Lauren Booth – Pain and hope of liberation and the bond between Syria and Palestine I Interview with brave activist
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AI: Summary ©
The speakers discuss the struggles faced by Sy obsessed people in Syria during the war and the lack of control and control, including attacks on buildings and Israeli bombings. They express concern over the dangerous attacks and the potential for conflict with the Turkish regime. The speakers also discuss the struggles faced by the Iranian Kurds and the unrest surrounding the arrival of Islam. They express hope for relief and encourage people to take action, including a charity called Ikra for the children.
AI: Summary ©
As-salamu alaykum, I just got back from
Syria and a trip that the horrors of
which I will never forget.
In fact the only reason that I'm able
to sleep at night and to move forward
is because of our beautiful faith of Islam
subhanallah.
For the first time we were able to
travel all the way from the south of
the country Damascus to the border of Turkey
along with a stream of Syrian people who
have not seen their country in 14 years
subhanallah.
In this video I am speaking to Raquel,
a friend who I've known for several years,
originally from London.
She and her family are aid workers who
have started great projects and they've survived all
of this hardship plus an earthquake.
I spoke to her about what it was
like in the new free Syria, what it
had been like and the question that many
of you have been commenting on.
Wasn't Assad one of the axis of resistance
for the Palestinians?
Wasn't he therefore useful to the Palestinian cause
of justice?
After this is a quick appeal which I'm
sure you'll want to be a part of.
I would never recommend a project that I
hadn't seen with my own eyes and ICRA
is doing great work.
I've just returned from seeing their projects in
Syria and they are changing lives.
40% of Syria is in ruins.
Half the country are displaced subhanallah and ICRA
have been on the ground since day one
and now they have projects in every major
city from Damascus in the south to Azaz
in the north.
You're probably asking yourself will my donation change
lives?
I know it will.
I love what they do and I encourage
you to let all your friends and family
know that this is a charity you can
support together.
Join us to help rebuild lives and Syrian
communities.
Assalamu alaikum.
Welcome to a podcast here in Syria in
a camp in the north Azaz run by
ICRA and my guest is my friend mentor
in activism Raquel Hayden Best who's been here
for 12 years and you know what today
I want you to listen to all of
this inshallah you're going to want to listen
to all of this because we're going to
be unpicking the politics and the people around
the changes in Syria from someone who's lived
through it and a real first-person account
because I don't know about you but I've
been getting seriously confused what is our role
as the ummah in this?
How do we make sense of the geopolitics?
Do we even need to as an ummah?
Put geopolitics above human beings?
These are some of the questions we're going
to be going through today.
Inshallah.
Assalamu alaikum.
Waalaikumsalam.
Alhamdulillah.
We've got a bit of sunshine today.
Yeah it's so nice.
I'm enjoying it just sitting here in the
sun.
This for a busy person right is a
bit of a break.
Yeah no it is.
Just to get that you know that break
feel the sun you know on me is
nice.
MashaAllah.
Alhamdulillah.
Please how would you introduce yourself?
How would you describe your time here and
what you've been doing and why you came?
Okay so my name is Raquel Hayden-Burst
as Lauren gave me a really nice introduction.
Alhamdulillah.
We left the UK in 2012 on a
journey here to Syria not knowing what that
journey would unfold for us but Alhamdulillah 12
years later we're still here.
Alhamdulillah Allah has made it possible for us
to start many projects to help the Syrian
people and obviously as well as our aid
work we are activists.
We came here because we wanted to help
stop the oppression on the Syrian people and
speak up against oppression and what was going
on here on the ground in Syria because
we felt that we had it was an
amanah for us to get that voice out
there to the Western world in English to
let people know exactly what has happened and
what is happening in Syria.
So just to clarify something when you say
we came yeah did you come to Syria
with?
So I came with my husband so we
made the journey we came on an aid
convoy so we came bringing vehicles, ambulances, lots
of aid blankets to the Syrian people and
then we started off our projects really small
so the first project we did was we
used to teach English in one of the
refugee camps so I would teach to sisters
he would teach to brothers and then we
made a Tannour type ovens for bread and
then we had the idea of the school
and then the project just grew and grew
and grew.
