Hamza Tzortzis – Sapient Voices #03 – Dr. Osman Latiff – New Book, Successes & Failures, Self-Amazement & Gratitude
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The host discusses the importance of writing in various topics, including divine perfection, divine love, and the process of realizing one's true message in Islam. Pr practicing daily prayer is crucial for achieving success in writing, along with the need to focus on long-term vision and learn about writing. Consistent and passionate actions are crucial for success, and the host emphasizes the importance of empathy and strong connections with Allah. The host also reminds listeners to be mindful of their actions and to use the example of hitting a rock.
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Smilla Rahmanir Rahim Al hamdu lillah wa Salatu was Salam ala Rasulillah Salam alaykum Warahmatullahi Wabarakatuh brothers and sisters and friends and welcome to Sapiens voices the sapience Institute podcast that aims to give platform to voices of wisdom and to facilitate debate and discussion in order for reason to prevail. I am delighted Alhamdulillah to have with us Dr. Usman Latif. I'm going to quickly introduce him then we're going to go straight into insha Allah. Dr. Ismail Latif is a senior researcher and instructor at Sapiens Institute. He has a BA in history and MA in Crusader studies, and he completed his PhD. And he also has engaged in postdoctoral work
concerning othering and dehumanization He has published in at Springer and bro academic publishing, publishing, he has written books for Sapiens Institute, on being human, and also divine perfection, and so much more. I think what we need to get into right now is because of the amazing writing that he has done for Sapiens Institute's to ask, Dr. How do you write? And how, and what is the process and first and foremost, samadhi conference, Allah to South Africa. So doctor, you know, I'm always fascinated, your ability to write on kind of different topics that are not really related, and become an expert in that topic, and also be able to write in that topic. So for example, obviously,
you're on being human for us. And on being human. It was part of your postdoctoral work as well. othering dehumanization. But then after you went all the way to the other side of the intellectual world, if you like, in a different landscape, and you had to do with philosophical issues, divine perfection, soteriology Hemmati theology, you know, salvation theory, the concept of sin in the summer Christianity, divine love, and then now, you're working on something else concerning how we must be as preachers of Islam as duat as those who want to go out in the world and articulate a positive positive message of Islam. Now, you're talking about psychology, you're talking about way
of being how we must relate to people in the most positive way and in a way that's in line with the prophetic tradition. How do you do that? I mean, what's the process? Smart multimo Allah masala Allah, Muhammad Ali Muhammad, I want to begin by thanking Allah subhanaw taala all blessings are due to him alone subhanaw taala all goodness comes from Him. And we begin Of course, by reminding ourselves that we are we are where really where we should be in terms of that DUA of Musa alayhis salam when he gets to Meridian. And there is a process of realization because there's an actualizing and verbalizing. So he of course sees these two, these two young girls and they can't watch the
sheep and they held back. And so we asked them what's up with you guys and they said, This is a Situ alpha is old man. And Allah says Apollo Houma that he wants the sheep for them. So therefore, there is a sense of service the duty there is fulfilling an obligation there is doing a good deed, good work, fit long pay rod. And then of course Allah says something that will illuminate then it tends towards the shade. And some of them are they say kind of represents his sense of a class and because he's he's not hanging around long enough for them to say thank you very much
for us, and then He says he'd be following So Robbie, in the Lima Anza television for whatever goodness you send to me Oh ALLAH and desperately need often all of us are for Cara all of us are poor, impoverished before Allah subhanaw taala, desperate in need of things while we can do them. And I think that that's the perspective. I think that like you mentioned, I don't see myself as a very prolific writer or anything. I don't see myself as that but I think that what we can do to help us develop some some some sense of confidence in wanting at least to write or share the message of Islam is it begins with having a sense, I think, having a sincere concern.
I began writing divine perfection and the 2020 if you remember, and I really, I really felt as if this individual needs a response because because there's such wrong information about Islam. And I think that I think that's a strong stimulus for a person if he notices something that sets her wrong about something he holds so dear, which is of course Islam itself. And then he would feel a drive at least to try to and and of course, I had so many hiccups on the way of writing that book, you know, yourself. So many hiccups so many things I got wrong and I needed to add this point there was so many edits and reviews and this and that, but that didn't I mean, it didn't upset me. In fact, it
helped me I think hamdulillah because, because I'm we're all only human, we're only human not perfect and
No book is perfect except the book of Allah subhanaw taala. And it's a reminder that when I give talks, for example, usually sometimes I might prepare a talk, like I have a cookbook today inshallah soon I prepared my notes right away over here, right. And so usually, I want to hit home a strong message, but I might sometimes do the talk and I forget the main main message I wanted to deliver to the people, what happened to you also, I'm gonna just remind myself that no speech is perfect except the speech of Allah. So I'm bound therefore to have imperfection in my speech in my preparation for it, and in my delivery of it, and that's fine because I'm decision we all as humans, but I think
that will handle if I was to say, like, what I try and do and I think it's advisory for myself and for others,
is currently I'm teaching a book by ethnological Hanbali called Al muhajir. If you say the dojo, and it's translated as journey to Allah, like, Chicago, Mesa has translated the text, but it's not called Journey to Allah. It's called Al muhajir. Visit a dojo, which means Alhaji means like the way they let the Qibla and if you say it means in traveling and a dojo is a dojo is the last portion of the night. That's the That's what the book is. So it's like the clear way in traveling to the last portion of the night. And his whole book Subhanallah, it had I known before, I would have used it a lot in my book, because the whole book is about one single Hadith. And this hadith is when the
Prophet of Allah says that none of you will enter heaven, or none of you will be saved, because of his deeds. Right. And it's not even you, it's not even mix if Allah was show me with his mercy. And then he said, in different narration said, they do what God who want to do Whoa, whoa, and then be firm, be balanced, and journey to Allah in the beginning of the day, and the end of the day, and worship Him and something, have something from the last portion of the night. And the whole book is explaining this one Hadith, in different kinds of ways and different kinds of, it's very interesting. But one thing that's emphasized that we try and practice in our course, is, what are
the practical steps we take to ensure that the beginning of the day becomes so essential and consequential that it has leaves an imprint on the remaining part of the day, so that by the end of the day, you're somewhere good, because of how you began your morning. And so aside from therefore praying, Fajr and try praying the machine everything else, but we say for example, we have like to try and practices that we wake up in the morning
and say, Look, I said you're going to brush your kids are going to wash your face anyway, but and turn that into a wudu make a will do, you know, when you couldn't want to, and now it's like you're, you're free sailing, once you've made your wudu and it's a very powerful, very powerful thing. And I'd say let's all try and practice our bow Ha, if you pray your bow ha prayer, because remember, the Doha salah, is like it's not obligatory, but is encouraged and the Prophet prayed and, and this is like the purposes for every the join in your human body. It's a sadaqa it's a charge for every joint in your body. It's a way of saying thank you to Allah for you being you, and the fact that your
limbs can move. And he also disapproved of the O YB. In the our being are the ones who are returning always back to Allah. Like, for example, look in the Quran in certain, I think certain animal
know, maybe the NBA, maybe, but it concerns the, the description of
when Allah says to, sorry, it's an early said, le maki maki surah. And Allah says, Allah, my Apolo, and be patient, what they say against you giving the references. And then he says, What could I have done that would will aid in a web and remember our seven that would, and he had power, but it was power of obedience to Allah, and he was a web. So a web is one as Roger illallah, always returning back to Allah, that Allah says we called the mountains, to remember Allah with him, and the birds above him to do the same. And Allah says all of them were aware of Allah goes on to say Allah blessed him with a child named milab, in a beautiful child, Missoula, mannerism and he also was our
everything became moving in his landscape, because he began the process of remembering Allah. That means if you begin, Allah makes them world move with you, right in remembrance of Allah. And as you I think that's a powerful thing. So how you begin your morning, that's the advice if knowledge becomes in his book is it has a big impact. And I think then then, Baraka is blessing. So for example, I try and because I'm married, I have children and I do other stuff as well. You don't get all the time to sit down for lengthy periods and simply write I mean, that's a that's a blessing. I wish inshallah I had, but it's it's small portions throughout the day. So I'll begin to write in the
morning, early in the morning, and then the afternoon, the evening, sometime late in the evening. And I try and therefore make sure that I've I've done, I've done work in the day. And so
Sometimes it's not even, it's not always easy because you have other things to do whatever traveling, but something's always better than nothing and Hamdulillah. So, and I think that consistency, even if it's small, it was beloved to Allah, the Hadith that says habla Malik will Allah and was beloved to Allah and Duomo in KL the continuous ones, even if they're small, some days, for example, I intend to write like 1000 words today, that's kind of a target I have. But I get to around four or 500. And, but it's okay, because at least I've written whatever I could in the space of the time, and like the other commitments and stuff will Hamdulillah. So I think, and I
think this sense of discipline, discipline yourself, you know, reading, I think, is really important, because the more you read, then the more kind of you learn about what should be writing about. And DUA and all these things are really helpful and the lesser. So the two main things I got from this is, you know, actually be born of this goodness to Allah subhanaw taala. And you thank him for even having the ability to do this stuff, as per the Dr. Musa alayhis salam that you refer to. And also and this sounds quite significant is make sure you get your morning, right. Yeah, it's a big thing. There's a lot of Baraka in the morning.
