Naima B. Robert – Children’s Book Q&A Muslimah Author Summit 2022
AI: Summary ©
The speakers discuss the importance of writing books and maintaining a positive mindset, as well as the challenges of creating children books and the importance of staying committed to projects. They provide tips for finding a good publisher, including the power of social media and influencers, and emphasize the importance of finding one's own purpose and staying committed to projects. They also discuss their day 4 program, including creating a landing page and learning about the process of creating an email list, and encourage followers to buy their books and support each other while also encouraging them to use the blessings of workspace. They encourage their followers to follow each other and support each other, while also encouraging them to buy their books and support each other.
AI: Summary ©
Excited for this next session. Hope you guys
are too, And
I believe we are live.
And welcome to
this very, very special session in the Muslimah
Writers Summit 2022.
I am so,
so stoked for this particular session.
These sessions on this day, day 2, have
been around children's books and writing for children,
and, I've said it before and I will
say it again, writing for children is one
of my favorite forms of literature. I I
love to do it myself. I love to
read children's book, and I love helping
other sisters, other women writing their children's books.
And so what we have for you in
this session is a very, very, very special
group of women who all happen to be
graduates of our children's writing programs or people
that we have helped to get their book
out there, get their book into readers hands,
etcetera.
Really special group of women,
gorgeous books, and they are going to be
sharing with you guys
who they are. They're gonna show you their
books. You're gonna get to see all the
lovely goodies, and then they're gonna talk to
you and share with you their writing journeys.
Because the writing journey of somebody who's writing
a memoir, for example,
or a self help book or, you know,
a book for, you know, professional reasons
is very different from the journey of a
children's book author. And I know how many
of you out there, you know, have a
dream of writing a children's book. So we
thought, again,
let's hear it from the horse's mouth. You
have to hear it from me. You can
hear it from the ladies themselves who have
written their first book and put it out
into the world, and you can see that
it is something that is possible. It is
doable,
and maybe it's the thing that you need
to be looking at. So I've got my
wonderful
clients, graduates, friends, colleagues
here. I've got Layla Goldsmith, Shazia Afzal, Emma
Hallim, Husna Rahman,
Mona Mona Zach, who I we call her,
Khosar,
and they are all going to be talking
to us about their books inshallah.
Before we get started, please do take a
moment just to
check out their names.
I will be asking you to follow them
on Instagram.
Ladies, if one of you wants to take
a picture of all of you on screen,
please do post it and tag me because
my phone is in use right now, so
I can't do it. But anyone of you
who wants to take a picture, please do
just take a couple of screenshots.
Tell the world where you are. Let them
know you are at the Muslim art writers
summit 2022.
And, yeah, they can come and join us
on YouTube as well.
You can pose, let us know inshallah if
you've got to take a few pictures because
we are going to kick off with
letting Leila Goldsmith introduce herself
and her book, her in this instance, her
claim to fame. Insha'Allah.
Leila,
what you got for us?
Thank you so much for having me here.
It's such a pleasure to,
join everyone here on this special night.
My name is Leila, and I'm the author
of,
Baby's Blessing, which is this nice little title
here. It was, published by Rokay Bookshelf,
I think we're going on to 2 years
now,
Insha'Allah.
So this book,
is based on the story of a little
girl from my hometown,
which you may not know about, but it's
called Lamu. It's in East Africa in Kenya.
And,
I really wanted to write this book because,
as I was looking I'm I'm a huge
book reader. I absolutely
love and adore children's books. But as I
was looking for books to read to my
children,
I couldn't find any story
that reflected my own culture and heritage.
And I it really bugged me, and I
I also run a community library
So
So I decided to kind of
what if, you know, play out that scenario.
What if I actually wrote the book that
I wanted to read?
And so that took me down a very
interesting journey.
I,
was I signed up for the
Muslim writers group that will that's,
run by sister Naima,
and it was really, really fantastic
And, yeah, I'm really, really glad
that,
you know, I I followed up that dream.
I listened to that voice in my head.
I was courageous enough.
So, yeah, here I am today.
I don't know. Naima, should I answer any
other question?
No. No. I'm gonna go around the room
and let everyone introduce themselves, inshallah, then we'll
dive in with the questions.
Thank you so much. We've got sister Emma.
Emma Helene, take it away, sis.
Everybody.
I just wanna take a moment because this
may be the most famous I ever get.
So if mom and dad, if you're watching
hi.
I made it.
So my name is Emma.
Good day, mate. I'm from Australia, and
I wrote this book called Ramadan Rockets.
I'm I'm just like I'm just I'm a
I'd it was a love it was a
love journey.
So this book
is, obviously, Ramadan themes.
A quick,
quick summary.
It's about a boy who
travels into space to search for the Ramadan
moon. And,
of course, he has to think, how am
I gonna get there? So what does he
do? He borrows a rocket from his friends,
and so he goes up into space looking
for Ramadan moon. And it's really just a
gentle way to
to introduce the concept of moonsighting to our
Muslim children. So,
that's what the book is about. And you
know what? I'm really nervous. I forgot what
else was I meant to answer.
That's it. Thank you so much, Emma. Okay.
So Ramadan. Thank you. Ramadan rocket. That's it.
Excellent. Okay. I've got Shazia Afzal next. Tell
us who you are and tell us introduce
us to your book or your, in this
case, books.
Assalamu alaikum, everyone.
I'm Shazia Absal and,
a teacher by profession. I loved books since
ever.
And I have 2 books published. So
one is the sleepy farmer
That is for Muslim children published by a
Muslim author,
And
it just got the Muslim
books the grant award as well for best
toddler
book.
And
this is my next book, the journey of
the midnight sun.
It's, about a journey of a mosque 4,000
kilometers away.
And both these books were
crafted and edited and Naima's,
most children's writing club. And
this one's coming out inshallah on 15th March
inshallah. So
looking forward to it and looking forward to
learning about everybody else inshallah.
Masha'Allah.
Love it, Shazia. Love it. And we'll talk
more about your writing journey because your journey
with us has been a long one. Masha'Allah.
We'll talk more about that in a bit.
But,
congratulations
on your prize winner. Masha'Allah.
Love it. Okay. I've got Komsara Ashaikhab next.
