Mohammad Elshinawy – S2 EP8 Our Imams, Our Lifeline – Behind the Minbar Podcast

Mohammad Elshinawy
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The speakers discuss the challenges of finding one's place in the world and finding one's place in the world. They emphasize the importance of community and building a community for growth and profitability. The speakers also emphasize the need for authentic learning and a teacher's mindset to address modern day issues. They emphasize the importance of educating parents and creating healthy environments for mental health and family-related activities. The speakers also emphasize the need for privacy and boundaries between old people and newcomers, and the importance of community involvement.

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			Bismillah alhamdulillah, salatu wassalamu ala rasoolillah, welcome back
		
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			everyone to behind the minbar, blueprints for a
		
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			better masjid and We are honored to have
		
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			Sheikh Yasser Birjes with us We're not going
		
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			to do that cliche thing of shaking hands
		
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			as if we just walk into the room,
		
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			right?
		
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			Let me start by saying, everything that is
		
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			said correct in today's episode is from Allah
		
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			azza wa jalla And everything that I say
		
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			wrong, it's because Sheikh Yasser Birjes did not
		
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			write his books yet So we put these
		
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			podcasts together to work through the conversations that
		
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			we need to be having and having faster
		
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			until Sheikh Yasser publishes his books and we'll
		
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			get to that inshallah I've been asking him
		
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			for years, and then welcome Sheikh Yasser Jazakallah
		
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			khair The audience needs to know that it's
		
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			11pm at night and you have a flight
		
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			that you're probably going to leave your hotel
		
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			for at 3-4am So this is not
		
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			something we take lightly and it's something we
		
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			deeply value and we're not for the fact
		
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			that I believe this should be your podcast
		
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			And this is your domain more so than
		
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			it is mine, I would not have embarrassed
		
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			myself and leaned in and asked you But
		
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			jazakallah khair for being with us Pleasure being
		
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			with you all the time Akramakallah Sheikh So
		
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			we want to talk about the life of
		
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			an imam in America So many directions to
		
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			take it, so much perspective we need from
		
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			you Let's at least get it started in
		
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			this episode You as an imam, did you
		
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			choose it or was it chosen for you?
		
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			Subhanallah I always called myself an accidental imam
		
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			Because originally when I first came to the
		
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			US, I used to work in Bosnia in
		
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			relief work And then I was called to
		
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			come by family members to come and join
		
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			a community in El Paso, Texas They're looking
		
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			for an imam and so I said look,
		
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			I'm not an imam, I'm not this, I'm
		
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			not that But subhanallah, they asked me to
		
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			come and check it out and see And
		
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			it was my first time coming to the
		
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			US, I was very impressed.
		
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			Alhamdulillah.
		
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			I mean, I loved the opportunity I saw
		
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			the opportunity, the da'a was amazing.
		
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			It was beautiful Subhanallah, the plan was to
		
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			stay there as an imam for a few
		
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			years because they had a project to build
		
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			a masjid And I wanted to help them
		
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			with that.
		
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			Inshallah, once it's over then khalas, my job
		
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			is done and I move on This is
		
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			El Paso.
		
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			That was in El Paso, Texas back in
		
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			2000 I came there Spent a few years,
		
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			alhamdulillah The project was over But then there's
		
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			always that pull, you know to keep you
		
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			in this position And then I came to
		
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			meet Sheikh Muhammad Sharif, rahmatullah alayh, who brought
		
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			me into Al Maghrib Institute.
		
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			Then you feel that responsibility really Realizing that
		
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			look, I mean the masjid, mashallah, start kind
		
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			of like increasing in numbers But we didn't
		
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			have enough Qualified cadre to fill up all
		
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			these empty spaces like the community builds a
		
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			masjid And then start thinking of looking for
		
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			an imam And I thought that that was
		
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			Maybe not the best model Subhanallah, but alhamdulillah
		
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			then after nine years I I was between
		
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			going to to Texas to Dallas or Go
		
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			to Chicago Subhanallah, I was kind of like
		
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			Invited to go to Chicago.
		
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			So go there Spent one year or less
		
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			a little bit less then I decided to
		
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			go back again to Texas I thought that
		
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			Texas was my place.
		
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			Subhanallah.
		
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			So I came back to Dallas So from
		
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			there, like I said, you know being an
		
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			imam was not really something I planned but
		
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			I thought it was Chosen Be with Allah's
		
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			Qadar Uh, is there like a pivotal moment
		
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			where I know if you're involved in something
		
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			it kind of becomes hard dying on you
		
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			I suppose everybody else it's a collective obligation
		
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			But once you get involved you kind of
		
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			need to power through was that it or
		
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			did you feel like there's nothing better?
		
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			I need I I could be doing with
		
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			my life This is where Allah's pleasure is
		
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			paramount considering the needs of the hour Well,
		
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			honestly, I thought that this is how this
		
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			is the the amana Yeah, and you came
		
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			over here and you speak with imams and
		
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			communities and visit places you realize how difficult
		
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			to me to find imams to these communities
		
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			and Unfortunately, some masajid don't return the imam
		
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			for a very long time And then when
		
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			you when you hold on to a position
		
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			you see that the huge responsibility upon you
		
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			to take care of the community I mean
		
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			And also working with the maghreb institute becoming
		
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			a public speaker traveling around speaking conferences I
		
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			always felt a responsibility and amana of every
		
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			day to be anchored in a in a
		
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			host community like you have to be really
		
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			Building a community like you're just going around
		
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			and giving talks and speak to people and
		
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			that doesn't build a community really It builds
		
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			audience But does not build community you need
		
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			to need to anchor yourself in a place
		
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			where you are building alhamdulillah From the masjid
		
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			to the groups that work with you and
		
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			the dawah The effort and bringing the muslims
		
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			back to the masajid and bringing the muslims
		
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			to islam alhamdulillah And also improving the quality
		
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			of the community as well That's the purpose
		
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			of it.
		
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			If you look at the prophet's mission was
		
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			all about that building communities shepherding Absolutely bringing
		
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			them together.
		
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			Absolutely Subhanallah.
		
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			Dr. Hatem used to say to me that
		
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			You will never change anyone's life by parachuting
		
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			into their city and giving them a lecture
		
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			You may convince them to want to change
		
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			their life But there's a big difference between
		
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			wanting to and actually getting there.
		
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			Absolutely.
		
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			It's a process sort of the pedagogical Just
		
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			taking classes is not sufficient until you really
		
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			live with the sheikhs We live with the
		
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			imam with your teachers and And be close
		
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			with them and subhanallah and taking classes going
		
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			out with them and living life and see
		
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			them how they live their life as well,
		
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			too That could be inspiring Subhanallah our young
		
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			cameraman Taha on the way over here Asked
		
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			me he said sheikh, do we know how
		
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			the prophet sallallahu alaihi wa sallam prepared his
		
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			lectures?
		
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			and so it's It was a wonderful question
		
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			because ultimately the prophet sallallahu alaihi wa sallam
		
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			as far as we know didn't really give
		
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			lectures the way we give He taught them
		
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			in real life situations.
		
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			He gave them instructions He piecemealed it modeled
		
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			it for them corrected gently Taught proactively but
		
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			not in this sort of didactic 45 minute
		
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			to an hour at a time He would
		
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			not sit down to give an official talk
		
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			except for khutbah al-jumu'ah and even
		
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			that wasn't very long So I don't expect
		
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			people to watch every episode Uh of this
		
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			podcast, so that's why I don't get tired
		
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			of myself repeating Uh certain data and I
		
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			believe it's just so important half the masajid
		
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			in the country don't have imams and The
		
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			half that do sometimes all they have is
		
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			an imam And sometimes that imam Is not
		
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			being used optimally or is not optimally prepared.
		
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			What do you think is the biggest challenge?
		
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			In sort of the the imam world or
		
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			the american muslim, you know community world, unfortunately
		
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			we have um, So much demand but not
		
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			enough supply and even the supply that we
		
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			have is not really uh, Between qualified or
		
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			even interested like we have a huge leak
		
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			in the muslim community when it comes to
		
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			imams See leaving the position and going so
		
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			you're talking about qualified trained, but they're just
		
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			not interested in community So that's one problem
		
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			that's one those are qualified many of them
		
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			don't want to be in the imam position
		
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			anymore so they go to work for example
		
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			for Relief organizations Um, some of them they
		
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			just build their own institute and start teaching
		
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			instead of just being an imam or others
		
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			Maybe depend on revenues comes from social media
		
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			perhaps and so on especially young ones Subhanallah,
		
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			but there's a huge leak like we're losing
		
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			a lot of qualified imams or at least
		
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			potential imams for the future Um and and
		
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			many imams who are alhamdulillah and they're holding
		
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			the position sometimes they um They don't really
		
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			they don't really upgrade their skills to the
		
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			level where the community is growing with them
		
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			So the community grows way way ahead and
		
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			they're still They're still behind and unfortunately many
		
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			many communities would like to depend on Imams
		
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			who don't maybe uh, I mean cost them
		
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			a lot to uh to hire So they
		
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			only bring prayer leaders But not community builders
		
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			So if you want to have a prayer
		
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			leader I mean, you're just gonna bring somebody
		
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			who will just be doing the bare minimum
		
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			of work in the masjid So how do
		
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			we work past that?
		
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			Uh From the expectation side, right?
		
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			No, uh I expect you know a job
		
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			that gives me a respectable salary, but also
		
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			I expect someone that Accepts me as a
		
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			human being no Well, I mean for an
		
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			imam to be an imam honestly the most
		
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			important thing you have to love people If
		
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			you don't love people or you care about
		
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			people, it's not your place That most beloved
		
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			people to allah those are most beneficial to
		
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			others And frankly if you look at the
		
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			prophet, he genuinely genuinely loved the people He
		
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			generally loved the people even those who opposed
		
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			him He would he would do everything in
		
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			his power to bring him to to islam
		
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			subhana But he's keeping escaping from his hand
		
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			salawat allah's voice.
		
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			So he really genuinely He cared for the
		
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			people.
		