So you'd be praying your Fajr. And you'd be, you know, hopefully staying awake after fajr as best as possible, depending sometimes the winter and the nights. So the winter, in the summer nights, obviously there's fluctuation, but you have your morning dedicated to, to, to Allah, obviously, the whole day is dedicated to Allah, but there's something special about the morning, you're further than after fajr, you have you do have prayer. And there's benefits in that, and so on and so forth. And even as you mentioned, the Doha prayer is actually related to gratitude in itself, because it's basically like a sadaqa for for all of our limbs. And you know, and obviously, the Elena also talk
about the Doha is important for health, the benefits of the ham. So, okay, that's great. So that's the kind of spiritual aspect and I'm not using the word spiritual here, just to secularize the discussion to make a distinction, because it's all spiritual for us, isn't it? Everything is linked to Allah subhanaw taala. But when you when when you face certain intellectual obstacles, or like a writer's block, what are the kinds of strategies that you adopt? Or maybe it's just become natural to you, because not only did you do a PhD, we did postdoctoral work, maybe it's just natural, you don't know how to unpack it. Some people are like that. But, you know, could you tell us if you
could reflect on when you get writer's block, or you have research issues, you have to read this book that book and, and try to, you know, work out an argument. If, when there is an obstacle, what do you do?
Yeah, so I think I think the obvious thing is to have Savox AF patients, this is not a race, you know, and Allah doesn't burden so modeling in there, and we're only human and I think that there is
we have a false expectations on ourselves that we want to achieve so much, but then this realization about the vulnerability and fragility of all human affairs, and just like yourself, you won't live forever, nor can your body function continuously, repetitively, all the time, your eyes need rest, and your ears and everything is right and your body is right over you. And then so the important thing to realize so before it could be for example, sometimes I could be writing something and honestly, you know, I'd struggle to finish a sentence because I just couldn't think of the right word. You know, and it could take like minutes, minutes, minutes, minutes, five minutes, 10 minutes,
I mean a long time and I just put my leg up put my legs up and let's kind of just sit back on it sit back on it until I can think of something to do other times for example you know it's important not to be so soaked into your work because then you could for example not realize that there could be bigger thing that you're missing or smaller things that you're overlooking, and you simply go for a walk or go forever Park very close to where I live and just go for a walk in the park I think a big thing by the way is your your morning and evening as car I think because you can expect to the first question even attend Me or him Allah even look at him his students said that I would see able to
Tamia
right recite like a car from like, the morning to overtime sometimes. And and he would say things like, if I don't do it, I have no strength energy in the day. It's like my breakfast for the day.
So I think that never overlook your car, meaning your connection with Allah, because it's really a big sense of baraka for you. And I think that every author you mentioned has a writer's block. But it's something you have to kind of overcome with patients with subpar and and with and, and just try and see how you can move forward with it. Sometimes for example,
and this again, I think is just a reflection of Baraka I could have I could be writing something and and don't know where where this should go. And there could be a book in my library I haven't touched like into
and 15 years go by and all of a sudden, yeah, honestly, and then you know, it will kind of the corner of I will kind of look upon this book. And I'll just pick it up and and and find something that's so relevant and so useful in from that book. And I think that in when I was doing my PhD, there was a rule that we had as our students, which is that you have to follow the footnotes. And that's a rule, you follow the footnotes. And if you do that, then you realize where you know where your argument is stemming from. And that's a big thing. I think it requires discipline. So if you're reading something, look at the footnote, and then follow that footnote through to try and get as far
back as you can. And then you'll just find so many so many things, to read so many things to research, so many things to try and amend and correct and edit and take benefit from and so on and so forth. And I think that this is a endless process. You wouldn't have you wouldn't get you wouldn't have a lot to do. Yeah, no, exactly. here that's quite powerful. So you know, writer's block, do you have coffee in the morning in the evening as even Tamia said this is it his strength? In actual fact, I believe when evening Timmy had a problem with to see a problem of exegesis understanding an idea he would go into Sudan MC da. Yeah. So it's very, very powerful. So you know,
obviously linking it to Allah subhanaw taala is the most important thing. But your the strategies are quite powerful. So okay, good. So let's the writing stuff. By the way, I don't know, I feel sorry for you. Not in a bad way. But it is tough. Because writing is very, very tough. And getting and getting it right. It's easy to write. But generally speaking, but writing well, is hard. And I think Hemingway, the famous writer, he said, Yeah, writing is easy. You just go to your typewriter, and you bleed
despairing as a very hard process. Yeah, I think when I think one of the things we're, I think that you know, you have to see
kind of a purpose and usefulness in whatever you're writing. Because if you don't, you will simply not have enough steam to get you through
a PhD, for example. And because you'll end up doing over three or four years, you have to have enough. Believe in that in that idea, or that project or that theme that can take you through the three or four years of writing. Otherwise, you simply go by now you wouldn't have you this board event. And I think that's a very powerful thing. So wherever you're writing, therefore, make sure you you believe in what you're writing, you make sure you hold it dear to your heart when you're writing, and then realize that it might be that what you've written, it may not, you know, you may not see the full fruits of what you've written.
And in anytime soon, you might not I mean, in Islamic history, in fact, his testimony to that on my PhD I did, I did, I did translations of the poetry of a tsunami, a tsunami was an emotional tsunami. He was the first chef, if a key who wrote as a response to the First Crusade, it was a first person and, and his texts cutable Jihad was, so we have surviving what's called some art which are like manuscripts of public readings, even found find them in books in and so as library. And we know therefore, from a Salamis texts that he read in the grand homemade mosque in Damascus, we know who was present, how many were present, how many women who have no children, how many were women, or
women and who the scribe was, and we have, and the numbers were very small, very small numbers attended his, his gatherings for his grand text as a first response to the crusade. And it was a big text, it was gonna it was read in small portions, but all together, it wasn't that many. But the amazing thing is that 1187 But of his 18
It was his text and he had died 1105 So long time before, but his text was brought out. And his text was brought even before even MOBOTIX Kitab al Jihad text and we joined this more prominent one, but it was a tsunamis texts. So it was that grand texts that we used to motivate the Muslims to fight against Christian theme, and then we conquered Jerusalem.
I mean, this goes to show
your loss your intention will always surpass your actions. Yeah, because yeah, Allah, Allah will bring the fruits out of a text when Allah chooses to blend them when they're most needed. It could be for example, you could write something and you might think this is so needed now. But maybe Allah just wants to wants you to hold on to another time where it's even more needed. And then Allah will bring out Elena is bassinet, but your job is you simply convey and Allah deals with the you know, the, the effects of whatever you're conveying later on. That was a very profound point very compelling. That's why I advise people to actually write because of books battery never dies, you
see no, like, you know, when you do a lecture, a lecture is like not even a chapter of a book, maybe it's half a chapter, and you know, who's going to go and sit at a computer screen and
go through, like 1216 20 hours of content is not always the case. But when you have a book, you know, people are carrying books, it's with them, it's part of the lifestyle, and they're engaging with the book, and I think is important for people a lot of the art to write because books will kind of transcend the kind of social media work, in my view, because media is very context based, you're reacting to something or it's based on the particular context. Books can be like that too. But a very good book, just like in the case that you've just spoken about, just like the books that you have written on being human, divine perfection, you know, those books are timeless, because you're
dealing with timeless issues about who God is God's love, forgiveness, hematology, soteriology. And that would, you know, imagine gets translated in the future in 20 languages, you now open the door to, you know, engage with so many different people all around the world. So and we've seen this, we've seen this even look, look at Malcolm X's autobiography, right? Many brothers, they read the book today, or Malcolm X has died, what, in 64, or 6364? I think it's about what, nearly 40 years ago, right or something, no more than 40 years ago. So it's like 60 years ago, right? No.