Assalamu alaikum, everyone. Thank you so much for
having me here, Naima. Really, really appreciate it.
So I am the author of
Tales of Mini Mariam, my debut book.
So it's all about my little Miriam. So
Miriam, who's not actually not little anymore, she's
now 13 years old. But this was 10
years ago when she was, 3 years old
and what she used to get up to.
And the things that I'd say to her
afterwards the was I'd say to her afterwards.
One particular story I'd love to share really
really quickly in this book because the short
the stories are quite short:
Miriam has a pushchair full of loads of
items. She collects things from the whole of
the house and she walks around the kitchen
and then all of a sudden
the pushchair is like that. Yeah. Full of,
you know, the toaster and the bread and,
everything else and then the dollies, etcetera. All
of a sudden the pushchair falls
and, I come into the I walk into
the room and I said, MARIAH!
Literally, I did. And and Maureen looks up
at me with an innocent face, a beady
eye says to me,
Okay. Oh my god. So Hannah, Lana. You
know, how can you tell your child off
when she says that to you? So yeah.
So that's in the book. So it's all
about my little Miriam, and that's why it's
called Tales of Little Miriam.
I love that. Oh, that is so precious.
That is so, so good. In an earlier
session, I talked about sharing your experiences in
a children's book,
and that is definitely one for the records,
Just to capture that moment of just innocent
tawakkul, I guess.
I love it.
Congratulations.
Well done. And we'll talk more about your
journey with this book because it's been a
very exciting one as well.
I've got Husna Arrahman up next. Take it,
Oasis.
Assalamu alaikum, everyone. Sorry. You said my Internet
connection is unstable, so I apologize for that.
Great timing. But just a couple of highlights
for having me here. And everyone, it's so
lovely to see you with other amazing sisters.
So my name is Susan Rahman and I
am author of the book I Lost Something
Very Special,
which was self published and launched in September
2021.
And it's a story about grief and loss
and a very, very personal
story to me because it's based on,
based on my little girl.
And yeah, I'll tell you a little bit
more about it later, but,
yeah, it's my it's my special, special book.
Thank you so much everyone.
And a special book. It definitely
is. We should know. We've been behind the
scenes of all these books.
I would like to invite sister Mona up
next.
Take it away, sis.
I am Mona. I am an author, a
mom, a poet.
I actually used to write a lot of
poetry.
I didn't write. I just came up with,
like, little rhymes on the spot. And interestingly,
it was something that really, really annoyed my
sisters. They're like, why do you do this
about everything?
But subhanAllah, it was something,
that always stuck with them. Anything I've made
a poem about, it's stuck in their heads.
And,
one of the things that I
realized when my daughter was about 3
was
that I was journeying towards knowing who Allah
was through his names and attributes. And
I had seen a lot of children's books
and things which are amazing out there.
But because
of my experience with my sisters and even,
like, with my child, like,
being so quick to remember rhymes and things
like that, I really wanted to write a
little poetry book. And so it's not very
little, but it's my treasury
of poems,
called connecting
with Allah Subhanahu Wa Ta'ala.
And,
yeah, it was a real journey and
I really hope it connects children
to a lot in a way that
is accessible to them and enjoyable to them.
And for me, one of the things that
I really wanted to be as well was
a real family journey. I see this book
as something that families do together. They sit
together. They talk together.
You know, they learn about Allah together, and
really that was the whole purpose of the
book. And, SubhanAllah, Naima, as you know, it's
been a very long journey for me.
I think yeah it's been 5 years now
SubhanAllah
And it's only it's well, not only, but
it has been published this year by Proland.
So,
very excited
to share that with the world.
And so you should be because it really
is a a a gorgeous collection, and you've
just you know, you've you've made it so
much more beautiful. And I, you know, I
want to talk about this, in a moment.
But before I talk about all of you
honoring your stories, in the way that you
have,
I want to first say just a huge
to every single one of you because, you
know, your books are beautiful
and, you know, you've done something by Allah's
grace that, you know, 90%,
95, I think the number is 97%
of people
dream of doing, try to do and just
don't end up completing. They just don't get
to the finish line, and you guys got
to the finish line.
So as you can imagine, I mean, if
coach Hind was here, her and I will
be, like, clocking like matriarchs, you know, and
grannies because these are like our our daughters
and their grandbabies and, you know, these gorgeous
books that they're putting out into the world.
But but
every one of
you had that calling on your heart initially.
Yeah. Every one of you knew
somewhere inside you that you had something to
share. You had something beautiful that you wanted
to to to share with the world. And
those of you who are listening, who are
watching, I think that's obvious.
You know, everybody here and that's why I
love, love, love working with my sisters
because the intention
is always such a beautiful intention.
Very rarely do we find a sister who
comes, who wants to write a book just
because she wants to be famous or as
a vanity project or just to see her
name on a book very, very rare. As
you've heard from the sisters who are here,
who are by no means the exception, they're
just the ones who put their hands up
and were like, yeah, I'm happy to come
on the panel. But every one of them
had that calling on her heart and that
intention
to to eventually to please Allah through this
work, to achieve something beautiful
for the sake of Allah and for the
sake of the children, for the sake of
the next generation. So I just want to
honor every one of you
for not just having that desire, which is
something that Allah puts in us. I believe
that. You know, not everyone wants to write
a book. Lots of people do, but not
everyone does.
And then all of the ones who do,
very few of them actually take serious steps
to making it happen.
Every one of you has taken a serious
step, whether you enrolled in a program with
me, whether you hired us as editors, whether
you, you know, you you some of you
Mona, for example. Mona was our first one
of our first book coaching clients, and we're
talking from 2019,
I believe.
So that book journey has been,
you know, has been that long. Shazi is
another person who we've worked with for for
extended periods of time and worked on many
books together.
Emma came into a 6 week program. And
what is it, sis? Less than,
I don't know, 3 months later,
the book is there. So the point is
that everyone started with
place something in your heart that gave you
the desire to do this, and then you
made decisions along the way that led you
to getting your outcome.
And whether that took you 3 months, 6
months, or 3 years,
here you are because you didn't give up.
So I guess what I want to do
now is I want to well, the the
second thing I want to say was just
thank you everybody for honoring your stories by
actually
pushing to put them out into the world.
