Lauren Booth – Tiktok, Psychology and Zionisms Death Throes – TRT World

			Thank you, Lord, for being here with me today, and hoping that we can talk about how you see the
growing support for Palestine right now and globally manifesting itself and what that might signify
morally and otherwise for the West.
		

			So, so much of what's happening in the UK, where you're originally from, but we're seeing throughout
the West, do you think on top of the support itself for the Palestinian people, and the largest
struggle for justice that they're fighting?
		

			This signifies some kind of small shift within Western culture, away from individualism or a
preoccupation, perhaps with the self. I actually think this is a Gen Z, Gen X moment of awakening.
This is suddenly a couple of generations who have been encouraged by commercialism by other
political forces to navel gaze, to become what am I about who am I? How do I justify my being? How
do you justify my being? And how do you accept who I am to suddenly seeing a horror in their midst?
This is the most tech savvy tech connected generation in the history of mankind, they haven't been
able to avoid a manifest evil. And so suddenly, and this is just my opinion, that energy that's been
		

			inside is now God willing, going to change the world potentially, because that energy is pouring
out, it's pouring out so that every genocide supporting American senator, every pastor, every
business person who's investing in war crimes, because of their, you know, selling of arms deals,
for example, or land that that doesn't belong to them, they are being pestered. It's the pester
power of generation. They're being tested and hounded by an angry young people who are saying
something really interesting, not on my watch, not never again, not, not in my name, because these
are really diverse young people, but not now, not ever and not on my watch.
		

			Do you think that it's on account of some kind of moral sensitivity that perhaps earlier generations
didn't have? Or is it more of a function of today's technology? Because the plight of obviously, the
plight of the Palestinian people is not new, or their oppression is not new. You know, what it's
like, you know, let's talk about Zionism. Let's talk about the hideous nature of it, which has been
unchanged for over 100 years, found its zenith 75 plus years ago, in the Nakba, the taking of
Palestinian land. And there's only grown since it's been like it's been invisible to the public eye,
but out in the open. And now, this visceral anger from the Zionists are being challenged. But where
		

			were we before? I'd really been asking like, you know, even as someone who's been interested and
active for Palestinian justice, almost 20 years,
		

			how was it possible that they were doing this vileness and we kind of got on with our lives? I think
that's the question for humanity now is, this horror is obvious, and visceral and hideous, but it's
not really changed in its essence. So where were we before?
		

			Do you feel that it might have to do with what young people are seeing the Palestinians
		

			tell the world that they're learning something from how they're responding to their plight, that's
changing them? Interesting. We are seeing that we are seeing conversions to Islam. I think one of
the one of the areas that hasn't been talked about enough is the fact that the Palestinian people
		

			are faith based people, Christians and Muslims, and nowhere is that more manifest and clearer than
in Gaza. These are a religious people, they go to their face, when they are in pain, when they're
happy when they celebrate when they shop in their dealings with one another. And we are seeing that
now. And the under pressure personality of the person is very interesting, right? So you and I can
be nice to each other right now. If suddenly that you know, all of the everything went off and we
were going to be here till midnight, you and I might see a different side to each other, we'd be
scratchy, you know, or whatever would manifest. The world is looking at Gaza now and saying, My God,
		

			your children are
		

			Having their eyes explode in front of you. Babies are being cut out of pregnant women who are not
having any anesthetic. And you're praising God, and you're trying to be calm, and you're holding
your structure together. Do you know what's interesting? I've got a friend called the Assa from Bay
at high noon. And it's hard to say names like that, you know why? Because they, they're gone. It's
like saying Oscoda in Istanbul, oh, it no longer exists, or, you know,
		

			you know, Brooklyn, or what was Brooklyn, so I always have to, you know, we take a breath. So
anyway, but honeymoon. And he said to me, 10 days into this genocide, he said, you know, what,
sister, Lauren, I think that they want to make us into animals to prove why they have to kill us by
making a struggle for resources. That was day 10. We're now on day 150. And we are seeing, you know,
very dignified, gentle people scrambling onto surfaces, trying to get a sandwich thrown down by
their oppressor, to keep one and to keep themselves alive. But they're still not where I think the
enemy wants them. That they're still not full of, of a dirtiness and horror that makes us hate them.
		

			And that's the feeling of the Zionist image, I think. Yes. And I'm wondering, because you've been to
Palestine, in your own work, you've made some very important observations about Palestinian culture,
what you think may a candidate within the culture accounts for this kind of resolve, or
steadfastness that we're seeing, you know, what it's, it's, I can only talk about Palestinian
culture as an orientalist, because I go, and it's all very nice, but I do have an i in by the Grace
of Allah, as a Muslim. When I, when I first went to Palestine, I went as a Christian. So perhaps,
and I went as a journalist, so I had an eye in then, as someone who framed these people as bad guys,
		

			potentially bad guys, some kind of a mortise threat to my Western freedoms. That's how I went, even
though I did didn't think it was in my mind. But if you're asking me what it is, in the Palestinians
themselves, I can't speak for them. But I do have an eye in on space.
		