50 or 60 years ago, and yet people are still reading his autobiography, and is changing their life. Right? I remember when I read that book, it changed my life. I could move work to finish the book. I was so fascinated.
Story. So that's just one example. There are many, many other examples. Right? So I think it's very, you know, this is my kind of input to this podcast, please, brothers. Don't underestimate writing. You mean, don't give up long term success for short term glory? Yeah. Because the final outcome is for the righteous as Allah says, so focus on the long term vision, yes, we have to do online work, we have to do videos, we have to react to these things. But in the long term, you know, where are we? Where's the chess playing for the long term? And I see a key action is actually doing more writing, right. And it's very important to do that, because look at your book, divine perfection,
there was not one book in the English speaking world by a Muslim on this topic dealing with Dr. Craig's argument dealing with, you know, the Christian attack on God's love, on Allah's love and so on and so forth. And we filled the gap. And I truly Yeah, bro. So for this, you know, when I was speaking to one of the brothers, I was like, because, you know, one of the marks or one of the MacArthur said, one of the objectives of Dawa Allah's word to be the highest. And this is an expression of
us realizing that Allah is worthy of worship. And this is sometimes forgotten, we chase the results, but we don't chase the other Mark said, what I mean, by results is Shahar does and so on and so forth. But what about the one of the greatest MCSA, the greatest objective, which is making Allah's word, the highest? And I said to one brother, even if no one reads this book, I'm going to be happy.
The very fact that we that we asked something like that the very fact that we that you wrote this book, and we're showing who Allah is, he is the one who is maximally loving and maximally forgiving, and any other theological conceptual attack has been annihilate and obliterated, we have made Allah's with the highest, right? Because that's who Allah is. He's worthy of worship worthy of extensive praise. And the very fact that we did that, you know, in that sense, me being evolved in a small way. I was like, you know, what a beautiful thing. What a beautiful thing to show Allah Subhana Allah to
say, I made your word, the highest attacking you, and I made your word the highest. And for me, that's why I wasn't even I don't even really well, I cared, but I wasn't that concerned about the readership? Because just by doing I know, they'll be bothered. So in that context, you've you've you've contacted Dr. William Lane, Craig, because the book is A is about addressing his key arguments against Islam in our last panel water Anna, which echoes his predecessors as well. You said you wrote to him recently, what did you say? No, I haven't received reply as yet from him. But I kind of, you know, I wrote a nice thing to him. Again, saying that this is a book in response to
his
his comments, arguments about Islam from his website, and from his speeches and debates. And each of my chapters, in fact deals with one of his arguments. I think the other thing is you mentioned about, see people have responded to William Lane Craig in debates. He's debated with famous Muslim scholars and speakers. But I think that that's maybe why people didn't feel the need to write something. But I think that's a mistake. Because we weren't they weren't very good. Just be honest. I mean, they weren't optimal in my view. That's why we thought there was a gap in the market. Yeah, maybe because there isn't that much.
Have a time to convey a fully assembled response to a person's in a few minutes you have in a debate format, there isn't enough time to do that. Whereas if you if you take your time, and you begin to unpack, like, for example, you know, that when I began to write the book, it wasn't just William Lane Craig making these points, it goes all the way back to, you know, this individual.
Thomas Aquinas and John of Damascus,
Damascus before it goes back to him. So, and I find and I found it. And this is a good thing about reading because when you research you uncover unpack so much more. But it wasn't just William Lane Craig, it was Samuel Zoomer. It was Billy Seco and it was him and the Masters it was Thomas it was so many other people are also misquoting the Quran, just like the later ones, but the self and the * am I doing the same thing?
When I read your essay, and it's in the book, as well as an expanded version of it in your book on
and job, Damascus, I was like what liars? Yeah, like, obviously, like they're praised in Western culture to center you don't get me wrong. We don't want people to their mistakes and take from anyone even from shaitan himself, right, because we, we let the virtues of, of efficacy from Shaytaan. Right. But the point here is, are you just thinking how could they blatantly lie like this about, you know, the Prophet sallallahu alayhi wasallam, about Islam? It was, it's terrifying.
You know, they haven't been held to account intellectually and your pieces is phenomenal. So, okay. The point I wanted to mention was now is, right, so we've talked about writing, we've talked about how you deal with obstacles, we've talked a little bit about, you know, the kind of routine that you should have in place, making dua to Allah, making dua to Allah subhanho wa taala. So to have vicar of God, all of that stuff. Now,
let I just want to focus a little bit on what you're writing at the moment for Sapiens, right. And then often will ask you a question about, you know, how do we respond to successes in the tower, and we want to connect it to gratitude and humility and istikhara so on and so forth, which is very important. But now what are you writing? To me? Right now I'm writing and handler appears on the SIFAT of the dialog subhanaw taala. Those are the attributes characteristics of the duty to Allah subhanaw taala. And I think it's a big thing, a very important thing because all of us, in fact, aspire to be do we want to be of those who call to Allah subhanaw taala yesterday, I had a
lighthouse mentoring session with a brother from Keele University studying medicine finally, and he said, I want to just give dower and so the long conversation about kind of what to do and, and different courses that we haven't listened to. But I think that's kind of a big inspiration for Muslims. But then what are the characteristics of the DUA you know, what are the things that they should have embodied in their spirit and their character in their mannerism in their approach towards those that are willing to and in fact, I'm using them for the Quran as a main as a main thing because the Quran of course gives us examples of many of the prophets of Allah, each of whom
was adapted to Allah subhanho wa taala. But there's beautiful things in the Quran. It's beautiful psychology of the of the Dawa in the Quran, there's things that they say that they don't don't say, there's things that they do, and they don't do. And I think that there's so much for us here to learn lessons from so we can for example, if you look at, for example, the importance of sub patience. You have many examples in the Quran about those who were patient in Dawa. And again, like the point you mentioned before, you could be expecting quick results that you might say, but this person didn't accept Islam, or this person didn't kind of agree with the point. But remember, when
Allah Quran says in Nicolet demon, Baba is not you who guides people that Allah guides whoever He pleases? And this was revealed concerning the prophets uncle Abu Talib, who he, of course wished he would become a Muslim because he was supportive of the Prophet and his cause, you know, during his time in Makkah, but Allah did, but he didn't find guidance. So therefore, it was a way of showing porcelain that is not you, for you to feel a sense of, you know, like, don't feel what's the word like don't feel despondent. Don't feel despondent that people didn't embrace the sun because your job is to convey that's your job, your beshear, one zero you convey the message of Islam and Allah
if Allah guides Allah is Allah, Allah choice to guide on or not, not go. But your job is to convey the message as best as you can, in clear communication, using strong arguments and showing compassion. That's a very key thing. So I could therefore take back from what I've written in on being human and use some of the stuff because the book in fact talks about human empathy and the prophets had empathy with their people, even the expression you have oh, yeah, comb. So if you think about your call me like oh my people, that shows that there is a connection between them and the people.
meaning some things that they've shared together in history, in memory, and experiences in culture and ethnicity in language include all of these things, meaning they're my people they've been, I share all these things with you. And I think that that's important because that's showing empathic connection like we have, from honorable convenience and other things as well, like Courage, you know, a discipline, again, do is is quite key as well, you know, for this case about the same kind of stuff like always asking Allah for help and assistance, isn't that. And so Hamdulillah, I'm kind of, I'm about 20, just over 20,000 words.