Because I know many people who've written really,
really lovely stories, but the stories stay on
their laptop,
they stay in a notebook, they stay hidden
because it takes courage
to actually
send that manuscript to a publisher,
to make the decision to invest in an
illustrator,
right,
To make the decision to put in the
time to learn how self publishing works, to
go through the process of accepting rejections or
getting rejections from numerous publishers. Shazia, do you
remember the conversation we had about the different
levels
of response from publishers? You know, where
those of you who have actually, you know,
submitted your work, you know that sometimes you
don't hear anything back from them. And then
sometimes you do hear back and it's a
no. And then you start to hear back
and it's a, this is not right for
us, but keep us in mind for your
next one.
Or they come back with suggestions for how
you can improve. And then one day, there's
that one that comes back and says, we
want to consider this for publication. We'll be
having a meeting about it. But the fact
that you stuck with it and you stuck
and you stayed committed through whether it's the
self publishing process or the publishing process,
I wanna honor you for that.
And I think my question to my first
question to you guys is,
what's the biggest lesson that you've learned along
the way? You know, what is the lesson
you learned yourself
as an author, as somebody who, you know,
has kind of been on this journey? Who
would like to kick us off, Insha'Allah? Just
feel free to unmute and miss Mullah.
I can go, inshallah? Now if we play
yeah. Please. Because if we play too polite,
we're gonna be here for ages. Okay? So
you don't have to jump in there. It's
like hopscotch. You don't like double drop your
hopscotch. You don't have to just jump in
there. We're in another space. Go ahead. Lisamilla,
I think for me, honestly, it's been
persistence,
really,
and seeing it through to the end.
And one final one, which is giving up
on
trying to make things perfect.
That was a big one.
That was a huge one.
So
that was, I remember having a conversation. I
met you at a charity event, and you're
like, Mona, a book that's out there is
better than a perfect book that's not out
there.
And, yeah.
I'd say that. I'd say that in a
tweet.
It's true. It's true, though. An imperfect book
that is out being enjoyed and being you
know, benefiting the people
is better than a trying to be perfect
book that hasn't seen the light of day.
Is that clear enough for that? I forgot
about that.
Anyone else?
Just sort of the back of that of,
putting out the the perfect book. I'm still
making
changes in my book now after 5
months
so if I had waited
so long
to put it out there then you know,
it's fine. I'll let you think all those
people that have given me the thing that
I've learned, the biggest thing
is you have to
you have to, as cheap as it sounds,
you really have to believe
in your, the purpose for why you're doing
this book and we have to believe in,
sorry, I forgot my internet is unstable, but
you really have to believe in yourself and
I've realised that I had to be my
biggest motivator
in all of this. I've had so many
people supporting me and without them, I've not,
I've been able to get this book out
there at all. But,
there were days where I just thought, you
know what, I'm just gonna put it to
the side. Maybe it's not the right time
right now. I'm gonna leave it. So many
doubts.
But I just had to push myself and
taking those baby steps
as opposed to huge leaps sometimes just helped
a lot. So yeah, I think definitely believing
in yourself and believing in the reason why
and I remember, Sis and I will say
all the time, remember your why, just always
have your why in mind, and I did.
And I showed up.
Good. You did.
Yeah. Go ahead, Shazia.
I think my
biggest lesson is that, you know, if it's
your dream,
you can't give up on it,
but you have to invest time,
money,
efforts,
period.
Allah does listen. Listen. Allah responds to our
duas. Allah makes them come true,
but we have to put in the time,
money, effort, energy.
Without putting in that sweat and blood,
it just won't happen like that.
Yeah. That's Yeah. I'm definitely
person.
I love that. And, you know, like I
said, Shazia,
we've been working together for, you know, often
on for years now. And Shazia always used
to say, my goal is to be published
by a traditional publisher.
And sometimes we would say, just get something
published, Shazia. It don't have to be a
traditional publisher. You know, some of these stories
would be good in a magazine, you know,
because Shazia wrote a lot of stories.
So it's, you know, submit to magazines, you
know, maybe look at self publishing, and she
just I think we managed to wear you
down a little bit, didn't we, Shazia, at
the end. Right?
And, you know, you were able to kind
of understand that maybe there there are there
is still benefit even if it's not one
of the big publishers, but
you never gave up on that.
And I think midnight Journey of the Midnight
Sun is a testimony to to your to
stick with it ness.
Would you do is that how you feel?
Yes.
Great. Anyone else to share their lessons along
the way? What's this journey taught you?
I would say
that if you do have a book in
your belly,
get it out there.
Definitely
write it and then approach whether you have
to push either publish or self publish.
Because unlike
me, Tales of Miniveriam would not have existed
because it was actually I was writing memoirs
of my daughter,
and I had no intention of publishing it.
It was one of those what you spoke
about. I'd write it and put it on
top of my cupboard, and that's where it'd
be. And the reason was my purpose was
when my children grow up inshallah they'd want
to know how they were when they were
young and I'm going to read it to
them one day. That was my purpose. But
then one day my older child, Malija, she
came to my house
and, I had written up her birth story
when she was, you know, when I was
when I gave birth to her what happened
you know all the drama that was going
on in the room I'd written that up
and I was so excited about her and
about the story. So she came home and
I said, hey. Look, Lilia. Look. This is
what I wrote about you. This is what
happened. This, that, and the other. And she's
like, alright.
And she walked off. You know, that's no.
Oh, I'm like, no. No. No. She's like,
alright. And I said, okay. Oh, that's that's
interesting. And then just walked off and I
thought to myself, why am I doing this?
And then do you know what? I thought
to myself, oh, wow. I'm not writing that
Marian. Forget my own children. There's children in
the world that need to hear my story.
You know, there's
And so this book, this book is for
the children of the world, you know, and
that, and my children too, but the firstly,
the children of the world. So yes, if
you have a book in your belly, get
it out. Vomit it out. Do something. Just
get it out then.
I love that. Book in your belly. I
love that.
Go ahead, sis.
Should I should I go ahead, ma'am? Leila
and Emma raising their hands. Yeah. Go ahead.
Yes.