Alhamdulillah.
One of the things that's really struck me
Raquel driving for the first time from Damascus
all the way north with this open area
now that people can move around and see
for themselves even the Syrians going back to
their homes you just went to Damascus for
the first time in 12 years what shocked
you what amazed you?
This is like one of the things that
a lot of Syrians said to me was
that what you've seen of Syria you haven't
seen anything so we had just been obviously
in Idlib we lived in a small village
called Asma then we've moved here to Azad
so these villages, well they're literally like little
towns now but they were small little villages
that have become you know bigger towns because
most people have moved from the areas that
are being bombed to these areas so obviously
after the areas got liberated and were open
and we went and visited the rest of
Syria you know subhanAllah one thing obviously is
how beautiful Syria is and how really what
we've seen in these areas is you know
a tiny tiny bit of the beauty of
Syria obviously you have the beauty and the
Islamic history side of it but you have
the destruction I didn't think that when I
would go to Homs for example I would
see that scale of destruction and buildings literally
bombed out you know we went past one
building bombed out and there was one uncle
sitting on his rocking chair in his bombed
out home subhanAllah so that obviously opportunity that
was us not being from the land from
Syria having that reaction so we couldn't imagine
that feeling of the Syrians from those areas
going back to their home and seeing the
destruction and seeing how it's changed you know
over the past 12 years you know it's
heartbreaking but at the same time obviously it
was a very and it still is a
very very historical and happy moment for many
many people here We'll go back in a
second about what we didn't know but take
us now through those moments and hours yeah
when the news started to come through oh
there is a resistance you said to me
last night you said something really telling you
said you were almost hitting hopelessness this is
it for the rest of our lives describe
that yeah yeah so before about a week
before it had all happened I was just
like because we kind of what we say
like an Arabic you say Mahasa so you
can't we're kind of like we was kind
of locked off from the whole world so
in this area that we're in borders were
impossible to get out of them it was
always difficult bringing people in you know we
were just in these little areas and we
were not able to go to just say
Aleppo or go to Homs or Hama so
I was feeling you know is this what
it's gonna be like for the rest of
my life are we going to be stuck
in this place or is there going to
be an end to this are the people
going to see an end you know to
the suffering that they've been going through and
then within with one day that it was
announced that the battle had started and then
it was just literally updates and all the
groups a village after village then city then
town was just being taken up one after
the other and I tell you no one
slept that whole week no one slept literally
like obviously the people in the camps were
all from the areas inside of Syria so
when just say their village was taken their
village was liberated there would be like celebrations
everywhere gunshots people in their cars obviously here
they celebrate gunshots and shooting and stuff so
there were people going out on the street
and so the time leading up to the
liberation and the fall of Bashar al-Assad
it was very intense it was very intense
and it felt like it was like no
one kind of believed it it was like
is this really happening like they got to
Hama they really get to Hama they got
to Aleppo city do they really get to
Aleppo city and then can we really actually
see Aleppo city now because back in the
day when we first came the kid promised
to take me to Aleppo city but I
never got to go so he got to
see the city before and he said look
you're gonna go I'm gonna take you and
then obviously the siege happened and then it
fell and I never got to see the
city so even just to go and see
the city after 13 years it was it
was an amazing moments of Panama amazing moment
so so there's so so the opening comes
yeah and then you you travel down and
of course there's this immediate mitigation of joy
yeah by Israel bombing and invading going through
the Golden Heights Heights invading parts of Syria
were you where were you were you in
Damascus yeah so yeah so literally we made
the journey to Damascus the first day of
its liberation and we made the journey on
the same day so literally the news came
at Fajr that Bashar al-Assad had fallen
we were like that's it we're going so
we've got in the car we went and
by the time we reached Damascus it was
Maghreb so the whole skyline of Damascus was
just smoke so there had been Israeli bombings
there were burning of buildings containing any type
of evidence anything from the Assad regime they
were burning those buildings down and there were
also Israeli bombings happening at the same time
our first night in Damascus there was like
a whole hour of constant bombing bombing bombing
how do that it's it's it's an inane
question but I want you to describe how
it feels to have heard those bombings again
