirza died at 69 according
to most records Including records put down by
his own sons and his first Khalifa Hakeem,
Nooruddin, they testified that Mirza was born in
1839 Okay, Mirza himself gave his age in
a court case as we will see in
due course Okay So if he was born
in 1839 and he died in 1908 that
makes him 69 years old and according to
his own prophecy He said that I will
die between 74 years and 86 years That
makes him a liar This is another Gift
for the Ahmadi missionaries like Ahmad before I
proceed I would like Ahmad to come in
and comment comments Specifically on this prophecy, which
is more specific because before that Ahmed was
playing games.
I was saying.
Oh, he said 80 more or less 80
more or less 80 Possibly a bit more
or a bit less but in this prophecy
Mirza was very very specific.
I will die between the age of 74
and 86 Okay, he died at 69 over
to you.
I've got two minutes.
Okay, so Ahmed, this is your last Last
say basically, I'm going to bring in another
copy of this.
So, please So I didn't have Nishan-e
-Asmani open in front of me while they
were speaking for 25 minutes or so I
tried I've opened in front of me.
The Promised Messiah says in Urdu That
from that day when that person would would
present himself as someone who receives revelation Okay
Chalice, but a stuck zindagi karega Okay.
Now the Promised Messiah alayhi salatu wassalam Right
received in his revelation in about 1860s and
I'm going to give you the exact date
here So so based on that He fulfills
the criterion that your men mentioning because the
point that's been mentioned here It's rose Walker
up Netanyahu karega chalice baraka zindagi karega a
buzzer a key I just up new market
Charleston burst my dog at a hockey league.
I'll have a possible Okay, yeah, or Beshara
D.
Gaye key.
I see what I stuck.
Yeah, it's a creepy humor So it's it's
it's a long reference, but the point is
and I'm although this my last time I
know you want to take other people specifically
and generally with regards to the age of
the promised Messiah sallallahu alayhi wa sallam till
today in the community there is if they
laugh on the day the You know, I
mean there there's differences of opinion with regards
to research about the promised Messiah sallallahu alayhi
wa sallam birthday And they know that right
just as there is if they laugh and
and you know on the birthday of the
Holy Prophet Peace be upon him as as
well Okay, so so this is you know,
and there's a whole research where 1835 is
mentioned 1837 is mentioned And there's numerous other
things, you know other dates.
I mentioned what the point that that I'm
trying to make here is is that The
specifically to choose this revelation about which they
know that the person's birthday is not even
fully known It wasn't written down Tells you
that there's already ambiguity about his a date
of birth Okay And to choose that specifically
is to confuse the conversation and take take
it away from all of those other prophecies
Which have been fulfilled to the word To
the word and this is exactly the case
with you know The the opponents of Islam
as well but if you want to go
into the detail of of this specific prophecy
with you know, we regards to his date
Then there has to be a proper format
and and we welcome you and we can
discuss that in detail But the point is
why is it the case and the question
is that you deliberately choose something and you
know that his birthday Is something that is
is is it wasn't written down when he
was born?
Right, and you know, there are several opinions
on that All right.
Thank you.
I've met There's a lot here.
We're going to bring in another Qadiani, but
just a look here for your time.
Thank you so much.
Thank you very much