I think, I'm just going to echo what
Shazia said about investing in yourself because,
I think as women, we are so good
at giving others,
like, a 100%
to others. But we always tend to put
ourselves last and that's one of the things
that I really had to overcome
is
trying actually showing up for myself
and showing up for my dream.
If that means that I put in a
little bit of extra money to the site
to save
up for, you know, signing up for training
courses, for an illustrator,
for all these other things that come with
being a writer,
I had to start doing that. And that
became something it was a practice that kind
of, like, spilled over to other areas of
my life as well.
Another big thing I,
that I found really helpful and I've learned
along the way is
not to be so judgmental
of yourself. Don't compare yourself to anyone else.
I think when you're writing a book, you
have to approach it with a very healthy
sense of curiosity.
So just start the journey, start the first
step,
and really follow that trail. I think someone
called
it follow the thread of sweetness.
So follow that thread
and see where that takes you. And I
found that I didn't know what I was
doing.
But along the way,
helpers came up. I connected with so many
amazing women who helped me along the way.
I signed up and formed a critique group.
I've become close friends with some of, the
ladies that I,
I kind of
came into into contact with, on my writing
journey.
And things just start to kind of, like,
come together. Things just start to happen
and that's because I let go of what
my idea of how things should be and
just surrendered
to this
idea
of I'm just going to approach it with
a healthy sense of curiosity
and I'm going to see what
Allah has in store for me. And it's
been a really delightful journey.
I love that, Masha'Allah. Super super important advice
as well because comparison truly is the thief
of joy.
You know, and as we said earlier,
although every one of you has, you know,
the same more or less the same outcome
in that you have a book in your
hands,
your pathways to getting there are so have
been so different. And as you can see,
everybody has learned something
unique on their own unique journey. Emma, you
wanted to share.
I was just I think everyone pretty much
just summed up everything so, like, eloquently. I'm,
like, a bit nervous to jump in and
say something, but I was just gonna say,
how everyone like,
remembering your intention and your purpose, I also
found that really big. I mean, for me,
personally,
as a as a revert to Islam, I
grew up as a Caucasian
Australian.
I never realized.
I never felt
not represented in media. I always felt represented
in books and all types of media. And
it wasn't until I became Muslim and had
children that I that I realized
I would notice
a a book or, you know, something in
an article with a girl in a hijab,
and then I felt, oh, that's really awesome.
And and then I started to realize, actually,
it's something that I didn't notice before, like,
the way that I grew up. But now
I feel like I'm on the other side
of the spectrum, and I can really appreciate
how important representation is in all facets of
media, like, not just for our children, but
for us as adults.
So that's why I feel like it's for
me, it was really good to keep that
in mind if I ever had any struggles
because I was like, you know, if anything,
I'll have a book for my children
that they can see themselves in and then
you kind of just I always just tell
myself
if one kid in the world reads my
story and learns about, like, it feels represented
that, you know, oh, there's this kid in
this book and, you know, they're Muslim too
and, you know, or they learn something about
or they get they connect to Allah Subhanahu,
then I feel like I feel success, you
know, inshallah in that manner. So, yeah, just
remembering your your purpose. I thought that was
fine. So
I'm done. I love that. I no. No.
No. I love that. It's fantastic. And, you
know, you've mentioned about sort of, you know,
the representation aspect, and, obviously, that's come up
for several of our authors. And because we
are mainly
minorities in the countries in which we're publishing,
it stands to reason that the issue of
representation
or diversity is gonna be something that is
of cons not just not concern to us,
but but it's actually something that works in
our favor. And I'll just for those you
guys have heard this before, I'm sure. If
you've been to the children's book workshop, then
you've heard me saying this many times.
But
for us as Muslim women authors,
this is one of the best times to
be to be doing this because
not only
are there so many more Muslim publishers
than there were 5, 10 years ago. Right?
No. Not only has the children Muslim children's
book industry
expanded
exponentially,
but also
so called mainstream publishers are also aware of
the need for, you know, different voices, alternative
voices,
representation
of the communities that they serve, etcetera. So
that puts us in a fantastic position.
Some of you are published by
public publishers that are very aware of this.
Shazee, I think you're an example of that.
Leila, your publisher, is one of the indie
publishers that has come up really in the
last 5 to 10 years. Rukeya's Bookshelf
is doing amazing work, And she wasn't around
10 years ago, you know, and and Mona
and and just all of us being able
to
to to to to tap into this increased
demand for children's books where Muslim children can
learn, can enjoy, can, you know, can grow.
I'm really excited for that, and I can
only see that trend actually growing inshallah.
But the other thing that I want to
bring to everyone's attention who's watching
is
when you see these books,
you cannot tell which ones are self published
and which ones are published by publishers.
And I don't know whether you guys got
this from us, but I'm very, very I'm
happy about that because I've always said that
if we as Muslims are going to produce
anything for our children,
we want to make sure that the standard
is not subpar.
Right? That it's not below the standard of
the books they'll find in the library. That
was one of my motivations for going in
and getting publishers because I wanted the books
that I offered to my child, which represented
him or our life or told our story
to be just as beautiful as the books
out there.
And I wanna say everyone, especially those of
you who self published,
thank you, thank you, thank you for investing
in a fantastic illustrator
and great design.
I thank you. And our children thank you
because the fact that the books that they
are buying from, whether it's an independent publisher,
whether this is your only book that you've
put out there, or it's from Simon and
Schuster,
that qualitatively
there is no difference. I absolutely love that.
I'm just putting that out there. But I
wanna hear from you guys in terms especially
for our self published ones. How
how tough was it to navigate that whole
process of, you know, the the the illustrator
and the design, etcetera?
And did you learn any tips that you
wanna share with our with our attendees, inshallah,
with people who are watching this now? Who
would like to kick us off?
And then I'm gonna go on to the
published authors next because I know that there's
lots of challenges
with being published as well, and I wanna
hear what tips or tricks you guys have
that you'd like to offer to those who
are watching this video. Mona, you know I'm
calling on you, and then Husna, I'm coming
to you next. Mona,
I know she knows why I'm calling on
her as well. Yeah. It's on. Go.
So I actually,
went down something called hybrid publishing,
where it's a publisher, but I you know,
we kind of both do it together.
And what was really lovely about,
well, it was it was a long journey.
