Yasir Qadhi – Three Levels Of Aqida – Theology
AI: Summary ©
The speakers discuss the importance of cooperation, conflict, and unity in the face of conflict. They touch on topics such as the importance of cooperation, avoiding controversial statements, and the importance of cooperation and avoiding controversial statements. They also mention the need for a level three, but level two is okay, and discuss the need for a level three, but level two is okay. They also discuss the need for a level three, but level two is okay, and the need for a level three, but level two is okay.
AI: Summary ©
One good thing about the Salafi school of
the 90s and 2000s was that the Aqidah
books you guys are reading are human developments.
Understanding Wittgenstein's theory and all on language will
actually help you understand the Sifat controversy.
The problem is not the critique, the problem
is the critique is lax adab and it
goes from okay he's wrong to he's a
kafir and he's a CIA agent, that's the
problem right?
How many fights do you want to pick
today man?
Forget me, go listen to these other three
guys.
We were talking about this in the car
as well, you famously kind of moved away
from a kind of let's say a passionately
held worldview that you used to have to
a different kind of someone could say a
different worldview and it was quite public about
it.
Some of the criticism that might get from
people is you know people like that they're
just kind of flip-flopping around they're going
to keep changing their worldviews and so my
question is will you ever go back to
windows?
No, never.
I have repented and there is no going
back.
We've been kind of following obviously your discourse
and some of your writings and your lectures
and stuff.
The last time we spoke was a good
few years ago, all three of us but
since then I've noticed you've been doing lots
of great work in terms of reaching out
to different scholars you spoke at you know
alongside different scholars from different backgrounds, Ash'ari,
Ath'ari and Maturidi and so forth but
one thing that I noticed and we spoke
about briefly was you say that you don't
take a position in that traditional historical kind
of classification of Ahlus Sunnah but you say
they're all correct we should all get along.
Why the ambiguity is something some people might
be questioning?
Jay, so this is a deep question I
will ask you to allow me to elaborate
a little bit on that and also a
quick disclaimer that you've asked a bit of
a technical question so if our viewers are
not aware of any backgrounds of this nature
then this probably is not a useful conversation
for them.
The disclaimer is this is an advanced topic
that's what I'm trying to say.
So let me answer at different tiers as
well because this is an advanced topic.
At level one I would say to the
average Muslim that comes to me if he
were to or she were to ask me
which school should I follow I would say
whichever of the mainstream schools that you find
comfort in, whichever of the mainstream schools makes
you feel the most love of Allah and
his messenger, that would be my generic advice.
Whether you go to moderate Sufi, I mean
the mainstream I'm talking about.
I'm not talking about the whirling diversions I'm
not talking about it would be be sensible
here I'm talking about the ones that we
know you know the ones that we're aware
of and and interacting with you know Jamaat
-e-Islami like these are the main Ahl
-e-Hadith, they're all good.
I'm not saying they're all equally the same
I'm saying okay this is at the level
one okay the level two would be that
where somebody goes like okay but I've studied
all of them and I kind of sort
of see that there's good in all you
know so now we're talking about somebody a
little bit more a little bit more you
know understanding now he wants to know but
I want to study a book of Aqidah
I want to be involved for a few
years in a madrasa should I go to
Jamat-e-Islami or should I go to
you know Al-Azhar or should I go
to you know Malaysia or should I go
to Timbuktu all of these are different strands
now he knows a little bit and he's
interested in pursuing to that person I would
say understand what you're getting into in all
of these and go to the one that
is the most conducive to multiple factors logistics
family finances the level of education don't base
the primary factor on the version of Aqidah
I would literally say this that is a
factor if you already understand these different schools
to a good degree and now you want
to further your Islamic studies then look at
a whole bunch of faster political safety literally
you don't want to go to a place
that there's going to be a civil war
in a few years we'll almost time you
know look at a bunch of factors and
then go there and go there and absorb
all they have to teach you but with
an open mind meaning understand had you gone
to another university another institute you would have
been exposed to an alternative that has completely
proved itself internally just like your current system
is internally consistent so go there with an
open mind understand that this is a great
interpretation a great understanding and Alhamdulillah there are
other understandings out there this is level two
okay does someone need to get into that
though even level one you describe a some
okay choose whichever one you feel well yeah
because someone needs any do you need by
need do you mean salvation no yeah but
by need do you mean like to fulfill
intellectual curiosity yes because if somebody's interested in
well what is fiqh what is happy the
complete lay person like just go to your
local masjid and study that's what i would
say go to the one that you feel
the most confident accessibility accessibility yeah but it's
not needed for salvation some some instructional recommendation
to the person teaching that person then who
am i should we say the third person
i mean the person is coming to me
and wanting to be told because again the
way the world works they want these simplistic
answers and i'm not like that anymore maybe
we need to provide that to them in
a so then so then you might become
a part of the problem because my goal
by by by saying what i say my
goal is to put that kernel of open
-mindedness even in this person here my goal
is that this person inshallah they will understand
that actually in this particular field i have
studied and perhaps i am an expert and
yet still i'm saying you know maybe that
little idea is gonna resonate with them for
years to come so that's level two i
explain now okay level three is now the
more if you like complex one level so
level level two is basically like you go
you study you take a tradition you come
back knowing your own tradition and understanding that
there are other traditions that are just as
internally cohesive and just as internally validating as
your own so don't take them as the
enemy you do you and let them do
others and we have bigger fights to fight
however the problem with level two still remains
and that is that at level two the
average graduate who hasn't really critically thought still
internally believes and that's what he will have
been taught that my paradigm is the best
paradigm in fact it is the only authentic
paradigm and all of the other paradigms okay
i don't doubt their sincerity but they're wrong
in fact they're misguided about aspects of theology
in fact if depending on which school you
go to they're actually moved to there is
this widespread uh this feeling this this it
if you go to any uh reputable mainstream
seminary yes because that's the whole point you
are taught this is the particular aqeedah this
is the particular man has that we're going
to follow this is the best way of
doing fiqh and anybody who goes beyond this
and these are all mainstream those who go
beyond them anybody who goes beyond this accusations
of misguidance and heresy come the natural consequences
of those views is it said or unsaid
i mean the main depends again on which
seminary and which era i caught the version
of my institute in the 90s in which
it was very clearly said yeah it was
explicit from top to bottom i believe that
they have changed that a little bit but
uh you can't get away from it because
in the end of the day if you
believe that this particular interpretation of islam is
valid then automatically would imply the others are
invalid okay so at some level there will
there will be this so what what happens