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			I know all this crap, but in the
		
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			quran about him salawat allah Like anything hurts
		
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			you will hurt him keen for what is
		
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			beneficial to you and What the believers very
		
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			very compassionate salawat allah So he truly genuinely
		
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			love the people so if anybody is not
		
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			in that business I don't think this is
		
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			a good place for them.
		
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			That's the first thing people should understand about
		
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			that Now as I often i've repeatedly hear
		
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			heard you say over the years.
		
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			This needs to be a passion not a
		
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			profession.
		
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			Absolutely Absolutely, and if you don't enjoy Really
		
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			doing it and if you don't enjoy it
		
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			Yeah, I need a sacrifice that you put
		
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			in order for you to guide somebody or
		
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			help someone or even handle yeah, I mean
		
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			help somebody learn the quran or Or bring
		
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			the community together so that they can have
		
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			a beautiful program for their children and for
		
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			the families if you don't enjoy that stuff
		
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			Then that's not for you What if they
		
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			enjoy it?
		
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			You know the reason the way I think
		
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			about a few things these days speaking to
		
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			my high schoolers about it is that This
		
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			is they call it self-determination theory what
		
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			makes someone self-motivated it's like three factors
		
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			there's like agency and aptitude and Belonging so
		
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			I feel a sense of belonging.
		
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			This is a calling.
		
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			This is my job Allah's gonna ask me
		
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			community needs me the amanah you spoke on
		
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			no, but then there's the aptitude am I
		
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			competent enough?
		
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			whether islamically or just sort of Like does
		
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			shaykh yasser ever feel?
		
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			Self-doubt does shaykh yasser ever feel like
		
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			he's about to burn out That's an intimidation
		
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			factor that could like flush the passion out
		
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			of them Actually, it's not that if he
		
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			if he fears it's going to happen it
		
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			happened multiple times Because one of the biggest
		
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			problems we have in our communities Unfortunately is
		
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			the imam's job or position in the community
		
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			is is a like a straight line Which
		
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			means uh, uh, it really never never goes
		
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			up Well goes down goes up go down.
		
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			So although that's an ever-expanding pool of
		
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			responsibility.
		
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			Exactly Exactly.
		
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			So as the community grows the responsibility also
		
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			grows, but the imam's Uh qualifications stays as
		
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			is they don't send him for example for
		
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			training The imam sometimes they've banned him from
		
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			going to conferences because now we want you
		
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			this weekend for example Rather than going there
		
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			and learn something new for the community Uh,
		
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			they don't even sometimes you know send them
		
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			like even in corporate america For example, you
		
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			send some of your employees to go and
		
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			get a master's degree.
		
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			Yeah, but basically the communities don't really invest
		
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			in upgrading the skills of their imams So
		
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			as a result, of course the imams would
		
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			eventually would only put effort um For the
		
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			skill that they have and as a result
		
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			after a few years when they run out
		
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			of ideas They're not out of programs or
		
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			activities They just feel burned out and that's
		
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			why we have this whole cycle of Average
		
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			imam's position in our community is five to
		
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			seven years and they keep going out out
		
00:12:29 --> 00:12:32
			there But if the community invests in the
		
00:12:32 --> 00:12:35
			imam's position Meaning the imam for example after
		
00:12:35 --> 00:12:38
			seven years Upgrade to put different position in
		
00:12:38 --> 00:12:40
			the community or send them for example to
		
00:12:40 --> 00:12:42
			study for the two years not send them
		
00:12:42 --> 00:12:44
			But at least give them for example Uh
		
00:12:44 --> 00:12:45
			an opportunity to study for two years or
		
00:12:45 --> 00:12:47
			something get a master's degree and new skills
		
00:12:47 --> 00:12:49
			that would help them whether it's a leadership
		
00:12:49 --> 00:12:51
			Or adult education and training or anything like
		
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			that So the idea is that we have
		
00:12:53 --> 00:12:55
			to invest in human resources More than anything
		
00:12:55 --> 00:12:57
			else people they would say but wait a
		
00:12:57 --> 00:12:59
			minute It's going to cost a lot or
		
00:12:59 --> 00:13:01
			the salaries are the highest thing, you know
		
00:13:02 --> 00:13:04
			Cost of the community, but yeah, if you
		
00:13:04 --> 00:13:07
			have alhamdulillah a good leadership That brings you
		
00:13:07 --> 00:13:10
			good programming that money that you invest in
		
00:13:10 --> 00:13:13
			and And in the payments that you give
		
00:13:13 --> 00:13:14
			you're going to give it get it back
		
00:13:14 --> 00:13:14
			again.
		
00:13:14 --> 00:13:18
			Alhamdulillah and Recruiting community members and also more
		
00:13:18 --> 00:13:21
			donations and and the growth of the community
		
00:13:21 --> 00:13:24
			inshallah And you will see it it's not
		
00:13:24 --> 00:13:26
			going to be a problem subhanallah you see
		
00:13:26 --> 00:13:30
			the communities that have invested in talent Uh,
		
00:13:30 --> 00:13:32
			even if we just mean to recruit talent
		
00:13:33 --> 00:13:36
			Even just that People move to those communities.
		
00:13:36 --> 00:13:37
			They say oh, I need someone to address
		
00:13:37 --> 00:13:39
			my kids because I can't I need someone
		
00:13:39 --> 00:13:42
			to you know, uh To die and leave
		
00:13:42 --> 00:13:44
			my my children with when I leave right
		
00:13:44 --> 00:13:46
			it's it's the anchor and it is the
		
00:13:46 --> 00:13:48
			security mechanism and it should be I mean
		
00:13:48 --> 00:13:52
			the prophet sallallahu alayhi wa sallam said Right
		
00:13:52 --> 00:13:55
			my as-sahaba or my amanah Sort of
		
00:13:55 --> 00:13:57
			the trickle effect is true or it gets
		
00:13:57 --> 00:13:58
			passed on sheikh.
		
00:13:58 --> 00:13:59
			I do want to double click on something
		
00:13:59 --> 00:14:03
			because we addressed in previous episodes the issue
		
00:14:03 --> 00:14:07
			of uh Investing in imams meaning proactively instead
		
00:14:07 --> 00:14:08
			of waiting for an imam 10 years just
		
00:14:08 --> 00:14:10
			send an imam It'll take you four years
		
00:14:10 --> 00:14:12
			you come back have a fellowship type setup
		
00:14:13 --> 00:14:14
			They'll be contracted to be with you for
		
00:14:14 --> 00:14:16
			at least two years just like any profession
		
00:14:16 --> 00:14:20
			might do uh but we never touched what
		
00:14:20 --> 00:14:24
			you just mentioned before which is continual investment
		
00:14:25 --> 00:14:28
			I I've noticed myself that the imams that
		
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			have been disproportionately impactful In the united states
		
00:14:32 --> 00:14:34
			that have studied outside of the country are
		
00:14:34 --> 00:14:37
			those that didn't settle for their seminary training
		
00:14:37 --> 00:14:41
			Right they insisted on learning english or insisted
		
00:14:41 --> 00:14:44
			on getting a secondary degree or getting certifications
		
00:14:44 --> 00:14:47
			or otherwise How important is that?
		
00:14:47 --> 00:14:48
			How have you found that beneficial?
		
00:14:49 --> 00:14:51
			I know you've done that yourself Uh, and
		
00:14:51 --> 00:14:52
			what do you think are the most important
		
00:14:52 --> 00:14:56
			advices about the directions to apply themselves to
		
00:14:56 --> 00:14:57
			continued learning?
		
00:14:57 --> 00:15:01
			So obviously graduating from medina university It gives
		
00:15:01 --> 00:15:02
			you the information doesn't give you the skill
		
00:15:02 --> 00:15:04
			to be an imam really like there's reason
		
00:15:04 --> 00:15:07
			there was no practical training For being an
		
00:15:07 --> 00:15:07
			imam.
		
00:15:08 --> 00:15:09
			They don't they don't forget about leadership.
		
00:15:10 --> 00:15:12
			Talk about being an imam counseling like there
		
00:15:12 --> 00:15:16
			is no no Course, I would say that
		
00:15:16 --> 00:15:17
			will teach you What are the the how
		
00:15:17 --> 00:15:19
			how to lead the salah how to run
		
00:15:19 --> 00:15:20
			the khutbah of jumah?
		
00:15:20 --> 00:15:22
			They give you the fiqh of jumah the
		
00:15:22 --> 00:15:23
			fiqh of salah and this and but nothing
		
00:15:23 --> 00:15:27
			about the actual Uh profession that you might
		
00:15:27 --> 00:15:29
			be assuming in the future whether it's being
		
00:15:29 --> 00:15:32
			a teacher Being an imam being a public
		
00:15:32 --> 00:15:34
			speaker none of that stuff, unfortunately, let alone
		
00:15:34 --> 00:15:37
			of course on subject of leadership So therefore
		
00:15:37 --> 00:15:39
			when I came into the u.s. Alhamdulillah,
		
00:15:39 --> 00:15:43
			I I realized immediately Since I came from
		
00:15:43 --> 00:15:43
			bosnia.
		
00:15:44 --> 00:15:46
			So my second language was after arabic was
		
00:15:46 --> 00:15:49
			bosnian already And it took me a while
		
00:15:49 --> 00:15:51
			to switch obviously And I didn't know much
		
00:15:51 --> 00:15:52
			of english.
		
00:15:52 --> 00:15:54
			But one thing I learned I immediately put
		
00:15:54 --> 00:15:57
			as a as a as a priority If
		
00:15:57 --> 00:15:59
			i'm going to be in this place, uh
		
00:15:59 --> 00:16:01
			For some time then I need to make
		
00:16:01 --> 00:16:02
			sure to deliver the message in the language
		
00:16:02 --> 00:16:04
			that the people understand As allah subhanahu wa
		
00:16:04 --> 00:16:06
			ta'ala mentioned that about the anbiya and
		
00:16:06 --> 00:16:06
			the prophets, right?
		