And, again, it's it's one of those things
where,
I'm sure everyone here knows, like, finding an
author who can bring to I'm sorry. An
illustrator rather who can bring to life what,
you know, what you envision for the book
and all of this. And
I wanted a little more control over that
than, you know, if I give it to
a publisher and they produce something,
that was very different.
I also
and Naima and I had this conversation about
it being a treasury
and all these treasury books that I've seen
have,
I don't know, something it's like something very
special and elegant and it's kind of, you
know, a certain kind of look like a
linen cover and all of this. And, you
know, I wanted it produced in a very
particular way.
And,
I was lucky enough that the person who
now I run
a whole sort of small business with,
my illustrator and I,
we got together
and it took over a year because there
are 150 poems. So it was a long
time. And then she was, you know,
there was a lot of back and forth
and things like that.
And then,
in all honesty,
the publisher
was
amazing in finding me things like printers,
you know, doing a little bit of editing
here and there. But overall,
I'd actually come in
having done most of the work just looking
to get it put out into the world.
It was a very, it was a long
journey. And I think one of the things
is also finding
of if you're doing hybrid publishing, somebody who
you have good communication with.
And for me, ProLiant has been amazing because
otherwise, it's a bit difficult. Like, in self
publishing, you know, you have more control.
And
if you're giving it to a conventional publisher,
they have more control. In hybrid, it's sort
of a hybrid. You both kind of, you
know, have to work very much together and
decide,
you know,
talk things through. I don't like this, maybe
this, and come to compromises and things.
It worked for me,
partly because I didn't really want to get
too involved
with the printers. Sorry. My phone's going off,
but with the printers and things. So yeah.
Thank you.
Good to hear that. Anyone else wants to
go give self publishing tips? Don't hold that,
Posner.
Yeah.
Just like.
Yeah. With a self published person, so I
didn't
really,
know which route to take. And when I
joined the Muslim Writers Academy, that's when
yourself, Naira and the other amazing sisters ahead
as well helped me to come to that
decision. Initially I did
submit
the manuscript to a couple of publishers and
hybrid publishers and hadn't heard back from most
of them, so I got really
disheartened by
that. But, I remember the the coaching call
that I had with Naima really clearly, and
that's when you sort of made me think
about, well, why don't you why don't you
potentially,
you know, have a think about the self
publishing route.
And when I heard that the traditional publisher
can take a year, 2 years,
and self publishing, yeah, because you've got more
control, like what you're saying, Mona, so you
can just get it out there in a
few months. So I was like, yeah, I'm
not going to hang about, not waiting 2
years, I want this book out there ASAP,
inshallah. And it really took me almost 2
years to get it out from the
the, starting point to,
publishing it. But yeah, I think the whole
journey, self publishing journey, gosh I learned so
much along the way, and I was watching
all the the,
webinars and just going on YouTube and trying
to get tips. I was literally that crazy
lady up at midnight taking all these notes
and stuff, my kids are in bed, I
was like, yeah, it's my time to actually
do a bit of research and, you know,
what all that paid up, alhamdulillah. And I
even found my illustrator
via Instagram. So never, never underestimate, you know,
the power of social media, because fans are
through Instagram, and the work's there for you
to already see, and I just fell in
love with her,
her images, Anita.
And I was really fortunate because with my
illustrator, she's also she's also the format
the cover design, everything. I literally found the
jack of all trades with her.
So, alhamdulillah that was perfect. I didn't have
to go and look
at other places or look at other people
and it was just like you were saying,
it was just real labor of love, like
the whole
process and the relationship,
I just want to kind of reiterate what
you're saying there, so the relationship that
you build and have with a person really
makes a huge difference because I couldn't imagine
myself now not working with, you know, Sister
Naim, not working with Sister Hend, and not
working with Anita because it was just such
like like, I learned so much from them
and they made it so easy for me
to talk to them and give me feedback
and, you know, if I felt like something
wasn't right, I was able to comfortably say
that. But, but yeah, it was really I
honestly wouldn't have been able to do it
without the advice and expertise and support
from from all the professionals and experts out
there. But, no, I think it was really
good because it meant that I was able
to to get it out quicker and it's
just a message that I did want to
to get out into into the world. And
I think if I left it any longer
then I probably would have just left it
to the side. But I, you know what,
writing a book, publishing a book isn't for
me but, yeah, alhamdulillah, it was a good,
it was a long challenging
process.
There were ups and downs, of course, but,
the ups definitely
outweighed
the the downs. So,
yeah, I think I'm, I'm
a bit, you know, more
savvy, is that the word, with, the self
publishing
world now. Not not so I'm an expert
or anything, of course, far from it. But,
yeah, I've got a I've got a nice
feel to to it now, I think.
So, yeah. So I could do that again?
I can do that again? I could have
one in my pocket.
Tell us another one.
Emma, I wanna come to you. But before
I come to you, I wanna talk to
let Shazia speak
on
the long journey. Right? Because Husna was sharing
with us that, you know, it was a
long arduous process.
Shazia, you've had a long arduous process with,
you know, working or trying to work with
publishers.
Give our author some hope here because, Leila,
I'm gonna come to you to talk about
your publishing experience. But because we're talking about
long arduous processes, I wanna just let Shazia
speak on this because there are a lot
of people, as you can hear, who are
like,
waiting for a year or so. No. Let's
start with waiting for 6 to 12 weeks
for a response. Okay? Already people are like,
oh, no.
And then even if you get a yes,
it could take a year, 2 years. People
get put off by that. Why did you
stay the course, and what have you learned
along the way?
I think it comes down to your dream.
If you want to do it, then you
have to stick to it because, yes, it's
a long process.
I've been working on 2 things side by
side. So one thing was to do
Islamic books, most for Muslim children. So I
needed Islamic Muslim publishers. I've tried that a
lot of times, and I get lots of
no responses. No responses. No responses.
I've worked with lots of,
send submissions
to traditional publishers and,
often no response or sometimes
no. Thank you. Somebody else. No. Thank you.
Like, I can't even tell you the number
of times I've had no rejection
from
from publishers.
But I think,
I think what what I find helpful for
myself is that because it's something I want
to pursue, it's not like one manuscript only.
See, if I have only 1, I've sent
it to them, and I'm waiting for them.