the average graduate comes back believing deep down
inside that yeah my tradition is the best
and these other guys you know they kind
of messed up along the way but you
know what we're just gonna have to get
along with them because we have bigger battles
to fight and this is how i was
when i started my institute 2005 yeah it's
exactly how i was my way is the
only way 19 years ago i know that
the other ways are wrong yeah but for
the maslaha of the ummah i will come
and cooperate with them did you feel that
in fiqh as well uh fiqh was never
an issue for me because the institute that
i study with always emphasized comparative fiqh so
for me from day one they gave you
for yeah no that was the book not
doing that was you're trying to make a
joke of it it was my book i
studied pretty much cover to cover that was
the book i studied we didn't do we
didn't do is there something in that way
that led to you being being a bit
more relaxed when it comes to yes to
us with yes yes can you see something
like that in akita no that's not happening
in akita this is where the line is
drawn something that could happen in that's what
i'm trying to do that's what i'm getting
that's point three no that's what i'm trying
to do here so one good thing about
uh the salafi school of the 90s and
2000s was that it really did teach us
that fiqh is a human development and that
allah sharia is distinct from human fiqh this
is an amazing thing that they actually taught
us that we understood the are attempts now
to do so of course they opened up
a pandora's box and that pandora's box is
do-it-yourself fiqh that pandora's box is
you don't have a consistent usul that pandora's
box is like you know literalism so there
are negatives that come with that type of
opening up as well yes uh but that
is but the thing is that the the
average well-grounded salafi student of knowledge will
inherently be more open-minded to fiqh differences
really the average open-minded salafi student of
knowledge not some strands of salafism okay like
the the the the strands that study fiqh
you're talking about one jordanian strand that's something
else but mainstream salafi fiqh like they will
understand that okay it's not that big of
a deal even you say this it's not
a matter of bid'ah or whatnot it's
not that big of a deal of course
aqeedah there is no compromise in aqeedah okay
that's that's taught by all of the schools
this is level two my point with level
two would be if you get to that
level where you're going to work with others
for the pragmatic good that is good enough
but still there's a cognitive dissonance something in
your heart that there's something in your heart
it's going to angst it's going to create
and it's not healthy for the ummah i
was that person from 2005 i mean even
before but i mean my active that was
2005 up until around 2015 when i just
i just it did not make sense to
me it just did not make sense to
me yeah these are not evil people and
of course the worldview i held we were
not just accusing them of bid'ah we
were accusing them of shirk if you know
what i'm talking about and i've and for
those who don't understand you can listen to
my library chats i have them very clear
i've been very open about this right we're
accusing them of shirk how do you compromise
on somebody whom you're accusing of committing shirk
yeah and this is my cognitive dissonance like
this doesn't and then i know these people
i'm interacting with them these people are more
pious than i am their tahajjud is better
than mine their actual love allah and his
messenger is shining through i don't see any
shirk from them you know when you what
your teachers say in a closed room when
it's only your group that's just your own
you know internal box that you're you know
you're only but when you actually go and
interact with them you see a different side
of things and it became clear to me
that it's not that simple but i couldn't
understand why it's not shirk this is again
15 years ago because the what i 76
78 because what i had been taught to
me it seemed as simple as one plus
one equals two yeah my version of islam
was solid like it this is shit this
is exactly the quranic shit how come these
guys don't see it how come they don't
see what i'm seeing this is what led
me to study for a few years directly
from their books and ask their scholars very
deep and probing questions an open mind and
the difference was the open mind because when
you go with blinders when you go wanting
to critique when you go with the mindset
of you're going to find whatever you're looking
for of you know finding false you're going
to find what you want to find i
went with the mindset of i don't think
i've understood these guys not with the mindset
i want to become them with the mindset
of clearly i haven't understood what's going on
here i think we call it empathic listening
empathic understanding and so that was the mindset
that i had and of course you know
my my master's and phd is all in
islamic theology development like theology this is when
of course a number of years it came
to uh the conclusions i came to are
a little bit technical and this is where
it gets awkward because now the critics just
jump up for the 30 seconds because it's
difficult to elaborate and i understand but i
will try to elaborate in a nutshell the
conclusions that uh i have come to are
that all of these strands of theology are
human attempts shaped by frankly cultural and socio
-political factors to answer questions that trouble the
minds of generations long gone and i've tried
to explain this in my library chats about
the attributes of god controversy islamic is obsessed
with the attributes of god all the single
group the groups that are not even in
existence maybe 30 or 40 of any textbook
of discusses god's attributes okay and when you're
introduced to your or even the other you
don't think why okay this is aqeedah but
the third level the three dimension the higher
level is like hold on why are we
obsessed with aqeedah when it comes to sifat
why is the sifat and aqeedah question the
sahaba never debated sifat when you go in
and i've done my library chats when the
muslims entered damascus for the first time and
aqeedah was a clean slate there was no
there was no writing on the wall there
was no table of contents right they came
across christians arguing over the nature of god
and the nature of god's attributes and how
jesus and god are interconnected or not and
how is the logos and is the logos
created or the logos separate or the logos
is god this is well known as some
of their yeah and when they found all
of this controversy and their slates are blank
human nature that controversy is going to get
a whiff onto our slates and so it's
just like today with other things like culture
wars everything everything yeah but the difference is
that there was a clean slate back then
so on a blank slate the first domino
then becomes the sifat controversy so rather than
saying is jesus nature one is jesus part
of god it became are the sifat of
allah one or the sifat or the sifat
this and that right and then is the
logos created or uncreated oh what is logos
kalam is the kalam allah you literally copy
and paste and then i mentioned john of
damascus go listen to my library channel the
origin of the john of damascus's analysis becomes
the beginning of literally the early muhtazila are
copying copying and pasting john of damascus that's
where muhtazilism begins then as a reaction the
atharis come along the proto atharis the proto
sunnis and say no no actually allah has
a yid that is actually a yid and
we believe in an actual yid the sahaba
didn't say like this i'm not saying they
didn't believe it because what the sahaba believe
is a back projection of later groups onto
them we don't know what they actually believe
right we really don't know we're just assuming
my so my point is that the 3d
analysis the deeper analysis you understand the entire
sifat controversy is a contrived one as a
response to a socio-cultural phenomenon that took
place at a certain period in time allah
did not reveal controversy the sahaba were not
involved in the samad controversy so once you
understand the origin number one number two you
understand we have the benefit of hindsight that
they did not have this is a key
point we have 13 centuries of looking at
what actually happened because of the samad controversies
whereas the founders of these movements and the