00:16:08 --> 00:16:10
			So you explain to the people through of
		
00:16:10 --> 00:16:12
			course their own tongue so that was my
		
00:16:12 --> 00:16:15
			purpose so I start learning even english From
		
00:16:15 --> 00:16:16
			the very beginning by going to the library
		
00:16:16 --> 00:16:18
			and getting kids books for my kids and
		
00:16:18 --> 00:16:21
			learn with them as well And then we
		
00:16:21 --> 00:16:24
			start having digital dictionary kind of translate words
		
00:16:24 --> 00:16:25
			for you reading books and so on and
		
00:16:25 --> 00:16:30
			so on And you have the But I
		
00:16:30 --> 00:16:33
			also um Yeah, I made it imperative upon
		
00:16:33 --> 00:16:36
			myself never stop growing in terms of knowledge
		
00:16:36 --> 00:16:39
			So you have the sharia knowledge Which you
		
00:16:39 --> 00:16:41
			keep reading and sometimes summarizing and sometimes doing
		
00:16:41 --> 00:16:44
			certain classes for the for the community and
		
00:16:44 --> 00:16:46
			for the masjid and so on With the
		
00:16:46 --> 00:16:47
			maghreb institute as well to doing the research
		
00:16:47 --> 00:16:48
			for these classes and so on.
		
00:16:48 --> 00:16:50
			So that's the sharia growth goes with it
		
00:16:51 --> 00:16:54
			But also the skill How to deliver that
		
00:16:55 --> 00:16:57
			That's something that I need really to learn
		
00:16:57 --> 00:17:00
			differently like I keep telling people subhanallah when
		
00:17:00 --> 00:17:03
			we're in medina I taught sheikh muhammad sharif
		
00:17:03 --> 00:17:05
			rahim allah ta'ala how to seek knowledge
		
00:17:06 --> 00:17:08
			In america, he taught me how to deliver
		
00:17:08 --> 00:17:12
			that So, uh, and I benefit a lot
		
00:17:12 --> 00:17:13
			from his uh, sheikh.
		
00:17:13 --> 00:17:15
			I think it's worth it that you without
		
00:17:15 --> 00:17:18
			cutting you off to just For not just
		
00:17:18 --> 00:17:20
			for his reward, but for us all as
		
00:17:20 --> 00:17:24
			a refresh we The evolving needs of the
		
00:17:24 --> 00:17:29
			community addressing modern day issues How'd you go
		
00:17:29 --> 00:17:30
			about figuring out what I need to do
		
00:17:30 --> 00:17:34
			what the framing should be Same traditional knowledge.
		
00:17:34 --> 00:17:35
			We're going to be authentic but sort of
		
00:17:35 --> 00:17:37
			a modern framing for it.
		
00:17:37 --> 00:17:41
			So two things obviously number one is um
		
00:17:41 --> 00:17:44
			the priority Like what do people really need?
		
00:17:45 --> 00:17:46
			Versus what you need to teach them So
		
00:17:46 --> 00:17:48
			as a teacher what i'd like to review
		
00:17:48 --> 00:17:50
			exactly from my notes like many many imams
		
00:17:50 --> 00:17:53
			and I've seen some others Mashayikh and so
		
00:17:53 --> 00:17:55
			on when they teach in the masjid They
		
00:17:55 --> 00:17:58
			just want to teach classical ilum, which is
		
00:17:58 --> 00:17:58
			beautiful.
		
00:17:58 --> 00:18:01
			Nothing wrong with that For example, you want
		
00:18:01 --> 00:18:03
			to do a class on fiqh, for example
		
00:18:03 --> 00:18:06
			or Detailing a class on aqidah, for example,
		
00:18:07 --> 00:18:07
			there is no doubt.
		
00:18:07 --> 00:18:09
			These are a very important subject But at
		
00:18:09 --> 00:18:12
			the same time there are certain Immediate issues
		
00:18:12 --> 00:18:16
			the community is going through marriage issues Parenting
		
00:18:16 --> 00:18:19
			issues Economic issues and all these things and
		
00:18:19 --> 00:18:20
			so on so and now we're addressing these
		
00:18:20 --> 00:18:23
			issues for the community Mental health issues for
		
00:18:23 --> 00:18:26
			example all these things So you start seeing
		
00:18:26 --> 00:18:28
			what are the trends what the community is
		
00:18:28 --> 00:18:29
			really looking for?
		
00:18:29 --> 00:18:29
			What do we need?
		
00:18:30 --> 00:18:31
			So we start kind of highlighting these subjects
		
00:18:31 --> 00:18:34
			and addressing these issues So that brings of
		
00:18:34 --> 00:18:36
			course people to come and listen and and
		
00:18:36 --> 00:18:39
			hear from you the second thing the methodology
		
00:18:40 --> 00:18:43
			And alhamdulillah in classical format of teaching obviously
		
00:18:43 --> 00:18:44
			we have a special way of learning the
		
00:18:44 --> 00:18:46
			shaykh is speaking everybody is sitting down taking
		
00:18:46 --> 00:18:48
			notes But no now the modern day of
		
00:18:48 --> 00:18:52
			teaching is different you have to involve, of
		
00:18:52 --> 00:18:55
			course the the audience you have to Take
		
00:18:55 --> 00:18:57
			in consideration that they don't come empty They
		
00:18:57 --> 00:18:59
			come with at least in half full quarter
		
00:18:59 --> 00:19:01
			full with knowledge of the subject that you're
		
00:19:01 --> 00:19:03
			teaching and so on Also people they need
		
00:19:03 --> 00:19:06
			to Know why they're learning this exactly so
		
00:19:06 --> 00:19:09
			it's a whole different model of teaching We
		
00:19:09 --> 00:19:12
			were able to highlight what are the priorities
		
00:19:12 --> 00:19:15
			that people are looking for And then alhamdulillah
		
00:19:15 --> 00:19:17
			working on the model as well of how
		
00:19:17 --> 00:19:19
			to teach that for the later baraka wa
		
00:19:19 --> 00:19:22
			ta'ala and and it launched your your
		
00:19:22 --> 00:19:25
			career and your Your style so the needs
		
00:19:25 --> 00:19:27
			and the styles.
		
00:19:27 --> 00:19:31
			Absolutely So you said the priorities and then
		
00:19:31 --> 00:19:32
			how we're going to deliver them.
		
00:19:32 --> 00:19:35
			Absolutely so it seems to me could be
		
00:19:35 --> 00:19:38
			my bias for sure that uh, like foundational
		
00:19:38 --> 00:19:41
			faith and its counterpart, of course the need
		
00:19:41 --> 00:19:44
			being Widespread not that our communities are being
		
00:19:44 --> 00:19:49
			overrun, but there is significant phenomenon of crisis
		
00:19:49 --> 00:19:52
			of faith What advice would you give to
		
00:19:52 --> 00:19:56
			imams in handling this phenomenon whether proactively or
		
00:19:56 --> 00:19:58
			like on in a case management?
		
00:19:59 --> 00:20:00
			It's the same thing.
		
00:20:00 --> 00:20:01
			Like we said, you know, you need to
		
00:20:01 --> 00:20:02
			look for the priorities, right?
		
00:20:02 --> 00:20:04
			Even when the subject would come to teaching
		
00:20:04 --> 00:20:07
			tawheed, for example naqeeda I mean imams, they
		
00:20:07 --> 00:20:10
			love to teach harith Um, I was one
		
00:20:10 --> 00:20:11
			of them as well too when I first
		
00:20:11 --> 00:20:16
			teaching aqeed in the beginning jibreel and talk
		
00:20:16 --> 00:20:21
			about But then we don't tackle the issues
		
00:20:21 --> 00:20:23
			that now the new generation is dealing with
		
00:20:24 --> 00:20:26
			Like a few years back when people want
		
00:20:26 --> 00:20:28
			to ask faith issues, they would say why
		
00:20:28 --> 00:20:31
			allah said that for example And what does
		
00:20:31 --> 00:20:33
			allah mean by this for example right now
		
00:20:33 --> 00:20:36
			the people ask why allah and What's the
		
00:20:36 --> 00:20:37
			way and why do I have to do
		
00:20:37 --> 00:20:39
			this and why this one is a question
		
00:20:39 --> 00:20:40
			even the authority?
		
00:20:40 --> 00:20:41
			Of the quran the son of the prophet
		
00:20:41 --> 00:20:43
			sallallahu alaihi wa sallam these things needs to
		
00:20:43 --> 00:20:46
			be really highly addressed very well and properly
		
00:20:46 --> 00:20:48
			But it's not just a matter of giving
		
00:20:48 --> 00:20:49
			a class.
		
00:20:49 --> 00:20:51
			It's creating an entire culture in the measure
		
00:20:51 --> 00:20:55
			that will Bring the people to inshallah to
		
00:20:55 --> 00:20:56
			learn these things.
		
00:20:56 --> 00:20:59
			So I believe personally The most important thing
		
00:20:59 --> 00:21:02
			that to build a community is what I
		
00:21:02 --> 00:21:03
			like to call the culture of the community
		
00:21:03 --> 00:21:06
			like the identity Like if you enter if
		
00:21:06 --> 00:21:08
			you enter a masjid And you cannot sense
		
00:21:08 --> 00:21:09
			from the community.
		
00:21:09 --> 00:21:10
			What is this about?
		
00:21:12 --> 00:21:13
			Then that's a shortcoming.
		
00:21:13 --> 00:21:14
			That's a shortcoming.
		
00:21:14 --> 00:21:16
			Absolutely But you go to such communities, for
		
00:21:16 --> 00:21:18
			example, you realize these people tabarak allah or
		
00:21:18 --> 00:21:21
			family oriented For example, this one is more
		
00:21:21 --> 00:21:23
			educational this one have some sort of like
		
00:21:23 --> 00:21:27
			a activism political kind of This one a
		
00:21:27 --> 00:21:30
			humanitarian this one is very traditional for example,
		
00:21:30 --> 00:21:30
			right?
		
00:21:31 --> 00:21:33
			But some communities you go to there's you
		
00:21:33 --> 00:21:34
			don't feel anything.
		
00:21:34 --> 00:21:36
			It's just a matter of a masjid open
		
00:21:36 --> 00:21:40
			for salah and and all the classes are
		
00:21:40 --> 00:21:42
			just Traditional classes everywhere else.
		