			And they absolutely believe with every cell in their being in the dignity of one who believes in one
God, and that their children are in Jannah, that dead are in a better place. And the only way that
they can they can reach that place is by being good and steadfast. And it is this determined
steadfastness that has really stymied and shocked a clear plan for ethnic cleansing over and over
and over again. Now, here's another proof that the Zionist do not belong there.
		

			If you go there and you feel this much less if you feel you own the land, could you destroy 750,000
Ancient olive trees? Could you absolutely decimate an area where where ancient stones and profits
are and where profits have walked? No?
		

			Really not if you believed in any way, in a love for that land? There the Zinus are alien bodies, a
viruses in a beautiful body? They're a virus because the virus kills a virus does damage and people
are going to freak out. Oh my god, you're calling. You're calling them viruses. But show me what
good they've done for the land of Palestine. All right. You we you we made it pretty clear. You
don't want the people you don't even believe that people are subhuman. You say you love the land.
Show us the nurturing of the land. A swimming pool is not nurturing the land, by the way. Yes, no,
certainly. And perhaps a drawing from your own experience as a journalist and knowing well, the
		

			power of story or framing things within a narrative. What do you think might account for this? The
sense of entitlement that we're allowed to do this? What story are they telling themselves? What is
the story that that that ties the 17 year old tick tock her you know, eating at a barbecue just
outside in two kilometres from where people are starving to death? What is the story they tell
themselves? It can only be of supremacy. It can only be we deserve this. But also there is there is
a get out here. When Zionist wake up when the Jewish fraternity who have been brainwashed for three,
four
		

			Five generations with this with this real mind control, because we have to remember that Israeli
media is very different from anywhere else in the world, you know, then that they're really not
seeing what we're seeing. And at the same time, they have in their hand the same as what we have,
they call it polywood. They tried to say this as a real. And then what happens is, you know, Zionist
filmmakers will deliberately make something false in like Lebanon, right, a fake scene of a hospital
and then go, Oh, see, it's all a lie, because that's a lie. And we can prove that's a lie. But all
of that is falling apart. Now, what is the story they tell themselves, I think it's, it's a story of
		

			supremacy, and of urgency, and of drama, and of, of panic.
		

			That that that cannot hold them together any longer. And it won't, because post traumatic stress, it
goes straight goes both ways. Kosovo's ways, you do not get to drive a tank over human beings, and
go home and have dinner in a normal way you don't. And that's a very common point and well taken
because the thought has crossed my mind many times as to how not just the leaders, but Israeli
society is able to go on just taking warm showers and eating well, when this is happening just some
kilometers away. But I'll say the Ozzie the red, the rates of domestic violence have spiked, the
rates of young depression have spiked, and the airports are full of people wanting to leave. So this
		

			is not a healthy society, you cannot export this level of bloodshed and be a normative society. So I
I've always said this, I think the breaking down is going to come from within even you know,
America, refusing to take action, or dropping a few peanut butter sandwiches along with bonds. It
was really interesting and sad this week, and disturbing to see, you know, our brothers and sisters
in Heiser saying, I'm not going to eat this, and I'm throwing it away. Because it matches, it's not
the same stamp the same logo as a bullet torn out of a child's body. So you want us to to die with
this and eat this now?
		

			I think it's a very important point. And maybe that's not been really explored enough within
mainstream media with the consequences this will have for the society that stands to quote unquote,
gain from all this. So I can cannot do this to a mass of defenseless people and expect to get away
with it. What is going on? I mean, what is the right level of outrage right now? You know, every day
we see worse and worse. And I was thinking about it in the in the, in the way of a period of a
lifespan we have in the US and now mothers who are having cesarean sections on the ground with blunt
utensils with no anesthesia, and the baby is torn from them. And the mother dies and bleeds out. And
		

			that baby is already alone, traumatized and damaged by the non state of Israel, and by every one of
those people who are culpable, right the way through all of life. All of the children that we're
seeing, you know, six or what is it? How many a day? You can't take in the fingers? Is it six or 60
losing limbs every day? It's too much to take in for the human heart. Right to and this is very
disturbing. And I think we need to talk about this more in the media. Why our soldiers sent in to
destroy graveyards, 16 graveyards in Gaza, which is a small place but a lot of people have been
totally or partially destroyed. And not just bulldoze not just skeletons being scattered of the dead
		

			bodies being dug up and taken away.
		