The thing with this book is not only it's going to be a book, but it's going to be a course on. That's right. That's right. We have a learning platform. And we have free courses on there. And it's aimed to basically ensure that people who go through the courses, they're able to share some academically and intellectually. So this sounds quite fascinating. So what's different about the book is I don't just simply focus on what are the attributes of the day, but I have a I have done a subsection that goes with everyone, which is how do you achieve how do we mean, these attributes we had this discussion
is so important that, you know, there are so many books that say, Do this, do that, though,
look for answers that. But you know, our job, and I've been focusing on this past week or so not a massive focus, but had a meeting with someone who deals with ontological training and kind of transformational learning. And what's, what I've realized is that there is a massive gap in the data in learning in our pedagogy, because we focus on informational type of learning. But we need to focus on transformational type of learning. And I've mentioned so happy when we can know all of the ayat on vicar, all of the Hadith on vicar, but we will never become a person of vicar. So there is a gap between what we know from an informational point of view, and who we become how we are
transformed, we need to try and close that gap. And this book is fantastic because you're helping people transforming into what they should become and who they are
calling people to Allah subhanaw taala. And it's so significant. You know, for example, I know what good food is, in actual fact, I could probably write a book on how to, you know, train well how to eat well how to have like 7% body fat, how to gain muscle or how to be good boxer, I could put all of that down in a book, I probably could just from experience. But do I eat well? What did I have this morning? Like? It wasn't me, I hope. So the thing is, just because I may know something in abstraction in an informational sense, doesn't mean it's going to transform me. And this is so critical in the next stage of the Dawa, especially in the western world is that we get people to
engage in transformational learning. And this is called a fear to Lana K fear. This is called the wholeness of the action. So Alana Quran when he says that Allah, Allah gave you power, so we can see K for time alone, how would you behave? Not simply what you would do, but how would you do what you do? So for example, if you take anything in life, for example, Allah, Allah says, for example, you speak good to people, to speak good to people. But it's something I used to do, for example, marriage counseling before I do, like, much less of it now. And I had one example. So this is a true story. So 111 sister came into, she was no problem, my husband. And and as always, she said, she
said to me, she said, My husband lacks empathy. That was her thing. Yeah, he likes. Yeah, that's what she said. So and then again, we had a meeting together with both of them there. And I said, Brother, this is kind of a complaint from assuming a wife. And he said, it's true, brother. It's true, brother. Yeah. He said, because my family don't have empathy. My parents never raised me like that. So I can't I can't understand what that is all about and everything. And then I had to do a separate session with him Subhan Allah, where I would, I would guide him words that he could use teach him stuffs words, and it was so simple, like, you know, words he could use that could kind of
help like things he could say and how he was how he should say them. You know, and I think that's so so key because sometimes you might say do something, but without telling the people how it is that that should be done. It's like It's like doing half the job it's like you don't have the thing which is telling you I need to do that thing without telling me how it should be done. Because it how element is so key is like for example the promise of sure salaam spread Salam. Now you could have two people and one person and I remember this from years ago, this be a run from the mosque, whenever he would give salami would always smile and give salam always like you wouldn't give a
Salam aleikum
Like, you know, it was, it was a lesson I want to go with a smile. And it makes such a difference because you think, wow, this person means like, Peace be on you, my dear brother, or embracing someone hugging someone and smiling and Salem, all these things are like furnishing features, you know, of the act of giving salam. So I think therefore focusing in something so important like Dawa and knowing how to say, or giving examples, what's there, for example, I'm a small section on, you know, you could you can meet people for the first time, so they might not, you know, they might not be
they might come to a Dell table or stool, for example, you know, but then how do you break the ice? How do you begin a conversation with them? And you might not say, for example, your call me Oh, my people, you see, you might not say like the problem. But there is something you could extrapolate from that because your call me like I mentioned, it kind of connotes all these things of similarity, like we call these human codes of recognizability. I write about it in another book. And so therefore, by saying You have called me in the context of today, you could say, for example, you know, the petrol costs arising, for example, you know, I'm facing them, you're facing them, and
we're in the same boat. Energy costs are rising, we're in the same situation. So what's what's kind of similar is very key at the same because it creates a sense of human connection between you and the person you're speaking to. And then if you then bring in the midst of a storm, it can have more of an effect in terms of people reciprocating in different ways. And so Absolutely, absolutely. That's, that's extremely fast and his input. And it's really interesting, you mentioned language, because in transformational learning, there are three key components, I forgot the third one, but two of them are the language that you use, and your behavior, your weight, your physic, your
physicality, how you engage physically in the world. And that's why language is so significant, how you frame things changes everything. Yeah, for example, if you want someone to be positive, you change their language, and you get them to change their body, the way they behave in their body structure. And when you link those two things together, and there's no third couple, and I forgot it now, but basically, that creates transformation. So that's really, really, I'm looking forward to doing a review of the book.
It was worse than your PhD vice Durval. Terrible, terrible.
But you are such a joy to work with. I've never had a complaint from you. I've never, you know people sometimes when they own they have emotional and spiritual intellectual ownership of something and then he gets poked many times. Like they get like, oh, you know what you're doing, You're frustrating me, I mean with you is the same ease and may Allah bless you and guide me the best. Okay, just
looking forward to that work. That's fantastic. And obviously the costs that will come from it as well.
So now I want to talk about successes in the dollar. So you know, Alhamdulillah Allah subhanho wa Taala has blessed us in the Dawa, globally, you know, people get shahada as people become Muslim. And you know, there's there's great efforts happening online and offline, people writing books, delivering videos, the doing
so many amazing things at different levels, or even on academic level, like I was having a, a private meeting with University of Birmingham that doing some research on science and Islam, from a kind of sociological perspective. So they asked me to be one of the interviewees.
And I and we were, we were, they were asking the stuff about evolution and Darwinism, and we're making a contrast between what's happening now and what happened 15 or 20 years ago, and Hamdulillah. With Hamdulillah, we have so many people now, like Dr. Shrimp Malik, we have a super ama doing his PhD and people engage in this area in a nuanced way. And we're not basically articulating ourselves in a way that would be described as sub optimal. It's changed, it's improving from an academic level. And even looking, when you look at organizations like aI era, you know, 50,000 shahada is from June to July or something and Hamdulillah, you know, great work all around
the world. Now. How do we respond to these successes, watch and the reason I feel this is so important, because
Whew, I'm afraid that we will not have the next generation there'll be no Baraka the next generation, if we don't respond adequately to our successes, because sometimes we attribute success just to ourselves that we have the intrinsic power, we have the sense of urgency, which is, you know, vanity or this delusional understanding that it was because of me because of us. And this is one of the key spiritual diseases of the heart. So how must we respond to the successes what should be the way of being the spiritual response of the Muslim when they receive successes in the dollar? Let me give you an example. Yeah, like, you know,
because we just had the finishing of the first tenders will hit you when of course you have my Alexa from the hedgehog who have been in during the Hudson is a big thing. It's a big effort. But there's something so interesting in the Quran about this. Allah in the Quran is so fundamental to Allah for Kobe to monastic a Confed. Could Allah because he could come back commercial as the Quran. Allah says Now when the rituals have come to an end, remember Allah
like you to remember your futsal even more than that. Now, if you think about you think how long everything in the Hajj in rituals is full of remembrance of Allah, the terroir of the site, ie the Mozilla demeanor, the art of everything is all all events of Allah, but Allah is saying now you finish your rituals. Now remember Allah like you remember. And also for example, Salah Allah says that COVID masala when Saul has come to an end, Fed could Allah remember Allah standing, sitting lying down in meetings as a whole and I just spent the whole time remembering Allah and Salah and Allah says I can remember it's obviously Allah for my remembrance. So you have been remember Allah,
Allah, but Allah is saying, Now you remember Allah? Well, for example, if Allah says, when you coming down from Ottawa into like Mozilla, Allah says, Fed could Allah remember Allah? So you think to yourself, What is Allah saying, Hello, because that means
you know, we can't. It's like, for example, if you think about the, the modes of a human existence, you know, and Allah is saying, Remember Allah standing, sitting, lying down every time you think you've remembered Allah, Allah says, remember Allah. Now you begin your essay, for example, the line from Muhammad Ali when he says, I heard it from Psalm a said, When do you when when do you start? When do you what is? He says, you might know because you, he says, When do you start count? When do you stop counting something, and it says, I started hurting.