00:21:42 --> 00:21:45
			They don't necessarily give people what they need
		
00:21:45 --> 00:21:47
			for real life issues.
		
00:21:47 --> 00:21:49
			Give them what they want And if you
		
00:21:49 --> 00:21:50
			would like to benefit the people you have
		
00:21:50 --> 00:21:53
			to focus on what they need Not just
		
00:21:53 --> 00:21:55
			what they want give them what they need
		
00:21:55 --> 00:21:57
			in a way they want absolutely You give
		
00:21:57 --> 00:21:58
			them what they need you give them what
		
00:21:58 --> 00:21:59
			they need.
		
00:21:59 --> 00:21:59
			They never go.
		
00:21:59 --> 00:22:01
			You know, you never go wrong with that
		
00:22:02 --> 00:22:06
			family issues family crises relationship crises Do how
		
00:22:06 --> 00:22:10
			does your masjid seek to proactively handle that?
		
00:22:11 --> 00:22:13
			Do you see that as an imam's job
		
00:22:13 --> 00:22:14
			or do you pull in smes?
		
00:22:14 --> 00:22:14
			How?
		
00:22:15 --> 00:22:18
			Frequently do you address parenting and marital coaching
		
00:22:18 --> 00:22:19
			needs as an imam?
		
00:22:19 --> 00:22:22
			You have to be resourceful I can't cover
		
00:22:22 --> 00:22:22
			every subject.
		
00:22:22 --> 00:22:24
			I'm not qualified for every topic, but I
		
00:22:24 --> 00:22:26
			need those who are qualified for it.
		
00:22:26 --> 00:22:27
			So Think about it now.
		
00:22:27 --> 00:22:29
			I just need to hear that Look about
		
00:22:29 --> 00:22:31
			10 years ago for example more than 10
		
00:22:31 --> 00:22:31
			years ago.
		
00:22:31 --> 00:22:34
			We started this many many years back More
		
00:22:34 --> 00:22:36
			than 10 years ago parents came to me.
		
00:22:36 --> 00:22:39
			They asked me to um teach them teach
		
00:22:39 --> 00:22:42
			their kids certain stuff and so on but
		
00:22:42 --> 00:22:45
			instead of me teaching the children I created
		
00:22:45 --> 00:22:48
			the um, like a series of parenting workshops
		
00:22:48 --> 00:22:51
			and subhanallah since then it's still still be
		
00:22:51 --> 00:22:54
			running Every we have series of parenting workshops
		
00:22:55 --> 00:22:57
			Because I believe that the parents also need
		
00:22:57 --> 00:23:00
			to be educated About what we need to
		
00:23:00 --> 00:23:01
			discuss with their children.
		
00:23:01 --> 00:23:02
			I don't want to talk to your kids.
		
00:23:02 --> 00:23:04
			I want to talk to you Exactly like
		
00:23:04 --> 00:23:06
			you you're the you're the first teacher for
		
00:23:06 --> 00:23:08
			your children So i'm going to talk to
		
00:23:08 --> 00:23:09
			you about what you need to talk to
		
00:23:09 --> 00:23:10
			your children about How do we have youth
		
00:23:10 --> 00:23:12
			directors as well who are taking care of
		
00:23:12 --> 00:23:13
			their kids on their own but the point
		
00:23:13 --> 00:23:15
			is That we need to educate the the
		
00:23:15 --> 00:23:16
			family.
		
00:23:16 --> 00:23:19
			So alhamdulillah our programming is usually Focusing on
		
00:23:19 --> 00:23:21
			what people really need.
		
00:23:21 --> 00:23:23
			So we have age groups and we have
		
00:23:23 --> 00:23:24
			of course the adults as well have their
		
00:23:24 --> 00:23:26
			own needs So alhamdulillah, we kind of like
		
00:23:26 --> 00:23:30
			more Focus on demographics and age groups and
		
00:23:30 --> 00:23:32
			demands and needs and we cover all the
		
00:23:32 --> 00:23:34
			areas as much as we can inshallah You
		
00:23:34 --> 00:23:37
			cannot just uh Keep the measure running on
		
00:23:37 --> 00:23:40
			one size fit all kind of programming like
		
00:23:40 --> 00:23:41
			family night.
		
00:23:41 --> 00:23:43
			We call it What's the point of it?
		
00:23:43 --> 00:23:43
			What was that?
		
00:23:43 --> 00:23:45
			Yeah, right.
		
00:23:46 --> 00:23:49
			I mean Last night we had a family
		
00:23:49 --> 00:23:51
			night in the masjid and the topic was
		
00:23:51 --> 00:23:53
			masjid safety in preparation for the month of
		
00:23:53 --> 00:23:56
			ramadan And the purpose was to talk about
		
00:23:57 --> 00:24:00
			Most common accidents happen to children in the
		
00:24:00 --> 00:24:02
			masjid And who was speaking there?
		
00:24:02 --> 00:24:05
			We have a whole team called vric Medical
		
00:24:05 --> 00:24:09
			emergency response team So those are doctors and
		
00:24:09 --> 00:24:11
			security people and and health care providers in
		
00:24:11 --> 00:24:12
			the community.
		
00:24:12 --> 00:24:16
			MashaAllah They are a full team and they
		
00:24:16 --> 00:24:17
			came and they talked about the age groups
		
00:24:17 --> 00:24:19
			This age group is the most common accidents
		
00:24:19 --> 00:24:21
			happen to them in the masjid This age
		
00:24:21 --> 00:24:23
			group this age group and talk with the
		
00:24:23 --> 00:24:25
			people about okay in terms of something like
		
00:24:25 --> 00:24:26
			this happens Please make sure to do one
		
00:24:26 --> 00:24:29
			two and three and four These are the
		
00:24:29 --> 00:24:32
			things that people need You know They might
		
00:24:32 --> 00:24:33
			not think that they want that because it's
		
00:24:33 --> 00:24:36
			not it doesn't sound like an entertaining subject
		
00:24:36 --> 00:24:38
			for them, but they really need it And
		
00:24:38 --> 00:24:41
			alhamdulillah people appreciate that stuff tomorrow inshallah I
		
00:24:41 --> 00:24:43
			don't know what is going to be broadcasted.
		
00:24:43 --> 00:24:47
			But tomorrow for example, i'm having also a
		
00:24:47 --> 00:24:49
			parenting workshop And it's going to be about
		
00:24:49 --> 00:24:51
			children in the quran in preparation for the
		
00:24:51 --> 00:24:52
			month of ramadan this one will be given
		
00:24:52 --> 00:24:56
			Well, I also bring experts I bring with
		
00:24:56 --> 00:24:59
			me the the head of the quran school
		
00:25:00 --> 00:25:02
			One of the quran teachers and how and
		
00:25:02 --> 00:25:04
			once a student of the school as well,
		
00:25:04 --> 00:25:06
			too and a parents Who have kids learning
		
00:25:06 --> 00:25:07
			the quran?
		
00:25:08 --> 00:25:11
			We also bring a professional therapist who talk
		
00:25:11 --> 00:25:14
			about the psychology of of all this stuff
		
00:25:14 --> 00:25:16
			and so on I'm only just the organizer
		
00:25:17 --> 00:25:19
			And my job is to talk about the
		
00:25:19 --> 00:25:21
			religious aspect of caring for our children connecting
		
00:25:21 --> 00:25:23
			to the quran And the rest of the
		
00:25:23 --> 00:25:25
			techniques and the skill and everything else has
		
00:25:25 --> 00:25:26
			a professional voice.
		
00:25:26 --> 00:25:29
			So the idea is to be resourceful To
		
00:25:29 --> 00:25:32
			provide to people what they need And you
		
00:25:32 --> 00:25:34
			don't have to do everything yourself beautiful I
		
00:25:34 --> 00:25:36
			mean the reason i'm asking all these questions
		
00:25:36 --> 00:25:39
			in case anyone doesn't notice is It would
		
00:25:39 --> 00:25:42
			help the the sense of competence and you
		
00:25:42 --> 00:25:45
			know, uh ability of the imam his self
		
00:25:45 --> 00:25:47
			-worth To know okay I need to be
		
00:25:47 --> 00:25:49
			diligent in just these issues and I can
		
00:25:49 --> 00:25:51
			delegate those issues and you make you bring
		
00:25:51 --> 00:25:52
			a beautiful point that a Lot of these
		
00:25:52 --> 00:25:53
			people are already in our communities.
		
00:25:53 --> 00:25:55
			No, you would just tap on their shoulders
		
00:25:55 --> 00:25:57
			They may actually feel wanted in the more
		
00:25:57 --> 00:25:58
			sense of belonging and you just activate them
		
00:25:58 --> 00:25:59
			That's all you really need to do.
		
00:26:00 --> 00:26:03
			Sometimes the institute of the imams Puts a
		
00:26:03 --> 00:26:06
			like a gatekeeping culture You know, they don't
		
00:26:06 --> 00:26:07
			want anyone to come and talk in the
		
00:26:07 --> 00:26:10
			masjid because i've seen this to be sure
		
00:26:10 --> 00:26:12
			them to be kind of like An incompetent
		
00:26:12 --> 00:26:14
			or not qualified for this and so on.
		
00:26:14 --> 00:26:16
			So they're really just kind of like Keep
		
00:26:16 --> 00:26:19
			the masjid circulating around their program and their
		
00:26:19 --> 00:26:21
			activities your committee is not going to grow
		
00:26:21 --> 00:26:23
			and at some point They'll outgrow your program
		
00:26:24 --> 00:26:25
			And they will see that and that imam
		
00:26:25 --> 00:26:26
			eventually is not going to be there for
		
00:26:26 --> 00:26:30
			too long Yeah, and abu salam listened to
		
00:26:30 --> 00:26:32
			uh, i'm sharing this for whoever doesn't know
		
00:26:32 --> 00:26:32
			it.
		
00:26:33 --> 00:26:35
			Obviously, you're my sheikh But I think of
		
00:26:35 --> 00:26:36
			salman right?
		