icons ibn taymiyya and ghazali did not have
what we have this is not to say
we're better than them because again the critics
come and say oh so you think you
are because no we are standing on the
shoulders of giants but here's the point because
we're standing on their shoulders because of their
shoulders we see what they cannot see doesn't
make us better than them it's just that
they pave the way they did so much
now we have the opportunity to look back
and what does this show us these 13
centuries of debates what did we gain by
them it's awkward to say this it's like
the kid who cried out you know the
emperor is no clothes if you know the
parable here but the reality is all of
these strands of bickering and fighting over semantics
that's just a fact those who affirmed allah
comes down or versus those who said yanzil
is a metaphor they're both praying tahajjud to
allah yeah in the last or the next
yes those who said allah is yes and
basically they're trying to make that wheel of
some of allah which is the mu'tazila right
and the ashara said this and the maturidi
said this and the and the athari said
this in the end of the day all
of them including the mu'tazila they're raising their
hands to allah when their son is sick
and they're saying ya shafi cure my son
it's just how you're phrasing it's just a
of philosophy of language that's how it is
right but there's there's a sorry interrupt there's
a qualitative there's a difference between that completely
with you there but when someone when you
started this convo or um when it comes
to tawhid and shirk in terms of somebody
saying oh so and so oh you know
be this and that or saint so and
so even this goes back to an understanding
of what exactly is intended and what defines
a god but do you see that as
a as a as a separate controversy no
it's a separate controversy to this one i'm
giving the safat one and what you're talking
about is a distinct controversy which is not
directly related to safat the claim is made
that it is related but it's not related
it doesn't map onto the schools historically uh
not the early schools no this controversy is
coming after the 7th 6th 7th century whereas
the contrary the safat is from the 2nd
to the 5th century the formations are done
okay so and this is what i love
to do my actual passion and forte my
phd my my academic research that i do
at the advanced level is the development of
ideas develop islamic theology that's what i love
to do okay a political history military history
that comes on the side the real history
that i write papers on and publish papers
on my gestation on is in my library
chats is ideas of aqeedah so once you
understand that it sounds sacrilegious to the average
student of knowledge the aqeedah books you guys
are reading are human developments yeah trying to
solve problems that are relevant to certain eras
and epochs all of a sudden then we
have to ask ourselves do i need to
teach my kids the safat controversy do i
need to brainwash and indoctrinate them with one
school versus the other do i need to
replicate the hatred that existed in third century
baghdad maybe even legit because they didn't understand
the repercussions i'm not even blaming them and
i'm not even faulting them but we have
13 centuries and again allah protect us all
i mean may allah protect i don't like
the cancel culture i don't like the refutation
culture and i always have to feel you
know make these caveats here may the intelligent
people understand what i'm saying here the ibadis
of oman are mu'tazili in creed their worship
of allah is no less frankly it is
better than most sunni lands frankly if you've
ever visited oman yeah their akhlaq their tahajjud
their quran their strong iman i know the
critics are going to go absolutely crazy with
this i'm not saying mu'tazilism is correct but
i'm saying the way you guys made it
out to be the brother of shaitan no
it's not i think partly so let me
finish this one quick so the accusation that
if you say x this will imply why
that syllogism is a figment of the imagination
of the critic if you deny allah's istiwa
then it's going to happen well this then
is from you not from the people themselves
the people who actually hold it don't go
there and this is what i'm saying when
i say we have the hindsight of history
13 centuries we look back the zaidis of
yemen are mu'tazili they're praying tahajjud and doing
everything as well you know i'm saying they
clearly the i'tizaad they believe the ibadis believe
the quran is makhluq their grand mufti is
on youtube literally defending and then saying but
sunnis he literally said but sunnis you guys
made this a bigger issue than it needed
to be we still recite the quran take
the sharia that's his view i'm not saying
i agree with it right yeah and look
at their laws and look at the people
so what i'm saying is firstly the origin
of the controversy secondly the hindsight that we
now have okay and then thirdly at a
deeper level we have access to various disciplines
of knowledge that earlier scholars did not have
that we can employ as tools to better
understand and of them is the philosophy of
language yeah for example with the safad controversy
we now understand the usage of language the
functionality of language yes true ibn taymiyyah mashallah
tabarakallah he did contribute you know a little
bit in the nominalism and and great but
the level we now have because that's what
the modern world has done it really has
gone to a level of ilm that is
unprecedented human history and frankly i mean understanding
wittgenstein's theory on on language will actually help
you understand the safad controversy to the point
of it making a non-controversy you can
literally take wittgenstein's theories of of language look
at the safad controversy and collapse it all
and say well actually there is no controversy
have you thought about writing about that i
have but again time is always precious my
problem is i'm spread so thin in different
ways so to finish this off yeah so
that you look at you look at the
origin you look at hindsight and then you
look at that we now have that they
didn't have put all together and you start
to realize much of what we took as
being important was actually superfluous we don't need
the safad controversy to be good muslims and
if you are in ashari or maturidi or
mu'tazili i know this gonna get me canceled
immediately in the safad issue because the mu'tazila
the here's the point the mu'tazila the main
issue with us and them is qadr i
say and i will say this may allah
protect me from the problem is not the
critique the problem is the critique is lax
adab and it goes from okay he's wrong
too he's a kafir and he's a cia
agent that's the problem right this is the
problem is like he's wrong fine i know
you're gonna follow mainstream sunni thought you're gonna
say i'm wrong i get it but don't
make it bigger than it is okay i
am saying the modern ibadi movement has issues
but safad is not one of them that's
going to cause any issues between us and
them they're good people in the end of
the day we see this so we learn
from all three of these issues the origin
the history and the illumine that we now
have that we can look back to that
the safad controversy was completely blown out of
proportion and you don't need it to be
a good muslim so when you ask me
what are you a shari maturidi mu'tazili you
know a 30 or whatnot you understand i
don't believe in these boxes anymore because i
understand where the controversy came from and i
empathize i know this sounds weird with all
of them i genuinely see where they're coming
from and i don't think any one of
them is divine they're all human attempts to
answer questions that were problems of their time
i'm it's a historical controversy i like studying
it i don't find myself having to carry
a card about one of these past issues
so on the sheikh look so there's three
options for the general population now is it
one that we minimize the engagement with understanding
aqeedah in those classical boxes as one option
number two we deconstruct it to then just
educate people or three should we use a
blank slate and relook at aqeedah for modernity
excellent question and that is a very profound
question mr omar salman i love it number
one should we yeah minimize so profoundly forgot
the question we should minimize the controversy at
the level of the masses yeah this is
what i've done on a personal note i