I started counting when he starts hurting. So it's like, never think therefore that you've done something. And number one, you've exhausted everything because there's always things to do other things. Look, for example, in certain NASA in the Quran, either nust Allah who will affect when the victory and success from Allah comes and opening comes from Allah. And you see people embracing Islam in crowds, Allah says, persevere behind the Arabic Now remember, Allah is the same thing, glorify and celebrate praise of your Lord in the morning and evening hours, and ask Allah for forgiveness. So Allah is saying, therefore, you are a servant of Allah, your spiritual nourishment
energy is in his remembrance, your remembrance of him is indicative of your love of Him and your devotion to Him. So therefore don't lose sight of the UI. Say for example, if we're chasing after like, only numbers, numbers and this and that, you will forget the bigger point of I need to, you know, look, for example, look, Allah sent Musala seminar right by this length in my book, yeah, Allah sent Musa to four hours ago differ on his tava Yeah. Now Musa alayhis salam is a messenger, one of the five grimaces of Allah Subhan Allah Allah Allah Azzam
and he says to Allah, Allah, we should at least surgery, which means, you know, make wide my chest may give me that sense of confidence bearing in this and make easy for me my task and unloosen not from my tongue because he will speak with a lisp. And because I want people to understand what I'm saying. So he's asking Allah for uniform help in all of this. And Allah gave him a special stick, of course to stick with transforming to a serpent him and he had power that stick. But still he asked Allah still he asked Allah, which only was human he held on he sent me support from my family, my brother Harun because he would strengthen me with him. But look at the reasoning he provides. Look
at the recent provides, he says, Hola, que nuestra Bianca cathedra on Earth Cuca cathedra. So we could refer you much And remember You much, but it does. He says to Allah, I only need that support because you should be remembered more with me and my brother, if he remembered more with me and my brother as opposed to only me. So it's it's completely mindset change because that means that your whole purpose is to ensure Allah is remembered. And if I remember Allah more with you, rather than without you, then I should remember Allah with you rather without you, you know. And I think that's a it's an important thing for us to bear in mind. Therefore, if you make that a focus, you know,
Allah, Allah is to be remembered to Panama to Allah, that's a big thing. So I think that like you mentioned, there's a danger of our job and our job is like, you know, vanity is like, self praise. It's like self being absorbed your own selfishness and it's like Allah gives examples in the Quran, like for example, tres Juma. We're so lucky to have and she'll Kevin's a great example because you have the money when the two gardens and Allah says We gave him a tea now who Wallace did you we gave him the two gardens Allah Allah gifted them and two, but he was so happy with his gardens and all of the the fruits and the trees and the lake that would kind of the river that would kind of stream
between the two gardens. And and then because of this
He says, you know, this is my own doing this is my own doing and I felt so proud in this. And then the believer who was his friend he says to him, why didn't you you know when you had the goddess simply say Masha Allah La Quwata illa biLlah this is all from Allah, and all from Allah what is because he said it could be is what he said. He said, It could be that you lose your gardens. It could be that the heavy rain comes and the storm comes and destroys all of your trees and everything else. So why don't you simply say mashallah, and it's a big lesson for us because it could be something that you might devote your energy, effort, attention to live to, without realizing that I
need to attribute all of this that I'm doing only to Allah, Allah subhanaw taala otherwise, that wind and storm could come and demolish everything and more than that, more than than the effect it would have on my heart, on your heart, because all you present to Allah is Caliban Salim is a Musa came to Allah is Jeremy Corbyn said he came to Allah with a sound heart. And that is a heart that is free of urge of vanities, pride, shaken all these things. So remember that whatever you're doing in life you're doing because you want your heart to be in a good state, nothing else. I mean, you will take nothing to Allah, I mean, you will have nothing, no, no merchandise, no pens, nothing, nothing
will mean anything except the fact you're going to come to Allah with a heart that is in a good state. So everything you do is is having an effect on your heart one way or all the other way, you know, and this is why a decree of Allah istikhara Toba is so key because it kind of cleanses the heart. You know, from from things that might kind of this is amazing. So I'm thinking as well, from an organizational perspective, sometimes we can have a sense of collective or job. Like we think that we've developed a vision, you know, a world that receives the message of Islam, and we have a strategic focus, which is that we share Islam academically and intellectually, and we develop others
to do so the same. And we give that kind of strategy and the vision and our modus operandi, our way of being in a learning platform, we give you some kind of intrinsic power. And sometimes we can, we can move ourselves away from the true reality, which is that everything happens because of Allah subhanaw taala his erotic Qudra right now that will occur where there is no true power apart from the power of Allah subhanaw taala. And these are just gifts that Allah has given us. And this is just a manifestation of Allah's names and attributes. And Allah has favored us has given us a gift, rather than there's anything intrinsically special about my own abilities, right, because it was
really Allah. And we have to remind ourselves and I've seen this organization libro with organizations that have been I've been involved with, and you know, even in Sapiens, when we start to give intrinsic power to strategy, don't get me wrong, we have to plan we have to strategize. But if spiritually intellectually, we give it intrinsic power, we think we got it right. We've we've we've we've we've we've broken the code that we've, we've, we've decrypted the code, the divine code and how to achieve success. And then we did it and we put it into place. What happens is, there's a diminishing of Baraka, I noticed that there is a diminishing of Baraka, and it's so important for
outdoor art. And as I speak to myself, obviously, first and foremost, to deal with urgent because Ultra was one of the four major spiritual diseases of the heart where all the other spiritual pieces emanate from. You have kibble, which is arrogance, you have a job which is self amazement, you have Hassard, blameworthy jealousy and you have real ostentation, but and we need to be really, really careful with our job. And it's very powerful, what you mentioned concerning the 110th chapter of the Quran, you know, when the victory of Allah has come and the conquest and you see the people entering into the religion of Allah in multitudes, then exalt Him with praise of your Lord and ask
forgiveness of him. Indeed, he is ever Accepting of repentance. So you you hit the nail on the head, Allah subhanho wa Taala is saying that talking about the success that's coming, and our response should be humility, right? Because he wasn't, it wasn't us, it was Allah, we should respond with gratitude, because we know it was Allah, and we should praise him turned back to him and repent. So I think here we have 100 tough 10th chapter of the Quran gives us a kind of criteria or a self assessment check that every time we have successes even if we write an essay, or we post a video, our responding in this way, is increasing our humidity is increasing our gratitude is increasing our
praise of Allah. Are we turning back to him and repenting? This is extremely significant. This is x
Stream is significant. And I think everyone must have this in place and just to repeat, so we just really, you know, you know, have this in our hearts, every type of success that we have in the Dawa? Are we responding with humility? With gratitude? Are we praising Allah? Are we turning back to Allah? And are we repenting to him? And this is so significant, if we're not, we don't have these things in place, then there could be a diminishing and Baraka, just like the man with the two gardens, it could be all taken away. And I've seen this and you see on different levels, it depending depending on how, how big the job is, individually or collectively, this reminder for
ourselves and everybody that All successes, we have to respond with humility, gratitude, praising Allah, turning back to him and repenting. Isn't that right? Talking about Allah knows it's a, it's a wonderful thing you've just said and really reality is the is for all things that were and everything else as well. It's for all successes. It's for the fact that Allah allowed you eyes to see and ears to hear and the tongue to speak and limbs to move. Allah gave you a heart that breeds all of these things are indicative of Allah's divine favor upon you. And time and time. In fact, you know, in my book, I have a I have a section on on divine grace is kind of it's not it's not titled
but I have the verses because our Christian friends they oftentimes make and by the way, this is such a big thing. Yeah, it's such a big thing. It's such a big thing, because you'll find you'll find almost every Christian missionary is saying exactly the same thing. Muslims rely on their deeds we rely on on the blood sacrifice of Jesus Christ. So they might see for example, we do good deeds like five pillars praying and fasting as a gardener. They the people look at them they didn't so many good deeds, they think they're likely good deeds. And I was in I was in Ireland, they said the same thing to Dr. William. Dr. Michael, as I said, You guys always say this. I said, How can you say
this when Allah in the Quran says not once, not twice, not three times no for them, multiple times will Lola formula here Alikum warahmatu. If it was not for the grace and mercy of Allah, you will never attain purification, it will not for again, again Allah keep saying the same if it was not for Allah's grace and mercy, and allow us to open Hakeem and Allah keep saying the same thing, meaning everything is bound by the grace and the mercy of Allah subhanaw taala nothing can happen. No good can be achieved if it wasn't for that divine grace and mercy of Allah. You know, Sophia and authority he says to him Allah, He says Kula, nettement him and Allah, Allah, Allah Tangela sugar,
every blessing from Allah to the seven requires gratitude, somewhat to feed Alicia chronometer and okra, Yatta geological signing, and then having the Tofik to make sugar is another blessing that requires another Shuker. That means you can't fully thank Allah because every time you do, Allah has inspired you to thank him. So you have to be this way. I think it was him or her husband Basu that when he would be in the light prayers Gamliel he will recite the verse in the Quran. We're calling it mutton, what are technically Mr. ultimo that whatever you ask comes to you. What in total do net Matala laughter Soha in Santa Holloman kuffaar that if you try to enumerate Allah favors, you
wouldn't be able to an old man is unjust, an ungrateful and every time you would read the verse, he would remember a fever and then repeat the verse and the whole night was spent just reading the one verse of the Quran because he would have to remind himself of the blessing again and again and again and again. And Allah has blessed us with so much so much so much. Subhanallah I mean, just the fact that you're alive, you're, you're being alive, is a divine gift and blessing of Allah. Because that means in life, there's a wire of from Israeli at that time collecting this. It says that Allah asked Allah says to nada wood says to Allah yarby Brittany told me what is the Atlanta market? What is the
least of your favorites to me? And Allah says to dellwood Oh, the WHO tena first breathe, and then that would breathe in Allah. So this is a list of my favorites to you the fact that you're alive, and it's another one for Israel that says that. Allah says to that oh, the elder would wish couldn't be Hakka Shukri thank me that way I deserve to be thanked. And it says the woods as they are via my Lord, how can I thank you that way? When thanking you is a blessing from you. And Allah then says I'll earn chakra 20 Now that would you have thanked me Do I deserve to be thanked because sugar is mad if atonium It means sugar is mad if attorney and meaning to recognize a love statements of
what's what's very interesting is is about the paradigm as or sometimes the frame. How do we frame this sometimes we frame it yes, I'm gonna be grateful for my wife, my children, my car, but I like to go to the very kind of fundamental aspects of our existence because it will show if you can't be fully grateful for the fundamental aspects of your of your existence, then everything else is just a bonus right?