00:26:37 --> 00:26:39
			We said the sassanid persians used to use
		
00:26:39 --> 00:26:42
			this method of Uh holding out the siege
		
00:26:42 --> 00:26:44
			by digging trenches so they didn't have to
		
00:26:44 --> 00:26:47
			engage in active combat And he listened Or
		
00:26:47 --> 00:26:50
			when he said it's not a good place
		
00:26:50 --> 00:26:53
			to stay in the army at badr Evolution
		
00:26:53 --> 00:26:55
			of the imam is what i'm feeling and
		
00:26:55 --> 00:26:58
			hearing Have you ever thought about what imams
		
00:26:58 --> 00:27:02
			may need in the near future considering online
		
00:27:02 --> 00:27:05
			platforms digital media uh, the messages inshallah becoming
		
00:27:05 --> 00:27:11
			more nuanced youth director So, um The biggest
		
00:27:11 --> 00:27:14
			challenge for not just masjid any home house
		
00:27:14 --> 00:27:17
			of worship And all religions organized religion really
		
00:27:17 --> 00:27:20
			is the challenge of the of the internet
		
00:27:21 --> 00:27:25
			because uh, um In the past people used
		
00:27:25 --> 00:27:26
			to come to the masjid to the house
		
00:27:26 --> 00:27:29
			of worship for almost everything Related to their
		
00:27:29 --> 00:27:30
			faith.
		
00:27:30 --> 00:27:33
			So whether it's the information the knowledge the
		
00:27:33 --> 00:27:36
			social gatherings and activities The the help and
		
00:27:36 --> 00:27:39
			assistance the spiritual as tons of that stuff
		
00:27:39 --> 00:27:42
			right now people don't seem to be um
		
00:27:42 --> 00:27:44
			Need that that knowledge from you in the
		
00:27:44 --> 00:27:47
			masjid anymore So when you make a big
		
00:27:47 --> 00:27:51
			fancy You know program and and lecture you'll
		
00:27:51 --> 00:27:53
			find a handful of people really come to
		
00:27:53 --> 00:27:55
			it But if you if you come and
		
00:27:55 --> 00:27:59
			and do a food fest For thousands of
		
00:27:59 --> 00:28:00
			people come flocking to it.
		
00:28:00 --> 00:28:02
			For example, why why what happened there?
		
00:28:02 --> 00:28:05
			See because for the subject of knowledge people
		
00:28:05 --> 00:28:08
			now they have uh, um The ilm already
		
00:28:08 --> 00:28:13
			provided for them online for free even Not
		
00:28:13 --> 00:28:15
			just that they have a variety of teachers
		
00:28:15 --> 00:28:17
			There was a time I remember in el
		
00:28:17 --> 00:28:21
			paso, texas but Yeah over 20 plus years
		
00:28:21 --> 00:28:25
			ago When when the youtube became something We
		
00:28:25 --> 00:28:27
			start seeing some of the mashayekh that we
		
00:28:27 --> 00:28:30
			never think of bringing to el paso on
		
00:28:30 --> 00:28:30
			youtube.
		
00:28:30 --> 00:28:33
			So you have a youtube halaqa Like a
		
00:28:33 --> 00:28:33
			youtube.
		
00:28:33 --> 00:28:34
			Yep.
		
00:28:34 --> 00:28:36
			Yep in the masjid people watch watch party,
		
00:28:36 --> 00:28:37
			right?
		
00:28:37 --> 00:28:37
			Exactly.
		
00:28:37 --> 00:28:38
			Subhanallah.
		
00:28:38 --> 00:28:41
			It was a big deal But now you
		
00:28:41 --> 00:28:43
			have all these mashayekh That you can pause
		
00:28:43 --> 00:28:45
			the lecture and save it and this and
		
00:28:45 --> 00:28:47
			that and so on So that was a
		
00:28:47 --> 00:28:49
			big challenge for the role of the imam
		
00:28:49 --> 00:28:52
			in the masjid if the imam is is
		
00:28:52 --> 00:28:55
			not really um If the imam is taking
		
00:28:55 --> 00:28:59
			his role as traditional leadership, meaning khutbatul juma
		
00:29:00 --> 00:29:04
			Halaqa after fajr lecture and that's it then
		
00:29:06 --> 00:29:08
			They're not gonna last long because people don't
		
00:29:08 --> 00:29:09
			come to the masjid anymore for these things
		
00:29:09 --> 00:29:12
			anymore They come for what the internet does
		
00:29:12 --> 00:29:13
			not provide for them.
		
00:29:13 --> 00:29:16
			And that's the social belonging They want to
		
00:29:16 --> 00:29:17
			belong to a community.
		
00:29:17 --> 00:29:19
			They want to feel part of something So
		
00:29:19 --> 00:29:21
			therefore we focus so much alhamdulillah and community
		
00:29:21 --> 00:29:25
			on social programming Social programming involved like for
		
00:29:25 --> 00:29:28
			example community breakfast 500 people come for the
		
00:29:28 --> 00:29:31
			community breakfast What are you going to serve?
		
00:29:32 --> 00:29:35
			I mean brisket brisket you texans in the
		
00:29:35 --> 00:29:36
			brisket.
		
00:29:36 --> 00:29:39
			That's that's for dinner but for breakfast I'm
		
00:29:39 --> 00:29:40
			not a brisket guy.
		
00:29:40 --> 00:29:41
			By the way, I'll tell you what for
		
00:29:41 --> 00:29:41
			breakfast.
		
00:29:41 --> 00:29:43
			We'll still get to nihari Just to tell
		
00:29:43 --> 00:29:47
			you and other things alhamdulillah But people mashallah
		
00:29:47 --> 00:29:49
			come about 500 people come to that breakfast
		
00:29:49 --> 00:29:55
			event alhamdulillah you do um uh an evening
		
00:29:55 --> 00:29:57
			program for the family and the children for
		
00:29:57 --> 00:29:59
			example, like a uh, more of like a
		
00:29:59 --> 00:30:02
			uh, Uh kahoot program or event or something
		
00:30:02 --> 00:30:03
			like that And after that there's a social
		
00:30:03 --> 00:30:06
			time outside having tea cookies and so on
		
00:30:06 --> 00:30:08
			whether the committee gets together people.
		
00:30:08 --> 00:30:10
			They love these kind of events uh in
		
00:30:10 --> 00:30:13
			addition to talk about the things that they
		
00:30:13 --> 00:30:15
			um, we don't seem to be brave enough
		
00:30:15 --> 00:30:17
			to talk about them, you know Uh openly
		
00:30:17 --> 00:30:19
			so we talk about family issues what happened
		
00:30:19 --> 00:30:23
			between husband wife parenting and children In-laws
		
00:30:23 --> 00:30:25
			issues all these kind of things like what
		
00:30:25 --> 00:30:28
			people really don't see it in lectures You
		
00:30:28 --> 00:30:31
			create programs for it and people will come
		
00:30:31 --> 00:30:34
			I'm also hearing from you Don't believe the
		
00:30:34 --> 00:30:37
			hype like as the digital world becomes people
		
00:30:37 --> 00:30:40
			start living like vicariously through like, you know,
		
00:30:40 --> 00:30:44
			uh digital world They're going to become more
		
00:30:44 --> 00:30:46
			and more empty more and more thirsty for
		
00:30:46 --> 00:30:46
			belonging.
		
00:30:46 --> 00:30:49
			Oh, yeah, so the imams of tomorrow need
		
00:30:49 --> 00:30:52
			to be ready uh To embrace them, right?
		
00:30:52 --> 00:30:53
			There's going to be a greater demand not
		
00:30:53 --> 00:30:57
			even tomorrow It's already today It's not even
		
00:30:57 --> 00:31:00
			yesterday There's a lot of people right people
		
00:31:00 --> 00:31:02
			want community more than they want community more
		
00:31:02 --> 00:31:05
			than more than ever Yeah that the knowledge
		
00:31:05 --> 00:31:07
			right now the information is not a priority
		
00:31:07 --> 00:31:09
			for them But it's the identity the belonging
		
00:31:09 --> 00:31:11
			that they that they they care for for
		
00:31:11 --> 00:31:14
			themselves and for their families as well, too
		
00:31:14 --> 00:31:16
			I have a few personal questions shaykh, but
		
00:31:16 --> 00:31:18
			I want to ask one final community-based
		
00:31:18 --> 00:31:20
			question in terms of the life of the
		
00:31:20 --> 00:31:24
			imam uh You are the imam at valley
		
00:31:24 --> 00:31:27
			ranch islamic center Uh, but you're involved in
		
00:31:27 --> 00:31:29
			more than what comes to mind when people
		
00:31:29 --> 00:31:33
			think of the traditional imam role How involved
		
00:31:33 --> 00:31:37
			do you believe the imam should be in
		
00:31:37 --> 00:31:41
			the overall vision of a community because the
		
00:31:41 --> 00:31:44
			community Starting to become a small village or
		
00:31:44 --> 00:31:47
			a little city, right a micro micro city
		
00:31:47 --> 00:31:49
			So how much of that should the imam
		
00:31:49 --> 00:31:51
			be in and how much should the imam
		
00:31:51 --> 00:31:54
			insulate himself to do little less things better?
		
00:31:55 --> 00:31:58
			It really depends on the the uh, you
		
00:31:58 --> 00:31:59
			know, the kind of community that you're building
		
00:31:59 --> 00:32:02
			around you But alhamdulillah from the very beginning
		
00:32:02 --> 00:32:05
			our community is very clear on the identity
		
00:32:06 --> 00:32:08
			We're a family oriented community.
		
00:32:08 --> 00:32:10
			We're building a community on a message and
		
00:32:10 --> 00:32:13
			everybody believed in that and everybody really, uh,
		
00:32:13 --> 00:32:16
			uh supports of that vision alhamdulillah So that's
		
00:32:16 --> 00:32:18
			why all the programming heads in that direction.
		
00:32:18 --> 00:32:21
			It's already that alignment exactly So my job
		
00:32:21 --> 00:32:23
			became alhamdulillah is to make sure that how
		
00:32:23 --> 00:32:26
			however we evolve It's all heading in the
		
00:32:26 --> 00:32:26
			same direction.
		