yeah were you afraid or were you like
oh it's just bombing does it ever reach
that yeah for me I think it's all
because my kids didn't go with me so
I was like had I made the right
decision to go as soon as I did
obviously as a mom you know you have
to make those decisions and hum that produce
the heart about at the same time I
don't think you can ever get used to
the bombs like we've been close to some
like some real big bombs but that night
I really felt like subhanAllah like can the
Syrian people not have you know a bit
of rest a bit of relief that hundred
in now the main aim that the people
wanted the main thing that everyone worked for
and sacrificed their lives for the fall of
Bashar al-Assad happened and still a few
hours after that they were still getting bombed
you know still being bombed it wasn't just
in Damascus also there was a bomb in
Tartus which some people actually say was a
nuclear bomb the way that it was so
huge that it caused an earthquake there was
a there was a tremor from from that
bomb so in my mind I was thinking
you know subhanAllah other people literally no no
rest you know subhanAllah and Israel obviously you
know there were talks saying that Bashar al
-Assad before he had left he told Israel
where the strategical points were and where the
military stuff was so they were targeting those
areas but literally it was like you've got
the good news in the morning come evening
it was it was a good week or
so that Israel was was in Damascus subhanAllah
so you can never get used to the
bombings and yeah I did have a sense
of fear definitely subhanAllah and Israel is that
part of this great confusion yeah as ever
yeah in the affairs of the Muslims yeah
about the Palestinian cries for justice and solidarity
and I know that there's been a lot
of confusion because I've been reading it too
and I almost got sucked into it that
the idea of geopolitics means that a cause
is more important than a people see what
I mean I just want to hear from
you on the ground in Syria the attitude
first of all towards people who are saying
Bashar al-Assad was useful to the Palestinian
cause yeah this is the thing that it
was a whole new whole new conversation discussion
that happened when the fall when the fall
of Bashar al-Assad happened I didn't expect
to be seeing these comments and I thought
that most of the people would understand and
be with us and be you know have
the same kind of understanding so when we
even have people on following us pro-Palestinian
supporters saying you guys you know Bashar al
-Assad had helped the Palestinian people and he
tell me in what in what way was
Bashar al-Assad helping the Palestinian people when
Palestinians fighters and Palestinians were taken out of
his prisons so after obviously the prisons were
liberated and the families were released there were
actually Palestinian Hamas fighters inside the prisons of
the Syrian regime you know so this is
where you see what we see that the
reason why Bashar al-Assad was getting involved
in the situation of Palestine was for his
own personal benefits but not for the benefit
of the Palestinian people and one message that
you know we try to get out to
people is that Bashar al-Assad was as
much as an oppressor and a war criminal
as Netanyahu so how can you how can
you support any one of them you know
it's impossible for us as Muslims and as
us as humanitarians and humans you know to
support anyone that had done that much oppression
and that much killing to you know you
know humankind and that's where obviously we try
to explain that to a lot of people
and I think that over time with videos
coming out from Palestine Palestinians celebrating with the
Syrians are saying they're happy for the for
their Syrian brothers and sisters people kind of
realize look even the Palestinians are happy for
Syria because at the end of the day
their struggle has been won and their struggle
they feel what the Syrians have felt their
feet they're still feeling it till this day
you know and I can say inshallah you
know alhamdulillah we've got to Masjid Umayyad you
know inshallah we pray that inshallah it's Al
-Aqsa next I mean I mean and in
fact that's not the first time I've heard
that dua here by the way brothers and
sisters the majority of people that you speak
to and the ones that don't mention this
I've forgotten to mention it at that particular
moment say Umayyad Masjid, Khalid bin Waleed Masjid,
tomorrow Al-Aqsa it's on the lips and
it's not impossible people you know like how
I of subhanallah was losing that hope and
how Allah changed the situation in a few
days you know Allah liberated the whole of
Syria in a few days you know subhan
even now as Palestine is going through the
worst that we could imagine you know it's
not impossible that Allah can change the situation
of the Palestinians and give victory for us
inshallah you know just like how he gave
victory here there's a weird thing about this
idea of clever people creating geopolitical narratives and
almost like Astaghfirullah this this Nafsi ego of
being a God who can see over what
everybody Putin's here and Biden's there and if
you move this and it's all gonna be
fine and a few hundred thousand dead never
mind it'll it'll work out in the end
when did we become a people I'm talking
to the Muslims here because you know if