was obsessed with the sifat controversy i mastered
it literally my master's was on the sifat
my master's published in medina 800 pages go
look it up jahab ibn safwan it's all
sifat 800 pages of masters alhamdulillah and i
i'm not trying to it was the awarded
and it was published and it was like
number one in my class it's there you
can read it and i came back to
this country literally yaqeen that the sifat as
understood by ibn taymiyyah and his group is
the correct understanding of allah there is no
question in my mind that all the others
are bothered or whatnot but again that's your
one dimensional view you start doing two and
three d view and all of a sudden
you understand okay but he is right but
he's not necessarily only right ashaar are also
right in their way and what this is
also right in the way it all goes
back to your paradigm right so i stopped
talking about these controversies at the mass level
completely look at my khutba and duroos yeah
ignored completely recently there was a massive debacle
between the asharis and salafis online and i
got angry at both sides i reached out
on behind the scenes because i'm not on
social media i reached out to people on
both there's a genocide going on leave these
issues so at the mass level yes completely
bypass your second question should they be taught
with wisdom they should be taught at the
grad at this madrasa level yes because you
can't reinvent the wheel so when you go
to a higher seminary when you go to
any mainstream school understandably the school has to
teach you a thousand four hundred years of
intellectual history and understandably you're not going to
get rid of the schools i'm not challenging
asharism atherism salafism i keep on saying i
moved on i've always used this term i
didn't switch sides moved on i've been very
precise because i no longer view these schools
as being divine i really don't allah didn't
reveal salafism nor did he reveal asharism i
can show you human elements i can show
you evolution in all of these schools i
can show you spectrums within them when you
tell me be a salafi i will say
which version abu ya'la's version or ibn
aqee's version or ibn jozi's version or ibn
taymiyyah's version if you tell that one okay
if you tell me and even ibn taymiyyah
who's going to interpret ibn taymiyyah because after
ibn taymiyyah there's no vision right the same
the same the same with the asharis which
version of asharism ghazali and virgin razi and
version which again i can show you evolution
i can show you spectrum i can say
i think part of i'm set since i
sense that none of you what you said
is that weird you keep saying that oh
this is going to give me cancer whatever
i think the reason why you feel that
way is because you're you you dedicated so
much research and learning and and and you're
seeing that because from your expertise from your
background when it comes to the average oh
what i'm saying the average layman will understand
not the layman even to love and even
people that delve in these books i think
you give them more credit than i do
i'll be honest with you because for most
people the tradition that they subscribe to is
the religion of islam but i think i
think what you're maybe subconsciously you're bringing a
lot of your own expertise i hope i'm
wrong baggage maybe maybe i knew when you
see it but look at what's happening over
the last few weeks online between people that
are worthy of respect mainstream western clerics battling
it out while bombs are dropping in gaza
over does allah have a hand or not
over does allah have istawa or not i
haven't been watching okay the massive debate is
taking place right now as we speak still
still is still going on right now and
these are mainstream sheikh not little kids these
are people of with respect and they are
i'm not i'm not saying there aren't people
who are still but these are icons yeah
that's what i'm saying so i think they're
always going to be people like this so
and then your third point deconstruction that's what
i'm doing at the advanced level which is
my library chats which is the islamic seminary
america where i teach the students in order
to to get to that level you need
to have a background it cannot be done
just as a public lecture so all the
yeah we're looking at yeah i'm getting there
i'm getting there so deconstruction is taking place
and it's taking place and i encourage everybody
who has a solid background and who is
resonating with aspects of what i'm saying i
say this to anybody who says i want
to study with the islamic seminary i say
listen to my library chats if you find
my library chats appealing to you these are
of the real philosophy of the seminary go
ahead and apply and it is an accredited
seminary you're going to get a master's degree
that is accredited by the western world so
apply to that because that's where we go
into that level of thinking okay that's level
three level four then which is when you
ask me which class was i the most
excited to teach that's level four yeah that
is what does modern aqidah look like i
don't care about the sifat we all have
teenage kids none of them are debating about
the sifat i know somebody's going to take
that little clip yeah okay i don't care
about the sifat controversy yeah of course the
sifat i'm looking out for your best interest
thank you yeah even though it doesn't matter
if i say the sky is blue they're
going to come and say whatever it is
i'm a firm believer as allah says in
the quran that that which is done yani
for the sake of allah will remain and
that which is done for others will be
gone so my goal is sincerity and ikhlas
and hidayah and jokes aside all of the
criticism will not even be in the footnotes
of the books of history if what we're
doing is for the sake of allah it
will remain as a legacy look at the
critics of i mentioned this even omar mukhtar
ibn tahir whatnot look where are they now
and the only reason you know about them
is because of those exactly so i yes
it is painful now and it is causing
drama amongst the masses now but it's not
and it's not a benefit and it's just
you know passing so the long term so
my point therefore is that what will modern
islamic theology look like and you know what
it's going to look like we take our
teenagers and we just have them in a
room while we're sitting there taking notes blank
slate and see exactly what are the questions
they're asking what are the issues that are
troubling them and then we look at that
and start formulating islamic responses this is what
needs to be done hardly anybody i would
say nobody's done it the way i like
it to be done it is one of
the projects you asked me do i have
any project this is one of the projects
i have inshallah time is an issue but
wallahi one of my biggest passions right now
and and i say this to my my
because i still have a massive soft spot
for the salafis for ibn taymiyyah come on
i even tell me i i can't you
can't tell but admire him and one of
the biggest things i admire about him is
the courage the fearlessness he really did not
care about popularity his views were so eccentric
salafis don't realize that salafis who love him
don't realize he came with a whole bunch
of shahad views fiqh wise and aqidah wise
but he didn't care because he felt it
was the haq and guess what those shahad
views became mainstream salafism today literally i know
it sounds blasphemous to the salafis but it's
true modern salafism has so many views that
are absolutely unprecedented pre-ibn taymiyyah include i
don't want to get too quick because it's
a whole different i have a whole i
have a i have an article that i'm
writing about you know ibn taymiyyah's contributions to
the salafi dawah meaning pre-ibn taymiyyah atheism
was very different salafism was different right the
main was ibn taymiyyah introduced the categorization of
rabbi and alohia into salafism yes one or
two people referenced some concept but nobody took
it mainstream and nobody interpreted the way ibn
taymiyyah did nobody brought this notion of okay
you can believe in god but worship other
than god and not call him a god
yeah that is uniquely taymiyyah to differentiate between
rabbi and alohia as a practical mechanism to
pronounce verdicts on actions yes i know ibn
manda and fulan two people had you know
statements where you kind of sort of see
a distinction a categorization they didn't do anything
with that categorization and that's why you're getting
into a lot of trouble imam ahmed would