00:32:27 --> 00:32:29
			So for example One of the early committees
		
00:32:29 --> 00:32:31
			that we establish in the community is the
		
00:32:31 --> 00:32:33
			women committee believe it or not Because i'm
		
00:32:33 --> 00:32:35
			a strong believer that subhanallah if we have
		
00:32:35 --> 00:32:37
			a healthy women community It brings the men
		
00:32:37 --> 00:32:39
			and the women and the children to the
		
00:32:39 --> 00:32:43
			masjid but having a strong men's community They
		
00:32:43 --> 00:32:45
			usually don't like to bring their families and
		
00:32:45 --> 00:32:47
			the kids within southern asia, for example or
		
00:32:47 --> 00:32:49
			or programs They just want to pray and
		
00:32:49 --> 00:32:51
			just spend some time go back home But
		
00:32:51 --> 00:32:53
			if you bring the ladies and have their
		
00:32:53 --> 00:32:56
			programs alhamdulillah after they start bringing the husband
		
00:32:56 --> 00:32:58
			they bring the children You you build a
		
00:32:58 --> 00:33:01
			community, uh behind it So that's one of
		
00:33:01 --> 00:33:03
			the early committees we had and then we
		
00:33:03 --> 00:33:04
			have a program committee Then you have the
		
00:33:04 --> 00:33:05
			quran school committee.
		
00:33:05 --> 00:33:07
			You have the weekend community Then we establish
		
00:33:07 --> 00:33:10
			alhamdulillah a men's committee who is responsible for
		
00:33:10 --> 00:33:11
			the men's also and the youth they had
		
00:33:11 --> 00:33:15
			their own also, uh programming so Everything is
		
00:33:15 --> 00:33:18
			masha'allah as it evolves, but everything should
		
00:33:18 --> 00:33:21
			be Kind of like funneling into the same
		
00:33:21 --> 00:33:23
			direction in that same vision So as an
		
00:33:23 --> 00:33:25
			imam alhamdulillah, I make sure that we're still
		
00:33:25 --> 00:33:28
			into the same vision the same direction for
		
00:33:28 --> 00:33:31
			allah No matter how big we grow We
		
00:33:31 --> 00:33:32
			need to keep everybody inshallah on the same
		
00:33:32 --> 00:33:38
			page As for the decision making My job
		
00:33:38 --> 00:33:40
			is the mashoorah The decision at the end
		
00:33:40 --> 00:33:41
			of the day is in the hand of
		
00:33:41 --> 00:33:44
			the political leadership of the community and that's
		
00:33:44 --> 00:33:47
			the board Now that sounds like a very
		
00:33:47 --> 00:33:49
			wide net you've cast to bring in as
		
00:33:49 --> 00:33:53
			many people as possible What challenges do you?
		
00:33:53 --> 00:33:59
			See in terms of maintaining diversity Obviously the
		
00:33:59 --> 00:34:02
			when the community starts growing It starts getting
		
00:34:02 --> 00:34:06
			divided on sometimes ethnical racial sometimes ideological or
		
00:34:06 --> 00:34:07
			whatever that is But alhamdulillah, we don't have
		
00:34:07 --> 00:34:10
			that as as a major issue in our
		
00:34:10 --> 00:34:13
			community But I see it actually like I
		
00:34:13 --> 00:34:15
			hear you in fundraisers saying like the the
		
00:34:15 --> 00:34:18
			cricket team or the Pakistani physicians or whatnot.
		
00:34:19 --> 00:34:20
			No, but it doesn't seem sectarian.
		
00:34:20 --> 00:34:23
			It does at least not outwardly It's alhamdulillah.
		
00:34:23 --> 00:34:25
			The thing is that obviously a cliquish mentality
		
00:34:25 --> 00:34:29
			start develop being developed Between the newcomers the
		
00:34:29 --> 00:34:30
			older ones and this and that and so
		
00:34:30 --> 00:34:32
			on So we try to break this by
		
00:34:32 --> 00:34:36
			creating all these events That will help everybody
		
00:34:36 --> 00:34:39
			regardless of their background to participate So when
		
00:34:39 --> 00:34:41
			you have all these programs to break this
		
00:34:41 --> 00:34:42
			this cycle, for example, we have the men's
		
00:34:42 --> 00:34:46
			retreat for example We had masha'allah 154
		
00:34:46 --> 00:34:50
			people come to the retreat different age groups
		
00:34:51 --> 00:34:55
			Different demographics background spending all weekend together and
		
00:34:55 --> 00:34:57
			by the time they came back alhamdulillah back
		
00:34:57 --> 00:35:00
			home They broke the ice for life We
		
00:35:00 --> 00:35:03
			do umrah for example, we take different families
		
00:35:03 --> 00:35:04
			together from different backgrounds.
		
00:35:05 --> 00:35:06
			They come back alhamdulillah.
		
00:35:06 --> 00:35:08
			They're like one family So we're trying to
		
00:35:08 --> 00:35:10
			do all the programs we can to break
		
00:35:10 --> 00:35:15
			all this uh Division there's imagined boundaries as
		
00:35:15 --> 00:35:18
			we call them Psychologically speaking actually the sociologically
		
00:35:18 --> 00:35:23
			speaking I would say it's proven that The
		
00:35:23 --> 00:35:25
			community is very intimate as long as it
		
00:35:25 --> 00:35:30
			doesn't grow, uh beyond 150 members Once you
		
00:35:30 --> 00:35:31
			become more than 150, that's it.
		
00:35:32 --> 00:35:33
			You become diluted.
		
00:35:33 --> 00:35:34
			It's no longer as intimate as it should
		
00:35:34 --> 00:35:37
			be So as the community is growing masha
		
00:35:37 --> 00:35:39
			'allah, you can see that they are forming
		
00:35:39 --> 00:35:43
			their own Comfort groups I would say but
		
00:35:43 --> 00:35:46
			we make sure alhamdulillah that they're not in
		
00:35:46 --> 00:35:48
			trenches camps Too isolated from each other.
		
00:35:48 --> 00:35:50
			I mean, we don't we don't claim to
		
00:35:50 --> 00:35:52
			be perfect You can always find people have
		
00:35:52 --> 00:35:52
			their favorites.
		
00:35:52 --> 00:35:54
			Obviously, I mean no matter how much you
		
00:35:54 --> 00:35:57
			try but at least alhamdulillah overall, it's not
		
00:35:57 --> 00:36:00
			um It's not the highlight of the community
		
00:36:00 --> 00:36:02
			is not on the front stage of the
		
00:36:02 --> 00:36:05
			community But something maybe it's not that of
		
00:36:05 --> 00:36:09
			a big deal for us alhamdulillah Alhamdulillah, this
		
00:36:09 --> 00:36:10
			sounds like a lot of work.
		
00:36:10 --> 00:36:14
			So how do you reconcile this with?
		
00:36:15 --> 00:36:18
			Our primary function our duties to our families
		
00:36:19 --> 00:36:22
			the imam's life, uh With wife and child
		
00:36:23 --> 00:36:26
			It's not easy Honestly, it's not easy.
		
00:36:26 --> 00:36:27
			I mean the family usually takes that the
		
00:36:27 --> 00:36:28
			greatest.
		
00:36:28 --> 00:36:33
			Yeah I would say uh liability of being
		
00:36:33 --> 00:36:36
			the imam's uh family, you know, it seems
		
00:36:36 --> 00:36:40
			that people They think the imam And the
		
00:36:40 --> 00:36:42
			imam family should be at the same level
		
00:36:42 --> 00:36:44
			They don't realize the expectation.
		
00:36:44 --> 00:36:44
			Exactly.
		
00:36:44 --> 00:36:46
			You don't realize that your family is a
		
00:36:46 --> 00:36:48
			private citizen to you, right?
		
00:36:49 --> 00:36:51
			They're not they're not the imam.
		
00:36:51 --> 00:36:53
			They're not Representing the imamship of your imam
		
00:36:53 --> 00:36:55
			and so on but there is a lot
		
00:36:55 --> 00:36:58
			of unfortunate pressure on on Imams families and
		
00:36:58 --> 00:37:00
			honestly, this is one of the biggest issues
		
00:37:00 --> 00:37:04
			imam they deal with in their communities like
		
00:37:04 --> 00:37:06
			sometimes if if If the imam is not
		
00:37:06 --> 00:37:09
			well taken care of Obviously the family is
		
00:37:09 --> 00:37:11
			not going to be happy with that And
		
00:37:11 --> 00:37:13
			they will put pressure on the on the
		
00:37:13 --> 00:37:16
			imam really to uh, no resent community and
		
00:37:16 --> 00:37:18
			maybe religion exactly And as a result you
		
00:37:18 --> 00:37:22
			find some imams wives completely isolate themselves And
		
00:37:22 --> 00:37:24
			Try to protect the family and the kids
		
00:37:24 --> 00:37:26
			from from any pressure that comes from the
		
00:37:26 --> 00:37:29
			community And we we had our share.
		
00:37:29 --> 00:37:31
			SubhanAllah as we grow up in the communities
		
00:37:32 --> 00:37:33
			And sometimes the people they wonder why your
		
00:37:33 --> 00:37:35
			kid didn't go to islamic schools, for example
		
00:37:36 --> 00:37:40
			because we tried but unfortunately, I mean It's
		
00:37:40 --> 00:37:43
			not healthy for our kids, unfortunately There is
		
00:37:43 --> 00:37:45
			always expectation different from them than anybody else
		
00:37:46 --> 00:37:49
			Same thing, you know your family don't really
		
00:37:49 --> 00:37:51
			maybe Show up very often in most programs
		
00:37:51 --> 00:37:53
			or many programs for the exact same reasons.
		
00:37:53 --> 00:37:57
			Unfortunately, there's a lot of expectation But alhamdulillah,
		
00:37:57 --> 00:37:58
			I mean if you build a very healthy
		
00:37:59 --> 00:38:02
			social uh environment and social network with the
		
00:38:02 --> 00:38:05
			community And your family is part of it
		
00:38:05 --> 00:38:06
			for the light that is the pressure a
		
00:38:06 --> 00:38:10
			lot on you So that's how the community
		
00:38:10 --> 00:38:12
			perceives your family in a way that could
		
00:38:12 --> 00:38:17
			be uh detrimental to them What about your
		
00:38:17 --> 00:38:18
			availability for your family?
		