Okay, so you know, and this room in a gala context, you know, what does Allah say in chapter 49? Verse 17, right? Allah subhanho wa Taala talks about. He talks about that the people thought that Eman was a favor to the Prophet alayhi wa salam. And Allah says, No tell them that this is not a favor unto you that we basically gave this as a fable unto them, we have blessed them with a gift. And that's eemaan. So for mudarabah context, imagine the gift of calling other people to Iman. So if your own Iman is a gift, and you engaged in work, that you're calling others to emaan others to faith to Islam, then that's a compounded gift, right? Which is fascinating. So in terms of the
frame, when I talk about existence, like for example, I'd like to talk about maybe the heartbeat or every conscious moment of your existence. And so if I said to someone, or as I said to you, you got 10 minutes left to live, but to get another 10 years or 10 days, you have to give me all of your wealth, you know, many of you, and you would throw all your wealth at me, which shows the prices nature of every conscious moment. But we don't earn these conscious moments, we don't own them or necessarily deserve them. And we kind of create a fly, yet they're given plus freely at every conscious moment. So if someone gives you a priceless gift, you don't earn owner deserve, how should
it make you feel grateful? And that's just life. This is life every conscious moment, what I'm saying what you experience in that moment, we're seeing the conscious moment itself. So imagine now those conscious moments are now full of doubt. What I mean,
this is where I will lie. You know, I've said this publicly, and I try and say this privately as well.
I will lie to you know, I don't know, I don't know, should I say this? I don't, I believe I don't deserve anything, you know.
That's how I feel.
If you and this is not like some kind of, you know, look, I'm coming righteous, you know, I truly believe that I'm the, the Westerner amongst everybody. But this is the key is this, once you understand who Allah is, and how he manifests His names and attributes in your life and in the world in the cosmos, then there is no other way intellectually irrational spiritually, just to conclude that you don't deserve anything.
And, and yeah, it's just a phenomenal, phenomenal, phenomenal understanding. And all of this links back to who Allah is. And his his reality, you know. So
yeah, so in terms of gratitude, in terms of Life Hope, though, because this is trying to shift it now. So we know when the odds have successes. You know, we should be praising Allah, it should increase our humidity increasing our gratitude, we don't attribute intrinsically to ourselves astray by like Islam says, My success comes from, from Allah alone. And also, we respond with humility, gratitude is too far praising Allah subhanaw taala. And turning back to Allah, that's fine. But let's shift it now. Sometimes in the dour, you could just hit rock bottom. You could say, oh, I'm not worthy. You're you're engaging in this work. I don't engage with this work anymore. I'm facing
lots of struggles. How does no gratitude fit into that as a way of being as a psychology? How does gratitude take you out of that state? Or what else should they be reflecting upon it in to get themselves out of that state? Because it's good, talking about successes, but what if people hit rock bottom with the face extreme humiliation, or they've they've lost a debate or they've basically lost motivation and engagement without then yeah, it's a beautiful thing. By the way, you said beautiful things we want to repel the fact that you know, we don't feel ourselves deserving. And it's a it's a great stress state to be in. In fact, we're because the seven of Allah is simply an
perpetually faqeer. He is always in a state of complete dependence, reliance and feeling of impoverishment for Allah subhanaw taala. And I think that that's, that's something that I think that should be emphasized and stress because that's a beautiful state to be in. I think in light of your question. We know there are many examples in the Quran that can help us look example of Eunice la San, for example. He was sent to people of Nineveh and in a way and his people people have innovated they
was slow in accepting they were not liking what he's saying. And they became seven and arrogant and because of that, and by the way, when he goes off, he goes off angry, but it was a good sense of anger. It was anger for the sake of Allah he's angry with the people maybe thinking I could find a better people than these chaps over here. And it goes off and as you know, there was his he seek safety in a ship but the ship was full and they have to cut slots and he was thrown overboard and Allah says well who are more leave and he was
One that was to blame, meaning he should have remained patient with his people and patients who is not something that we can say for example, I've tried hard and they didn't listen to therefore I got to stop because what about new Allison's example in the Quran and new is some is dealing with them for centuries calling them back to Allah. And by the way New Orleans Salam, he says okay, so I call my people Lena want to have a night and day and publicly privately, but what he's doing something that he sent to them, I'm saying to them, ask Allah for forgiveness, and you'll find a lowest forgiving and if that happens you're a citizen, Monica Medina Allah will send you the rain and Allah
will give you a good children and, and wealth and everything else, meaning Allah will give you your blessings in this life and the next slide. But that was his message it was ask ask Allah to forgive your sins also forgive your sins. But the point is, is it was a long campaign you know with those people in Eunice's example.
It loses hope with them. And so therefore it goes on the ship but Allah says in the Quran latter condone be like the companion of the fish meaning like units, Allah says don't be like units. And it seems to differ although he's like an amazing paradigm is not through his action of running from his people. That's not where he serves as an example for us. What comes after is paradigmatic because now is in the belly of a whale swallows him hole is in the belly of the fish. So what happens Allah says, and by the way, beautiful thing here Yeah, because there's two different places where this is made maybe even more. One of them is when Allah says Yunus was from the messengers and it's Abacha
in Philippine machine when he goes up a car by the way is like the Arabic the Arabic it's like the runaway slave. So Allah says he's like the runaway slave you know, running away, and the world swallows him hold and, and then if another for Soleimani, cries out in the darkness is very powerful because now that feels Olamide cries out in the darkness is and the first thing they say darkness of the whale darkness of the sea darkness of the night three, like sometimes you feel in your life, layers and layers of difficulty one on top of the other one, there's this but it's also that there's also that one as well. And and it's his prayer, Allah Allah Allah and Subhana Kinnikuman Allah mean
that number one is three layers, the three depths or three parts of his prayer as well. Discord as they say, because the first is to heed and second is to Sabetha resisting far or blame, and so far, he says Lila and none deserves worship except you Oh ALLAH Subhanak all perfection belongs to you and no imperfection belongs to you are worthy of all praise. And then I was wondering wrong my own soul. And then Allah says first the debonair level when we responded to him, I will remove his grief from him. Look at Delica non GMO meaning and just like that we responded to believers that means it becomes an example for us. But the prophet says that an evil Tamia even Timmy has a shortly sada on
just this dua, just to Dwyer and the inlet of the Hadith of the Prophet says that when anyone any one of you makes dua, let him pray with the prayer of universalism because no Muslim prays with that pray except Allah answers Allah responds to him. Because that key that third part is key. Just like that we respond to believers. Now the other verse in the Quran concerning his universalism, Allah says, fellow Allah and no cannula Mr. Bean, if he was not, this is very clear if he was not of them was the behavior of those who always work for Allah, He would have remained in the belly of the whale until Yamaka, Yama until the end of time. stampedes, that means, you know, something was very
helpful for universalis salaam at a time where he needed the most his liquor, his test be, his remembrance of Allah has so far and as if he was not like that before even he will remain in the belly of the fish until the end of time. Therefore, never undermine the good you do today because it could come a time tomorrow where you would need that the most promising the Hadith he says the armor of no Allah a federal ha in E is the RF coefficient and Allah will know you in hardship. So if you're with Allah, when things are easy for you in life, you have some money in your pocket, you have some clothes, the weather is good, everything's fine. Remember Allah more remember Allah more,
pray to Allah more, do try and do more. Give her the Como because when you have a difficult day, you'd find Allah Allah is closer to you, and Allah will aid you. So I think that on the one hand, you don't want to fall victim to Shere Khan because she Aton encourages hopelessness and you could find for example, I could give now and no results. And she thought because you know what, forget it. It's a it's an end game, you're gonna have to let somebody else do it. Let him you know, and then this is shaytani because this is this is where the discouraging you from doing a good deed you should do with and by the way, you know, when the Prophet says in the Hadith, your actions won't
save you. He says for Saturday, do caribou. So as Senator Cory Booker means be moderate mean be, you know, like pace yourself in an easy way like Don't be. Don't overburden yourself.