allow tawassul imam ahmed would allow tabarruk the
hanabilah were well known to be mutasawwifah they
didn't have an issue with this regard look
at abdul qadir aljilani and the stuff that
he would right ibn taymiyyah comes along the
first person in human history to say you
cannot travel to the qabir of the prophet
with the intention of visiting great that becomes
a bid'ah and a stepping stone to
shirk again i respect ibn taymiyyah immensely but
i challenge you to find me based upon
his distinction of abudi rubia there are some
that had other reasons but ibn taymiyyah is
coming from a specific theological paradigm okay anyway
you got me into a lot of trouble
there's my point is that ibn taymiyyah redefined
salafism completely with shahad unknown views he brought
them in they're now mainstream it is a
fact take it or take it qualitatively they
seem to be more about classification more about
the the human elements of the science no
rather than but they're still reading in a
theology that was not understood i mean why
is it that the previous hanabilah including ibn
qadam and others are very open about going
to the qawad of the process and i'm
speaking to him asking him to ask allah
for forgiveness right it's not even occurring to
him that there's a problem here in this
regard by the way i have never done
this in my life believe it or not
i'm still influenced by bin taymiyyah i have
never once and i've gone to the qawad
of the process more times than i can
count and i go and i have utmost
haiba and respect and there's awe and there's
genuine awe in front of me is the
most sacred body to ever have walked the
face of and allah knows that all that
i have but to this day i have
never said ask allah for this and that
but i don't have a problem with the
one who does and i know that's going
to get into a massive problem i don't
how can you i mean i can give
you 50 scholars they all say this controversy
comes when it's kind of applied beyond that
right and when you kind of so we're
opening up the door of what is this
and what is that and you can go
over my talk there but yeah the controversy
comes everywhere even with this i just said
the controversy comes so i am no longer
emotionally invested in this because i recognize all
of these people are coming from different paradigms
i have to choose one in my own
personal life and because i was born and
raised well not born but i was born
in jamaat islami background my father was one
of the founders of jamaat in america my
critics say he's gone back to his roots
because now he's a haraki activist you know
what i'm saying okay it is what it
is but um uh my education was in
a salafi paradigm and i don't have a
problem saying yes ibn taymiyyah's impact on me
will probably remain you know till the day
i die there's no problem with that but
my point is i don't have a problem
with all of these other mainstream normative interpretations
that would do things that ibn taymiyyah and
ibn abu wahab would consider shirk and bid
'ah it's their interpretation i don't i see
from this other group's paradigm it's not the
it goes back to your paradigm and your
definitions ibn taymiyyah's definition and then especially ibn
abu wahab's definition are radically different than the
definitions of ibn hajjah they're radically different the
definitions of the other strands once you understand
that this really goes back to not simplistic
issues rather deeper issues neither of them are
committing shirk then man just you choose and
you preach what you want to in a
positive manner and understand that the other group
has its ta'weel and even if they're
wrong allah will look at their ta'weel
allah will look at their good intentions in
this regard this is what i'm talking about
having moved beyond these i am not obsessed
with bashing the other groups even as i
myself have not yet celebrated the mulad believe
it or not once i know it's crazy
isn't it tell me tell me what your
personal experience is okay i haven't once spoken
to a dead person or wali or whatnot
because i i don't personally don't like that
i just don't feel the need to do
that but like i said i'm not going
to criminalize or demonize those strands that view
these issues because i know they're coming from
a legacy they're coming from a trajectory of
scholarship right so you know so to resurrect
those past issues and make them the defining
factor goes back to another point that i
haven't mentioned yet but i've given talks about
it the narcissism of small differences once you
understand this psychological concept that human beings are
naturally inclined to problematize similarities with similar groups
because they need to define themselves against their
closest competitors yeah it makes a lot of
sense the animosity between asharis and atharis the
animosity between sufis and salafis even though 90
is exactly the same once you understand this
psychological reality you just cease to have i
don't want to have animosity in my heart
against any believer who loves allah and his
messenger wallahi i don't want that i can
disagree i don't want to have hatred so
i've moved beyond these groups i don't consider
them to be the defining factor of who
i am and therefore when you ask me
which group do you follow all in none
really all in none it doesn't matter to
me i'm much more concerned about defending islam
theologically politically socially in the world that we
live in and therefore i have that blank
slate i don't care about the slates that
have been inherited by my dad and forefathers
and i'm worried about what does it mean
to be a muslim in the modern world
citizenship liberalism feminism these are the issues you
know balancing islamic law and as you know
these are the critics that come here because
again their paradigm is madhabism you know their
paradigm is okay the law of ibn qadamah
should never be changed i don't say that
but that's effectively what they're doing okay the
the the slate that has been filled by
the previous scholarship is the religion of allah
so when i come along say well no
actually that's not the religion of allah that's
their extrapolation obviously one-dimensional minds oh he's
reforming islam destroying islam no bro you don't
know the problem is you know some your
critics some of them are just nuts right
and they'll just do take bits and pieces
and just have motivated by hatred or whatever
but the problem is they those drown out
the legitimate and constructive criticism and excellent nobody
is perfect yeah and there's no doubt that
some of what i'm saying and doing is
worthy of legitimate criticism nobody i mean i
found you to you people who have genuine
critique and they they're open to email you
and i mean i'm against this whole reputation
culture i am i am somebody who loves
positive criticism that comes from adab and sincerity
yeah and anybody who has interacted with me
inshallah can testify to this i'm not perfect
who nobody's perfect yeah and we will become
stronger when we criticize for the sake of
perfection criticize for the sake of mutual enhancement
that's what we're going to come better if
we're going to criticize to take down to
put down this is not the way forward
it's different isn't it and it just comes
across yeah the thing is you know you
know that so some some critics might list
to what you just said and say look
he's he's belittling doheed and shirk and these
types of things because and i think that's
their definition but the part of the thing
that might that might be beneficial to from
your angle the way you describe these things
is because i think because of your expertise
with background maybe it goes above certain people's
heads or you're talking about a very specific
thing they think you're talking about the general
you know chapter or whatever is just to
clarify your i think part of the problem
is we make it into an aqeedah issue
we make it into an issue of theology
of defining groups and sects and so forth
when i think if you look at from
the perspective of just draw a circle around
everything those things that the vast vast majority
agree on yeah you'll find people in that
circle which happen to identify as different groups
based on these man-made categories asharism atharism
salafism all that kind of stuff but they
would agree for example that and this might
be a better way of maybe phrasing it
that they all agree that okay or you
know asking a dead person for you know