			What is that? And then bodies of people who have been murdered, dragged away deliberately by by ioof
soldiers, and having their retinas taken, having been returned without livers without kidneys that
you know, in plastic bags in bin liners. What is really going on? That it's like, you know,
honestly, it's like * has just regurgitated a load of demons now now, how do we stay sane? And
how do we do anything within this? Well, I have my face. Thanks, Peter. God will lie. You know
what's interesting is Biden because he has some late stage dementia very clearly. Sometimes lets
things slip out in the way that Trump does. But Trump does it deliberately a manipulative like, Hey,
		

			I've seen the CIA today. Biden's just like oh, you know, we have to stop this before Ramadan because
		

			Is this going to look bad? Oh my god. Yes, it's going to look bad. Guess what? It looks bad now,
it's a genocide you maniac. It's not a PR opportunity. These people are a broken and fractured and
psychopaths. We have psychopathic leaders. And what are we going to do about it? Well, it's a great
point, because sometimes this has made me question the causes that they do, on the surface, at least
say that they support for example, I mean, because Women's Day is tomorrow, the West, very often,
Washington leaders will very often say that we stand for women's rights. But now because they're
complicit and not even more than complicit, but they're willing participants within this genocide.
		

			It's really made me question their sincerity, if it's there at all, even for the causes that they
say that hang on a second, because women's rights and women's day and National Day, women's annual
day, it's all led by white women who want to rescue Arab women from Arab men and black women from
black men. Let's make this very, very clear. This is a colored this is a supremacist version of the
sisterhood because I was in the sisterhood, I put this on, we want everyone to be free or not while
you're wearing that.
		

			And that and these left to leftist women will turn on you and tear you shred your reputation. If you
just choose to be dignified in this way, I'm not in their way. So I'm not that interested in these
global women's days. Because there is a section of that female community I'm sorry to say, who will
be looking and go, well, at least the next generation will have freedom.
		

			They won't have to marry like the the women did before and inventing this whole image about society
they know nothing about do you feel the hurt? Islamophobia or Palestinian this selflessness of
Palestinian culture.
		

			The resistance to it on the part of the West has anything to do with a threatening the way that
Westerners are expected to be in the world by power, because if you become other oriented and you
become involved in a community, it sort of undermines what you're supposed to do as a consumer. And,
you know, eventually that kind of erodes, that is part of it. I'm gonna say that and I'm going to
add something to it. Don't let me forget. Tarik Ramadan, the scholar, he said, over a decade ago, he
said, I don't believe it is Islamophobia that's driving Western policy and in Iraq and Afghanistan.
He said, they don't care what Gods you follow, but they do care that you buy their stuff. And if you
		

			are a believer, you might need one, two pairs of shoes and you give the rest of your money away.
Right, you may have a food but you'll share it with your neighbor, you are not going to maintain the
way that they want to live. Now I want to just roll back on something because I think we're at risk
here of making the Palestinians into some hippy like oh, wow, you know, freedom and love. Let's just
be good people, man. No, these are there is a there are resistance there. And I have had the honor
of meeting with them as a journalist,
		

			Al Aqsa martyrs brigades. I've interviewed
		

			various Hamas officials, I have even been into the homes of Islamic Jihad in Gaza. And I have never,
ever felt at risk.
		

			Before Islam, as a journalist related to a British, you know, a politician, I was never ever at
risk. They told me we will protect you as long as
		

			anybody who comes to our land they said, Who stands with our people is under our protection. They're
not hippies. This is a strong people with a right to their land, a right to dignity, a right a right
to their own way of life and their own freedoms. And they have a right to fight for that. Let's be
very clear. I think it's an apt comparison. For the point that you're making that they're not quote
unquote hippies because there's definitely nothing self indulge me. Sometimes people use the hippie
metaphor to kind of say that this person or this group of people is being self indulgent. But
there's new ageism is self indulgent. And that's kind of our lynchpin for anything spiritual at the
		

			moment. And that's where we're kind of going wrong because spirituality isn't this makes me feel
better about myself. There's actually no spirituality or it's very politically conscious. There's a
resistance here there's a putting your life on the line, which is not self indulgent at all. I mean,
you know, it's called Allah
		

			except flood. And we are now coming up to, I should probably shouldn't timeframe it, but we're about
to enter the holy month of Ramadan. And the world is watching as people will be fasting in solvation
period, and that they will be either attacked or denied in their holy space. Where is your morality?
America, Britain and France? Please don't talk to us don't export any more of your democracy. Thank
you very much. And the United Nations. Wow. And the Security Council. Just
		

			not interested? Yes. Yes. I think it's going to just because everything's so out in the open right
now, I think it's going to somehow undermine people's confidence in the so called moral foundations
of the West and what they mean when they talk about democracy. And I'm wondering whether you see,
		

			because there is now a lot more familiarization weigh on, especially among young people with Islam
as they become involved in their support for Palestine, whether that represents
		

			a possible turning point in Western society, morally or otherwise, like, will there be some kind of
transformation that we've not seen before that might make people better people? Only Allah knows
that that's a really big question. Maybe in 200 or 500 years, this bit of it will become clearer.
But I think what there is a hunger and a thirst for is an explanation beyond our own mortality, for
how to be a good person. Nobody wakes up in the morning and says, I want to be a sadist today. It
doesn't happen. They justify it, right? That story that designers tell themselves, but we as we as
Westerners, me before Islam, I was telling myself, I gotta get from life, whatever I can get. And
		