00:38:19 --> 00:38:22
			Uh, or your emotional well-being For your
		
00:38:22 --> 00:38:25
			family, I mean keep in mind, you know
		
00:38:25 --> 00:38:28
			as they when they're younger They probably do
		
00:38:28 --> 00:38:31
			more So alhamdulillah, I mean, you know, you
		
00:38:31 --> 00:38:33
			spend time with them and even when I
		
00:38:33 --> 00:38:36
			was traveling with the maghreb institute And make
		
00:38:36 --> 00:38:39
			sure that uh, and when the school is
		
00:38:39 --> 00:38:41
			off if they need me to teach somewhere
		
00:38:41 --> 00:38:43
			you have to bring my family with me
		
00:38:43 --> 00:38:46
			Because they're a priority but alhamdulillah, they they
		
00:38:46 --> 00:38:48
			they made friends almost all over the place
		
00:38:48 --> 00:38:52
			from the light of allah Um also when
		
00:38:52 --> 00:38:54
			you're home you try your best to focus
		
00:38:54 --> 00:38:56
			also that they have their time and sometimes
		
00:38:57 --> 00:38:59
			I don't care about my duty to the
		
00:38:59 --> 00:39:01
			measure in that time because that's my family
		
00:39:01 --> 00:39:03
			time right now So I spend that time
		
00:39:03 --> 00:39:05
			with them alhamdulillah as they grow older, obviously
		
00:39:05 --> 00:39:08
			The pressure is a bit less and less
		
00:39:08 --> 00:39:11
			So, uh, you dedicate more time for the
		
00:39:11 --> 00:39:13
			community perhaps alhamdulillah your personal duties as well
		
00:39:13 --> 00:39:16
			too and so on but It's a very
		
00:39:16 --> 00:39:19
			delicate situation That you need to be make
		
00:39:19 --> 00:39:22
			sure when you come home You don't bring
		
00:39:22 --> 00:39:25
			the masjid business with you for the family
		
00:39:25 --> 00:39:28
			to deal with May I ask if you
		
00:39:28 --> 00:39:30
			have uh, like no masjid discussion rules at
		
00:39:30 --> 00:39:34
			home That's a given thing Not even actually
		
00:39:34 --> 00:39:36
			I need it's not I don't even discuss
		
00:39:36 --> 00:39:36
			it myself.
		
00:39:37 --> 00:39:39
			I don't have to discuss it myself Uh,
		
00:39:39 --> 00:39:43
			you don't get requests forwarded through others to
		
00:39:43 --> 00:39:46
			you Yeah, and if that happens very limited,
		
00:39:47 --> 00:39:48
			but they know me I tell even if
		
00:39:48 --> 00:39:50
			my offers on people they go through my
		
00:39:50 --> 00:39:52
			wife I tell my wife says ask them
		
00:39:52 --> 00:39:56
			to email me because I want to Get
		
00:39:56 --> 00:39:57
			my wife out of it.
		
00:39:57 --> 00:39:58
			So it doesn't have to be burned out
		
00:39:58 --> 00:39:59
			because of it.
		
00:39:59 --> 00:40:02
			That's one thing second thing I don't allow
		
00:40:02 --> 00:40:04
			people to call me my personal number.
		
00:40:04 --> 00:40:07
			Um, you know for uh, for business Masjid
		
00:40:07 --> 00:40:09
			business except of course the board and those
		
00:40:09 --> 00:40:11
			are official general So you believe imams should
		
00:40:11 --> 00:40:13
			have two phones or two numbers?
		
00:40:13 --> 00:40:14
			Well, I have one number and if no
		
00:40:14 --> 00:40:17
			one, uh, anybody calls on my private number
		
00:40:17 --> 00:40:19
			I say to them email me like I
		
00:40:19 --> 00:40:22
			try my best not to uh Do that
		
00:40:22 --> 00:40:23
			because it's not fair for my family and
		
00:40:23 --> 00:40:26
			after isha People want to call text you
		
00:40:26 --> 00:40:28
			because that's when they're free or even on
		
00:40:28 --> 00:40:30
			the weekends Like everybody wants to meet with
		
00:40:30 --> 00:40:33
			you on the weekends I hear you but
		
00:40:33 --> 00:40:36
			also When you're off my kids are also
		
00:40:36 --> 00:40:38
			off as well too on the weekend.
		
00:40:38 --> 00:40:39
			They're not they're not off on the weekdays.
		
00:40:40 --> 00:40:43
			Yeah So try the evenings Can I meet
		
00:40:43 --> 00:40:45
			you at isha like yeah, but that's my
		
00:40:45 --> 00:40:47
			my hour with my family, right?
		
00:40:47 --> 00:40:50
			Yeah One time somebody called me and that
		
00:40:50 --> 00:40:51
			was long long time ago when I was
		
00:40:51 --> 00:40:54
			still beginner as an imam So somebody called
		
00:40:54 --> 00:40:56
			me around 2 a.m I was like,
		
00:40:56 --> 00:41:00
			whoa I'm gonna divorce my wife.
		
00:41:00 --> 00:41:00
			Exactly.
		
00:41:00 --> 00:41:00
			Really?
		
00:41:03 --> 00:41:05
			Sure, i'm gonna divorce my wife I said,
		
00:41:05 --> 00:41:08
			okay, go ahead Assalamu alaikum and I hung
		
00:41:08 --> 00:41:09
			up.
		
00:41:09 --> 00:41:11
			Oh my god And and then I unplugged
		
00:41:11 --> 00:41:14
			the phone It was the home the whole
		
00:41:14 --> 00:41:14
			house.
		
00:41:14 --> 00:41:16
			Yeah, the next day he meet me he
		
00:41:16 --> 00:41:19
			goes when I called yesterday, you know, uh,
		
00:41:20 --> 00:41:21
			Were you serious when you told me the
		
00:41:21 --> 00:41:21
			divorcer?
		
00:41:22 --> 00:41:23
			I said well, you called me at 2
		
00:41:23 --> 00:41:24
			a.m to divorce.
		
00:41:24 --> 00:41:26
			You must be serious yourself So why are
		
00:41:26 --> 00:41:26
			you calling me?
		
00:41:27 --> 00:41:28
			But alhamdulillah, they're still together.
		
00:41:29 --> 00:41:32
			Yeah until the But I told people I
		
00:41:32 --> 00:41:34
			made an announcement I said don't you ever
		
00:41:34 --> 00:41:39
			ever they're calling me after isha If anything
		
00:41:39 --> 00:41:44
			happens You have uh Authority to deal with
		
00:41:44 --> 00:41:46
			you have other people to talk take about
		
00:41:46 --> 00:41:50
			if it's something other than emergency Don't call
		
00:41:50 --> 00:41:53
			me I think whether it's isha or not
		
00:41:53 --> 00:41:57
			our listeners should just hear Like not necessarily
		
00:41:57 --> 00:41:59
			the letter of the law, but the spirit
		
00:41:59 --> 00:42:00
			of the law they need to know What
		
00:42:00 --> 00:42:02
			will and will not be accepted?
		
00:42:03 --> 00:42:05
			No, and I I'm not saying but i'm
		
00:42:05 --> 00:42:07
			not saying I don't take any phone calls.
		
00:42:07 --> 00:42:09
			Yeah, but actually I ask people to email
		
00:42:09 --> 00:42:12
			me But set the expectation and leave me
		
00:42:12 --> 00:42:15
			your phone number And I call them back
		
00:42:15 --> 00:42:17
			So I call them back when i'm free
		
00:42:17 --> 00:42:20
			for that, uh, alhamdulillah, my mind is free
		
00:42:20 --> 00:42:22
			for this instead of me trying to uh,
		
00:42:22 --> 00:42:25
			call them Uh when i'm busy or my
		
00:42:25 --> 00:42:26
			mind is not there for them or they
		
00:42:26 --> 00:42:28
			call me when i'm exhausted and tired So
		
00:42:28 --> 00:42:30
			it's it's there's there is a time for
		
00:42:30 --> 00:42:32
			that I really appreciate you.
		
00:42:32 --> 00:42:35
			I I I personally all the time, you
		
00:42:35 --> 00:42:40
			know, sometimes I hear the hadith Rahimahullah when
		
00:42:40 --> 00:42:47
			he asked her mother Did he ever pray
		
00:42:47 --> 00:42:50
			seated she said Yes after he was wore
		
00:42:50 --> 00:42:54
			out by the people And then other times
		
00:42:54 --> 00:42:55
			you hear the hadith of like when he
		
00:42:55 --> 00:42:58
			spoke he would turn entirely Right, he wouldn't
		
00:42:58 --> 00:43:00
			be multitasking and we're as guilty as it
		
00:43:00 --> 00:43:02
			comes with this sort of stuff and you're
		
00:43:02 --> 00:43:04
			trying to reconcile Everyone's got to figure out
		
00:43:04 --> 00:43:06
			their fix or we're human being after all.
		
00:43:07 --> 00:43:09
			Yeah, he would have to understand that Yeah,
		
00:43:09 --> 00:43:11
			we have our own weaknesses our own shortcomings
		
00:43:11 --> 00:43:16
			our struggles And alhamdulillah imams not prophets and
		
00:43:16 --> 00:43:18
			we hope that our the good thing that
		
00:43:18 --> 00:43:22
			we bring to the community Will inshallah outweigh
		
00:43:22 --> 00:43:24
			the mistakes and the the faults that we
		
00:43:24 --> 00:43:27
			have I mean, can I ask one last
		
00:43:27 --> 00:43:27
			question?
		