for for you know cure or children or
assistance or something like that don't do it
they won't now they'll differ is it shirk
is it this is it that but they
i pretty much yeah everyone that's what i
say too yeah but the way but the
way you kind of the way you talk
about it is very sometimes academic and you're
talking about the shirk point someone might think
because he's saying it's not shirk therefore they'll
go to the opposite they'll assume the opposite
and oh everything's allowed go and start you
know go and asking someone in grave just
because it's not very public of course yeah
multiple times i've said it is a stepping
stone to shirk exactly but it is not
inherently shirk but if you describe it as
this is for example you know this is
like the common denominator of vast majority i
get this point because sometimes i feel that
we have a hang up with trying to
prove whether or not it's shirk or talking
about whether or not it's shirk rather than
what's actually important for a muslim's life which
is should you know should i be doing
something like this or not okay i feel
this sometimes i feel that we we want
to kind of win the argument yeah not
yourself but people who argue about this they
would rather win the argument of is it
shirk then stop people doing it i would
personally i would i don't know how you
feel about this but i would much rather
someone doesn't believe it's shirk and never does
it in their life i actually said this
explicitly yeah yeah but okay because i
genuinely wish to raise the bar of academic
acumen and thakafa and intelligence of the masses
that are listening and i'm not interested in
winning points or just smoothing things over i
will push back at you even though it's
going to open up a whole can of
worms i personally believe it is haram it
is bidah it is munkar it is stepping
stone to shirk and it's only going to
be shirk with certain aqid it could be
shirk but it is not in and of
itself shirk that having been said with that
big caveat and disclaimer the awkward reality is
that there are many many famous reputable mainstream
sunni preachers who say that it is mustahab
or at the very least jais and for
any random person they're talking about the prophet
sallallahu alayhi wa sallam right the prophet sallallahu
alayhi wa sallam so i mean we can
make that exception by the way theologically you
cannot make that exception theologically you cannot just
from i'm saying from the perspective of starting
off let me finish this point here so
this this nice beautiful save that you want
to do it works in our safe space
and for the viewers who were jumping to
critique me say okay he said that i'm
going to give them ammunition now because my
goal is not them my goal is the
people who are genuinely trying to understand and
make sense i don't want to mention names
but pretty much every single reputable mainstream western
cleric outside of the salafi paradigm believes it
is jais or mustahab that's just a fact
yeah i've spoken to them yeah i accuse
one of them when in my heyday salafi
days of literally saying you are you're preaching
shirk but allah will forgive you because you
don't know any better oh that's my ignorant
25 year old idiot self literally you're a
kid your teachers tell you this you go
regurgitate it right i literally said to somebody
20 years older than i am the senior
most cleric and you know i'm not you
get who i am literally said to him
and i feel so stupid now but it
was what i felt this is the haqq
i need to make you know i say
look i need to tell you that you're
going to hear there's some other people but
i am preaching that you are preaching shirk
and i will say this i felt validated
okay and what do you expect him to
do luckily so to be pedantic accurate here
this nice simplistic back and forth we had
is disconnected from reality those guys don't say
it's haram for who cares if it's only
for the you can't just do shirk with
one person or the other but that's the
thing the reason why they make an exception
about the prophet you can see the so
it's i know for a fact i cannot
mention names here because i mean he has
public articles in it i know for a
fact one of the icons of that strand
literally has an entire paper justifying it for
ambia and alia in english ambia and alia
so your theory here and your attempt is
nice but my interest really is the long
term let the cancellations occur i hope when
people listen to this do your own research
what do you do when the bulk of
the umma is not agreeing with you in
this regard this is the dilemma i faced
15 years ago when you come to the
realization you're the minority when you say that
and you are when you don't understand the
default of the shafiis of egypt of the
syrian scholars of the yemenis of the moroccans
the default is that it is jazz that's
why you have to go deeper and understand
where they're coming from and understand their definitions
of of shirk and tawhid is radically different
than ours and then you need to understand
where they're coming as you go deeper and
deeper and deeper and the least that you
will come to is okay they have a
paradigm may allah forgive him for it that's
what i'm upon i'm not saying they're right
i'm not saying they're right i'm saying i
see where they're coming from and in their
world view in their world view it is
not shirk that's what i come to you
understand i'm saying so this is why we
have to move beyond the platitudes and the
slogans and get to the real nitty-gritty
how can you achieve unity with groups that
you think are worshiping other than allah even
if you say okay allah will excuse them
for their ignorance because you're still saying that
they're worshiping other than allah you know you're
still and by the way the the haram
doesn't save you why because even i will
have clearly like what literally says you know
even if you say it's haram but you
don't think it's shirk you are mushrik yeah
but i mean that's his literally that's his
literal view so i see that as like
kind of kind of on the fringes but
there is as is the person like the
like the you know that i think even
those who would say for example okay it's
just it's must have they in their practice
okay on part from the the more extreme
ones that even that that intuitively the the
average muslim kind of looks upon and says
well this is a bit i agree the
fitra finds this fitra would a hundred percent
agree to keep kind of like a magnet
draw them to not going and going there
and i think it might be kind of
sometimes i think it almost talking about it
and think of it as a big thing
because even if you're saying speaking against that
that mentality it's kind of accidentally reviving and
and keeping that thing alive okay whereas maybe
reducing i would feel reducing the the commitment
to convincing people about that issue so i
was thinking maybe i bad that maybe we've
got the notion of ibadah as some kind
of simply definable thing wrong so i would
if i were to meet one of these
you i would say to them my dear
brothers in islam you know this is a
controversial issue and you none of you say
it's none of you say it's what you
why don't you just let it be i
would literally advise them just get out of
this controversy because you provoke the other side
i know the other side's acting rash and
foolish as well but by you constantly doing
this you're going to provoke the other side
and they polarize yeah they polarize so i
would definitely advise them this as well like
don't get involved in controversial stuff but when
all is said and done i am not
interested in categorizing these other muslims as being
the worst of mankind of course i can
cooperate with them for other needs and goods
not just that but you you can feel
that they are brothers they are and not
just feel they are our brothers like cooperation
so this that cannot happen if i have
this cognitive dissonance and it didn't happen because
i know myself when i was on the
old school paradigm you're smiling at them but
in your heart there's this ache you're you're
sitting and eating with them but they're they're
not really my full brethren you can't help
it because that's the way you feel and
now that's not the case because i genuinely
view all of these strands yes salafis included
they're still my brother i'm not anti salafi
i just moved on and they are all
what is that no that doesn't mean all
muslims are exactly the same i've said this
as well there are red lines to believe