you're not Muslim you I don't know do
you know you I don't know we all
have an ability to be humane yeah but
we don't want us as an ummah to
write off a hundred thousand believers in Allah
to Allah as dust for a cause the
mate yeah you know it reminds you of
the hadith about how valuable the blood of
one Muslim is and then you think about
the hundreds of thousands that have lost their
lives in Syria alone you know subhanAllah so
this is the thing that we know when
we hear that hadith about how valuable the
death the blood of one Muslim is and
how we should feel the pain of our
ummah are we really feeling that pain you
know are we really sincerely you know in
unity and feeling that for our brothers and
sisters because we don't want it to be
just okay Palestine is big in the news
let's help Palestinians Syria is big in the
news let's help Syria no as Muslims we
need to help our ummah you know whether
you are high in Iman or low in
Iman this is a duty upon us and
this is the thing you know a lot
of these Western propaganda tries to divide the
Muslims and even at the beginning of the
liberation where you had the comments of people
saying oh you know because you're against Bashar
al-Assad that means you're with Israel and
I was like how in the world does
that how does that make how does that
make us now with Israel because we're against
Bashar al-Assad yeah you know but then
it was like okay people had their own
concoctions going on in their in their in
their in their minds because of what they
were reading and what they were seeing and
all it done was create division between the
ummah and division between the main cause you
know which was bringing that that freedom and
that victory for the Muslims you know I
wonder how the Palestinians feel when that were
about Yarmouk camp yeah remind us about Yarmouk
okay so for people who are you're sitting
there and I know you have love for
Palestine and you know I know that you
are most likely feeling my god what these
people have been through you know they've been
forced into refugee status for 75 years plus
Yarmouk yeah so did you get to go
to Yarmouk I did you went to Yarmouk
but I don't want to say I want
you to say so I haven't actually been
yet right then I'll say it but yeah
yeah yeah but obviously I've heard stories yeah
my god when I what it is like
what they're doing to Gaza it was Gaza
before Gaza Yarmouk you have to understand this
absolute cataclysm of bombs and snipers and emptying
of the area and starvation people eating grass
people eating cats okay people starving people freezing
that famous awful picture of you know half
a million Palestinians going for across the bread
bread being delivered by by aid workers Palestinians
being tortured by Oh Bashar al-Assad so
we care about Palestinians there but not there
we're for a cause that that negates humanity
as long as there's a principle you know
what is the principle what is the principle
so far yeah that's that you know like
what I said so far now you know
it's a it's a on my thing it's
not about okay a Syrian or a Palestinian
you know at the end of the day
so far now this is all be like
the sham you know so it's all one
but we cannot be okay because of he
was the the head of Syria we stick
with Syrians or we only want this victory
for Syrians no you know the struggle is
for for the whole for the whole of
my everyone that is suffering everyone that is
under oppression and like the Palestinians they have
been through so much even under the ruling
of Bashar al-Assad they were not helped
they were still put under much oppression and
so upon that obvious I think many people
probably have seen a lot of videos that
came out of your morgue of children that
were really really malnourished the same as water
the same as you know so many areas
that were besieged here in Syria and literally
left to eat the grass animal feed you
know subhanallah so this is the thing you
know so upon that it was a war
war against Islam and this is still happening
right now you know in what's happening right
now in the world you know because inshallah
Islam will be victorious and you know that's
what the aim is and you know they
the West you try to put to put
their agendas and try and make it look
like a bad thing but we know that
Islam will bring good and the Islam that
they portray is not the Islam that we
believe in so when we talk I mean
if you're not Muslim and you're watching this
listen this is a stain on humanity you
know and if your heart hurts that like
our hearts hurt that's because we have a
fitra a natural propensity to feeling for one
another and to having regret and shame good
things to a degree that it doesn't debilitate
us so let your heart be your guide
here and when someone like Bashar al-Assad
is supported and accepted by the mainstream politics
around the world because he was he went
to the banquets and the dinners and he
met the Queen of England and he was
you know around those wealthy people he was
not enough of a pariah because nothing was
done then it hurts all of us I
think it hurts the human body on this
planet it hurts all of us and him
going we should breathe a bit we must
breathe a bit easier alhamdulillah we say all
thanks and praise to Allah so in the
first few days yeah being an activist instead
of celebrating and going around and you know