			I'm a good person, but I hadn't visited anybody who was sick. I hadn't really given my time to the
poor very much. I hadn't looked after my own mother, what qualifies us what quantifies goodness? And
once we start down that looking at an ethical framework, by the Grace of Allah, you will come to
Islam? Yes, this is a fascinating point, you know, because I think that is one of the I think you
kind of alluded to it here. The problems with the West is that things have to
		

			somehow
		

			benefit me. This hard work, even if I'm engaged in very hard work, strenuous work, it has to pay off
for me, the idea that we have ABA, it's like almost a dirty word that we have obligations or duties
to others. It's almost become like taboo now. But hasn't that been done deliberately? I don't know
by I'm not gonna get cast any theories here. But you're right, there is this feeling on all of our
social channels? You know, don't ask me to change. Don't ask me to do anything. Who were you to put
me on the pressure, I should be free to be me. What is that if everybody's free to be themselves,
we're just bumping about in the same space of goo. And, and it's, it is a strange pointlessness.
		

			It's a very strange pointlessness, because being being a part of society takes work. Certainly, in
and I think that's the irony, too, because, presumably, the goal of like doing your thing, whatever
you want to call it, just being you is to find fulfillment. But so much of this kind of way of being
in the world leaves people, I think, feeling unsatisfied. And this is something that that if you
were if you and I were to get into Gaza, and go to Rafa next week, in sha Allah,
		

			we would be given food by people with no food, and they're not getting anything from us.
		

			And we will be very aware of that we are low status human beings, and that they are winning. As I
mentioned to Dr. Gilbert, I, I feel just seen this from a distance as a Westerner, I'm forced to
interrogate everything. There's many things that can do it, of course, and the Palestinian people
have absolutely no obligation to do this is not like their duty. But
		

			I feel like it's causing me to interrogate myself.
		

			Things that I felt were important or that I need to do, how much is that really wrapped up in
		

			Uh, or tied into self interest? You know, it's really caused me to think this because that's how
you're sort of raised in the West. Who do I care about who Matthew matter, not not only who matters
to me, who do I matter to? And and one of the things that I noticed in myself before I went to
Palestine and met these incredible people of faiths, and determination, and strong culture was,
nobody asked me, nobody would call me and say, Can you do this for me? I was not anybody's go to
person. I was the fun person, the drinkie person, the flashy person. All right, but no one's gonna
get on the call, and then call Lauren and say, Can you pick me up from the airport? In that way,
		

			we're all pointless. If we're not connected to other human beings, as a point person, to help them
what really is the point in us, and there's a young girl now she's 18, she got a scholarship to
Istanbul, a university here 10 days before the genocide started. And she came up to me when I gave a
talk. And she said, I'm from Gaza. And she started to cry. And I sat down with a shiny at Neville
Neville of Gaza. And somebody came over and said, but at least you're not there. You must be happy
about that. And she looked at them, like, you don't understand this at all. And she whispered in my
ear. No, I'm asking God, why I'm not deserving of being there, under the bombs. And I almost feel
		

			that what Israel is doing is like Western ism writ large, you know, like, we will destroy everything
and let others bear the costs. You know, we see this, you know, even at the more local level, in
cities, where there's gentrification people are displaced. And you're always fleeing from something
in capitalism. And in this version of modernity, you're always running to the next best thing. And
you can leave a trail of devastation behind you. But you've got to get to that it's to do with not
having satisfaction. And that is something else. The most said word in the Huzar is Alhamdulillah.
It freaked me out on my previous visits when I was there before I before I became Muslim. What's
		

			this praise and love God, and you've got nothing but but but, you know, a shed and Rafa to live in
how are you praising and why the hamdulillah because we're eating today, or Hamdulillah. I have one
child who might be dead, but a Hamdulillah. And then I realized, wow, I lived in a state of
permanent ingratitude. And this is something else that the modern psychologists got very wrong,
Paul, is this idea of do a gratitude journal, you're okay. Be grateful. Gratitude has two parts, the
one expressing the gratitude and the one to whom you're grateful. So if you move this table, because
it's in my way, I didn't say Oh, thank you table or I'm grateful to the universe. I thank you for
		

			moving it out my way to two way process. Who were you grateful to? If you don't know that you can't
even start on the process of gratitude