in a prophet out of the process and
it's clearly a red line to believe in
a god other than all which no muslim
actually does is a clearly a red line
to abandon worship of allah which one or
two of the extreme ismaili groups have done
there is no taboo there is no salah
there is no zika there is no when
you're when you're not even worshiping there is
no la ilaha illallah there is no worship
no that means you've crossed the red line
over there right so there are red lines
but within these red lines all of these
movements are muslim now some are better and
closer and without a doubt sunnism alhamdulillah respects
the sahaba that is definitely a positive thing
to do i don't agree with the other
school that disrespects but they're not kafirs for
it without a doubt you know um i
mean i still say this for the record
the athletic creed overall overall that's the more
sensible one because it's not going from john
of damascus's division of the attributes but still
it's a trivial difference so my point though
is these differences should not be to the
point of dividing us such that we cannot
come together for the greater good this is
the key point and for the record before
we finish off as well we didn't talk
about the um details of why i say
it's not shirk and it's only haram or
whatnot for that you can listen to my
three-hour lecture on the najd where i
go into in a lot of detail please
listen to it uh take notes if you
need to but i go into it and
i explain why i hold these so that's
explaining that inshallah did you have something on
that i've got another yeah i was actually
going to ask sheikh you know you're talking
about dissonance and um there's one thing within
the muslims but actually i think for a
lot of muslims especially for us growing up
kind of those mid 40s right is with
the 30s as well 30s with the non
-muslims yes another issue the wala and bara
versions we were taught this was one of
the first how many flies do you want
to pick today no no but this is
like it's a natural concept if you're talking
about dissonance a lot of people they've kind
of reconciled with other muslims but with non
-muslims there's still that thing yeah this is
a topic i need to talk about in
more academic detail i was planning to give
a library chat about this because this is
another massive problem the average muslim has the
misunderstanding of wala and bara again to be
academic may allah protect me but this is
the truth it is the academic truth the
understanding of wala and bara that was taught
by ibn abdul wahab was unprecedented to islamic
history ibn taimiyya didn't teach it ghazali didn't
teach it tahawi doesn't have that type of
understanding the ibn abdul wahab understanding wala and
bara became a politicized takfir yeah if you
don't agree with me and you side with
my political enemy you are a kafir in
the eyes of allah that's what he taught
and that's what he did and he fought
and he killed based upon that again well
known read the books that understanding of wala
and bara wala and bara before ibn abdul
wahab is more of an adab than fiqh
i.e what do i mean by this
you should have a generic love for the
muslims and anybody who wants to harm islam
you can't like that person this is a
more of an adab you don't politicize it
because politicizing it means you are going to
define who is a good and a bad
muslim and who is on the side of
this on the side of that that only
occurs in the battle of badr there are
rules of sheikh isn't it a quote like
jizya for example so there is some politicization
if islam is no no okay wala and
bara comes into the reality of the last
20 years of all that's taking place in
our nation states taking sides means you're a
kafir well but that's exactly what wala and
bara would entail taking sides means you're so
this is the whole issue here right so
this understanding needs to be deconstructed academically i
haven't done it yet others have done it
i need i have a big library chat
about the reality of wala and bara the
misunderstanding that has come from ibn adwaha's movement
and then after that from the modern manifestations
you know al-makhdisi and others how they
have resurrected that misunderstanding ironically i find this
interesting for the academically inclined subhanallah so so
interesting right this notion is purely coming from
one strand of islam but because of interaction
it has trickled over into other understandings you
hear their bandi ulema talking about wala and
bara it's not a part of the dewan
tradition at all you know it's like interesting
how they've taken these types of things and
and and you know uh when was it
when your queen died right and something happened
i forgot what like uh some child's uh
in the masjid oh yeah yeah central masjid
there listen i'm not taking sides here but
nobody became a kafir let me just put
it that way okay i mean the whole
brouhaha and controversy i forgot the details i
should be careful here but i was just
laughing like seriously guys i mean you can
say it's not appropriate you can say but
accusations of kufr accusations of bro i mean
i mean yeah i don't think anyone was
anyone serious anyone was taken seriously who was
online they were there like there was i
mean you're gonna get that kind it's like
this this extremism that has happened that if
you merely show any type of you know
you can say acting foolish in this regard
i get it totally get it but there
is no theology here in this regard you
know and a lot of us that it
is what it is man so your your
expertise your background is the the evolution the
history of ideas and sects and so forth
what would you say my
question is what do you think historians later
on would say about today what and how
will they described describe muslim sects and groups
and so forth today and going forward so
i think we are seeing a new phase
of interest and a new revival of questions
and epistemologies because of the circumstances we find
ourselves in and later historians without a doubt
will have a lot to say about our
times we are the one of the first
generations especially in the west that has to
tackle sectarianism in a very academic way you
don't find ulama in pakistan or in timbuktu
or in egypt tackling sectarianism head-on yeah
because there's no need to it's the muslims
of england and america that are actually talking
and producing academic papers sheikh haytham has produced
something i have multiple talks about sectarianism right
how we deal with this difference of opinion
believe it or not we're actually producing a
thought that is effective for the rest of
the world we're producing in the western world
why because we have been forced by circumstance
to think and to act in ways people
outside of us don't have to do the
same applies for what i'm doing i if
i hadn't been forced to think along the
lines i'm being i wouldn't have been thinking
along these lines i'd just be a card
carrying you know taimian all the way through
but life and circumstances teach you what books
do not teach you and to see with
your own eyes this reality of okay this
isn't the religion of allah to tell people
the sifat are like this and tawhid is
like this and whatnot they're all tawhid they're
all people of tawhid my version of tawhid
is but one version all that these people
are loving allah and his messenger none of
them in their mind have to go back
to and none of them is equating the
process with allah that's the best definition of
tawhid knowing what you know now about what
happened in the second century third century and
how later it was it took on a
kind of life of its own these groups
these these that's not going to happen because
the the the chart has already been filled
do you think do you think it's not
going to have no different * from different
angles no i don't think so not really
there will be fringe movements but you cannot
reinvent that wheel because those are the original
dominoes those they have a certain um privilege
a historical privilege not a theological privilege see
logic that might be because of the subject
they're talking about what about for example along
the lines of secularism or liberalism well we're
talking about we don't call them sects we
don't call them schisms or or so groups
or parties identities you really want to get
controversial let's go for it you interviewed dr
hatem and had that two weeks ago about
secular mind right i heard that interview actually
it was done ages ago but really just