handle a handing out sweets you and your
husband went straight to hospitals yeah in it
down in Damascus yeah tell us what you
were looking at looking for what you saw
so the first trips that we made to
Damascus you know obviously when you hear Damascus
is free you think you know I want
to go pray in the Umayyad and it's
not the first trip that we made we
didn't even get to pray our Salah in
the Umayyad Masjid because we were just you
know subhanAllah the happiness of the liberation you
could see that but then you'd see people
in Damascus looking really sad and depressed and
we asked a few people like why are
you sad you know what is it that
you're feeling and one sister said to us
I tried to go and find my brother
and I couldn't find him so obviously the
reality of the situation was that it was
still such a sad time for so many
people so the first few days we were
in Sayyidinaya we went to Sayyidinaya prison there
were literally miles and miles of cars just
waiting to try and get into the prison
trying to find any type of any clue
that their relative was either in the prison
still in the prison had been released you
know one of the things that obviously I
wish that there was I wish that there
was more of a system in place because
there were a lot of prisoners that were
just let out to go and then they
were missing and obviously they've come out of
prison they're not in their right minds they've
literally forgotten everything you know so who was
supposed to be helping those people try it
you know try and get back to their
family so obviously we spent some time in
the prison and talk to us a little
bit about the feeling and yeah it was
really it was really horrible you know to
put it to put it like that and
we went to one of the hospitals where
the body bags were where the bodies were
and subhanAllah the hospital in itself felt like
a prison the hospital the smell was just
death it was dark it was dingy families
were just running around crying literally holding up
their phones to us asking like have you
seen this person like this is my husband
is my brother have you seen him so
we walked through the hospital and then we
got to this room and where there were
black body bags and subhanAllah there was probably
about nine bodies in this room and at
the same time whilst we were in there
and loads like just tens and tens of
people coming in to just have a look
and see if that was there you could
see the faces but the bodies you could
see the torture on the bodies and obviously
the smell obviously we don't know how long
those bodies had been in that room alone
there was nine but there were many different
other rooms where there were there are more
bodies and more bodies were being found in
that period so in one hospital more bodies
and one thing that really made me like
kind of like a bit shocked was in
that hospital we tried to speak to the
nurses just to ask them about how the
situation is for them what it was like
whilst you know before the liberation and the
fear that they had they didn't even want
to speak to us they said that you
know just be careful because they're watching you
because back when Bashar al-Assad was in
power he would have spies on every single
corner of the road spies in every everywhere
every supermarket cafe even in the hospitals so
they even still had that fear in them
not to speak to us or say anything
or give us any information although we're trying
to help but they still had that fear
that they didn't even want to give us
their names you know give us any bit
of information and I think we need to
clarify something well said Naya prison people are
hoping to find hundreds of thousands of missing
people because it's vast and people were crammed
in and their brothers and sisters and aunties
and uncles they all were missing but when
you went there on these days only a
few hundred emerged yeah so everyone's going okay
this is the biggest prison we know there
are other hidden prisons but where are they
where are they yeah and then the mass
graves start coming to to site interview and
I stood on one in Al-Khatefa yeah
did you go to I didn't go to
Al-Khatefa I didn't go because that way
basically Tokia found that on his way back
from the second time he was in Damascus
so one brother stopped them on the road
and said guys go this way yeah there's
a mass grave over there so he filmed
there and one of the things that subhanallah
has made me really think and feel and
think about is those mass graves there were
actually civilians that were actually literally forced to
wash the bodies and you know the bodies
that were whole and put and to bury
them if they had said no or if
they had said anything they would literally have
the same fate so in that situation and
people knowing knowing that those mass graves were
there and living next to them you know
imagine the fear that these people were living
under subhanallah and then obviously with the prisons
you know a few days later after the
prisons were liberated and there was a kind
of like an app so you put the
name of your your family member inside it
and it would give you their status whether
they're alive or they're dead and subhanallah many
people that lost their family members from like
2013 literally found out that that same year
or even like the year later 2014 that