Okay. Now what? Well, I haven't heard back.
Should I send again a lot?
I was working on multiple ish, multiple monsters.
Once I've sent 1, forget it. Work on
the next one.
So the next one. Forget it. So the
next one.
Like, I've had, I think, 1 manuscript or
2, which I have, like, literally,
I have a list of I I think
I got from another helper from another agent,
and I had sent one managed group to
at least,
a
100 different
agents, and all said no to it.
So it it can be that that long.
It's the the Jugnu story, the the fireflies
story.
So and there's another one. It's absolutely. But,
again, I'm not giving up. I'll keep I'll
keep sending.
So one thing is when you say to
traditional publishers because there's lots of competition,
and it takes time for them to cut
back. But if you just have one unit,
then it's just like, oh, you wanna give
up. But no. No. No. Work on something
else. Keep sending out. And when it comes
back,
this, Midnight John journey, I got the contract.
And I'm like, yeah, I got my oh,
my wish was as as, you know, as
Naima said, I wanted to be a traditional
author first and then just tell me, I
got both the offers together, in that same
year.
So
I got it 2 years ago. So it
took 2 years for this book.
So I got the contract in 19,
in 2020,
and they said it would be published in
2022.
So 2 years for the book to come
around
and, illustrations,
but it just process.
And finally,
it's here. I've got the hard copies and
show us launch them on the 15th March.
But
it's a long process. But if you want
to do it,
can you stick with it? I sometimes it's
just I gotta keep reminding Masino. There's this
old old saying, 3 feet from gold.
You might just be a 3 3 publishers
away from your book being published.
Don't oh, let me just send one more
time,
one more publisher,
one more agent. It's okay.
It's okay. Sometimes I change the story and
send it again because it has to keep
going. It has to keep going. The moment
you stop,
you stop.
That's it. So, yeah, that's the the process
of going for the traditional,
publishers.
Wow. And if you guys needed any more
proof of this lady's dedication, then I think,
well, I don't know what to say to
you, mate, because because that is literally has
been her her attitude ever since the beginning.
And, you know, you mentioned a couple of
things that we've talked about together, and I've
said this and I say this to all
my you know, all our clients, all our
cohorts.
The only way to fail
is to give up.
Failure is guaranteed
for those who give up,
and victory
of whatever kind is guaranteed for those who
refuse to give up because it is exactly
as sister Shazia was saying.
Sometimes you are trying and you're trying and
you're trying, and it's at that moment that
you give up that you were literally 3
feet from gold. If you had tried just
3 more days, 3 more months, 3 more
years, you would have had your outcome. Right?
But for sure, once you give up, you
leave the arena, you're no longer in the
running,
that's the end of your dream. Like, it
will definitely not happen now. You know what
I mean? So sticking to it, staying in
the arena, staying committed,
is a super important part of it. And
I just wanna give everybody some before I
come to you later, I just wanna give
everyone some perspective
on working with traditional publishers because I'm sure
people are, like, saying, why would anyone do
that? Like, seriously, wait 2 years?
No. I'm not doing that.
The difference between working with,
a respected
publisher,
and just doing it yourself,
in terms of impact,
is that, yes, the traditional publisher takes much
longer.
You get a lot less money on each
book sold. Okay? That publisher takes on the
responsibility
and the expense
of producing the book.
But you will find that if a publisher
does give you a contract,
they are going to be investing in your
book because they pay the editors, they pay
the copy editors, they pay the illustrators,
they pay the sales teams, they pay for
the marketing material,
they pay and they invest time and effort
in getting your book out wherever they can.
So a respectable
publisher,
your book is gonna be in libraries, it's
gonna be in schools, it's going to be
in bookshops all over the place, it's going
to be in sales catalogs where they have
actually salespeople who go out and sell your
book into various places.
They're going to enter your book for competitions.
They're going to enter your book, you know,
for school pro reading programs and all that
kind of things. So,
if that's your dream,
it's worth the wait to be part of
that institution, if that makes sense, because those
books are all published and are backed by
respected publishers. They just have more longevity, and
they usually reach more people.
So, you know, if that's your bag, then
it's definitely worth it. I don't want anybody
to leave this session thinking 2 years? Are
you kidding?
It is worth the wait because when they
come with your book, they're gonna come with
your book. Okay?
So, really, it depends on, you know, what
your priorities are. Okay? Leila, did you have
to wait 2 years for your book to
be accepted by Rekaya's bookshelf and to come
out into the world? What happened? Tell us
the story.
No. I,
oh my god.
No.
I actually didn't
have to wait for very long.
I always,
it's almost like,
caught me really by surprise. And I think
2 years later, I'm still really surprised by
it, if that makes any sense,
because
I submitted
my manuscript to Rucayo's bookshelf thinking, okay.
That's it. I'm never gonna hear from these
people again.
It's done. It's done. I've kicked it off
the list and whatever.
They got back to me, I think, in
less than 2 days,
and said,
we love it.
When can we have amazing?
So I'm still in shock as you can
tell.
So it was a really really,
it was such a surprise. It was such
a pleasant surprise and I think that,
you know, because
I've had time to kind of, like, research,
go hear
so many stories,
I've done tons of research. I realized
almost like what a,
like, a freak thing my story is
for lack of a better word.
And I'm really, really, really, really grateful,
because I don't know if I would have
had to wait that long for a traditional
publisher.
I don't know what would have come of
this story. So I'm very, very, very grateful.
No. We appreciate the honesty. And, yeah, I've
I've also had that freak experience, and it
is
very uncanny because
as we know, many people are waiting, you
know, months, if not years, to get that
yes. So when you get that yes within
a week, it's like, is this really happening?
Yeah.
Emma, did you have to wait 2 years
to get your book out into the world?
No. Because I'm a very impatient person. So
I
when I heard
when I heard it could take that long,
I
thought that's just gonna give me anxiety, like,
waiting and submitting my my
my manuscript that I worked so hard on
and then wait for, you know, sitting oh,
did they like it? I haven't got back.
So I just decided,
you know what? I'm just gonna self publish
and,
that's what I did. So I even,
got my little logo there. It's behind the
river book banks. And,
so when with me for self publishing,
from Allah, honestly,
Allah just sends people, like, out of nowhere.