published okay i heard it two weeks ago
okay and i interviewed dr akram medui because
these are publicly mentioned names okay and i
interviewed dr hatem al-haj about these issues
and my views are also known okay us
four i mentioned by name because they're all
public our views are very close when it
comes to muslims living in modern times under
secular lands very close we and especially me
because i don't know why just me but
we are extremely criticized by many other strands
we're actually called sellouts deviants ci agents ran
agents reformers whatnot you all know this right
this is an example of a modern theological
battle taking place in front of your eyes
it's literally a new battle taking place because
we are attempting to navigate living in the
lands that we live in in a very
different way than are you called any of
that by people with any any kudos or
like are you equating creating like social media
comments with you're right social media guys agreed
hamdulillah their social media are you misunderstood sheikh
or is it that you're it's that you
are a ci agent where's my paycheck man
is it genuinely that you're bringing something different
or people are misunderstanding you are they really
understanding the points that you make both both
are there i am look at look look
at what i just said about aqidah yeah
very few people are this blunt about saying
i don't care about the sifat controversy i
don't know i think you think there are
people saying in my experience okay it doesn't
sound that outlandish it sounds like it feels
like you're you're bringing your background as could
be there okay you know this and this
is you know people are gonna cancel me
and people are gonna well they are but
i'm saying it i i feel my anecdotal
experiences that that's more like social media kind
of banter and stuff that's so the average
molana in my masjid you know even the
deobandi molana in my masjid even if you
push cuffs to shove you probably agree with
most of the stuff you said likewise you
know the the i think my experiences with
uh clerics is different than yours then yeah
i think maybe maybe you rub rub them
up differently cleric could be could be because
you know clerics that are trained is that
you get a bit yeah that are trained
in their traditions yeah generally don't appreciate this
sentiment and like i said they don't mind
level two and level two is okay i'm
right you're wrong but we're still let's live
and let live they don't mind that that
if you're talking about that i agree with
you i'm not level two is fine and
i'm happy if you get there but for
the intellectuals we need to get a level
three but you're within all this i think
part of what it is is you see
when you're shining a light on and i
don't want to say criticizing because i don't
think it's criticism but you're shining a light
on what many people's lives entire scholarship has
been built upon then it's like you're taking
away the foundations and what's the goal of
doing that for them to know for me
what is no no there isn't a but
i don't think you are sheikh this is
what i'm saying we see what you may
think is implied that actually you're building upon
or it's how you've understood the tradition and
you're bringing it into how it's manifested today
it's very different to saying i disagree with
the tradition and sometimes it comes out as
if you are pushing yourself away from the
tradition just and it's just how people understand
what you're saying so the tradition is how
we got here we wouldn't be here without
the tradition yeah so where there's no need
to rethink or change we should stick to
the tradition without a doubt but where circumstances
force us where we find the tradition is
simply not working then let us go back
and see is the tradition itself the religion
of allah or is it a development from
the religion so the default and this is
where i say i'm different from the modernists
and progressives because i do don't don't like
their hustle the default is we stick to
the tradition yeah and we admire the tradition
with the recognition that the tradition is a
man-made product yes but there are going
to be specific issues that are going to
challenge us and life will be almost impossible
or very difficult yeah where that happens let
us not me groups of people senior to
me elder than me come together and then
discuss those particular issues and see can we
find a way that respects the religion of
allah because we can never compromise there is
no reformation in the deen of allah but
the interpretations of men without a doubt that's
interpretations of men so who's going to make
that distinction qualified people i am the least
of them but perhaps inshallah can sit in
the room with them and it can do
that so like i said listen to i
liked the interview with dr haytham i like
the interview with um uh you had with
another person as well uh and then i
give two interviews with dr akram tom as
well good and dog no but before i
forgot dr akram as well and dr hatim
alhaj iris i asked the viewers that are
watching forget me go listen to these other
three guys she had that dr akram by
the way dr hatim alhaj they're all older
than me in age they're all wiser than
me in experience they're all more knowledgeable than
me and all of them are saying pretty
much what i am saying is that yes
theory is great but right now we're living
under a nation state right now we have
to carve a way out understanding that it
might have to rethink through some of the
simplistic notions we had in the past this
is not a rejection of the religion of
allah it is actually the proper manifestation of
how it should be applied given our context
but also within that i think we can
say sheikh they have the humility to say
that and some mistakes may be made of
course but it's a journey right of course
but it's better than hiding your head in
the sand exactly exactly because that's not going
to teach you anywhere yeah which is what
traditionalism does yeah it's better than saying that
we cannot change anything because the the the
human product that we have inherited is the
religion of allah no that's not correct so
yes all of us are going to make
some mistakes all of us but we hope
inshallah that people will come and help us
correct the mistakes and make a bigger and
better product for the future rather than pull
people down for the small mistakes that are
made so you mentioned like um muslim vis
-a-vis the secular nation state the secularism
today that could be one of the kind
of fault lines that emerge or historians might
look back at i'm mentioning these so we
can kind of preempt it and maybe lay
the foundations for being careful not to let
these kind of schisms become too extreme and
i don't think they're going to create in
the they're going to result in the creation
of actual sectarian lines but they're going to
be trends because i mean maybe the the
early um you know i don't see this
happen but you never know you never know
you couldn't even didn't know that about but
yeah so sectarian i mean so you're going
to find these trends when it comes to
this issue obviously another major uh elephant in
the room uh is the issue of gender
wars taking place right now uh about the
role of men and women and as you
know this is one of the biggest hottest
topics online i know how should men and
women what does it mean to be a
muslim man in our times and again my
views are somewhere along the spectrum and you've
got people to the right of me to
be beloved to me so it is what
it is you know um another is going
to be political uh participation which is a
very very awkward and we haven't solved this
problem we have not solved this problem we
have yeah you definitely have not 100 percent
we have because you have a muslim mayor
and a muslim prime minister i'm worried about
this 20 miles an hour 20 miles an
hour the american view ship has no idea
what you're talking about but the biggest criticism
salman by has of his mayor is that
he has lowered the speed limit to 20
miles an hour and salman is so angry
that he's going to cancel the mayor let's
uh let's bring it wrap it up then
inshallah it's been a marathon one for joining
us and zack for you at home and
also omar as well for sorting out the
offices thanks for watching tuning in let us
know in the comments uh you know if
you agree disagree if you want to refute
anyone here anyone here but uh yeah if
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