00:43:30 --> 00:43:36
			One regret you have That you wish to
		
00:43:36 --> 00:43:45
			save other imams from well, it's honestly it's
		
00:43:45 --> 00:43:47
			too I mean, I don't know how to
		
00:43:47 --> 00:43:50
			say that but um I hope the young
		
00:43:50 --> 00:43:54
			imams In addition to working for the community
		
00:43:54 --> 00:43:57
			very well inshallah That they can I don't
		
00:43:57 --> 00:44:00
			want to say find any um side hustle
		
00:44:01 --> 00:44:04
			But if they can if they can find
		
00:44:04 --> 00:44:08
			a way to create silent income So that
		
00:44:08 --> 00:44:10
			when they reach certain age, they don't have
		
00:44:10 --> 00:44:12
			to depend on the community for uh, uh
		
00:44:12 --> 00:44:15
			for earning for living Rather their income is
		
00:44:15 --> 00:44:17
			a hand of providing for them enough To
		
00:44:17 --> 00:44:19
			enjoy doing the thing they do they want
		
00:44:19 --> 00:44:23
			to do the best for the community So
		
00:44:23 --> 00:44:26
			some investments will be smart inshallah to do
		
00:44:26 --> 00:44:28
			so if they can talk to some professional
		
00:44:28 --> 00:44:32
			investors, maybe what they can do Without having
		
00:44:32 --> 00:44:33
			to take away from their time with their
		
00:44:33 --> 00:44:34
			communities.
		
00:44:34 --> 00:44:36
			That would be great Otherwise, unfortunately what i've
		
00:44:36 --> 00:44:38
			seen some other imams they do They do
		
00:44:38 --> 00:44:41
			two three or four jobs That takes so
		
00:44:41 --> 00:44:43
			much from the energy That when they come
		
00:44:43 --> 00:44:46
			to the masjid, they're underperforming big time Sheikh
		
00:44:46 --> 00:44:50
			mass exodus of imams from masajid or masajid
		
00:44:50 --> 00:44:50
			not hiring.
		
00:44:51 --> 00:44:52
			What's your advice?
		
00:44:52 --> 00:44:53
			How do we reverse this?
		
00:44:54 --> 00:44:56
			The communities need to understand that the imam
		
00:44:56 --> 00:44:59
			position Is different than corporate america?
		
00:45:00 --> 00:45:02
			Because in corporate america we deal with with
		
00:45:02 --> 00:45:04
			money with products with numbers with stuff like
		
00:45:04 --> 00:45:07
			that and so on But here the imam's
		
00:45:07 --> 00:45:08
			position is really it's human.
		
00:45:09 --> 00:45:12
			Yeah resources He is working his heart into
		
00:45:12 --> 00:45:13
			the community.
		
00:45:13 --> 00:45:16
			So he's developing people And that there's no
		
00:45:16 --> 00:45:18
			price tag on it really So therefore you
		
00:45:18 --> 00:45:20
			need to qualify the imam for this level
		
00:45:20 --> 00:45:21
			Hopefully inshallah.
		
00:45:21 --> 00:45:23
			Hopefully the imam has his heart into it
		
00:45:23 --> 00:45:25
			And if we take care of them very
		
00:45:25 --> 00:45:26
			well, we hope it brings their heart into
		
00:45:26 --> 00:45:30
			the community inshallah unfortunately because of this whole
		
00:45:30 --> 00:45:32
			uh, the drama that happens between the board
		
00:45:32 --> 00:45:34
			and that keep changing and sometimes you know,
		
00:45:34 --> 00:45:38
			the Uh, the the perpetual leadership that has
		
00:45:38 --> 00:45:40
			in the communities and forcing imams into doing
		
00:45:40 --> 00:45:40
			things.
		
00:45:41 --> 00:45:43
			They don't want to do Or unfortunately put
		
00:45:43 --> 00:45:44
			them on the salary that's not even sufficient
		
00:45:44 --> 00:45:45
			for them to survive.
		
00:45:45 --> 00:45:48
			I mean Along with with family as it
		
00:45:48 --> 00:45:50
			grows with them A lot of young imams
		
00:45:50 --> 00:45:53
			no longer interested in coming to these positions
		
00:45:53 --> 00:45:57
			and I feel I feel sometimes upset At
		
00:45:57 --> 00:45:59
			these young imams because many of them not
		
00:45:59 --> 00:46:02
			young imams young graduates Who graduate from islamic
		
00:46:02 --> 00:46:05
			seminaries and universities and so on and when
		
00:46:05 --> 00:46:06
			they come and you ask them what they're
		
00:46:06 --> 00:46:07
			going to do for living?
		
00:46:07 --> 00:46:10
			they just They don't have the imamship in
		
00:46:10 --> 00:46:14
			their on their mind And I think it's
		
00:46:14 --> 00:46:16
			the fact that they went to study all
		
00:46:16 --> 00:46:20
			these years Becomes Fault upon them.
		
00:46:21 --> 00:46:23
			There's an obligation upon them to take this
		
00:46:23 --> 00:46:24
			position.
		
00:46:24 --> 00:46:26
			That shouldn't be taken lightly I remember dr
		
00:46:26 --> 00:46:27
			Hatim also like a brother asked him should
		
00:46:27 --> 00:46:28
			I go to medina or not?
		
00:46:28 --> 00:46:30
			I finally got accepted if it's a bit
		
00:46:30 --> 00:46:32
			late and I don't know He said listen,
		
00:46:32 --> 00:46:33
			do you plan on being an imam or
		
00:46:33 --> 00:46:33
			not?
		
00:46:33 --> 00:46:35
			He said this to him He said you
		
00:46:35 --> 00:46:38
			are being educated by the zakah money of
		
00:46:38 --> 00:46:41
			people who intended to produce imams No, so
		
00:46:41 --> 00:46:42
			don't fill that seat.
		
00:46:42 --> 00:46:46
			Don't accept that, you know free pass Uh
		
00:46:46 --> 00:46:47
			that blank check unless you're going to put
		
00:46:47 --> 00:46:48
			it back into the community.
		
00:46:48 --> 00:46:50
			Absolutely So that that's your message to the
		
00:46:50 --> 00:46:52
			imams and you said the board give them
		
00:46:52 --> 00:46:56
			stability make them Certain confident that they're in
		
00:46:56 --> 00:46:56
			it.
		
00:46:56 --> 00:46:59
			We're supposed to be working together not against
		
00:46:59 --> 00:47:03
			each other and if the imam position and
		
00:47:03 --> 00:47:05
			the political leadership in the masjid would work
		
00:47:05 --> 00:47:07
			here as a flat leadership in a way
		
00:47:07 --> 00:47:09
			where they Support each other as i'm working
		
00:47:09 --> 00:47:10
			against each other.
		
00:47:11 --> 00:47:12
			That's how it should be.
		
00:47:12 --> 00:47:16
			That's beautiful advice I think The communities are
		
00:47:16 --> 00:47:20
			starting to wake up to Paying respectable salaries
		
00:47:20 --> 00:47:23
			not forcing them to three jobs But what
		
00:47:23 --> 00:47:25
			if they not enough of them wake up
		
00:47:25 --> 00:47:26
			fast enough what?
		
00:47:26 --> 00:47:28
			We need to compensate that with some passive
		
00:47:28 --> 00:47:30
			income some thinking for yourself.
		
00:47:30 --> 00:47:33
			How can I become financially independent so I
		
00:47:33 --> 00:47:33
			can give more?
		
00:47:34 --> 00:47:36
			And one of the major issues is the
		
00:47:36 --> 00:47:39
			401k for imams which is still The vast
		
00:47:39 --> 00:47:42
			majority of masajid don't even have it Yeah,
		
00:47:42 --> 00:47:43
			and when you give this to your medical
		
00:47:43 --> 00:47:46
			insurance, well when you give this to your
		
00:47:46 --> 00:47:48
			imam from the very beginning of their employment
		
00:47:49 --> 00:47:51
			You're telling them that I will I want
		
00:47:51 --> 00:47:53
			to keep you until your retirement So I
		
00:47:53 --> 00:47:54
			want to take care of you when you
		
00:47:54 --> 00:47:58
			retire diamonds are forever very much But if
		
00:47:58 --> 00:48:00
			the imam he knows that his contract is
		
00:48:00 --> 00:48:04
			for two years or three years And he's
		
00:48:04 --> 00:48:06
			gonna start looking from the end of year
		
00:48:06 --> 00:48:06
			one.
		
00:48:06 --> 00:48:06
			Absolutely.
		
00:48:07 --> 00:48:07
			Absolutely.
		
00:48:07 --> 00:48:10
			Yeah And definitely you're not gonna have his
		
00:48:10 --> 00:48:14
			heart in the community anymore I'm gonna get
		
00:48:14 --> 00:48:15
			heavy on your scales.
		
00:48:15 --> 00:48:16
			When can we expect the books?
		
00:48:17 --> 00:48:19
			um I'm, not giving you homework.
		
00:48:19 --> 00:48:21
			I'm sort of wanting to get out of
		
00:48:21 --> 00:48:25
			this seat Right now some students marshal in
		
00:48:25 --> 00:48:25
			the masjid.
		
00:48:25 --> 00:48:28
			They're collecting the recordings and so on Fantastic
		
00:48:28 --> 00:48:29
			and the work on things inshallah.
		
00:48:29 --> 00:48:30
			That'll be amazing.
		
00:48:30 --> 00:48:32
			We're eagerly looking forward to inshallah.
		
00:48:32 --> 00:48:35
			May Allah allow your benefit Uh to ripple
		
00:48:35 --> 00:48:37
			and multiply until the day of judgment.
		
00:48:37 --> 00:48:37
			Ameen.
		
00:48:37 --> 00:48:38
			Jazakallah khair.
		
00:48:38 --> 00:48:41
			May Allah Grant you the best of this
		
00:48:41 --> 00:48:43
			world and the best of the next you
		
00:48:43 --> 00:48:44
			and your loved ones and grant us all
		
00:48:44 --> 00:48:47
			a husn al khatima Jazakallah khair everybody.
		
00:48:48 --> 00:48:49
			What topics do we need next?
		
00:48:49 --> 00:48:51
			Throw them in the comments Please your questions
		
00:48:51 --> 00:48:53
			your objections to me not the shaykh.
		
00:48:54 --> 00:48:54
			Jazakallah khair.
		
00:48:54 --> 00:48:55
			Assalamu alaikum