Like, you might feel like you're trying so
hard and you're reaching out to these people
and someone says, this person will help you.
And you're like, okay. And then you don't
hear back. And then randomly, Allah will send
someone to be like, oh, hey. I heard
you're writing a book. Would you like a
hand? And you're just like,
really?
And
And then with the illustrations,
I absolutely
love them. I don't know if you can
see any of the illustrations, but
my brother illustrated this entire book for me.
Alhamdulillah.
Allah give him Hidayat. He's not Muslim.
I came to him last this book actually
is
a I wrote the story last year for
Ramadan for our homeschooling
community
for the children.
And, alhamdulillah,
I got some really good feedback. And then
my mom said, oh, you should turn that
into a book. And I was like, oh,
mom say that.
But then I thought, oh, maybe. And then
she's like, yeah. And your brother can do
the drawings for you, and you could be
like a brother sister team. And
and I was like,
alright. And then,
I'm glad I did your, writing course, and
then you you learn things. And I think
doing a course helps you with accountability
to be like, you know what? These are
the steps, and there are people to, like,
guide me along the way.
So,
and, also, I feel like
if you're looking at
whether you're self publishing or otherwise,
you
don't let it overwhelm you and think, oh,
I have to get an illustrator, and I
have to learn how
to format a book, and I need to
do this. Because if I had known all
the things that I would have to do
to publish my book before I started, I
would have probably felt really overwhelmed and said,
oh, that's just how is that gonna work?
But
you learn as you go along,
so it's all in little increments. And so,
honestly, if I can do it, I just
feel like, you know, if you're watching and
you have, like, even an inkling, like, you'd
like to give it a go, like, it'll
always be something that,
you know, oh, I I wish I could
do that or I wanted to do that.
But if you,
like, step towards it, you can you can
make it a reality.
So my my take home is, like, for
doing this is there's so much free stuff
on YouTube to help you to, you know,
do all these things. As Husnu was saying,
like
like, you my YouTube, I have, like, so
many tabs open. Like,
there's so there's so much that you can,
you know, get help from others. So
don't ever feel lonely that, you know, it'll
be
you won't have help.
There's there's heaps of help.
I love that. Brother and sister team.
Everybody who's watching is kinda like, oh, that
is so cute.
Right, guys. Our time is up, but I
want to end with sister Khoso because sister
Khoso has had a different journey. As you
heard her say, she wasn't intending to write
a book for anybody else out there. But
in the end, she decided to put it
together, these collections of tales about Minnie Maryam,
and the book was published as well by
a publisher. And since then, she's been very
busy. Kosa, tell us about
what steps you took from when you decided
forget these kids of mine, this book is
for the children of the world, to finding
that publisher
and what you've been up to since because
I know that you've been a very busy
bee,
Oh my gosh. SubhanAllah.
I'm I'm not too sure where to start.
But,
yeah. It it all in all, from start
to finish and then and there goes the
voice.
Excuse me. So all in all, from start
to finish,
in terms of the book, that actually took
me 8 years. So that's 8 years of
my life and the reason why is because,
as we as we're all moms, women, we're
busy. We're busy people, you know, especially if
you're married, you've got children, you've got grandchildren,
cut well, The grandchildren weren't didn't exist then,
but still, busy life, homeschooling mum, running activities,
you know,
in charge of all in in charge of
community activities.
So when I kind of, started looking for
my first publisher,
I was quite laid back about it. I
wasn't too concerned about it getting published. I
was like, fine. Okay. Fine. I've submitted my
manuscript. Whenever they come back to me, they
come back to me. I wasn't too kind
of concerned about the time it was taking.
I was, like, happy that at least
I've gone from
it being on a piece of paper, now
it's been sent to the publisher. So I
was happy with that. And then the first
the second publisher, she came back to me
and said to me, we love this book
and hand it out, and, you know, we're
going to publish it, and we'll we'll get
we'll get back in touch with you.
A year later,
they
I I hadn't heard from them. And as
I said, I'm just so busy with my
life. I kind of thought I could find
they'll come back to me. A year later
I thought to myself let me just find
out what's happening because I haven't heard from
them yet and so I emailed her and,
she said to me oh sister,
just ask her for coming back to me,
but I'm really sorry I didn't let you
know that we actually unfortunately, we have to
close the business down, and, unfortunately, we'll not
be able to publish your book. So I
was, like, thinking, great. Okay. Thank you. Well,
I wish you would have told me sooner,
but never mind. That's what happens when you're
so, you know, laid back. So all I
exactly.
So off I went and so I think
it was the 5th publisher Alhamdulillah, AHRC
I approached them and Alhamdulillah they said they
liked the book and from there on the
rest is history in terms of the book
being published. It did take, like, like, it
took 2 years. It was 2 years from
start to finish with them as well, You
know, back and forth back and forth, the
editor, and then finding the illustrator then agreeing
the pictures. That did all take time, but
like I said, I was like a relaxed,
chilled author that, you know, it's fine. When
it happens, it happens because I just had
something to give to the world,
my stories, and that's what I wanted. That
was the love. That was that's that's what
it all it was. As long as my
my words were out there and to be
really honest, you know, you mentioned about names
on books and not really wanting your names
in the book. I did put my dad's
name on the book though. So I made
sure, to Aziz, my dad's name was on
the book. So that's what I'm really proud
of.
But then, since then, alhamdulillah,
I then ended up
so you know what happened? I just want
to say this if in in time I
just want to say one thing especially,
that when the book was published I was
like, great, it's now published. Now what? I
had no idea that now the book that
was published there was work to do after
that. I had no idea that from now
I'd like you're seeing me now here, I'm
on this platform with you, you would not
have seen me before. I had no idea
I had to do this. I had no
idea I had to come out of my
shell, out of my comfort zone, and get
myself on Instagram.
People don't. But, actually, if you've if you
have a book and you've you've got it
out there, what's the point of having it
out there if no one knows about you?
So, I mean, so I had to get
myself on Instagram,
on Facebook. Facebook, I have no idea how
to use, or either Instagram. My kids were
helping me. I didn't know if I was
allowed to like pictures. Do I like them?
Don't I like them? Oh, this person's followed
me. Do I have to follow them back?
Oh my gosh.