they had passed away but from that time
2013 from that time all the way till
2023 2024 they had been paying thousands and
thousands of dollars to get a visit to
get any news on their family members you
know and I just want to to remind
ourselves that the actual whole bodies were in
the minority yeah what what I saw in
Pataifa when I went yeah were bin liners
plastic bags industrial plastic bags of parts of
pieces some of them small bones some of
them and and it was it was like
a field like this right yeah feel like
this and you're and when I found out
that I'd been walking on 100,000 human
remains not bodies yeah that gives you just
a tiny sense of the scale of what
so what what's your what's your work that
you do and how do you see people
moving through this well you know subhanallah obviously
we've got many projects here we're building the
super village and at the beginning of the
liberation it was like you know what the
people that have homes and let them go
back to their homes now let's host how
the people from Damascus and the other areas
but I'm glad all the areas are now
free but the sad reality is is that
there are still millions of tents still millions
of refugees living in tents although Syria is
free it doesn't mean that every single family
has a home to go back to because
of the vast majority the vast amount of
destruction and literal towns areas are literally to
the ground and the sad thing is is
that as you know the regime were bombing
areas they were literally stealing anything from the
houses of these families so you know at
the same time whilst we are celebrating and
a lot of people are celebrating the victory
there are still people right now you know
we've had a week long of heavy heavy
rain they're still suffering in their tents you
know we really hope that they will feel
the real relief and the real victory of
this liberation by getting out of tents inshallah
and going into into homes and having that
honorable life and living you know a life
that they have linked we making dua for
the sad thing is obviously when you think
about those that have lost their lives along
the way due to the cold due to
sicknesses due to you know living in these
tents that are not made for this long
term living 12 years living in a tent
you know it's not something that's easy and
so inshallah we're gonna have you know inshallah
projects coming up where we're gonna inshallah be
hoping to rebuild Syria to be a part
of rebuilding Syria and I really feel that
our work starts now subhanallah you know the
main work the big work starts now inshallah
a lot of people messaged me like is
that it you're coming you're gonna leave Syria
now a couple days after the the opening
of Syria was so I guess the camps
empty now she's like no nobody's left and
you have to get to grips with this
they're not leaving but because they're getting reports
when when people have gone back there's nothing
there's not even a window pane or a
screw in light bulb or wiring they took
everything the regime and these were kickbacks for
their workers like whatever you can find go
and do this like the people those not
people those IOF invaders in Gaza they go
and and rip everything out and take it
and it's pillaging the exact term is pillaging
so the people need these supervillages they need
these new environments some of them I have
such bad memories of what went on there
they're willing to stay in as as so
to be part of the rebuilds we have
to be realistic and know what's going on
and what the people want and what the
people are definitely definitely and we want to
try and encourage people as well to go
back to their areas you know we don't
want to leave that the areas you know
empty you know we can inshallah Yanni had
home by home bring the life back to
these areas you know even after destruction you
know if the umma really works together it
can happen you know it can really happen
and you know it's upon those areas we've
seen here how humble now you can build
a block of flats you know within a
few months you know now we shall we
want to be putting that work in deeper
into Syria in these areas that have been
destroyed and allowing these homes to go back
to what you know their homes you know
the main door that you hear from the
Syrian people after all these years was may
Allah relieve this from us and take us
back to our home you know so alhamdulillah
we're at a moment now where we can
you know we can do that but obviously
we need the support from from people outside
and you know we hope for the future
that we see we don't see no more
tents I mean you know you know these
tents are inshallah that you know the end
inshallah you know tent by tent you know
get these families into homes inshallah I mean
I mean jazakum Allah for being with me
today this is one busy busy person mashallah
you can see stables back there her family
has helped build these via a fantastic charity
called Ikra it's for the kids these are
widows and orphans use this environment families who
are displaced then they no need to be
displaced anymore once we get the homes rebuilt
inshallah beautiful cities across Syria oh Allah give
freedom from the loom give bless our sham
bless our people of sham bless the people
of Gaza and the West Bank and maybe
we'll be joined to pray one day in
a free