And it was originally mentioned variation of the Hadith where it says one of them is in the head of the newsroom this deen is easy. And nobody makes it hard on himself except that it overcomes him, it overtakes him, because he's made it too excessively hard upon himself. So first, give yourself realistic targets and goals. If, for example, you're gonna say,
maybe I was doing Dawa in x, y, and Zed way, maybe I can kind of change my strategy a bit, ask Allah for aid and assistance, and do it in a way that because the Prophet says Allah loves when it's continuous, even if it's small. So if you're doing something continuous, even if it's a small thing is better than doing a big thing only once, and then that's the end of the affair. So maybe sometimes we do the wrong way, maybe we did the big thing, run out of steam burn out, and we're using this nothing's gonna happen. Whereas the one who is patiently persevering in his Dawa, even if it's slow, we'll have better results at the end of it, and then he will always feel better in
himself as well. So, this is this is consistency and is the comma. And now to summarize what you said, which is very moving and beautiful. So if when we hit rock bottom in the data, so one important thing to do is to basically just, obviously, with heartfelt supplication, this application of unis Alayhis Salam, where there is no data except you, exalted or you, indeed I have been of the wrongdoers, but also in making this dua, we must become this dua. So what's really fascinating when you were talking about this, what came to mind is when we do hit rock bottom, or we do basically, we face hurdles and obstacles and self inflicted errors, if you like, go back to Tao heat. Remember,
this is all about Allah subhanho wa taala. My Tao is basically an expression of a timeless fact that Allah is worthy of extensive praise, ultimate gratitude is worthy of all worship is the only deity worthy of worship. So go back to Allah subhanho wa Taala Remember why you're doing this in the first place? This is just an expression of why Allah is worthy of worship, which is the the truest truth if you like Yeah. And then praise Allah as a result, because remember, the doctor the doctor is, there is no data except you Exalted are you. So then praise Allah Subhana Allah to Allah, you know, you know, Subhana Allah he is, he is transcendent He is beyond anything in our imagination. Praise
Allah. Extensively praise Allah because praise as we know on Kitab Surah Al Fatiha is actually one of the keys of worship, praise and gratitude, we say Al hamdu Lillahi Rabbil Alameen all perfect praise and gratitude belong to the Lord of everything that exists. And ohm Kitab is a summary of the whole of the Quran and a summary of the whole of the Quran is Tauheed itself. So that so once you remember this about worshiping Allah remembering who Allah is, then praise Him. And then
we ask Allah for forgiveness that we have transgressed is because of our transgressions. But that should also mean that you realize what those transgressions are, because humiliation, the Dawa, or hitting rock bottom, or basically moving away from the Dallas scene or feeling disheartened. It could be as a result of some things that you have missed out in your own life. It could be thicker, it could be the fact that you have a job it could be could be a whole range of things. So the very fact you're admitting that you're the wrongdoer means that you understand that among some wrongdoing has been done. You just kind of self reflection to find out what on earth has happened. What did I
do? What was going on? And you know, I shouldn't see this solace in my life. I went through crazy humiliation in the dollar, which now I remember one shifts that to me, on the Day of Judgment, you're going to wish that this happened to you 1000 times.
It wasn't
I don't think I've ever spoken too much. But I was like, almost suicidal. Yeah.
And that created a sense of awareness that there's some stuff inside me that needs to be fixed. And it was one of the greatest gifts Allah has given me a lot of Wallahi after that, I finished my book, then I became CEO of IKEA and so many different things. And if I was in the same state before that humiliation, all of this would have been a calamity for me.
And the way and the way it happened, I'm telling you, it was it was transformative, beyond anything and you know, for the arts, and for someone like me, who's maybe, you know, arrogant and stuff. You know, no one else could deal with me apart from only Allah could teach me this year, because other human beings maybe wasn't enough. Allah had to give me that shake. And it was profound. It was absolutely profound. So it helped me recognize within myself what has been missing
Beautiful. It's your state of heart and what is this all about? This is not about you, this is about
him says that whenever you find a loss in your affairs, he says for stuck below sugar, begin to make sugar. Because Allah answers let in chicken as eternal come, if you think Allah Allah will increase you. Now Allah doesn't say what is an increase you in by the way? Yeah. But there's going to be increase in you from chakra of Allah. So more gratitude to him Subhan Allah to Allah. And it could be for example, sometimes. And it's like, you know, it's been a it's, I don't know, even we, you know, went along, have mercy on the ship humbler Sharif in who passed away just yesterday? Oh, Subhana. Allah give me. I mean, I mean, growing up, of course, he was a big inspiration for all of
us, because he was, you know, we had all of his talks and everything else and one Allah. But you know, the day before you therefore, yesterday, my wife's mother passed away, the day before. We my friend's father passed away, you know, and so and then there's, there's been so many deaths around us SubhanAllah. And it's a reminder, of course, but one of the things that I've really taken, I mean, I think that we've really benefited as a community, in fact, from this is the fact that so my father, my friend's father passed away. You know, he had a stroke, he was paralyzed. He couldn't talk, he couldn't talk. But when he ended up and my friend was in the room, when he passed away,
he'd start shouting the shahada live
for half an hour. He's reading the Kenema you know, talk to people. And so yeah, on the day he dies, you know, so my friend, you know, is like his, his face is beaming, it's like smiling from there to there, you know, and I wanted to give condolences and he was just so happy he says
I'm so happy because my dad died on him on and so he them and he said that and it was like a sense of you know, his gratitude even through loss like you know, our friend from previously Omar and sorry, my very close friend who's whose son was stabbed to death Abdulaziz.
Likewise, I mean, there was a similar thing because when he when he when he died when he was when they heard when he heard the news that he had been stabbed to that. His mum who didn't know anything, because she toyed maybe were involved in an accident or something. And when her brother went to break the news to her in the night at the home, and had to kind of break that news to her imagine the feeling of a mother he said the first thing she did is she made she made such the simulation is satisfied to Allah and even Omar who was in hospital said that you know the first that they did that they went to make wudu when they are in the bathroom, and they prayed Salah and it's
like the the Allah mentions that you know with Imam comes a new order comes a light you see comes a light and that light it's something that you know you can't find anywhere else because the way that you conceptualize sugar now isn't just sugar as in shacket It's sugar as in sure cool. So you have the chakra and sure cool when it was the Lamb was praying the whole night and he said You are so low Why do you do that when Allah is this forgiving everything and he said to a fella Hakuna Abdon Shaku and should I not be then a truly grateful something all meaning in all situations being grateful to him? This is why even a claim says that the shocker yeah sure. He thanks Allah, Allah module that
for the things are like present for him in his life and things and stuff. And they should call thanks Allah for what's just missing in his life, you know, a shaker and shake your thanks Allah for blessings in Chicago thanks Allah for the calamity, because like you mentioned, that calamity, the Nicoma became a Nygma the calamity becomes a blessing. So that's the way because the person under five when he was you know, under when so much difficulty the HUDs of his life and five because the expectation may be they will listen to him like the McKinsey listen to him. They said Allahumma alayka escuela Kuwa t this is humility. Oh Allah, I complained to you for the weakness of my
strength, you know, both acuity and the minimum nature of my resources. And I'm not important in the eyes of the people who have Aniela nurse they don't think I'm important. But then he says well I can if you don't if you're angry with me that I don't mind what's gonna happen to me. Oh Allah. I mean that's that's the key thing. And so, the beautiful thing is, as I mentioned, to Omar, I said, look at the example of Ottawa because always example is Robin Zubair.