And then, alhamdulillah,
Naima I messaged her. Now I messaged Naima.
I think I sent her a Twitter message.
I didn't know her. I well, you know,
I knew her through her books. And I
went to one of her coffee morning. It
was an afternoon tea session years ago.
But I felt, you know, you know how
you feel you know the author. You don't,
but you feel that, you know, your best
friend's your besties. So I just I just
really wanted to let her know that, hey.
I've I've just published my book. I know
you don't know me but I just want
to tell you. So I just told her
and I'm like, she was so nice.
She's she messaged me back. I was like,
oh my gosh. You're gonna tell me back
a couple of times.
And then from there on,
I asked for some help, and then she
gave me a well, I think it was
a 30 minute coaching call. And she told
me, listen, sis. This is what you have
to do. This, this, this, this. I went
on to one of her courses and because
of Naima, I managed to learn how to
do what was it? A landing page.
So I learned how to do, Mailchimp,
all of that, and create an email list,
everything. Up until that moment, I had no
idea.
So yeah. I mean, I know my story
is pretty long, so I'm not too sure
how long you want me to go on
for. So I think I might have to
stop there.
Yeah.
Inshallah, we're gonna cover more about that,
on day 4, aren't we? We're gonna be
talking about author platforms and building author platforms
and mailing lists, my favorite landing pages and
all that good stuff. So that's our day
4 program. So definitely, Kosea, you have to
come back and talk to us about that.
I think you may be coming, actually, inshallah.
But
I want to close out before we do
our, like, last shot with everybody's books, inshallah.
Mona, we wanted to share something, inshallah, before
we close out the session. Thank you so
much for that, Kosta.
It's really, really wonderful to just, you know,
see your enthusiasm and, you know, just how
far
8 years, I think that's a record. I
think that's a record.
Certainly on this panel. Masha'Allah. Mona, take it
oasis.
Sorry. Go.
I think just one thing I wanted to
share with anyone listening really
is,
and sister Emma touched on it about intentions.
And,
you know, as Muslim women,
really
everything that we intend to do
is really should we should be looking at,
the hereafter as our goal, right? So what
it's a constant renewal of intentions. That's one
thing.
But one of the things that really, really
helped me as well,
in addition to constantly renewing intentions I mean,
even now I'm constantly renewing them,
is sister Naima actually said
so Naima, you said 2019. Our course was
actually in 2017,
and it was Ramadan.
And I was like, why are you doing
this at
Ramadan? Seriously? Like, in the middle and y'all
like, the barakah of Ramadan.
Like, the barakah.
My actual whole 150 poems
were finished in 1 Ramadan.
It was 1 Ramadan.
And
I cannot tell you the barakah. And it
wasn't like that was the only thing I
was doing.
The barakah of Ramadan
cannot. And I'm saying this because Ramadan's coming
up.
And if you have your intention set, you
have something going on, you know, like a
story in your belly, as sister Kosser says,
that you need to get at.
I would say, like,
really, really use use Ramadan if the time
is so blessed.
And the other thing is
if you really want something,
like like and sister Shazia said this, like,
ask Allah and do your bit. SubhanAllah.
It is.
There is nothing that can't be done. Like,
so many of Alexa Zakaria said, like, housewives,
you know, this, that, children. And that's, you
know, SubhanAllah.
And I just wanna say with Ramadan coming
up, please, please, please,
if you have something, do try and use
the blessings of Ramadan. There's a lot of
barakah in it.
So yeah. And sister Naima said that to
us because I was like, Ramadan? You want
me to write my book in Ramadan? You're
doing a course in Ramadan? She's like, yep.
So, yeah,
for reminding me about that one, and the
truth is I don't remember that. Subhanallah, alhamdulillah.
Obviously, that was what you needed to hear.
But guys, we've reached the end of our
time. What can I say? I don't need
to say anything. These ladies are amazing.
They've just they I'm just we're so proud
of them. If coach Hint was here, she
would be saying exactly the same thing. We
are so proud of every single one of
you.
We boast about you. We celebrate you. You
know, we ask Allah to bless you in
all your endeavors. You know, we pray we
get to work together again and again and
again, inshallah.
But you guys are, you know, the really,
I want to encourage every one of you
to follow each other,
to network with each other, to support each
other when you have books coming out. Because
one of the things that Muslimah writers as
a project and the Muslimah author project is
based on is the fact that we are
stronger together.
And you guys are like a new generation
of of authors
of Muslim children's literature.
And you're like the class, the class of
the 2000, you know, the 2019,
2020.
And, you know, I encourage all of you
to, you know, whether you are in the
Amplify program with us or you're just incubated
graduates or whatever it is,
stay connected to each other. Stay connected to
us, of course,
but stay connected to each other because that's
where the strength lies when you're able to
start collaborating with each other, when you're able
to start launching your books together, when you
we can have sessions like this where one
of you is teaching the others what she
learned, for example, how to make reels. I'm
looking at you.
Or how to get on TV.
Khosa, I'm looking at you.
Like, you all have now
developed such unique skill sets, and my intention
insha'Allah is to continue to make spaces for
you guys to be able to pour into
each other, inshallah,
because, yeah, you guys have done something that
I haven't done, you know, and you've done
something that Coach Chen hasn't done.
Each one of you has done something that
we haven't done, that you've achieved something that
we haven't achieved, and we're so proud of
you for that.
So let's just have one last look at
your books, please. Raise your books up.
Let's see them.
If that's if you're listening, if you're able
to just take a quick snapshot because I
can't because my phone is,
my phone is, in use. But, yes, ladies,
these are our
wonderful panelists for today. Please say a big,
give them a big round, and make sure
you follow them on Instagram. And most importantly,
buy their books, support their work, reach out
to them, and inshallah, if you would like
help with writing your children's book, you can
always reach out. The link to apply to
work with us will be in the description
below, this video.
You can go to my stories on Instagram
or just send me a DM on Instagram
and say, I watched the panel. I wanna
be one of your next authors. How can
we do this? Guys, can we have a
big heart? You all know how to make
a heart. I don't know. Yay.
I love you so much for the sake
of Allah. You guys are absolutely
awesome,
awesome, and we're gonna round it off now.
You can unmute and give the audience a
big. Assalamu alaikum.