He had four kids you know, and the Khalifa environment to Damascus you go to the mosque is one of his kids was playing in the in the stable with the horses and the horse kicks his son and the son dies. And so or one hour has to prepare the funeral for his son and he washed the baby body and prepared the funeral. And while he's doing that, I think digging the grave he injures himself and then his leg becomes infected.
Did and the doctor said you have to have it amputated. And so he had to have his leg cut off. And then the people said they, they said after a few days, they said, you know, we're so sad because firstly, let's use your son then you lose your limb. And then he said it's very beautiful word. He says, Look, Allah gave me a button when Allah gave me four sons. And Allah took one but Allah left three for the praise Allah. And Allah gave me four limbs, two arms, two legs, Allah took one military for that I praise Allah. Whenever Allah took something from Allah left a look back for me, you know, and it's just this perspective. So you have, Allah gives even opportunities for people to
really show the most remarkable sugar
in the most difficult situation. Subhanallah and that's, that's just that's something that we did, I witnessed that myself, and what is wasteful locally in my community, you know, so far, and it just goes to show that, you know, if we could get consumed by negative events and trauma, but what Islam teaches us that we need to understand that the meaning that we're giving this trauma is not the only meaning that we should give the meaning that Allah and His Messenger want us to give. And well, like your brothers and sisters, even especially in our context, if you give the meaning that Allah and His Messenger want you to have for this particular event, then you're going to transcend that
calamity in sha Allah. And we see this with in sort of Doha, and we see this with Musa alayhis salam isn't that right? The way Allah talks to the Prophet sallallahu alayhi wa sallam to gain to, to attribute a different perspective, a different meaning to his life and to certain issues or for him to transcend those issues Correct. Subhanallah yesterday, one of the because I do Thursday, three hours mentoring. And one of the guys said, Brother I feel so low in my life. I didn't know what to do with anything. He was just so depressed with everything. And so I mentioned so google how it to him. And I said look, when Allah mentioned suitable ha it was at a time in the Prophet's life when
we shouldn't began to insult him make fun because the first verses were revealed and it was a gap in Revelation that we can say what the Lord is abandoning what is abandoned him. And Allah revealed suitable AHA begins by saying, well, Doha by the early morning brightness, meaning there's always like it connotes has imagery of newness, freshness, new beginning, new chance, new opportunity, new beginning, new things could happen. No two days are the same. The life of an instant of Adam every day is a unique day. Well lately either surgery, which means you're the kind of second and when the night is still like that, like the stillness of the sea, the still dark night, Silent Night and the
early morning brightness. Your Lord hasn't abandoned you notice you score new, and what is yet to come for tomorrow's story for you will outstrip is better for you than we have today. And you'll be pleased with that. Then Allah says LM, you dedicate a team and for our so I should say, Brother so look, I said you can't fix it only on today you have to think about your yesterday's that's the lesson and Allah, Allah says, didn't we find you an orphan and jolted you and found you poor and enriched you and found your wandering and guided you meaning you know, who was looking after you when things were good for you in your life? When things were you know when you were in difficulty
but Allah agent assisted you and then comes kind of a social responsibility like empathy building, because there's going to be people you encounter in life who will be in like in your situation before for Emelia tema, Fela Takara. Why masala filata. And as for the orphan Don't be cruel. As for the when it comes to ask you don't push him back? And even cathedra says it means what could you remember when you were an orphan? And what could the fabric remember when you were poor meaning have that sense of empathy for other people? And I think that that's a powerful thing. So therefore, you know, we gain a lot of things we can you should gain love inspiration from the Quran, I mean, from
all these prophetic examples and stories and the Syrah and the Sunnah, because that's really what gives us life as Muslims and how else do we navigate the trenches and sludges of life, sometimes, of course, things happen in life unpredictable, we weren't expecting them, they can be difficult, but if we, if we navigate through life, you know, with these kinds of you know, positive reinforcements, then they will kind of build us I think Inshallah, in in good ways, and that's something I think for the day is I mean, for all of us Inshallah, hoping to be to add, remember, therefore, the importance of our connection with Allah subhanho wa Taala is of this of the primary as a primary thing, you
know, the way that you are with Allah subhanaw taala will dictate everything and, and you're not looking for successes only in this life. You want the success in the next life. I mean, that's the big thing. And it could be even if you have delayed successes in this life, all profits went through that. So that's what I mean, profits were bigger than us bear that US chosen by Allah. And they had said these delays and stuff, and look how Benissa eel went on they went back to whispering
The COVID Oh Musa to struggle with all these people but Allah still says to Musa speak to for ona soft word, maybe he's hot my might be reflected. And so therefore the message is conveyed the message as best as you can with guidance with basura with, with with insight and wisdom, and with knowledge and with courage and all these things, and then leave your affairs to Allah subhanaw taala. And you know what Allah guides, even cathedra says, I think, of course to be says, Because I mentioned in the book, he says that the one Allah guides is one who wants to have one who was deserving of the guidance, so you don't know who's deserving of the guide because only Allah knows
who's deserving. Why would you be yourself over if Allah knows who's another goddess. So therefore the it's a big blessing if Allah has afforded you, that the time the the chance in life, to do something to convey this beautiful deen and to other people, and in the course of that to make you more mindful of him and in his remembrance, that's the biggest gift I think Allah has given a person in his life. So therefore, may Allah make us appreciative, humble and grateful to him and patient in our affairs, as what alumni mean is so just to complete this podcast, I think, just to summarize what you've said, you know, when we go through these lows, actually, you know, standing the
possibility that the meaning you're giving is not the right meaning and the meaning that Allah is giving it and the meaning that the Prophet sallallahu alayhi wa sallam was giving it is the correct meaning of you transcend these calamities and these problems. And so with that being said, there is so much more we could talk about, of course, there's so much more we will talk about in the future in future podcasts. But you know, brothers and sisters, if you've been inspired, touched mood and inspired by this, and for me, it's been an emotional podcast throughout the podcast Alhamdulillah. I think, you know, start engaging with this work as well go to our learning platform, it's all free
learn dot sapiens. institute.org, where you can start your dour journey to share Islam compassionately, intelligently with wisdom and to share it intellectually and academically to our brothers and sisters in humanity. We have an advanced our training course we have the no doubt course 10 effective strategies on how to deal with your doubts and lots of others. We have the courses from doctors man the teeth on being human divine perfection, and many other courses on Christology, atheism, and so on and so forth. And we've got future quizzes coming out as well and feminism, secularism leadership, the SIFAT, to the attributes of the day, and so on and so forth.
And it's an exciting time. So Dr. Zabka, whom Allah bless you, obviously, hang a great drummer, and I pray that Allah subhanaw taala grants your mother in law janitor for those and forgives her.
It was not my mother in law, it was my friend's mother. Oh, sorry, if we said it's your wife's mother.
My wife's friend's mother, my wife. Okay, that applies to them, as well. And of course, our beloved brother whose father passed away as well with tidings really, you know, he couldn't speak but like, give him the power. He's speaking.
Allah, and also, you know, may Allah subhanaw taala, forgive, and grant mercy and gentle janitorial for those to Chef Mohammed Al Sharif, he passed away and have any illness, I think he just passed away, just like that. And whenever I didn't really know him that well, but when I saw all the kinds of positive comments from different people across the kind of logical and community spectrum, I was inspired in a certain way, you know, I was inspired, expand Allah, you know, he was only 47 or something and what he achieved was phenomenal. And it should encourage us to racing and at the end of the day, as Allah says, the final outcome is with the righteous, so we should all become
righteous as best as possible and that itself is going to be a gift from Allah and therefore that would require gratitude as well. It's always gonna be an infinite regress of gratitude.
And until I speak to you very soon, with Allah and some of the ricotta